Rules of the road, two questions please.

L1011

esel wrote: »

Not so. The thick white line merely marks the bus lane. Traffic can cross this line legally.

Precisely. The minimum width of a bus lane demarcation line is *wider* than the maximum width of a solid white line to show 'do not cross'.

Del2005

VERYinterested wrote: »

I didn't get that worked up to be honest, even though I could have been in an accident, but I am getting worked up reading posts by people like yourself that aren't really sure what they are talking about or the piece of road in question, as many people said that it was illegal to undertake as said it was legal, so I don't know where you're getting that I and ALL the other cars were in the wrong lane.

I know the road in question and I've driven it many a time. I get strange looks off people driving in the wrong lane as I drive up the out of service bus lane past them. When I reach the end of the lanes I merge with traffic, I judge the gaps and move in. Some people try and block me, but I just wait. It's not my fault that people can't read and will blindly follow the car in front of them.

I phoned the Gardai in Rathfarnham and they said there should be no undertaking on that stretch of road as it is extremely dangerous and unsuitable and illegal to do so, and they have had random checks in place to deter the speed merchants. Thanks everyone for the replies, sensible or otherwise.

You do of course know there over taking on the left is against the law, so of course the Gardai are going to say that. But that raises the question why do they allow buses and taxis to do this ever day of the week.

VERYinterested wrote: »

Eh, I thought this had put all these stupid replies about me being in the wrong to bed, read all the posts you will see a vehicle tried to undertake me, why should I yield to him, like has been said by other posters, it is very difficult for people to visualise the situation especially when they can't absorb facts, but just want to prove some petty point and now it appears even the Gardai are wrong. I better go and give myself ten lashes for upsetting you. :rolleyes:

Did you tell the Gardai that you where in the wrong lane? If you where in the correct lane no-one would have tried to untake you as they wouldn't have the option. You where in the outside lane of a 2 lane road.

Oh wait a minute aren't we barred from talking about this!

VERYinterested

Del2005 wrote: »

I know the road in question and I've driven it many a time. I get strange looks off people driving in the wrong lane as I drive up the out of service bus lane past them. When I reach the end of the lanes I merge with traffic, I judge the gaps and move in. Some people try and block me, but I just wait. It's not my fault that people can't read and will blindly follow the car in front of them.

So you at least had the manners to allow the car in the 'wrong' lane to continue on without trying to bully them off the road, that's noble of you, why don't you report them to the Gradai for dangerous driving? Pity the idiot undertaking me hadn't the same manners, ignoring the Yield sign and paint at the end of the bus lane, but sure they don't count when the bus lane is not in use!! When you drive past people on the inside, are you keeping within the 50kph speed limit, or would you have to go at say 80kph? I am delighted now that I wouldn't let him merge as some other person wanted me to, there was plenty of room behind me to merge, and that's what he did, near shat himself when he saw the road in front disappearing. I wouldn't like to be in your shoes nipping up the inside of people if they decide to pull over unexpectedly for some reason. Little old lady, not expecting someone to be undertaking on a road that is not a dual carriageway.

Del2005 wrote: »

You do of course know there over taking on the left is against the law, so of course the Gardai are going to say that. But that raises the question why do they allow buses and taxis to do this ever day of the week.

The Garda laughed his head off when I told him that people on here had misinterpreted the keep to the left law, and were suggesting that we all meander in and out of Bus Lanes after 7pm or whenever they were not in use. He said, "what next, will they be driving in Cycle Lanes and Hard Shoulders". He had never heard anything as ridiculous in his life. The erratic nature and layout of bus lanes makes it impossible to adhere to this mad suggestion, his words, not mine. I explained the full scenario to him and he said I was in the correct lane, driving with due care and attention, what you and the fool the other night are doing is dangerous driving and they have prosecuted other errant motorists on this stretch of road and will continue to do, hope you don't get caught.

Del2005 wrote: »

Did you tell the Gardai that you where in the wrong lane? If you where in the correct lane no-one would have tried to untake you as they wouldn't have the option. You where in the outside lane of a 2 lane road.

See answer above :rolleyes: If there isn't a Bus Lane, there is hatched area on this road, I suppose it's ok to overtake on the hatched area also? Or should we be driving in that section of the road and not the part they specifically provide for cars?

Not sure what you mean about being barred talking about undertaking, was this another discussion that got out of hand and was locked? Not surprised, the suggestion that we all hug the kerb at all times is laughable at best, no wonder it got locked.

golfpaul

You are entitled to use the bus lane outside of the times signposted on the lane. Taken from the ROTR:
"Where there is a bus lane, you will see an upright blue and white sign on the side of the road on a pole and on the roadway there will be markings of a continuous white line and the words "Lána Bus". You must obey the road marking and the sign. The white plate shows when the section of road is meant only for the buses shown. Normally bus lanes operate from 7am to 7pm or during peak hours. Outside these times, all traffic may use them. You should check the information plate to confirm the time limits that apply."

I'm surprised to say that garda did not know what he was talking about when refering to bus lanes. I don't know the particular lane you are talking about so I won't comment on your situation. I will always use the bus lane along the quays outside of operating hours as it moves quicker. And taken from ROTR you can overtake on the left when:
"You want to go straight ahead when the driver in front of you has moved out and signalled that they intend to turn right.
You have signalled that you intend to turn left.
Traffic in both lanes is moving slowly and traffic in the left-hand lane is moving more quickly than the traffic in the right-hand lane."

lightening

VERYinterested wrote: »

I am delighted now that I wouldn't let him merge as some other person wanted me to, there was plenty of room behind me to merge, and that's what he did, near shat himself when he saw the road in front disappearing

I think you need to take a more mature approach to your driving. Let people merge in front of you, don't try and race them to the end of the lane.

VERYinterested

The confusion surrounding this situation is simple really, I will try and explain it better, you are of course allowed to use the bus lanes when they are not in use or after hours but the section I refer to is located between the Eden Pub and the traffic signals before you enter Marlay Park heading towards Lidl from The Eden Pub. It is about 200 yards in length. I was in a line of traffic, of 7 or 8 cars, I was the last car in the line of traffic, it was about 9pm, no delays or traffic jams, we were all travelling along nicely 50 - 55 kph in a 50 kph limit, no slow cars then some numpty decides to try and undertake the line of cars on the inside in this 200 yard bus lane that is not in use. He tried booting it up the inside of us and 200 yards is not a big enough space to undertake 8 cars and he very quickly ran out of space as the road narrows to one lane before a set of traffic lights. He drew level with me at one stage and I was afraid he would crash in to the side of my car. I kept driving at the same speed as I could see he was realising the folly of his manoeuvre. There were no gaps in front of me or the car in front that he could pull in to as we were all driving along minding our own business. So he had to brake and merge in behind me, where he had come from. Would you allow a rude person to skip in front of you in a queue in a shop, just because they thought they had a right to skip you for no reason.

I was merely asking what the grey area was surrounding this situation and to date nobody has been able to explain it properly apart from people saying that me and the 8 cars should all have pulled over in to the bus lane and continue to do so all along this road as it meanders along, we were in the wrong lane and that we should have allowed ourselves to be undertaken as we were in the wrong, at least that's what I think they are saying. The Garda knew the specific piece of road I was talking about and they have concerns over it.

Lightening, the person that should adapt the more mature approach is the person that almost caused an accident, just accept that your diagnosis is wrong in this instance, he should not have tried to skip in front of us on the inside, he tried, he hadn't enough space, not my problem, I won't make allowances for rude and dangerous drivers.

lightening

VERYinterested wrote: »

I kept driving at the same speed as I could see he was realising the folly of his manoeuvre.

I just would have slowed down and let him in to avoid an accident, I would not have maintained my speed just to block him. He could have been drunk, stoned, a doctor on his way to a patient, a worried parent on his way to an accident, an inexperienced driver or simply a lunatic. There is a chance that when you crashed in to him he had no insurance or he could have got violent. I would relax and not try and police the roads. Your journey would have been extended by about three seconds.

VERYinterested

lightening wrote: »

I just would have slowed down and let him in to avoid an accident, I would not have maintained my speed just to block him. He could have been drunk, stoned, a doctor on his way to a patient, a worried parent on his way to an accident, an inexperienced driver or simply a lunatic. There is a chance that when you crashed in to him he had no insurance or he could have got violent. I would relax and not try and police the roads. Your journey would have been extended by about three seconds.

Ah I don't know, it's no harm to have a little bit of sport also, makes the day go quicker

Thanks all for input, I know the answer to my questions, off on holiday now.

lightening

VERYinterested wrote: »

Thanks all for input, I know the answer to my questions, off on holiday now.

Hey, have a good one! I hope your going to Italy, sounds like you would like their style of driving!!!

Esel

Some random Garda laughed his head off.......a load of random people on Boards laughed their heads off.

wil

golfpaul wrote: »

.
Traffic in both lanes is moving slowly and traffic in the left-hand lane is moving more quickly than the traffic in the right-hand lane."

The Irish ROTR is quite badly written and worded.
But even so you avoided noticing the important condition is MOVING SLOWLY, not as in haring down the empty bus lane when the traffic is getting a bit heavy.

BUS Lanes, in or out of use are NOT overtaking lanes.
Taxis seem to think otherwise.

Even if the car in front is in the right hand lane, beside an out of hours bus lane, you dont automatically have a right to undertake him.

Even if they are crawling, you should politely give them the opportunity to pull in.
Somewhere Irish drivers got the idea that the person going fastest has right of way. R.I.P

wil

Fingers Mc Gee wrote: »

Never heard of overtaking on the left being an offense? I have a UK license so that might be way. It is pretty standard in the UK provided you are in the left lane and doing the speed limit.

Where on earth did you learn, the Falklands?

It is absolutely an offence in the UK and has always been, and it is not standard to do it. I think you been driving here too long.:(

sickpuppy32

bet he's still a better driver than the one i met today on the carlow by-pass going the wrong way on the outside lane!

wil

sickpuppy32 wrote: »

bet he's still a better driver than the one i met today on the carlow by-pass going the wrong way on the outside lane!

:eek::eek::eek:
A bit like this one on egdirB llennoC'O nilbuD

Our man in Havana

wil wrote: »

:eek::eek::eek:
A bit like this one on egdirB llennoC'O nilbuD

Jesus H Christ. What a dumbass.

Esel

Bond-007 wrote: »

Jesus H Christ. What a dumbass.

But he's got a UK license. And it's better than an Irish one. So there.

wil

esel wrote: »

But he's got a UK license. And it's better than an Irish one. So there.

By far:D

But how can you tell from that picture?

Actually that kamikazi happened during Operation Freeflow IIRC. The garda at the other end of the traffic island completely ignored what was going on, cars beeping, people shouting, it wasnt till a Dublin bus driver who narrowly missed hitting her and shouted at the garda to do something.
Lo and behold the forgiving guard, stopped the traffic and directed her on her meandering way on the correct side of the road.
Who says we dont have effective enforcement here?:pac::rolleyes:

So far I've witnessed people crossing the Liffey on the wrong side, in full view of the gardai on only 3 occasions.:eek:

I'm not around there that often.:eek::eek::eek: