SMART TELECOM PRICES

Liam Byrne

Most of the posts comparing eircom to Smart seem to forget about contention.....isn't it still true to say that if 23 of your eircom neighbours are online at the same time as you, you're down to a VERY slow speed ??

So how can you compare the packages one-for-one on that basis ?

bk

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Most of the posts comparing eircom to Smart seem to forget about contention.....isn't it still true to say that if 23 of your eircom neighbours are online at the same time as you, you're down to a VERY slow speed ??

So how can you compare the packages one-for-one on that basis ?

Because it doesn't really work that way, all ISP's, including Smart have contention, Smart just don't tell you what their contention rate is, while Eircom is forced to due to Comreg rules.

As an example their is a fellow on Smarts 15m product in Letterkenny, who despite his line syncing at 15m with no problems, actually only gets about 4m from the service, due to their being too much contention and therefore congestion on Smarts connection to Letterkenny.

In fairness Smart do a far better job then Eircom of managing their network and contention and the majority of people rarely suffer from it.

AlmightyCushion

bk wrote: »

Because it doesn't really work that way, all ISP's, including Smart have contention, Smart just don't tell you what their contention rate is, while Eircom is forced to due to Comreg rules.

As an example their is a fellow on Smarts 15m product in Letterkenny, who despite his line syncing at 15m with no problems, actually only gets about 4m from the service, due to their being too much contention and therefore congestion on Smarts connection to Letterkenny.

In fairness Smart do a far better job then Eircom of managing their network and contention and the majority of people rarely suffer from it.

Has he been in contact with smart about that?

neacy69

bk wrote: »

Because it doesn't really work that way, all ISP's, including Smart have contention, Smart just don't tell you what their contention rate is, while Eircom is forced to due to Comreg rules.

As an example their is a fellow on Smarts 15m product in Letterkenny, who despite his line syncing at 15m with no problems, actually only gets about 4m from the service, due to their being too much contention and therefore congestion on Smarts connection to Letterkenny.

In fairness Smart do a far better job then Eircom of managing their network and contention and the majority of people rarely suffer from it.

Hmm if this is that case then how can smart advertise and sell their DSL products as uncontended?

bk

AlmightyCushion wrote: »

Has he been in contact with smart about that?

Yes, he is in constant contact with Smart about that, he has also posted about it multiple times over on the Smart forums.

neacy69 wrote:

Hmm if this is that case then how can smart advertise and sell their DSL products as uncontended?

Because they don't claim it is uncontended, if you look closely on the Smart website, they don't say anywhere that there is 1:1 contention, what they do say in the FAQs is:

O. What is the contention ratio?
A. When you are a Smart Telecom customer, you don't have to worry about contention ratios. Because Smart Telecom owns and operates its high-capacity fibre-optic network, it is automatically upgraded as links in the network approach capacity. What this means for you is unrestricted high-speed Internet access all the time.

If you read this carefully, it is clear what there saying is that there is contention, but they try and manage the contention in such a way that most people shouldn't be effected by it.

neacy69

bk wrote: »

Yes, he is in constant contact with Smart about that, he has also posted about it multiple times over on the Smart forums.



Because they don't claim it is uncontended, if you look closely on the Smart website, they don't say anywhere that there is 1:1 contention, what they do say in the FAQs is:

O. What is the contention ratio?
A. When you are a Smart Telecom customer, you don't have to worry about contention ratios. Because Smart Telecom owns and operates its high-capacity fibre-optic network, it is automatically upgraded as links in the network approach capacity. What this means for you is unrestricted high-speed Internet access all the time.

If you read this carefully, it is clear what there saying is that there is contention, but they try and manage the contention in such a way that most people shouldn't be effected by it.

Thanks for that answer.....
Maybe this should be explained to the sales staff as the Guy explicitly said to me today that there is no contention ratio on the Smart DSL products maybe he was just being careful with the facts.....
Although I have to say I haven't had any probs with Smart service before was previously on their 4Mb service and had no probs so I just ordered the 4Mb package for €40.36 with unlimited downloads (thats what made me choose them over Eircom...no other reason than this)

bk

neacy69 wrote: »

Thanks for that answer.....
Maybe this should be explained to the sales staff as the Guy explicitly said to me today that there is no contention ratio on the Smart DSL products maybe he was just being careful with the facts.....
Although I have to say I haven't had any probs with Smart service before was previously on their 4Mb service and had no probs so I just ordered the 4Mb package for €40.36 with unlimited downloads (thats what made me choose them over Eircom...no other reason than this)

I wouldn't worry about it too much, I'd say 98% of Smarts customers aren't ever effected by contention. I just like to point it out for the sake of accuracy and because some people mistakenly use it when comparing products with other ISP's, as well as some sales and marketing folk at Smart who clearly have no idea what they are talking about.

Also strictly speaking you do have 1:1 contention on the copper line between your home and the local exchange, but this is true of all ADSL ISP's including Eircom, it doesn't say anything about the contention on the backhaul from the exchange, so maybe this is what the Smart sales person is claiming.

TimTim

Eircom tradionally provisions a 2meg link to each of their interface cards. These cards are either 24 port or 48 port cards and thats how you get the whole 24:1 or 48:1 bit. (Don't ask why its 1 and not 2, no idea myself)

Smart don't connect up that way, the entire DSLAM has a 2.5Gig link to their backbone network so you don't have this "tradional" contention. But I'm 99% sure if everyone tried to use their link to an international site (where transit is used) you'd find contention pretty quickly.

And I leave that 1% margin of error in there because I don't know how many customers Smart has at what speed and the size of their pipes to the general internet is. So you might actually get uncontended.

jimmeh

On the letterkenny exchange myself and concidering signing up to smart, If these problems are true and having already been stung by netsource back in the , im a bit reluctant about changing from eircom, for all their faults about promised upgrades they're rock solid most of the time connection wise. From looking around the exchange in letterkenny I think smart use a microwave link to connect the exchange to the man, this might be creating a bottleneck on the network and causing the said problems. Think ill hang onto my hat and ride it out with eircom, better the devil you know.

Bohrio

TimTim wrote: »

Eircom tradionally provisions a 2meg link to each of their interface cards. These cards are either 24 port or 48 port cards and thats how you get the whole 24:1 or 48:1 bit. (Don't ask why its 1 and not 2, no idea myself)

Smart don't connect up that way, the entire DSLAM has a 2.5Gig link to their backbone network so you don't have this "tradional" contention. But I'm 99% sure if everyone tried to use their link to an international site (where transit is used) you'd find contention pretty quickly.

And I leave that 1% margin of error in there because I don't know how many customers Smart has at what speed and the size of their pipes to the general internet is. So you might actually get uncontended.

Hello

I dont think it is exactly like that. I will assume that Eircom's DSLAM are similar to BT or Smart I will assume. Contention is not applied at that level. Each chipset has a certain amount of "ports", depending on the model, normally, each card has four 8 port chipsets. Contention is applied after the customer leaves this port by applying an specific vlan profile, that's all.

By doing so you can adjust the speed and vlan profile without the need of manually changing the customer's port, for instance, on Eircom's system, when you upgrade a customer from 2 mb 48:1 contention profile to a 3 mb 24:1 contention profile its all done by software, and it doesnt take more than a few minutes, therefore it does not require physical intervention.

BT's DSLAM are the same only that they all are ADSL2+ and dont use ATM, eircom are also upgrading their DSLAMs to use ethernet instead of ATM as ATM it is becoming obsolete.

Most eircom exchanges will have a GigE fibre link between the DSLAM and their core network, some exchanges probably have faster STM links.

I would imagine that Smart does it probably in the same way. Once a DSLAM becomes overcontented, customer on that exchange will suffer from contention, no matter what. Smart seems to know how to keep their network in good condition but if the number of customers were to increase I am afraid they will suffer from congestion too.

It's all a bit more complicated as congestion can happen at many levels.

Spear

jimmeh wrote: »

On the letterkenny exchange myself and concidering signing up to smart, If these problems are true and having already been stung by netsource back in the , im a bit reluctant about changing from eircom, for all their faults about promised upgrades they're rock solid most of the time connection wise. From looking around the exchange in letterkenny I think smart use a microwave link to connect the exchange to the man, this might be creating a bottleneck on the network and causing the said problems. Think ill hang onto my hat and ride it out with eircom, better the devil you know.

If you're referring to Johnmd's case, Letterkenny's backhaul is saturated, and Smart have said there's already a project underway to fix that.

Nadie x x x

People listen to this I had smart phone and bb I was told i was getting 4mb and phone. I wasn't happy with the speed and when I have an issue there customer care aint very caring!! I called another company and asked them for the same package and see what how much it is going to cost!! I was told by this company that i couldn't get that package as my line wasn't good enough? I was told to do a speed test i done it and sure enough I was getting only 1mb that was uncontended??? :eek:

pizzahead77

Nadie x x x wrote: »

People listen to this I had smart phone and bb I was told i was getting 4mb and phone. I wasn't happy with the speed and when I have an issue there customer care aint very caring!! I called another company and asked them for the same package and see what how much it is going to cost!! I was told by this company that i couldn't get that package as my line wasn't good enough? I was told to do a speed test i done it and sure enough I was getting only 1mb that was uncontended??? :eek:

Have you posted your problem on the Smart Telecom Support Forum - http://support.smarttelecom.ie/forums/- the admins there may be able to tweak your line for more speed/stability.

The admins are usually more helpful that the customer care representives

dub45

Nadie x x x wrote: »

People listen to this I had smart phone and bb I was told i was getting 4mb and phone. I wasn't happy with the speed and when I have an issue there customer care aint very caring!! I called another company and asked them for the same package and see what how much it is going to cost!! I was told by this company that i couldn't get that package as my line wasn't good enough? I was told to do a speed test i done it and sure enough I was getting only 1mb that was uncontended??? :eek:

There are a number of issues here. Smart can only work the line that the customer has - thats a given and its not their fault.

Smart use adsl2 which is more forgiving of poor lines.

As posted above if you post to the Smart forums you will get excellent service there far above any other isp. They will attempt to get the mamixum that your line is capable of - and you will not get this type of attention from any other isp.

MunsterCycling

Nadie x x x wrote: »

People listen to this I had smart phone and bb I was told i was getting 4mb and phone. I wasn't happy with the speed and when I have an issue there customer care aint very caring!! I called another company and asked them for the same package and see what how much it is going to cost!! I was told by this company that i couldn't get that package as my line wasn't good enough? I was told to do a speed test i done it and sure enough I was getting only 1mb that was uncontended??? :eek:

If that is all your line can handle then its not Smarts problem, €ircon own the lines and won't do anything to improve them. What is Smarts slowest offering? 4mb so they can only offer you that one.

ADSL2+ btw Dub45

MC

dub45

MunsterCycling wrote: »

If that is all your line can handle then its not Smarts problem, €ircon own the lines and won't do anything to improve them. What is Smarts slowest offering? 4mb so they can only offer you that one.

ADSL2+ btw Dub45

MC

I deliberately left out the '+' to see if you were checking on me:)