Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

rossie1977

5starpool wrote: »

I do wish we had someone that was an undisputed deputy to Torres, but finding someone good enough, that is willing to play mostly second fiddle while upsetting pundits/fans somewhat due to lack of action, or finding someone who is versatile enough to fit in across a range of roles and be affordable, while at the same time be a decent option up front in the current syste, is far from easy.

yeah this is key, rafa was slated from every side for using keane as backup last year, for using crouch as backup the year before and bellamy as backup the year before that, none of those guys wanted to play second fiddle either

rossie1977

Kirby wrote: »

As i said earlier, agree to disagree. I know when I'm fighting a losing battle, too many die-harders in here and the thread is getting off-topic. The proof is in the pudding as they say, we shall see if Benitez guides Liverpool to glory. Im guessing not, but hey, thats just me. Apparently I'm wrong, Rafa is brilliant and nobody has anything to worry about

sure you are in a win-win situation either way so, be happy

Kirby

rossie1977 wrote: »

yeah this is key, rafa was slated from every side for using keane as backup last year, for using crouch as backup the year before and bellamy as backup the year before that, none of those guys wanted to play second fiddle either

Karmafaerie 's poll clearly proves that wrong though! Everyone agrees with Rafa.

Seriously though, I would like to see the United dominance end. It would make it a more interesting league and Liverpool winning it would definately accomplish that. I'd also like to see Villa and City break into the big 4 and make it a more big 6. I think both clubs have the right men at the helm to do it, if they are allowed.

~Rebel~

Kirby wrote: »

Yes, he does. Which is why they get thrashed playing relegation teams middlesbrough. Listen, stop being so evangelistic about it and read my post and apply some logic. Read what I wrote. He gets it right sometimes, The real madrid example that I gave that you chose to ignore.

But he also gets it wrong. and the biased fan in you needs to see that. He has bought some substandard players for alot of money, persists with a defensive system from set pieces that the majority would agree is inefficient, is very stubborn, etc. He feels he needs to be the centre of attention, like some referees do. You often see him waving his arms about on the sidelines and gesticulating to the players in ways they can't understand.

Saying he gets it right sometimes, and wrong sometimes is not in any way similar to saying the players ignore his decisions to do whatever the fuk they want. Of course he gets it wrong sometimes, he's only human, thankfully, as evidenced by the 86points last season and his spanish winners medals, he gets it right the majority of the time.

Liverpool went on a bad run after his "rant" last season. It was ill advised and another example of putting himself and his ego above the team. They didn't need that.

He is a decent manager. He has some very positive aspects. But I stand by my position. Liverpool have the team to win the premiership but not the manager.

Are the players absolved of blame because of rafa's conference (it was in no way shape or form a 'rant')? They're paid a lot of money by LFC and if they underperform a lot of the blame has to rest with them.

Dublin_Gunner

~Rebel~ wrote: »

Are the players absolved of blame because of rafa's conference (it was in no way shape or form a 'rant')? They're paid a lot of money by LFC and if they underperform a lot of the blame has to rest with them.

As I had stated here:

I cannot blame Rafa for Babels ruthless inconsistency, Lucas' naivity, Gerrard going off the boil (after injury), Keane not fitting in (and I think Babel playing with him had a lot to do with that), and some of the youngsters inexperience.

The manager chose the team, its up to the players to justify their call up to the squad - and on occasion, they came a long way short.

We had a few players who were brilliantly consistent - from whom the other members of the squad could learn a lot; Kuyt, Benny, Masch, Carra, Alonso (to an extent), & Torres.

If the rest of our team could play each and every game with the determination that the above showed every time they pull on a red jersey - we would have walked away with the league.

I really should have put Reina in there too, but I was referring only to outfield players.

Karmafaerie

Well in fairness Benni only had an okay start to the campaign, and Gerrard was immense 90% of the time.

Dublin_Gunner

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Well in fairness Benni only had an okay start to the campaign, and Gerrard was immense 90% of the time.

Benny, IMO, was one of the stars of last season. Him coming off the bench did a lot more than people seem to give him credit for. His scoring, passing, skipping by players, just generally attack minded, and always gave 100%.

Gerrard, when fit, was excellent. He did have a dip in form though, after he came back, which I alluded to already - and its justifiable.

~Rebel~

Details from the trial. They're clearly fond of going for the theatrical approach...Gerrards has the "style and speed of a professional boxer rather than a professional footballer".

Steven Gerrard "totally lost it" and hit a man "with the style and speed of a professional boxer", a court heard today.

Gerrard is at Liverpool Crown Court charged with affray after the alleged attack on businessman Marcus McGee.

All his co-defendants have now pleaded guilty to leave Gerrard facing trial alone.

Prosecutor David Turner QC claims that the fight started at the Lounge Inn, in Southport, Merseyside, when Gerrard asked McGee for a card that controlled the music in the bar.

Turner alleges that Gerrard said to McGee: "Here y'are lad. Give me that lad."

He went on to say: "Mr McGee took offence at his attitude and the expression 'lad' and he refused. Not many people on Merseyside, or indeed anywhere else, would refuse a request from Steven Gerrard but Mr McGee did.

"There can be no doubt that this refusal astounded Steven Gerrard. He walked away back to his party but the CCTV shows how much his mood had changed. He was no longer the centre of that high spirited party.

"He was clearly walking around pondering, musing over what had happened - about the man who said 'no' to Steven Gerrard."

Gerrard then allegedly went back to confront McGee, and his friend John Doran - who has pleaded guilty to affray - threw the first blow in a physical confrontation.

The prosecution then alleged: "We say at this stage Gerrard totally lost it. Almost immediately after the blow from John Doran, in fact within seconds, Steven Gerrard joined in the attack with a succession of well aimed uppercut punches delivered with the style and speed of a professional boxer rather than a professional footballer."

http://football365.com/story/0,17033,8652_5446443,00.html

gucci

~Rebel~ wrote: »

"He was clearly walking around pondering, musing over what had happened - about the man who said 'no' to Steven Gerrard."

Sounds like someone can mind read, if Stevie is up against some sort of psychic ninja lawyer he is screwed!

Fink Goddie

Karmafaerie wrote: »

This thread makes baby Jesus cry.:(

Baby Jesus is a Man u supporter!

5starpool

Remember too though, that Benayoun had a moan or two to the press about not getting enough opportunities around January or so, and the reason his appearances before then were fairly limited was that his form was fairly limited too. Saying that, he obviously was onle of our best players for the last 3 months of the campaign, and I really hope he, and the team in general, start next season like we finished last season.

Karmafaerie

Today on Judge Judy.

Morzadec

Ok to move away from all this rigmarole...

Everything's gone very quiet on the whole Xabi front. I was expecting things to happen once the 18th deadline passed, but absolutely nothing today, not even in any of the rags....

I suppose no news is good news and the longer this goes on, the less likely it seems he is to leave. Fingers crossed anyway.

jesus_thats_gre

Am still waiting for this Villa and Silva announcement

5starpool

Morzadec wrote: »

Ok to move away from all this rigmarole...

Everything's gone very quiet on the whole Xabi front. I was expecting things to happen once the 18th deadline passed, but absolutely nothing today, not even in any of the rags....

I suppose no news is good news and the longer this goes on, the less likely it seems he is to leave. Fingers crossed anyway.

But if he is going to leave, it would be best for everyone if it were now rather than at the end of August, where even if we could get a replacement of sorts, they would have had no time to try and settle in before getting stuck in.

I really wish he would do a Stevie G from 2005 and tell everyone else to fck off, that he has realised that he wants to stay here for life.

Karmafaerie

Ryan Babel ready to repay faith - Liverpool FC boss Rafa BenitezJul 21 2009 by James Pearce, Liverpool Echo

LIVERPOOL boss Rafa Benitez believes Ryan Babel will justify the faith he has shown in him – starting with tomorrow’s friendly against Thailand in Bangkok.

The 22-year-old Dutchman has struggled to live up to his £11.5million price tag since he arrived from Ajax two years ago.

However, Benitez has resisted the temptation to offload the winger and is backing Babel to be a major hit at Anfield next season.

“We have been really impressed with Ryan,” Benitez said.

“He worked hard in the summer and he came back really fit.

“He’s trying to do his best and that’s very positive when you have a player with his talent.

“The first two years in a foreign country are always difficult. Now he has the right mentality and I’m sure he will improve.”

The Reds touched down in Thailand yesterday after a 10-hour flight from Vienna and received a hero’s welcome in the capital Bangkok.

They face Thailand at the Rajamangala Stadium tomorrow (kick-off 2pm UK time) before making the short trip to play Singapore on Sunday.

After a goalless stalemate with St Gallen and a 1-0 defeat to Rapid Vienna, Benitez is looking for a big improvement.
The 28-man squad has been boosted by the return of Fernando Torres, Pepe Reina, Xabi Alonso, Albert Riera, Alvaro Arbeloa, Andrea Dossena and Javier Mascherano following their extended summer breaks.

"For us this is a really important stage of the season," Benitez said.

“Everything we do is preparing the players for the first Premier League game. We must spend this time getting them match fit and working on tactics.

“We analysed what happened last year and know what we can improve on. This time is crucial to what we achieve when the season starts.

“We will continue to prepare them well this week and look to play well in the games.

“It was disappointing to lose in Vienna and you can’t be happy when you don’t win but there were lots of positives to take from the game.

“Hopefully we can keep working well and keep working hard over here.”

Benitez refused to be drawn on Alonso’s future – despite a barrage of questions about where the midfielder will be playing next season.

The midfielder has been heavily linked with a move to Real Madrid but he is expected to play some part in tomorrow’s fixture.

“Xabi Alonso is with us and available,” Benitez said. “His future is to enjoy his time here this week with the people in Thailand – enjoy the weather, the game and the journalists. For the next week he will be here.

“We will talk together about tactics, prepare for the game and try to enjoy our football.

“We have a lot of respect for our fans here so we will try to use all the senior players.

“But the Spanish players and Dossena and Mascherano arrived back late because of the Confederations Cup and internationals, so they will probably not play as much as the other players.”

Meanwhile, Benitez is unlikely to be conducting any transfer business while he’s away after insisting he’s happy with the make up of his squad.

“We have already signed Glen Johnson, an England international, who is a very good signing,” he said.

“Also Andriy Voronin has come back after being one of the best players in the German League.”

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-fc/liverpool-fc-news/2009/07/21/ryan-babel-ready-to-repay-faith-liverpool-fc-boss-rafa-benitez-100252-24203300/

Karmafaerie

I was really worried about Babel not getting another year at the start of the summer.

I know that he'll shut up a lot of the critics this year.
Just like I feel Nani will at Utd (unfortunately:P).

The Recliner

Karmafaerie wrote: »

I was really worried about Babel not getting another year at the start of the summer.

I know that he'll shut up a lot of the critics this year.
Just like I feel Nani will at Utd (unfortunately:P).

I don't share your confidence in either to be honest

hopefully I am wrong about Babel though

jesus_thats_gre

Karmafaerie wrote: »

I was really worried about Babel not getting another year at the start of the summer.

I know that he'll shut up a lot of the critics this year.
Just like I feel Nani will at Utd (unfortunately:P).

Hopefully Babel will get a chance to play as a forward this season. Hopefully he takes the chance when it comes too.

Agree about Nani. Personally think he will do a lot more to justify his fee than Anderson.

Kess73

Karmafaerie wrote: »

I was really worried about Babel not getting another year at the start of the summer.

I know that he'll shut up a lot of the critics this year.
Just like I feel Nani will at Utd (unfortunately:P).

I hope you are right about the former, and wrong about the latter.

GuanYin

kirby, mike65, deadskin and karmafaerie (to name but a few).

The next time any of you snipe at each other, discussing moderation or go off topic, even partially in a post, you're getting a ban. You can disagree and debate without being petty.

REPORT THE POST if you have a problem, don't respond, don't quote, don't post some glib remark, JUST REPORT THE POST.

There seriously won't be any more warnings before bans.

Glico Man

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Am still waiting for this Villa and Silva announcement

you'll be waiting for an eternity for either of these stories to develop.

but fingers crossed it's just around the corner.....

daithijjj

I love the way some folk in here roll out the stats to show how many goals we scored last season to prove one point. And virtually with the same breath, claim that we 'need' voronin in the squad. :cool:

Every man and his dog in the street knows that the manager would sell him for practically any cash at this point.

Voronin will cost the club 2.5 mil in wages (estimate) over the next year, such 'meagre' sums can make all the difference when it comes to swaying a negotiation for a player who actually can make a difference.

I have no gripe against voronin but some of you carry on like your talking about a close relative.

Somebody mentioned he was voted player of the year at his club last season, quite frankly, i dont care if he was voted into the college of cardinals at the vatican, he wont make any difference to our season. He simply isnt the required standard. And i know we are not flush at the moment but somebody like tuncay/mcarthy would be much better and would not cost the earth either.

Karmafaerie

daithijjj wrote: »

I love the way some folk in here roll out the stats to show how many goals we scored last season to prove one point. And virtually with the same breath, claim that we 'need' voronin in the squad. :cool:

A goal scoring record of over 1 in 2 last season.
we also bring those pesky fahcts up about Voronin too.

daithijjj wrote:

Every man and his dog in the street knows that the manager would sell him for practically any cash at this point.

Never take advice from dogs, they have only a very rudimentary grasp of economics.

Rafa won't sell him for any money, judging by the simple fact that Rafa priced Voronin out of the market for Hertha, who were really interested in buying him, at 4 million.

daithijjj wrote:

Voronin will cost the club 2.5 mil in wages (estimate) over the next year, such 'meagre' sums can make all the difference when it comes to swaying a negotiation for a player who actually can make a difference.

Who of course will cost less than 2.5 million and work for free.:rolleyes:
Or is Voronin the only player who gets paid wages in the world.

The 2.5 is roughly £50,000 a week.
I'd say it's closer to £40,000, but lets even use estimate.

Any other player who could make a difference, in this overinflated market, would cost a minimum of £12,000,000.
Would have a signing on fee of around £1,000,000.
Would be on wages of at least £40,000 a week, meaning another £2,000,000.

So we're talking of an estimate of £15,000,000 all in just for this year, not including the other 3 years of his contract.

So Voronin, who is criminally underated for £2,500,000.
Or Player X for £15,000,000.

Notice a slight difference?

That £12,500,000 not spent could then be put towards a wide player like Sneijder/Silva/Young etc

daithijjj wrote:

I have no gripe against voronin but some of you carry on like your talking about a close relative.

Somebody mentioned he was voted player of the year at his club last season, quite frankly, i dont care if he was voted into the college of cardinals at the vatican, he wont make any difference to our season. He simply isnt the required standard. And i know we are not flush at the moment but somebody like tuncay/mcarthy would be much better and would not cost the earth either.

Again you ignore the little things like Tuncay/Martins signing on fee, and wages.
Both Martins and Tuncay offer roughly the same as what Voronin does.
No better.
Lets even say we could get them really cheap.
£5,000,000 transfer.
And the only asked for signing on bonus of £500,000.
And only for wages of £30,000 a week, so £1,500,000 a year
(All of which is way lower than it would be).

That all adds up to £7,000,000
£4,500,000 more than you think is wasted on Voronin.

And if you think that Tuncay will do anything that Voronin won't to win a league, you're very much mistaken.

Also, can you not see it as unreasonable that you say you don't care how well a player played last season.
Players have terrible seasons.
Look at Berbatov last season.
Does that mean that you wouldn't let Berba play for Liverpool, cause he had one bad season?

You admit that you don't know, or care how good Voronin was last season, or any other season.
You personaly have made up your mind about him, so we have no right to disagree with you?

The reason I mentioned Berbatov of course is the similarities between the players.

Both played together for a couple of years at Leverkusen.
Both came to the premiership, but had a bad season in their first at a top 4 club.

Now Berba is a hell of a lot better than Voronin.
But Voronin is good enough to sit on our bench, and free up funds for a wideman.

As I said, if Rafa does decide to bring in a front man, I'm sure Voronin will go, and I'm not too bothered.
If not, I'm more than happy to have him on the bench.

Don't cast off a player based on 6 months of bellow average football, and deliberately ignore the years of good football under his belt.

jesus_thats_gre

daithijjj wrote: »

I have no gripe against voronin but some of you carry on like your talking about a close relative.

Really, I was starting to wonder whether he ****ed your pony or something.

Let it go will you. No one here is praising him. We are just saying that he isn't as bad as some a making out and that the slating he gets is over the top when you consider the stats. If you don't want to hear anymore about Andre The Great, stop slating him unfairly and you won't have anyone defending him.

daithijjj

Karmafaerie wrote: »

A goal scoring record of over 1 in 2 last season.
we also bring those pesky fahcts up about Voronin too.




Never take advice from dogs, they have only a very rudimentary grasp of economics.

Rafa won't sell him for any money, judging by the simple fact that Rafa priced Voronin out of the market for Hertha, who were really interested in buying him, at 4 million.




Who of course will cost less than 2.5 million and work for free.:rolleyes:
Or is Voronin the only player who gets paid wages in the world.

The 2.5 is roughly £50,000 a week.
I'd say it's closer to £40,000, but lets even use estimate.

Any other player who could make a difference, in this overinflated market, would cost a minimum of £12,000,000.
Would have a signing on fee of around £1,000,000.
Would be on wages of at least £40,000 a week, meaning another £2,000,000.

So we're talking of an estimate of £15,000,000 all in just for this year, not including the other 3 years of his contract.

So Voronin, who is criminally underated for £2,500,000.
Or Player X for £15,000,000.

Notice a slight difference?

That £12,500,000 not spent could then be put towards a wide player like Sneijder/Silva/Young etc




Again you ignore the little things like Tuncay/Martins signing on fee, and wages.

Also, can you not see it as unreasonable that you say you don't care how well a player played last season.
players have terrible seasons.
Look at Berbatov last season.
Does that mean that you wouldn't let Berba play for Liverpool, cause he had one bad season.

You admit that you don't know, or care how good Voronin was last season, or any other season.
You personaly have made up your mind about him, so we have no right to disagree with you?

the reason I mentioned Berbatov of course is the similarities between the players.

Both played together for a couple of years at Leverkusen.
Both came to the premiership, but had a bad season in their first at a top 4 club.

Now Berba is a hell of a lot better than Voronin.
But Voronin is good enough to sit on our bench, and free up funds for a wideman.

As I said, if Rafa does decide to bring in a front man, I'm sure Voronin will go, and I'm not too bothered.
If not, I'm more than happy to have him on the bench.

Don't cast off a player based on 6 months of bellow average football, and deliberately ignore the years of good football under his belt.

The german league is tripe in comparison to what it was.That is a simple fact that you cannot grasp it seems.

And a decent player costs "money", thats a new one on me, il have to evaluate everything differently now :rolleyes:

daithijjj

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Really, I was starting to wonder whether he ****ed your pony or something.

Let it go will you. No one here is praising him. We are just saying that he isn't as bad as some a making out and that the slating he gets is over the top when you consider the stats. If you don't want to hear anymore about Andre The Great, stop slating him unfairly and you won't have anyone defending him.

****ed my pony???????? ......great comment there, congrats.

jesus_thats_gre

daithijjj wrote: »

****ed my pony???????? ......great comment there, congrats.

You trying to claim that you have no gripes with Andre is worth a clap in fairness.. Next you will be claiming that you have been making a reasoned, balanced argument that considers his performance stats, wages, transfer fee, cost to replace him and the willingness of someone else to play second fiddle to Torres..

As I have said again. Voronin is merely an average player. He doesn't deserve any particular praise and doesn't deserve to get slated either.

Karmafaerie

Just thought I'd add this.
When hertha were topping the table, and looked like the had a chance of winning the league, voronin was considered the talisman by both players and fans.
After he scored the winner against Leverkuson for insance.

Against Bayer, Hertha scored when Andriy Voronin's shot bounced off Leverkusen keeper René Adler and back on to his chest. "Thinner players wouldn't have made that goal," asserted the Liverpool loanee. "I scored with my sexy chest." It's hard to know whether team-mate Pal Dardai buys into this theory, but the Hungarian has certainly been impressed with the 29-year-old's contribution so far. Dardai called for the striker's ponytail to be cut off and put on show in the club museum "in case we achieve something big". Neutrals can agree that might be a very good reason for Hertha to win it, after all.

Boggles

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Both played together for a couple of years at Leverkusen.
Both came to the premiership, but had a bad season in their first at a top 4 club.

Lolz

Jesus Karma, Berba has been top class in the 3 years of his premier league career. He had by no means a bad season last year, he was bad at times, average at times but most important top class at times.

The only comparson you can make is they both played in the Bundesliga, where again Berbs distinguished himself on a different footballing universe to Voronin.

daithijjj

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

You trying to claim that you have no gripes with Andre is worth a clap in fairness.. Next you will be claiming that you have been making a reasoned, balanced argument that considers his performance stats, wages, transfer fee, cost to replace him and the willingness of someone else to play second fiddle to Torres..

As I have said again. Voronin is merely an average player. He doesn't deserve any particular praise and doesn't deserve to get slated either.

Andre????????.

What is your point??

You say he is merely average, how is that different from saying he should be sold?

Average is not good enough, end of story.

DeadSkin

Ok! Ok!

Chelsea & City keen on Alonso

Chelsea & Man City enquire after Xabi Alonso

Chelsea and Manchester City have contacted the agent of Xabi Alonso enquiring after the player`s situation at Liverpool...


In the last 48 hours, Xabi has spoken publicly for the first time since returning for pre-season. The Liverpool midfielder told Spanish newspaper AS that: “It`s always a great feeling when Madrid want you, especially considering the phase of the career I am in now...Madrid`s project is certainly impressive. But beyond that, I can`t tell you anything else.”


Xabi`s words have, understandably, been well received in Madrid, but the Spanish club continue to insist that they will not increase their last offer of €27 million for the Liverpool midfielder. Nevertheless, I suspect that, unless Madrid make another signing for the central midfield role, they may very well return with a higher offer following a few summer friendlies and it becomes increasingly apparent to Pellegrini that his side needs a player who possesses Alonso`s qualities providing control and stability in midfield.

Meanwhile, Liverpool remain unwilling to reduce their asking price and Rafa Benitez` public statements support that stance. However, as the player caught in the middle becomes increasingly frustrated and is pushed towards making a more public expression of his desire to leave, the likelihood that other clubs will start taking an interest grows.


As a consequence, Liverpool`s premiership rivals Chelsea and Manchester City have both made enquiries with Xabi`s agent, although at this moment in time, neither side appear willing to pay more than €30 million for the midfielder.

http://www.guillembalague.com/rumores_desp.php?id=218&titulo=Chelsea%20&%20Man%20City%20enquire%20after%20Xabi%20Alonso

Karmafaerie

daithijjj wrote: »

The german league is tripe in comparison to what it was.That is a simple fact that you cannot grasp it seems.

Yet lots of great players seem to be coming from there.

Diego to Juve for 25 million for instance.

A certain Mr Ribery plays there as well I heard.

Swinsteiger.
Klose
Demicheles
Mertesacker
Frings
Hyypia;)

Bremen got to the final of the Uefa Cup, and Bayern got to the quarters of the CL.


But that's all besides the point.
A league being bad, doesn't make everyone in that league bad.

That's what you seem to not be able to grasp.

daithijjj wrote:

And a decent player costs "money", thats a new one on me, il have to evaluate everything differently now :rolleyes:

good, cause you clearly need to.

Or were you just trying to bend the truth when you implied that Voronin was costing us money, and that a new player magically wouldn't!

Karmafaerie

Boggles wrote: »

Lolz

Jesus Karma, Berba has been top class in the 3 years of his premier league career. He had by no means a bad season last year, he was bad at times, average at times but most important top class at times.

The only comparson you can make is they both played in the Bundesliga, where again Berbs distinguished himself on a different footballing universe to Voronin.

Damn and here I was thinking that I said that Berba was in a different league to Voronin as a player in my post, therefore making your post completely unnecesary, and redundant.


Oh.

I did.

Karmafaerie

daithijjj wrote: »

Average is good enough for a squad player, end of story.

There.

FTFY.

GuanYin

daithijjj & jesus_thats_gre are taking some time off to cool down.

Boggles

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Damn and here I was thinking that I said that Berba was in a different league to Voronin as a player in my post, therefore making your post completely unnecesary, and redundant.

You were listing stupid similarities, stopping short at they are both Capricons, to make what point, I don't know.

Vornin is worth 2 million

Berba is worth 30 million

Pick someone else.

Voronin could come good, he has the skills, just not the pace Karma, which will hold him back.

I know you listed Owen earlier, but Owen is a poacher, nothing like Voronin.

One other thing I will say about Voronin, he does actually have the heart, and I think he needs to be loved, if the fans get on side, he could play above himself.

IMO though, he will be scapegoated at the end of the season if he actually stays on.

shotamoose

daithijjj wrote: »

You say he is merely average, how is that different from saying he should be sold?

It's different because we live in a world where we don't get everything we want, and in that world average players can have their uses. I'm sure if Rafa could stuff his entire squad with world-beating geniuses, he would. Or do you think that hasn't occurred to him?

ButcherOfNog

Boggles wrote: »

Berba is worth 30 million

Brought a smile to my face that one

mike65

If Alonso ends up at another Prem club I'll throw the rattle..I will!

NukaCola

I find it funny that some Liverpool "fans" would be so critical of a Liverpool player despite the fact of that player coming out and saying he wants to stay and fight for his place in the team i.e Voronin, and not bat an eyelid when another Liverpool player will not come out and say he wants to stay at Liverpool but come out with dross about If Madrid sign me great, if i stay at Liverpool that`ll be fine also ie Alonso. Before you reply with "Alonso is better, more important" etc etc I`m fully aware of the differences.

I just find it hard to believe some "fans" would single not just Voronin but others too (Kuyt/Lucas/Babel etc) for trying their best, IF they are picked to play they try there best, IF they arent good enough they wont start and be backups/squad players.

Cut these lads some slack, they are there to try and win medals and weren`t far off last season, get behind the manager and team and stop moaning.

Karmafaerie

Boggles wrote: »

You were listing stupid similarities, stopping short at they are both Capricons, to make what point, I don't know.

Vornin is worth 2 million

Berba is worth 30 million

Pick someone else.

Voronin could come good, he has the skills, just not the pace Karma, which will hold him back.

I know you listed Owen earlier, but Owen is a poacher, nothing like Voronin.

One other thing I will say about Voronin, he does actually have the heart, and I think he needs to be loved, if the fans get on side, he could play above himself.

IMO though, he will be scapegoated at the end of the season if he actually stays on.

Voronin is worth £4,000,000.
Berba is worth £20,000,000.

The simple reason that I chose Berba was because they both played together, and both are getting undue slack from certain elements of their fanbase.

I know that Berba is a hell of a lot more of a player, and wasn't comparing them as such.

As for the diferences between Voronin and Owen.
Neither have pace, and Owen is a better finisher.
But Voronin is more versatile.
He can, and has, played as a lone striker, part of a front two, a Gerrard esque attacking midfielder/second striker, a right wing forward, or a left wing forward.

It's 6 of one, half a dozen of another basically.

Karmafaerie

Great post Bumblebee.

Karmafaerie

The Mirror have the CCTV footage of Stevie killing a man with the power of his fists.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2009/07/21/liverpool-s-steven-gerrard-faces-affray-trial-alone-115875-21537119/

missingtime

Woah this thread has gone mental. Tis great.

I'm hoping the Voronin becomes this seasons Yossi!

Everone: Voronin Smells!

flanzer

Karmafaerie wrote: »

The Mirror have the CCTV footage of Stevie killing a man with the power of his fists.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2009/07/21/liverpool-s-steven-gerrard-faces-affray-trial-alone-115875-21537119/

I can only make out Gerrard getting held back..I think. There's more chance of Willy O'Dea getting that assault charge that Stevie getting anything. Handbags at most

fred funk }{

Karmafaerie wrote: »

The Mirror have the CCTV footage of Stevie killing a man with the power of his fists.

http://www.mirror.co.uk/sport/football/2009/07/21/liverpool-s-steven-gerrard-faces-affray-trial-alone-115875-21537119/

Fookin hell, is that it? Handbags to say the least.

Kess73

Interestlingly all six of Gerrard's friends have pleaded guilty to affray, and although Gerrard is pleading not guilty, the jury could still see it as a seven against one attack.


Gerrard's plea of self defence seems a bit weak after it was his mate that hit the guy. But I reckon money/status will talk in this and I would be very surprised if Gerrard got anything other than a slap on the wrist and maybe a fine. His mates may get minor sentences/fines.


Mind you, on the off chance the jury goes against him, it would cause a headache for the season ahead as the UK sentences for this is a large fine and/or between six months to three years in the slammer. Also if a person is found guilty of affray are then liable to being prosecuted for a full assault charge.

flahavaj

"Thinner players wouldn't have made that goal," asserted the Liverpool loanee. "I scored with my sexy chest."

What with all the handbags in this thread, the brilliance of this quote has totally flown under the radar. I'd make Voronin the club captain just for this comment alone.:pac:

flahavaj

Kess73 wrote: »

Interestlingly all six of Gerrard's friends have pleaded guilty to affray, and although Gerrard is pleading not guilty, the jury could still see it as a seven against one attack.


Gerrard's plea of self defence seems a bit weak after it was his mate that hit the guy. But I reckon money/status will talk in this and I would be very surprised if Gerrard got anything other than a slap on the wrist and maybe a fine. His mates may get minor sentences/fines.


Mind you, on the off chance the jury goes against him, it would cause a headache for the season ahead as the UK sentences for this is a large fine and/or between six months to three years in the slammer. Also if a person is found guilty of affray are then liable to being prosecuted for a full assault charge.

What are the chances of there being at least a couple of United, Everton or Chelsea fans on the jury!?:pac: