Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

PiE

Liverpool signing Ribery are about as likely as Liverpool signing Kaka. I don't understand why he keeps being brought up.

MementoMori

Meant to say - the second leg of the Liverpool v Arsenal youth cup is on Setanta Ireland (the free on on NTL/upc) starts at 7:30 think ko is 7:45.

Score is 1-4 from the first leg but fingers crossed.

Probable Squad: Dean Bouzanis, Karl Clair, Daniel Ayala, Joe Kennedy, Andre Wisdom, Chris Buchtmann, Steven Irwin, Tom Ince, David Amoo, Alex Kacaniklic, Nathan Eccleston ,Lauri Dalla Valle, Jack Robinson, Deale Chamberlain, Michael Roberts, Alex Cooper.

daithijjj

MementoMori wrote: »

Not to jump all over you but I can't agree with the bit about the right hand side of the team needing a lot more attention than the left.

It's not all about the goals but this is what the various wide players have scored this season.

Kuyt - 15 goals
Benayoun - 9 goals
El Zhar - 0 goals

Riera - 5 goals
Benayoun - 9 goals
Babel - 4 goals
Dossena - 2 goals

Ok so some of Kuyt’s goals game when he was playing up front but still he’s been the our best wide player this season.

The next best is Benayoun and I’m pretty sure at least half of his appearances came on the right.

Third best was Riera who started the season well but has faded as the season went on, which I would put down to the difference in physicality between La Liga and the EPL. I would be hoping that next season he will have a more consistent season.

Fourth best was probably Babel - however I don’t think there’s anyone who doesn’t think his season has been anything other than a disappointment.

Fifth was probably El Zhar - only played 479 mins in all comps so probably tough to accurately assess how well he did but I think he’s shown enough to be 3rd choice RW behind Benayoun and Kuyt. Also I think he works well as a sub for Kuyt as there is a nice contrast between what each brings to the team.

Sixth is probably Dossena and that’s mainly for his two goals. He’s clearly 3rd choice LB and I don’t think he’s good enough to play LW in 4-2-3-1 If we played 3-5-2 I think it would be a different story but we don’t.

There’s also the Pennant, Degen, Gerrard, Aurelio, Insua and Lucas who could be considered more remote options for the wide positions. Clearly Pennant is gone but I think EL Zhar has shown enough to be 3rd choice on the right for next season. Gerrard can play there but I think it would be a mistake. Degen next season might be a possible in contention for RM as he has lined out there before and from the glimpses I’ve seen seems well able to get forward. On the left Aurelio and Insua could also play there but I think it would be a case of playing a defender in an attacker’s position and I don’t want to see it. Pretty sure Lucas played LM in some game but I don’t think it’s a runner.

I really think it’s the left side that has to be the priority. It would nice to be able to buy some-one on the right who would be able to offer Kuyt more competition in terms of a starting place than El Zhar but with limited funds, I just don’t think it’s a realistic option. As such I think Babel and Dossena will both be sold and a quality player who is primarily a left-winger will come in.

Well to be honest, and in my opinion, we dont have a single player in the squad who would consider themselves a natural right side midfielder. Kuyt has done admirably there for someone who has been a striker all his life, benny has also done well but again, neither of them get to the by line and whip a cross in with any regularity. I was also referring to right back where arbeloa has done ok but carra will not have the legs for that anymore, skyrtel was a disaster .v. boro and we had mascherano there at the end of that game.

You cant just throw a central player out there and expect anything more than average. We need personell who can stretch the game for us on the wings because 99 times out of 100 they just collect the ball and move inside. Benny and kuyt arent blessed with pace and arbeloa needs competition for his place.

daithijjj

PiE wrote: »

Liverpool signing Ribery are about as likely as Liverpool signing Kaka. I don't understand why he keeps being brought up.

Liverpool signing ribery is about as likely as liverpool signing torres a few seasons ago.

whatawaster

daithijjj wrote: »

Liverpool signing ribery is about as likely as liverpool signing torres a few seasons ago.

way less likely since he'll probably cost twice as much as Torres

lint316

daithijjj wrote: »

Liverpool signing ribery is about as likely as liverpool signing torres a few seasons ago.

hmmm, not so sure about that although I see what you mean. Rafa's spanish, Torres is Spanish. There's a load of Spanish players in the Liverpool team. Rafa has many contacts at Athletico...... Ribery is french and plays at Bayarn Munich. I think Liverpool signing Aguero this summer would be more like the way we signed Torres

MementoMori

daithijjj wrote: »

Well to be honest, and in my opinion, we dont have a single player in the squad who would consider themselves a natural right side midfielder. Kuyt has done admirably there for someone who has been a striker all his life, benny has also done well but again, neither of them get to the by line and whip a cross in with any regularity. I was also referring to right back where arbeloa has done ok but carra will not have the legs for that anymore, skyrtel was a disaster .v. boro and we had mascherano there at the end of that game.

You cant just throw a central player out there and expect anything more than average. We need personell who can stretch the game for us on the wings because 99 times out of 100 they just collect the ball and move inside. Benny and kuyt arent blessed with pace and arbeloa needs competition for his place.

I just assumed it was about the attacking positions - obviously LB is much stronger than RB.

I totally agree that Arbeloa needs some decent competition next season.

I would agree with you to an extent about the lack of width. However I think if we do have width on the left-wing it isn't as bad as situation.

However if we do have play a 3 of Benayoun - Gerrard - Kuyt is becomes very very narrow.

Also I think El Zhar has to be considered a natural wide player on the right.

MementoMori

As regards signing Ribery I really can't see him moving for less than £35m maybe £30m at a stretch.

Considering the take-it-or-leave it offer for Silva was meant to be £15m, I really can't see Liverpool being remotely able to afford Ribery.

Same goes for Aguero - given Athletico paid €23m for him (currently £20m) and the fact that his rumoured buy-out clause is in the region of €50m (currently £44m), I really think he is well well outside Liverpool's price range.

Unless some billionaire buys us - even then I think the stadium would have to be the immediate priority.

PiE

daithijjj wrote: »

Liverpool signing ribery is about as likely as liverpool signing torres a few seasons ago.

Two completely different scenarios.

daithijjj

lint316 wrote: »

hmmm, not so sure about that although I see what you mean. Rafa's spanish, Torres is Spanish. There's a load of Spanish players in the Liverpool team. Rafa has many contacts at Athletico...... Ribery is french and plays at Bayarn Munich. I think Liverpool signing Aguero this summer would be more like the way we signed Torres

Correct me if im wrong but doesnt aguero want a move and athletico wouldnt mind cashing in?

At the end of the day, i just want to see a 'koala tea' signing over two average ones. A match winner is what we need, to unlock the painfull draws.

daithijjj

PiE wrote: »

Two completely different scenarios.

Are you saying rafa got lucky?

purple_hatstand

MementoMori wrote: »

......even then I think the stadium would have to be the immediate priority.

Seriously?

Important, obviously....but more important than buying a player who might be instrumental to us winning the league?

Chardee MacDennis

MementoMori wrote: »

Same goes for Aguero - given Athletico paid €23m for him (currently £20m) and the fact that his rumoured buy-out clause is in the region of €50m (currently £44m), I really think he is well well outside Liverpool's price range.

buy out clauses are not hard to find as they are public knowledge as far as i know, also they have no bearing on a players worth as they are required by the Spanish FA and therefore are always set ridiculously high so they never get activated.

daithijjj wrote: »

As a sidenote, how does silva sign a 7 year contract in summer 08, that expires in 2013?

isnt the longest contract now 5 years under UEFA?

whatawaster

daithijjj wrote: »

Correct me if im wrong but doesnt aguero want a move and athletico wouldnt mind cashing in?

At the end of the day, i just want to see a 'koala tea' signing over two average ones. A match winner is what we need, to unlock the painfull draws.

i've never heard Aguero saying he wants to leave. Haven't Atletico secured CL football? I doubt they'd sell him if so. Unless it's for silly money.
A quality signing doesn't have to cost 35 million.
Silva for 20 million would be great value. He's the kind of clever, tricky player who will unlock stubborn defences

MementoMori

daithijjj wrote: »

Correct me if im wrong but doesnt aguero want a move and athletico wouldnt mind cashing in?

At the end of the day, i just want to see a 'koala tea' signing over two average ones. A match winner is what we need, to unlock the painfull draws.

I don't think there's been anything much about Aguero wanting a move. From what I've heard the situation seems to be more of a perfectly happy where he is situation and given Atletico Madrid seem to have CL football next year secured, I would say he won't be moving this summer. Maybe if they didn't have CL football he might have been interested in moving. Also if Atletico were going to cash in on anyone it would probably be more likely Forlan, who is 30.

There's also the fact that Rafa was reportedly interested in signing him from Independiente, but when Atletico offered €23m it was a case of game over as the board said there was no-way we could afford to offer anything like that for an unproven youngster. I really can't see us signing him after that.

~Rebel~

purple_hatstand wrote: »

Seriously?

Important, obviously....but more important than buying a player who might be instrumental to us winning the league?

Well, you can look at it that way, but on the other hand, you need the higher ups thinking long term. If it was an either/or situation then its madness not to go for the one giving you the infrastructure to challenge for the foreseeable future rather then just investing in a man.

MementoMori

purple_hatstand wrote: »

Seriously?

Important, obviously....but more important than buying a player who might be instrumental to us winning the league?

Priority has to be the stadium.

Old Trafford has a capacity of 76k, Anfield 45k. That makes a huge difference in terms of revenue over the course of a season - you're probably talking at an utter minimum £10m over the course of a season in terms of ticket sales alone.

daithijjj

whatawaster wrote: »

i've never heard Aguero saying he wants to leave. Haven't Atletico secured CL football? I doubt they'd sell him if so. Unless it's for silly money.
A quality signing doesn't have to cost 35 million.
Silva for 20 million would be great value. He's the kind of clever, tricky player who will unlock stubborn defences

I will have to disagree on the 'great value' part of that. I just dont rate him as highly as other folk obviosly, just my opinion. Id rather we went for villa than silva. I think we can all agree that nando and villa work well together.

PiE

daithijjj wrote: »

Are you saying rafa got lucky?

What?

I'm saying Ribery is far more "in demand" than Torres was when we signed him. As whatawaster said above, he'd cost a lot more due to this. And I'm also saying that if given the choice (which he undoubtedly would be), he would choose several teams ahead of Liverpool.

daithijjj

MementoMori wrote: »

Priority has to be the stadium.

Old Trafford has a capacity of 76k, Anfield 45k. That makes a huge difference in terms of revenue over the course of a season - you're probably talking at an utter minimum £10m over the course of a season in terms of ticket sales alone.

United make 3mil more than us every home game, quite the eye-opener huh?

Obviously, long term, the stadium is the ultimate priority.

Chardee MacDennis

daithijjj wrote: »

I will have to disagree on the 'great value' part of that. I just dont rate him as highly as other folk obviosly, just my opinion. Id rather we went for villa than silva. I think we can all agree that nando and villa work well together.

so who's gonna sit on the bench nando or villa? Silva is a very good player who fits our system, why would change our system for one player?

MementoMori

daithijjj wrote: »

I will have to disagree on the 'great value' part of that. I just dont rate him as highly as other folk obviosly, just my opinion. Id rather we went for villa than silva. I think we can all agree that nando and villa work well together.

I don't think there would be general agreement that nando and villa work well together. Havent seem much of them apart from the Euros and they didn't seem to be a great partnership there in the way that Nando and Stevie are.

Also Villa would be another that I would think is way out of our price range as well - I really can't imagine any scenario where he could end up at Anfield this summer. Too many other wealthier clubs interested in him.

Blackhorse Slim

daithijjj wrote: »

Id rather we went for villa than silva. I think we can all agree that nando and villa work well together.

Villa is top class, but as for him and Torres working well together... they are Spain's answer to the Gerrard/Lampard partnership :eek:

Boggles

daithijjj wrote: »

I will have to disagree on the 'great value' part of that. I just dont rate him as highly as other folk obviosly, just my opinion. Id rather we went for villa than silva. I think we can all agree that nando and villa work well together.

Where does that leave Gerrard though?

As Villa will walk / booted if benched, same with Torres.

You need a striker that will sit on the bench, Villa ain't going do that.

Fromvert

BastardPrince wrote: »

so who's gonna sit on the bench nando or villa? Silva is a very good player who fits our system, why would change our system for one player?

Who sits on the bench for Man U, Berbatov and Tevez regularly how much they cost £50m+. We need strength and depth enough of this, we shouldnt buy a big name striker because one of them will sit on the bench.

lint316

BastardPrince wrote: »

so who's gonna sit on the bench nando or villa? Silva is a very good player who fits our system, why would change our system for one player?

Because the current system is too vulnerable in many ways. More strikers like Villa, Aguero would give us more options and doesn't mean we can't use the current system ever again. There's 60 games a season and Gerrard and Torres can't play them all

PiE

Fromvert wrote: »

Who sits on the bench for Man U, Berbatov and Tevez regularly how much they cost £50m+. We need strength and depth enough of this, we shouldnt buy a big name striker because one of them will sit on the bench.

It's easier to get players to sit on the bench when they're winning PL and CL medals.

Fromvert

PiE wrote: »

It's easier to get players to sit on the bench when they're winning PL and CL medals.

Is that not why we would buy them, to win the premiership and CL.

Chardee MacDennis

Fromvert wrote: »

Who sits on the bench for Man U, Berbatov and Tevez regularly how much they cost £50m+. We need strength and depth enough of this, we shouldnt buy a big name striker because one of them will sit on the bench.

united had a top class first 11 before they spent money on Berbatov. we have position(s?) in our first eleven that need improving before we start increasing our strength in depth up front...

and its not as if we have the money united have...

PiE

Fromvert wrote: »

Is that not why we would buy them, to win the premiership and CL.

Of course - but a club has to earn that sort of pulling power by first winning titles.

whatawaster

daithijjj wrote: »

I will have to disagree on the 'great value' part of that. I just dont rate him as highly as other folk obviosly, just my opinion. Id rather we went for villa than silva. I think we can all agree that nando and villa work well together.

signing Villa would be an error imo. We need to build our team around Stevie and Torres. That means quality wingers, and people to take the front two's place when they are injured. i think Yossi can do well in Stevie's role. We need someone who will be happy to spend the majority of games on the bench, but will do a good job when they come in. Obviously someone like that probably won't be cheap. My preference would be to sign a winger who can also play up front.

daithijjj

PiE wrote: »

What?

I'm saying Ribery is far more "in demand" than Torres was when we signed him. As whatawaster said above, he'd cost a lot more due to this. And I'm also saying that if given the choice (which he undoubtedly would be), he would choose several teams ahead of Liverpool.

Why is ribery far more 'in demand' than torres? Torres was courted by every single big club since he was 19. I apologise for that previous flippant comment btw, it wasnt meant to be but i think you might be doing us a disservice by saying ribery would choose several clubs over us. Do you not think we are a big enough club for ribery? As far as im concerned hes with an inferior club to us at the moment.

Boggles

Fromvert wrote: »

Who sits on the bench for Man U, Berbatov and Tevez regularly how much they cost £50m+. We need strength and depth enough of this, we shouldnt buy a big name striker because one of them will sit on the bench.

Exactly Liverpool can't afford to have a striker (25m-30m) sit on the bench.

Were you in a Coma through the Keane thing?

Fromvert

I can see your points, but we have decent enough cover in the wide positions to make do. Kuyt/Riera/Yossi/Babel can all do a job. But we have no real cover/competition for Gerrard and Torres. Yeah Kuyt can play up front but he doesnt score as much as when he plays on the right. Yossi has played well in behind a striker, has been great behind the second half of the season. We also need cover at RB.
But I really think we need another top class striker or attacking player, but I dont Silva is the answer.

Fromvert

Boggles wrote: »

Exactly Liverpool can't afford to have a striker (25m-30m) sit on the bench.

Were you in a Coma through the Keane thing?

Keane just wasnt right, but we are not talking about him. Just because he failed doesnt mean we should never spend big money on another striker.

Boggles

Barry 8 million, Left back, Left Wing. Central

Johnson 10 million (+7 owed) Right back, Right Wing

Sell some of the dross, get a 15 million pound striker.

PiE

daithijjj wrote: »

Why is ribery far more 'in demand' than torres?

Left-sided players of Ribery's abilities are much harder to come by.

i think you might be doing us a disservice by saying ribery would choose several clubs over us. Do you not think we are a big enough club for ribery? As far as im concerned hes with an inferior club to us at the moment.

I'm just being realistic. There are more attractive propositions out there for a player like Ribery - Liverpool (probably) aren't all that special to him. Man U & Barcelona are streets ahead of us in the pulling power stakes while Madrid, Chelsea and Inter would arguably be ahead too, with a lot more money to boot.

daithijjj

whatawaster wrote: »

signing Villa would be an error imo. We need to build our team around Stevie and Torres. That means quality wingers, and people to take the front two's place when they are injured. i think Yossi can do well in Stevie's role. We need someone who will be happy to spend the majority of games on the bench, but will do a good job when they come in. Obviously someone like that probably won't be cheap. My preference would be to sign a winger who can also play up front.

Are you serious?

"What we need is someone who is happy to spend the majority of games on the bench".

We walk a different path my friend. We need players on the pitch, not the bench, and preferably one or two better players than we have in certain positions at the moment.

lint316

I think Liverpool need to sign two big names this summer. Silva +1 would be great

daithijjj

PiE wrote: »

Left-sided players of Ribery's abilities are much harder to come by.


I'm just being realistic. There are more attractive propositions out there for a player like Ribery - Liverpool (probably) aren't all that special to him. Man U & Barcelona are streets ahead of us in the pulling power stakes while Madrid, Chelsea and Inter would arguably be ahead too, with a lot more money to boot.

Aye, fair enough points made there. Its just my opinion that ribery is not someone who goes to a team with the flash cash, he plays in a country with a wage cap, a great testament to the man, im sure he could demand what he likes if he moved on. I have alot of time for players who make football their priority and not cash, thats why i love benny, he took a paycut to join us because we are LFC. I think ribery has a similar philosophy which would put us on equal terms where cash is not the 'b all and end all of everything.

daosulli

Boggles wrote: »

Barry 8 million, Left back, Left Wing. Central

Johnson 10 million (+7 owed) Right back, Right Wing

Sell some of the dross, get a 15 million pound striker.

Have to agree with Jyou about Johnson, think he would be a great buy

~Rebel~

Fromvert wrote: »

Who sits on the bench for Man U, Berbatov and Tevez regularly how much they cost £50m+. We need strength and depth enough of this, we shouldnt buy a big name striker because one of them will sit on the bench.

Would be nothing short of madness to buy top quality players as backup when we still need top quality players in first team positions...

SlickRic

Boggles wrote: »

Barry 8 million, Left back, Left Wing. Central

Johnson 10 million (+7 owed) Right back, Right Wing

Sell some of the dross, get a 15 million pound striker.

this is the correct answer.

the top 2 being the absolute priority, with top-quality striker cover the final piece of our summer jigsaw. that's not to say a striker isn't important; it's just filling in the wide positions is of the utmost importance.

signing barry is surely a no-brainer for us, especially since he's so versatile.

whatawaster

daithijjj wrote: »

Are you serious?

"What we need is someone who is happy to spend the majority of games on the bench".

We walk a different path my friend. We need players on the pitch, not the bench, and preferably one or two better players than we have in certain positions at the moment.

We do need to improve certain positions on the pitch. The priorities being 1)Left Wing 2) Right Wing 3) Right Back

On the pitch we have Gerrard and Torres. Two of the best players in the world. They have a great understanding and work terrifically well together. Both are in the form of their careers.
Why on earth would we disturb that to bring in another striker? I want the money we have spent on the 3 positions above that need improving in our first 11. Realistically, I’d be happy with one winger and a full back.

Then we need to strengthen the thin areas of our squad. At the moment they are right back (should be covered by above purchase), central midfield and up front.

Someone like Villa is not a priority at all, because, given that I don’t think he’s better than Torres or Gerrard, he will not strengthen our first XI, given this very effective system we’ve adopted.

Jesus Wept

It's not a jigsaw! lol.

jesus_thats_gre

SlickRic wrote: »

this is the correct answer.

the top 2 being the absolute priority, with top-quality striker cover the final piece of our summer jigsaw. that's not to say a striker isn't important; it's just filling in the wide positions is of the utmost importance.

signing barry is surely a no-brainer for us, especially since he's so versatile.

Completely agree with yourself and Boggles..

SlickRic

The-Rigger wrote: »

It's not a jigsaw! lol.

yes it is, it's a metaphor.

putting the pieces together to create a full picture of a squad that is even more capable of winning things next season.

it's a perfectly apt use of the word.

daithijjj

whatawaster wrote: »

We do need to improve certain positions on the pitch. The priorities being 1)Left Wing 2) Right Wing 3) Right Back

On the pitch we have Gerrard and Torres. Two of the best players in the world. They have a great understanding and work terrifically well together. Both are in the form of their careers.
Why on earth would we disturb that to bring in another striker? I want the money we have spent on the 3 positions above that need improving in our first 11. Realistically, I’d be happy with one winger and a full back.

Then we need to strengthen the thin areas of our squad. At the moment they are right back (should be covered by above purchase), central midfield and up front.

Someone like Villa is not a priority at all, because, given that I don’t think he’s better than Torres or Gerrard, he will not strengthen our first XI, given this very effective system we’ve adopted.

Hang on a minute, something has been lost in translation here. We are basically agreed. I only brought up villa because i thought he was a better player than silva, i never mentioned signing him, i merely suggested i would prefer him to villa if given the choice. You say we need better players to play right back and right mid, 100% agree. I think johnson is perfect for us to be honest, he can play both if required.

Chardee MacDennis

daithijjj wrote: »

I only brought up villa because i thought he was a better player than silva, i never mentioned signing him, i merely suggested i would prefer him to villa if given the choice.

does anyone have that gif of the smiley banging it's head off a wall? i have a feeling i may need it this summer...

SWAR

I have to agree with some of the posts regarding Silva...don't rate him as highly as some people do and quite frankly I'm not sure how he would adapt to the premiership. As regards Villa, yes we could do with him of course, but for the money we would potentially need to shell out to get him, well I think it would be better spent elsewhere. I would love to see Glen Johnson and Arron Lennon and I don't want Barry if it means selling Alonso (gonna be a long summer on this issue :mad:). Sure Barry can play in various positions but we are pretty solid on the left hand side.

I think we also need a support striker...someone like Tuncay who would cost very little and will be content with a bit-part role and could definately do a job when he comes on. I also think Ngog has got a lot of potential...maybe not too many appearances for him next year but has definately showed signs this season.

As regards who goes...well I think Dosenna will be sold and I wouldn't be too sad to see Babel go. I have been waiting for him to show his potential for the last few years but it simply hasn't happened and I think Rafa has lost faith in him.