Shifting point of impact

kerryman12

Hi Guys

I was doing a bit of target practice last week and to be honest I am tearing my hair out at this stage. After a lot of messing around with my setup etc etc I got a point of impact I was happy with.:) The following three round group was ok. I decided to shoot a 5 round group. The fourth round was 1.5" lower than the rest of the group - I assumed it was the shooter and followed on with two more rounds.

When I was finished I had two distinct three round groups. The second was approx1.25" lower than the first.:eek:

Now I am using a prohunter with a moderator attached. No changes were made between any of the shoots to the rifle or scope - other than stopping to pull a bore snake through after four round. The ammo is all from the same batch.

When I got home I checked that the stock was secure to the barrell, the scope to the rings and the rings to the mounts. All was ok

Over the preceeding days I had put approx 50 round down range, the rifle was cleaned regularly with the bore snake though without any oils/cleaning agents.

What am I missing?

Vegeta

Is the barrel coming in contact with the stock at any point or does it use some forward pressure?

What distance are you shooting and off what sort of rest you using?

When's the last time you gave the rifle a full clean with solvents etc (how many rounds ago)?

Have you tried this without the mod on?

Has someone else had ago to make sure it is not the shooter?

Jonty

Is it a steyr prohunter?

kerryman12

Has someone else had ago to make sure it is not the shooter?

No I am shooting alone

Have you tried this without the mod on?

No at the moment as I am trying to Zero with it attached. I have been shooting for a year with out a moderator and been happy with the results

When's the last time you gave the rifle a full clean with solvents etc (how many rounds ago)?

Approx 50 rounds

What distance are you shooting and off what sort of rest you using?

Target was 103 yrds away. Shooting off a bipod with a few soft items placed between the bipod and the ground - previous experiance of better results this way.

Is the barrel coming in contact with the stock at any point or does it use some forward pressure?

Yes at the end of the fore grip, I have notice a few scuff marks on the barrell from contact with the foregrip. From what I have read it appears that this is a common probelm with the prohunter.

But the point is in the past the results were satisfactory/

kerryman12

yep Jonty that is correct.

Jonty

A soft fore end is a defect with the prohunter. I'm sorry to be the bearer of bad news.

An aftermarket stock would be a good solution or maybe try pillar or epoxy bedding the action.

Grizzly 45

Did you check that the suppressor hasnt shifted loose in the time of shooting the strings?Are you running the bore snake thru the can as well.Or removing the can and then cleaning the rifle?
The can might nt be dead on flush with the threads if you are removing it all the time to clean
What type of can is it?One piece or strippable?You might have thrown a baffle ever so slightly out of alingement.Or it picked up some crud from the Snake

2] What calibre are you using?Some cals have a tendancy to shoot off if they are coming out a warm barrel.300 win Mag is one.

Would suggest try the string again,but dont bother cleaning the gun all the time.See if it prints a reasonable group,then clean and see if you have the same good or bad result.

jwshooter

kerryman12 wrote: »

No I am shooting alone



No at the moment as I am trying to Zero with it attached. I have been shooting for a year with out a moderator and been happy with the results



Approx 50 rounds



Target was 103 yrds away. Shooting off a bipod with a few soft items placed between the bipod and the ground - previous experiance of better results this way.



Yes at the end of the fore grip, I have notice a few scuff marks on the barrell from contact with the foregrip. From what I have read it appears that this is a common probelm with the prohunter.

But the point is in the past the results were satisfactory/

styer are making rifles long enough to have this problem sorted we went through this some time ago hear the fore end if like a fly rod ,i had a styer 11 years ago a pro hunter the first of them and the fore end was **** lovely bolt and trigger i sold it for a sako 75

kerryman12

JW/Jonty you are both correct regarding the front end, it is what it is now. And you are right it should have been designed out by now but such is life:rolleyes:

Grizzly you make a good point I did not check if it had come loos but to be honest I dont thinks so for the following reason - shoot 4 which was 1.5" low, this was the point i stopped to clean. I removed the moderator cleaned the bore replaced the moderator and fired the finaly 2 rounds. Shoot 4 to shoot 6 was a good group though when you stand back and look at it. It is stripable but I didnt touch it at any stage during the test. The cal is .243.

Jonty in relation to the bedding I discussed this with a gun smith and was advised against it. Based on his experiance it was not effective on this model.

jwshooter

kerryman12 wrote: »

JW/Jonty you are both correct regarding the front end, it is what it is now. And you are right it should have been designed out by now but such is life:rolleyes:

Grizzly you make a good point I did not check if it had come loos but to be honest I dont thinks so for the following reason - shoot 4 which was 1.5" low, this was the point i stopped to clean. I removed the moderator cleaned the bore replaced the moderator and fired the finaly 2 rounds. Shoot 4 to shoot 6 was a good group though when you stand back and look at it. It is stripable but I didnt touch it at any stage during the test. The cal is .243.

Jonty in relation to the bedding I discussed this with a gun smith and was advised against it. Based on his experiance it was not effective on this model.

hi kerry did not mean to run down your rifle ,i bought one ,two or three years ago for old time sake like yours as i do like styer but did not keep it two months mc millan in the us make a stock for them ,ask peter jackson about it or go on to there wed site and if you like one i will get a dealer friend of mine to order it .other than that kerry if you have a bipod move it down the fore end a bit it will help .

Vegeta

I have no experience with .243 ammo but are you using cheap stuff or quality ammo which you expect better from?

Do you have a friend with a known consistent .243 who could try your ammo out to make sure its not the issue? Could you get a chronograph if possible?

How's the crown of the barrel, everything good there?

If it was me personally I would: (assuming there is no crown damage and the ammo is good)

Try to borrow a front rest and rear sandbag for the tests.

Clean the bejaysus out of it
Go fire a few groups without the mod (allowing adequate time for cooling between shots)
Clean the bejaysus out of it again
Replace the mod and try again (allowing adequate time for cooling between shots)

After this you should know if the mod is or is not an issue. At this stage then you have eliminated the ammo as a problem, the mod, using a front rest and a bag hopefully shooter error is reduced so it only leaves the rifle itself.

For the rifle and scope I would check is everything nice and tight with a torque screwdriver (if you can get one)

More cleaning and more groups

Is the problem still there, then I'd borrow a scope from someone (doesn't sound like typical scope movement over time but its an easy check)

More cleaning and more groups

If the problem is still there I'd look at a stock change (to be honest this is a known issue but it costs money so its why I'd leave it so late to change it)

Problem still there?

Get the rifle blessed, have a mass said for it.

I feel for you kerryman as my .223 is not being as good as it should be so I myself will be doing some experiments on it, now if we could just get the bloody weather for it.

Went for a spin the other night with the lamp and saw over 20 foxes, it needs sorting asap. Another sh1t summer plus lots of fox is not good for youg birds.

kerryman12

Vegeta

You are right of course that Is all I can do now. I am trying to get ideas so when this bloody wether clears I have a few options to try out.

Thanks for your help everyone.

REgards

The ammo is Hornady SST 95grn

+1 re fox's and weather

ballistic

i too had a steyr it was a provarmint in 223. I agree totally with what the lads are saying altering stock pressure will throw the poi. so overcome this by zeroing with the same hold as you will be using to fire at an animal.

one thing that i think may have been overlooked is heat haze, i know the weather is crap but its still very warm. heat haze from a moderator will open your groups up and this makes sense as your poi shifted with the last shots. I would suggest firing three shot groups pausing between each shot for a minute. after the group is fired take off the mod and remove the bolt and wait (point bore into the wind). the majority of hunting shots are taken on a cold clean barrel.

Copper fouling may also be a problem use kg 12 and a nylon brush followed by patches i would be highly sceptacle about how much a bore snake can do.

lastly check for paralax error. looking through the scope move your eye/head without moving the rifle the cross hair should not move relative to the target. if it does set the paralax if you cant set it then find out what range it has been fixed at and zero from that range. dont waste money on a replacement stock trade the rifle in a buy a sako or a tikka

Jonty

ballistic wrote: »

. dont waste money on a replacement stock trade the rifle in a buy a sako or a tikka

Kerryman,

If you do decide to trade the rifle be prepared for a crap trade in value. A mate went to go and trade his for a sako 85 and was offered €700 for his prohunter (1 year old in August, and less than 100 rounds!)

The place is full of used prohunters, according to this dealer.

kerryman12

I cant see myself trading in at the moment. To be honest I have been happy enough with the rilfe to date this is the first issue I have encountered really. That Is why I wanted to look at other possibles as well. This clearly is a weakeness of this model but other marks have there issues as well. I will check out that website JW depending on cost it may be a option. I am thinking of removing the bipod for this seanson and using stick but to be honest it is very handy.

Anythanks for the help guys.

jwshooter

kerryman12 wrote: »

I cant see myself trading in at the moment. To be honest I have been happy enough with the rilfe to date this is the first issue I have encountered really. That Is why I wanted to look at other possibles as well. This clearly is a weakeness of this model but other marks have there issues as well. I will check out that website JW depending on cost it may be a option. I am thinking of removing the bipod for this seanson and using stick but to be honest it is very handy.

Anythanks for the help guys.

i would leave the bipod on if your used to it .i hate them my rifles but there so handy .you should pratice shooting the gun with out putting weight on the forend

kerryman12

I will try that JW. I was hoping with the stick to be able to support the rifle further back on the foregrip, say infront of the magazine.Thanks

jwshooter

kerryman12 wrote: »

I will try that JW. I was hoping with the stick to be able to support the rifle further back on the foregrip, say infront of the magazine.Thanks

i dont like shooting from a stick myself ,as i mostly neck shoot and its to hit and miss off a stick ,and its just another thing to carry ,sand the bejasus out of the barrel channel using a bit of half inch waven pipe with sand paper wraped around it you will be grand .was on the mountain yesterday eve we shot targets out to 400 yrds with a friend of mine he shoots a 243 in a pro hunter and a bipod on it has the same problem as your self but he has learned to not put pressure on the bipod and he shoots it well

kerryman12

Guys

I was looking at the rifle/scope this evening to see the best way I would mount the new bracket for the striker 170. To my digust I realised that I would have to move the scope in relation to the mounts to get it to fit in, this would undo all the work to date in relation to the Zero.
As I was loosening up the screws I found a rock in the front base plate. I couldnt believe it as I had checked this alread. When I looked closed I noticed a swelled section on the plate between the barrel and plate. When I removed it completed I found that one section had broken off completly and the other had swelled up. I dont really know how this could have happened but the powder coat swelled up and away from the steel underneath. See pictures attached.

I was very surprised to say the least as they were Warne mounts, so it not like they were crap. Anyway I will have a word with the dealer tomorrow.

Hopefully this is the root cause of my problems.

Regards and thanks for the help.

jwshooter

kerryman12 wrote: »

Guys

I was looking at the rifle/scope this evening to see the best way I would mount the new bracket for the striker 170. To my digust I realised that I would have to move the scope in relation to the mounts to get it to fit in, this would undo all the work to date in relation to the Zero.
As I was loosening up the screws I found a rock in the front base plate. I couldnt believe it as I had checked this alread. When I looked closed I noticed a swelled section on the plate between the barrel and plate. When I removed it completed I found that one section had broken off completly and the other had swelled up. I dont really know how this could have happened but the powder coat swelled up and away from the steel underneath. See pictures attached.

I was very surprised to say the least as they were Warne mounts, so it not like they were crap. Anyway I will have a word with the dealer tomorrow.

Hopefully this is the root cause of my problems.

Regards and thanks for the help.

good stuff kerry should sort some of it out ,warne can fail if over tightened done it myself ,there will not be a deer safe in kingdom this season god help them

Vegeta

Jesus that's a new one to me. Never seen that before.

Well that could easily be your issue right there, fingers crossed for you anyway.

What kind of warranty do the rings/bases come with, wonder will you have to shell out for a new set. Hopefully not

kerryman12

Hopefully that will be the end of it guys.

It was the gundealer that installed them I havent touched the plates since. WE are currently in discussion on warrenty. The system is less that a year old so it is still covered, that much I have established witht he dealer in question.