Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

Karmafaerie

pesireland wrote: »

Glad you said supposedly, i always thought i was the best in the world

I'm the best player in my own head!:D
(Somebody should tell me feet though!:p)

NabyLadistheman

Does anyone know what the story with Stevie Finnan is?? He has come pot and said he is in Limbo as he is fit and has totally been over-looked by Rafa. I would still rate Finnan and am amused to say the least

mike65

Andy Hunter in the Grauniad seems obsessed with Rafa/Barry saga

http://www.guardian.co.uk/football/2008/aug/19/astonvilla.liverpool

Mike.

missingtime

Parry should be taken out and shot.

Handsome Bob

Karmafaerie wrote: »

But we need a selfish player!
Every top team has one.
If you have a selfish player, with a touch of genius, all it takes is one moment to win a game.

Players like Ronaldo, Robben, Queresma, Figo back in the day, and IMO Babel, are game changers.
We have a great team of unselfish passers, especially now with Keane.
We need somebody who's willing to step up, and try and do the un-doable.

If nothing else, when Babel is running at three players, that's three players out of position, and creates tonnes of space for the others.

I remember Torres, Bennayoun and I think Gerrard, all scoring tap ins after Babel rounded a few fired a rocket of a shot that the keeper could just deflect, and then because all the defenders were surrounding Babel, we had players free in the six yard box.

Selfish players are neccesary.

That may be true, and as I said I have no issue with Babel taking a shot. But when he has options, a choice of trying to skin a player or putting another player clean through on goal, he trys to skin a player. That is not productive at all and he needs to realise when to bring someone else into the game when it's the better option.

Selfish players are necessary. But even selfish players need to learn when to go with the blatantly easier option, sometimes they just can't do it all on their own. Look at the partnership between Villa and Torres for Spain. Two top class players, two selfish players at times. But both knew when to put the other through on goal when it was the safer option.

slingerz

Someone like Arjen Robben would be the ideal player for Liverpool's wide attacking problems

Karmafaerie

LZ5by5 wrote: »

That may be true, and as I said I have no issue with Babel taking a shot. But when he has options, a choice of trying to skin a player or putting another player clean through on goal, he trys to skin a player. That is not productive at all and he needs to realise when to bring someone else into the game when it's the better option.

Selfish players are necessary. But even selfish players need to learn when to go with the blatantly easier option, sometimes they just can't do it all on their own. Look at the partnership between Villa and Torres for Spain. Two top class players, two selfish players at times. But both knew when to put the other through on goal when it was the safer option.

True, but look at last seson.
One of the most promising aspects for me was Gerrard and Torres helping Babel.
If you look back ove rhte games, you can see when Babel makes a game, nearly always either Torres or mainly Gerrard (due to the language barrier I bet!:P) were going over to him and talking to him.
That's what I love to see in a club.

pesireland

slingerz wrote: »

Someone like Arjen Robben would be the ideal player for Liverpool's wide attacking problems

OMG you just made me wet myself

Handsome Bob

Karmafaerie wrote: »

True, but look at last seson.
One of the most promising aspects for me was Gerrard and Torres helping Babel.
If you look back ove rhte games, you can see when Babel makes a game, nearly always either Torres or mainly Gerrard (due to the language barrier I bet!:P) were going over to him and talking to him.
That's what I love to see in a club.

There's no doubt that last season Babel provided performances of great menace, and did improve playing alongside Torres, Gerrard and Kuyt at the end of last season. Just one or two little improvements and he could be phenomenal this season.

PHB

Robben's injury problems make Kewell look fit.

Karmafaerie

LIVERPOOL are ready to turn their attentions to Albert Riera as hopes of bringing the Gareth Barry saga to a successful conclusion fade.

The Espanyol winger has been on Rafa Benitez’s radar for some time and is under consideration to fill the Reds’ troublesome left wing spot along with Middlesbrough’s Stewart Downing.

Liverpool scouts watched Riera on several occasions last season and the 26-year-old is thought to have improved a great deal since he spent a year on loan at Man City two seasons ago.

Riera has already made it clear that he would relish a move to Anfield if Liverpool were to make a concrete offer for his services and a bid could now be imminent with the Reds’ move for Barry all but dead.

The Liverpool board refuse to meet Aston Villa’s £18m asking price for the England man, believing it to be far in excess of what the player is worth.

Benitez is now coming to terms with the fact that, unless Villa decide to reduce the fee for Barry, he is unlikely to be able to land one of his top targets for his ongoing team rebuilding programme and is ready to consider alternatives.

The Reds boss was desperate to land Barry because he can provide cover at left midfield and left back as well as operating in his usual central midfield role.

With Liverpool’s early season performances showing that they are in urgent need of a player who can provide genuine width, Riera is now coming under the spotlight.

Benitez’s squad has been replenished with the return of Ryan Babel from the Olympics after his Holland side was knocked out of the football tournament by Argentina at the weekend.

And either Javier Mascherano or Lucas Leiva will be the next to return with Argentina meeting Brazil in today’s semi-final in Beijing.

Benitez is delighted that he will soon have a full squad to choose from for the first time this season but he insists he doesn’t mind whether he gets Mascherano or Lucas back first.

He said: “I am really pleased for the players because they have done really well but I am also really pleased for us because Argentina are playing against Brazil so that means we will get one of them back.

“One of the players will be in the final and one of them will come back to Liverpool so I will be happy for the one who plays in the final and happy for the one who returns to us.”
Meanwhile, Steve Finnan has admitted he feels like he has been left “in limbo” after he was frozen out of the first team picture at Anfield.

Finnan has been told he is free to find another club but a lack of firm offers means he is currently on the sidelines with Liverpool.

“Limbo sounds about right, yes,” said the 32-year-old right back.

“I haven’t got a clue (what the future holds) to be honest. I haven’t played many games recently so I honestly can’t say.

“There is a big squad there and everyone is fighting for their place and I just have to train well and take the chance if I get it.”

tonybarrett@liverpoolecho.co.uk

He was sh*te with City, but amazing once back in Spain.

pesireland

PHB wrote: »

Robben's injury problems make Kewell look fit.

IMAO , still at least when he plays he is good

leninbenjamin

Karmafaerie wrote: »

He was sh*te with City, but amazing once back in Spain.

he's a gamble imo. I would would take his spell at City as a sign he'll struggle in the prem, as he wasn't exactly a novice when he went there. Given the lack of alternatives though, could be worth a shot if the price is right.

ibh

leninbenjamin wrote: »

he's a gamble imo. I would would take his spell at City as a sign he'll struggle in the prem, as he wasn't exactly a novice when he went there. Given the lack of alternatives though, could be worth a shot if the price is right.

The only way we should be taking him is on a season's loan with a buy option after a year. Paying any sort of decent sum for a 26year old, who did sh1t the last time he was in the league, is a joke.

What figure are we talking for him? 6 / 7 million??

zing

Looks like Xabi indeed does want to leave

The relationship between Benitez and Alonso has deteriorated, to the point where the pair had a bust up in the build up to the Champions League qualifier against Standard Liege.

Having previously been settled at Anfield, Alonso is now adamant he has to leave after learning that his manager no longer values him as highly as he once did.

And why Xabi is valued at 16m....

The situation is complicated still further by the fact that the deal which brought Alonso to Anfield saw Liverpool guarantee his former club Real Sociedad 6m euros if he was sold for 16m euros or less.

Anything above that and a 20% sell on clause kicks in, making it almost impossible for Liverpool to sell Alonso for 16m euros or less and still claim to have done good business.

http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-fc/liverpool-fc-news/2008/08/19/barry-and-alonso-100252-21558682/

pesireland

ibh wrote: »

The only way we should be taking him is on a season's loan with a buy option after a year. Paying any sort of decent sum for a 26year old, who did sh1t the last time he was in the league, is a joke.

What figure are we talking for him? 6 / 7 million??

I'd agree with that ibh, loan with a view to signing would be the best option imo.

pesireland

zing wrote: »

Looks like Xabi indeed does want to leave

And why Xabi is valued at 16m....


http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-fc/liverpool-fc-news/2008/08/19/barry-and-alonso-100252-21558682/

Gutted

zing

TB has been busier than usual today

Gillet had been involved int he deal to bring in Barry and is pissed with Rafa for his public comments over it. No one knows what Hicks is thinking (I'll assume he does think). Neither would put their names to the statement the club put out as they don't want to be seen to not be backing Rafa (ermm - actions speak louder than words, etc..) - thus leaving Parry as the fall guy.
http://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/liverpool-fc/liverpool-fc-news/2008/08/19/the-owners-100252-21558685/

monkey9

What a **** situation if it's true. The yanks won't back him in buying Barry cos he's overpriced, even though apparently the money is there. Overpriced or not, who are they to say what value Barry will bring to the team. It's up to Rafa to decide. But instead he has to go for Riera???? Barry is a proven Premiership player who can play in a number of positions, Riera is a major risk who has already flopped in the Prem.
Rafa's being given the proverbial lamp here again.

raven136

anyone else very worried that rafa migt just say f##k it and walk away?

i asked for a table they gave me a lampshade...its all so familiar

mike65

I was watching the post Sunderland match interview with Alonso (and Torres), he sure didn't give the impression is was unhappy with his answers or demeanor.

http://www.viddler.com/explore/lfcreds/videos/5/

Mike.

zAbbo

Whatever about Barry being worth 18m before, now he's not if he can't play CL until the 2nd round.

There are so many stories in this soap opera, with the sale of the club also bubbling under the transfer saga's

It's a real shame about Leto, and to a lesser extent Mark Gonzalez who looked immense at the tail end of last season.

Riera could be a smart buy, but we're hitting desperation with the window closing in 2 weeks.

leninbenjamin

ibh wrote: »

What figure are we talking for him? 6 / 7 million??

I read that there was a 9.5 million bid + Leto turned down already...

that was at the height of sh*te talk season though.

missingtime

If anyone was contemplating Milner...he's going no where aparently

http://www.goal.com/en/articolo.aspx?contenutoid=820984

DeadSkin

raven136 wrote: »

anyone else very worried that rafa migt just say f##k it and walk away?

i asked for a table they gave me a lampshade...its all so familiar

Yep. I posted somethin' similiar about 20 pages back.
When does too much sh!t become too much???

ibh

leninbenjamin wrote: »

I read that there was a 9.5 million bid + Leto turned down already...

that was at the height of sh*te talk season though.

Bullshit really when you put it into perspective that he's an average enough player at best. Would rather offer Madrid a decent price for Royston Drenthe. Although then he's similar in age and stlye to Babel.

Chardee MacDennis

well Rafa made Ballague retract what he wrote about Rafa thinking of leaving, and he has reaffirmed his commitment to the club but I can't imagine he'll be here next year if the clubs problems don't get sorted by then.

gixerfixer

Rafa will be here for a very long time IMO.Word is his kid is well settled in school and he loves the city and the people.Liverpool is a challange to him and he is determined to win the title.

raven136

gixerfixer wrote: »

Rafa will be here for a very long time IMO.Word is his kid is well settled in school and he loves the city and the people.Liverpool is a challange to him and he is determined to win the title.

publicly undermined last season and now the owners are questioning his judgement about players.How long would any manager put up with that

mru

the well publicised reason why rafa left valencia was due to lack of control and failure from the board to move quickly on new signings - i'm afraid it's starting to sound all too familiar. if he leaves, who would replace him? we got a more balanced side than we've had in years. a world class spine to our team, with some decent reserves who can fill in. i hope he doesn't leave...

monkey9

mru wrote: »

the well publicised reason why rafa left valencia was due to lack of control and failure from the board to move quickly on new signings - i'm afraid it's starting to sound all too familiar. if he leaves, who would replace him? we got a more balanced side than we've had in years. a world class spine to our team, with some decent reserves who can fill in. i hope he doesn't leave...

Knowing those yankie doodle twats, they'll probably bring in Dr Phil

Karmafaerie

Riera made the Primera League team of the season last year, yet he's an average player!

Astounding!:rolleyes:

He had a bad season on loan at City, in a bad City team.
City still wanted him but couldn't afford him.
He went back to Spain.

Had a really good season with Espanyol, follwed be a great one.

He was 23-24 with City, and players can change a lot in 2 years.

Playing at the Costa del Mersey, with a Spanish manager, Spanish staff, and Spanish team-mates would make a hell of a difference.


I'm not saying he'll be great, but with track record of one of the best wingers in Spain over the last two years, he's not average.

mru

monkey9 wrote: »

Knowing those yankie doodle twats, they'll probably bring in Dr Phil

"defend them there set pieces, um-kay?"

missingtime

mru wrote: »

i hope he doesn't leave...

Me too. It would be unfair on him to be forced out in this way.

I'm finally begining to see what he is trying to accomplish and it must be incredibly insulting to have people above you dismiss your opinions on a subject that you know inside out.

DeadSkin

mru wrote: »

if he leaves, who would replace him?

Lets not go there

mru

missingtime wrote: »

Me too. It would be unfair for him to be forced out in this way.

I'm finally begining to see what he is trying to accomplish and it must be incredibly insulting to have people above you dismiss your opinions on a subject that you know inside out.

That must be the most frustrating thing. As Brian Clough said time and time again, the board rarely knows anything about football. Rafa has experienced this once, and now is being similiarly edged out again. Must be a killer.

monkey9

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Riera made the Primera League team of the season last year, yet he's an average player!

Astounding!:rolleyes:

He had a bad seson on loan at City, in a bad City team.
City still wanted him but couldn't afford him.
He went back to Spain.

Had a really goo dseason with Espanyol, follwed be a great one.

He was 23-24 with City, and players can change a lot in 2 years.

Playing at the Costa del Mersey, with a Spanish manager, Spanish staff, and Spanish team-mates would make a hell of a difference.


I'm not saying he'll be great, but with track record of one of the best wingers in Spain over the last two years, he's not average.

Fair enough. But i suppose the point is, if he wants Barry and money can be raised through sales yet the yanks won't sign off on it but'll let him get Riera, then that's acting the bo!!ox.
It's showing no faith in Benitez and almost sounds like they're listening to someone else's advise instead of one the best managers in Europe.

pesireland

DeadSkin wrote: »

Lets not go there

OMG i imagine the uproar if rafa was to walk out, its not worth even thinking about

Mr Alan

mru wrote: »

As Brian Clough said time and time again, the board rarely knows anything about football.

Are you trying to get me banned?!?!?!?!;)

Look, this situation is not ideal, no doubt about it, but it is not that unusual for a manager to be told by his board that the fee wanted for a player is too much.....same happened to Shankly nearly every summer with him always threatening to walk-he won some, he lost some. no doubt it happened to Paisley,Fagan,Dalglish....I hate our american custodians as much as the next man, but they didnt invent this, its always been in football.

even the famous quote someone has as their sig on this site about owners only being there to sign cheques......why do you think Shankly said that? he wasnt commentating on the way his transfer dealings work, he was stating how he wished they worked!

ibh

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Riera made the Primera League team of the season last year, yet he's an average player!

Astounding!:rolleyes:

He had a bad season on loan at City, in a bad City team.
City still wanted him but couldn't afford him.
He went back to Spain.

Had a really goo dseason with Espanyol, follwed be a great one.

He was 23-24 with City, and players can change a lot in 2 years.

Playing at the Costa del Mersey, with a Spanish manager, Spanish staff, and Spanish team-mates would make a hell of a difference.


I'm not saying he'll be great, but with track record of one of the best wingers in Spain over the last two years, he's not average.

Players can change a lot in 2 years, but it's not as if he was only a kid when he was loaned to City. I have seen him on tv the odd time with Espanyol and i don't think he's great and i don't think he's suited to EPL.
Plus he's been around a while and only had 2 decent seasons in Spain. Obviously he's a bit better than he showed at city (International recognition) but very different style to Primera Liga.

Mind you if it was between him Downing and Milner i'd take him easily.
Just don't think he's what we need. I think if we were getting him on the cheap then if would be a bit more favourable but not at £9-11m.

monkey9

Mr Alan wrote: »

Are you trying to get me banned?!?!?!?!;)

Look, this situation is not ideal, no doubt about it, but it is not that unusual for a manager to be told by his board that the fee wanted for a player is too much.....same happened to Shankly nearly every summer with him always threatening to walk-he won some, he lost some. no doubt it happened to Paisley,Fagan,Dalglish....I hate our american custodians as much as the next man, but they didnt invent this, its always been in football.

Yeah, but what seems to be emerging here is that it's not just Rafa looking for money from them outright. He can raise the money through the sale of Alonso. It seems to be that Rafa doesn't think enough was done to get Alonso sold. So the board seem to think that it's not worth swapping Alonso for Barry.
Now, i know that may be the general consensus anyway, but Rafa thinks differently, say that Barry may not be as good as Alonso, but in other ways can improve the squad, help maintain a title challenge with the fact that he's an English player....well then that should be Rafa's decision. He's the one who knows best, Not the suits upstairs! He's just being undermined again.

Karmafaerie

I'm not saying that Riera is great now, just that he's a good few steps above average.

Pennant for instance, is an average winger.
I think we all know who we'd prefer!;)

raven136

Mr Alan,this situation does not and rarely does arise.The manager usually walks in around may,hey id like a,b,c and d.Owners/CE well we have the money for a b and maybe c but the get d you will have to sell players.
Manager is not happy but grumbles along.

What doesnt happen is manager walks in and says i think we are nearly there,i just need 2 big signings and a few smaller ones and i understand that we have to sell a few as well.
Id like Keane and Barry please rick,two good premiership players who will add experience and versatility to our team.
CE/Owners decide that keane is ok but hey Rafa hang on we think your wrong about Barry and we wont sanction it.Its not that he doesnt want to join us or we havent the money,its that WE the non footballing part of this think You the manager have got this wrong and our judgement is higher valued than yours.

How he puts up with this s##t is beyond me.

Karmafaerie

raven136 wrote: »

Mr Alan,this situation does not and rarely does arise.The manager usually walks in around may,hey id like a,b,c and d.Owners/CE well we have the money for a b and maybe c but the get d you will have to sell players.
Manager is not happy but grumbles along.

What doesnt happen is manager walks in and says i think we are nearly there,i just need 2 big signings and a few smaller ones and i understand that we have to sell a few as well.
Id like Keane and Barry please rick,two good premiership players who will add experience and versatility to our team.
CE/Owners decide that keane is ok but hey Rafa hang on we think your wrong about Barry and we wont sanction it.Its not that he doesnt want to join us or we havent the money,its that WE the non footballing part of this think You the manager have got this wrong and our judgement is higher valued than yours.

How he puts up with this s##t is beyond me.

It's fairly bad alright.
The lack of money is one thing, but the idea of the club having the money for one player, but not the same amount for another is worrying.

Still, we don't even know half of one side of the story, never mind what's really wrong, so we'll just have to wait anxiously and see i suppose.

Mr Alan

no, wat they are saying is that 18m is too much, most people agree with them, personally, i'd pay it, but i am a Rafa fanboy

all i am saying is, this situation has always been in football, boards will not in general splash out mega money on players of a certain age. or at least they will attempt to avoid doing so.

anyway, we'll see how it pans out.

last week i was very worried about Rafa walking.

This week, i am not at all.

Karmafaerie

Mr Alan wrote: »

no, wat they are saying is that 18m is too much, most people agree with them, personally, i'd pay it, but i am a Rafa fanboy

I won't tell Torres!:p
(Sorry, should have let it die!)

Mr Alan wrote:

all i am saying is, this situation has always been in football, boards will not in general splash out mega money on players of a certain age. or at least they will attempt to avoid doing so.

anyway, we'll see how it pans out.

last week i was very worried about Rafa walking.

This week, i am not at all.

I'm a lot more confident myself.
I get the impression that Rafa thinks that he'll be there long after Dumb n' Dumber!

noodler

I think things have been harsh on Finnan, he was the best right back in the league for two season for me. I don't rate Arbeloa nearly as high as some of the posters here (or some other Liverpool fans it has to be said). Sure he is younger and probably a little quicker but his positioning isn't the best and he can't time a run forward in the same way Finnan can. Don't get me started on his crossing ability.

I think Degen is crap.

missingtime

noodler wrote: »

I think Degen is crap.

I havn't seen anything of degen so I will wait and see.

I agree though that Finnans crossing is better than Arbeloas. He's one of the best crossers we have.

Mr Alan

:rolleyes:

dont bull**** me now noodler.....how many times have you seen degan play?

zAbbo

Just listening to Motson whinge about the 200 million spent and 44 players bought by Rafa, slightly out of context by they obviously weren't all 1st team players...

Still the pressure is on to mount a league challenge