Green Diesel

Fyr.Fytr

DCC160 wrote: »

There's a maximum fine of €3k so I won't be risking it either

And possible seizure of you vehicle eighter to be kept by the state and sold or destroyed or you can pay the fine, recover and storage costs. Lot of money for a few cent saving

Run_to_da_hills wrote: »

You would also see these guys accompanied by members of An Garda Siochain.

False, customs have the right to stop any vehicle without the guards, they do work closely with the gardai to combine powers, plus people stop 100 time faster for the guards then customs

taidghbaby wrote: »

does green diesel not give off a load more smoke than normal stuff, therefore only vehicles that have loadsa smoke coming out of them are stopped....hence non rule breakers dont get stopped!!

Thats kerosene your thinking off also used to run diesel vehicles on the cheap, doesnt do the engine any good tho.


Customs do have exhaust sensors and there is more then just dye in MGO (marked gas oil technical term for green)

Thomas_S_Hunterson

Blisterman wrote: »

Why is green diesel cheaper anyway?
If it's the same basic product, shouldn't everyone pay the same for it, regardless of use?

It's not to be used on public roads.

Fishtits

fishtits had a troublesome customer who wouldn't pay his bill.

Late night excursion to "top him up" with a few liters of green provided solace... its only a matter of time.

Agricola

Reject Vegetable Oil (RVO) is the way to go for diesels cars. Me father ran his old van on it for afew months. Saved himself a packet, only downside was it always smelled like chips when he started the van! (Maybe thats an upside!)

After awhile it does mess up the engine though. Its too thick to put in straight. Best to mix it with diesel, ratio of 60:40

irish_bob

Captain Slow IRL wrote: »

It lacks some of the lubricating additives in regular diesel - can damage modern (common rail diesel) cars.

If I had an old mondeo or some piece of crap diesel, I'd use it for on the back-roads.

not true , kerrosene or heating oil can damage an engine , i know people who use it in old bangers as its even cheaper than tractor diesel

half the farmers in the country drive around using green diesel

irish_bob

445279.ie wrote: »

you'd know by the sound of the engine, having said that I drive a diesal car and they've waved me on. Think they (usually) only check the trucks.

Even though, I wouldn't risk it for a biscuit

you wouldnt know by the sound of the engine

irish_bob

stephen ocad wrote: »

Went through a Customs Chechpoint in dundalk on Monday evening at 5.50pm (07/07/08), they were dipping cars, vans, Jeeps and lorries for Green Diesel, Seems as though they cought a lot of people as well, All fined €700 for the first offence of €3000 for second time, With the price of diesel gone through the roof, a lot to people are using green on a regular basis

the customs set up checkpoints every so often in random places , your chances of being caught are quite slim , 1500 euro fine on the spot and if your caught twice , they will haul your ass up before a judge , most people who have been caught have saved a fortune by then and the 1500 fine is money well spent

im a law and order type by irish standards but i can forgive those who use green diesel , motorists are raped by the state in every possible way in this country between VRT and whatever

irish_bob

Blisterman wrote: »

Why is green diesel cheaper anyway?
If it's the same basic product, shouldn't everyone pay the same for it, regardless of use?

because the goverment slap a huge tax on white diesel , green diesel is exempt because its used by truckers and farmers or people who use large machinery in thier business , the colours are different for the purpose of distinguishing one from the other , green in a car = customs want your number

irish_bob

mozil wrote: »

green or agricultural diesel is subsidized for farmers by the state I think its about 95c a litre.

Just woundering if you topped up your tank with green diesel would it show if you were dipped.if say the max you used was 40% green diesel

95 cent a litre , try half that , it went to 90 cent a litre when oil was heading for 200 dollars a barrell in the middle of 2008 , it was as low as 40 cent a litre earlier this year , its around 55 cent a litre tops at the moment

irish_bob

irish_bob wrote: »

95 cent a litre , try half that , it went to 90 cent a litre when oil was heading for 200 dollars a barrell in the middle of 2008 , it was as low as 40 cent a litre earlier this year , its around 55 cent a litre tops at the moment

+1

Anyone paying 95c a litre for green diesel at a filling station is a fool and Ive seen filling stations with prices like that. We filled the 600 litre tank at home for the tractor etc for less than 50c a litre earlier in the year.

We dont use green diesel in the cars but I know an awful lot of people around here are at it. The chances of getting caught out around the country is almost non-existant. If my car was diesel Id be tempted to use it.

Jonathan

Blisterman wrote: »

Why is green diesel cheaper anyway?
If it's the same basic product, shouldn't everyone pay the same for it, regardless of use?

Agricultural use.

segaBOY

Richard Tight Vaporizer wrote: »

We dont use green diesel in the cars but I know an awful lot of people around here are at it. The chances of getting caught out around the country is almost non-existant. If my car was diesel Id be tempted to use it.

I don't know about that. Three farmers from my area got caught during the summer. Customs simply walked onto their farms and swabbed their exhaust. All got fined so don't be so sure just because you're rural.

segaBOY

segaBOY wrote: »

I don't know about that. Three farmers from my area got caught during the summer. Customs simply walked onto their farms and swabbed their exhaust. All got fined so don't be so sure just because you're rural.

Are you sure they walked onto the farm as I doubt this very much. The cars would have to be stopped on the road as there is no law against using green diesel in a car on private land.

As I said no one in my family does it and I wouldn't as I drive across the country quite often but I have not heard of a customs check around my area for years and I have no doubt there are lots of people using green who just drive around locally.

blogga

But isnt green diesel so patriotic?

partyatmygaff

Why the hell was this old thread dragged up?
:rolleyes:

Dartz

Confuse customs.

Dye your diesel purple.

irish_bob

segaBOY wrote: »

I don't know about that. Three farmers from my area got caught during the summer. Customs simply walked onto their farms and swabbed their exhaust. All got fined so don't be so sure just because you're rural.

customs are not allowed simply walk on to someones farm

Dartz

irish_bob wrote: »

customs are not allowed simply walk on to someones farm

Customs have so much power in this country, they could simply walk into Mordor if they wanted to.

Slidey

irish_bob wrote: »

customs are not allowed simply walk on to someones farm

Customs are allowed to just walk on to your farm. They do not even need a warrant to do so.

You can be fined for having green in your vehicle even if it not on the road.

For all those who are new to this thread


* green diesel is exactly the same as white bar the dye they put in it.

*It will not make your vehicle any smokier. I have a smoke opacity meter at my disposal and have checked for my own interest.

*Any business that uses green are foolish as you should be claiming the VAT back from your white diesel purchases.

The only time I ever ran on green was after I ran out and got 2 gallons off a farmer to get me to a filling station. I put £5 of white into it and got dipped about 15 min later. Was sweating like a peado in a Barney suit but yer wan looked at the sample and sent me on my way.

jumpguy

Don't know if green diesel is ONLY for agricultural use, I thought it was for all non-public road related use?

Slidey wrote: »

Customs are allowed to just walk on to your farm. They do not even need a warrant to do so.

You can be fined for having green in your vehicle even if it not on the road.

For all those who are new to this thread


* green diesel is exactly the same as white bar the dye they put in it.

*It will not make your vehicle any smokier. I have a smoke opacity meter at my disposal and have checked for my own interest.

*Any business that uses green are foolish as you should be claiming the VAT back from your white diesel purchases.

The only time I ever ran on green was after I ran out and got 2 gallons off a farmer to get me to a filling station. I put £5 of white into it and got dipped about 15 min later. Was sweating like a peado in a Barney suit but yer wan looked at the sample and sent me on my way.

How incredibly unlucky. In all my years as passenger, I've never once seen anyone being stopped and being dipped. That's just Murphy's Law for ya.

I thought green diesel did lead to an increase in emission. Obviously, not a more pollutant emission just a more coloured one. I remember watching an episode of Road Wars and they spotted one that way.

Slidey

I think the reason behind the myth is that the people who would generally run on green would also not keep their jeep/truck well serviced as a rule so would be more likely to be smokey and would draw attention to themselves.

segaBOY

Richard Tight Vaporizer wrote: »

Are you sure they walked onto the farm as I doubt this very much. The cars would have to be stopped on the road as there is no law against using green diesel in a car on private land.

As I said no one in my family does it and I wouldn't as I drive across the country quite often but I have not heard of a customs check around my area for years and I have no doubt there are lots of people using green who just drive around locally.

Yep they have serious power. As I said, they caught three farmers in my area and I am 100% they dipped/swabbed at least one of the lad's jeeps on his farm. It's ridiculous that they can walk onto private property like this but they can and goes to show that you really can't hide.

Duiske

Slidey wrote: »

* green diesel is exactly the same as white bar the dye they put in it.

The only difference is that Marked diesel has a higher sulphur content than unmarked diesel. As i understand it, customs sometimes check for sulphur content at checkpoints, particulary in the border counties.

Marked diesel has a sulphur content of something like 1500 parts per million, while unmarked diesel in the Republic should show sulphur content of about 350ppm. Even when marked diesel is "washed" and the dye is no longer visible, it will still contain roughly 50% of its sulphur, around 800ppm.
Its impossible to get this content lower unless you have access to specialized equipment in a refinary.

I'm not sure how customs test for sulphur, wether they can do it by the roadside or if it requires a lab test. But they are doing it, especially on fuel tankers in the usual "suspect" areas.

Slidey

Duiske wrote: »

The only difference is that Marked diesel has a higher sulphur content than unmarked diesel. As i understand it, customs sometimes check for sulphur content at checkpoints, particulary in the border counties.

Marked diesel has a sulphur content of something like 1500 parts per million, while unmarked diesel in the Republic should show sulphur content of about 350ppm. Even when marked diesel is "washed" and the dye is no longer visible, it will still contain roughly 50% of its sulphur, around 800ppm.
Its impossible to get this content lower unless you have access to specialized equipment in a refinary.

I'm not sure how customs test for sulphur, wether they can do it by the roadside or if it requires a lab test. But they are doing it, especially on fuel tankers in the usual "suspect" areas.

It seems that you may know what you are talking about...

I was told by a mate that draws diesel from the docks in Galway that it all comes in on the one ship and they add the dye in Ireland.

Seeing as I don't know for certain either way I'll leave it at that.

Rovi

irish_bob wrote: »

customs are not allowed simply walk on to someones farm

Officers of the Customs & Excise have powers the Gardai can only dream about:
Customs & Excise Enforcement Manual

Specifically, this bit:
Chapter 3 - Powers (PDF, 480KB)

irish_bob

Dartz wrote: »

Customs have so much power in this country, they could simply walk into Mordor if they wanted to.

having power and enforcing it are two entirely different things , the power exists to detail mentally ill people against thier will in this country indefinatley but in reality , it never happens unless the person literally kills someone

Stones85

Isn't veggie oil the done thing for Diesel engines these days?

Just have to be careful you've a compatable fuel pump.....

Well thats what I've overheard.

segaBOY

Duiske wrote: »

The only difference is that Marked diesel has a higher sulphur content than unmarked diesel. As i understand it, customs sometimes check for sulphur content at checkpoints, particulary in the border counties.

Marked diesel has a sulphur content of something like 1500 parts per million, while unmarked diesel in the Republic should show sulphur content of about 350ppm. Even when marked diesel is "washed" and the dye is no longer visible, it will still contain roughly 50% of its sulphur, around 800ppm.
Its impossible to get this content lower unless you have access to specialized equipment in a refinary.

I'm not sure how customs test for sulphur, wether they can do it by the roadside or if it requires a lab test. But they are doing it, especially on fuel tankers in the usual "suspect" areas.

Interesting, another reason could be when some people "wash" diesel you use Sulphuric Acid to percipitate the dye as part of the process. And any acidic residue also messes up your injector pumps so best off sticking to the legal stuff. Cat litter can also be used I think, was all over the papers a few years ago when Slab Murphy's farm was raided on the border-they found mounds of the stuff in sheds.

That's from my own reckoning anyway, could be wrong. Would make sense if the green dye used had sulphur in it too so Customs could check for all different types of unauthorised diesel in a car using the same swab.

irish_bob wrote: »

having power and enforcing it are two entirely different things , the power exists to detail mentally ill people against thier will in this country indefinatley but in reality , it never happens unless the person literally kills someone

It happens, they do have the power and they do use it. Millions is lost every year through unpaid duties and they have stepped up the checks both roadside and on private property since tax revenues have fallen.

Just goes to show you really are better off sticking by the rules, the fines are pretty hefty.

OnTheBalls

What is Green Diesel? Can I use it in my old 88 toyota carina?

segaBOY

OnTheBalls wrote: »

What is Green Diesel? Can I use it in my old 88 toyota carina?

It was explained a few posts ago. It's diesel dyed for Agricultural use-costs less due to tax exemptions.

No you can't use it in a motor vehicle intended for use on the public highway.

Rovi

OnTheBalls wrote: »

What is Green Diesel? Can I use it in my old 88 toyota carina?

Marked Gas Oil [Green Diesel] (page 7):

Marked gas oil is diesel fuel which is marked with chemical markers and is subject to a low rate of excise duty and VAT. It may be used for domestic and industrial heating, in generators, in lawnmowers, in stationary motors, in agricultural tractors and in certain purpose built vehicles which are specified in law, e.g. mobile cranes, road rollers, etc. It is an offence to use it to fuel ordinary motor vehicles such as motor cycles, vans, lorries etc. and anyone found so doing is liable to prosecution and the vehicle is liable to detention and seizure.

brendansmith

I used to work in a garage that sold green diesel and the only people who would shamelessly fill their tank with it were the dodgy well off members of the community and hi-ace vans.

Terrontress

I used to use it all the time. I'd fill up in Morgan's on the border, it cost next to nothing and there's often a queue for the green, all going in to private cars. The guys in Morgan's will put white in for you but you have to get out and put in your own green. There seemed to be no difference in the running of the car and I never was checked. I also didn't much care about evading tax either, in fact I was quite happy to do that. I was only driving between Dublin and Belfast each week and very little besides so thought they weren't likely to hold up the main road by dipping.

bubbles747

whats the actual fine for being caught with green diesel these days?

jackiebaron

Well if the diesel is available at forecourts then it's safe to assume that those who are allowed to use it have to do some regular road driving. The guy in the jeep might have used his jeep mostly on a farm or some kind of agrarian operation such as hauling equipment, haybales, wood, whatever all over the place. Unless it was one of these immaculate SUVs that only see action in the Tesco carpark. Then it's a different story.

sbsquarepants

We have a tank of it here in work for running forklifts, the only difference is the price (and the colour of course). It's also found in your home heating oil tank. I personaly have a petrol car but if i had a diesel i'd certainly fill it with this. We have dozens of trucks, vans and cars on the road and in all the time i'm working here (almost 12 years) not one of them has ever been dipped. The chances of getting caught are remote in the extreme. If you do any reasonable amount of driving you'd save a fortune, well enough to justify paying the fine if you were unlucky enough to get caught.

biko

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