Liverpool FC Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

Karmafaerie

copacetic wrote: »

you said



Easily proven if it is a 'fact'. List the 15 starts he had and the dates of the games?

Stats are here: http://soccernet.espn.go.com/players/gamelog?id=41418&season=2007&cc=5739

(I'll give you a hint, you did make it up and are totally wrong)

Fair enough.
I'm hardly the most eloquent at the best of times, never mind while drunk posting at 4am after a club.:p

But lets use the link you just supplied to investigate Babels "supersub" credentials.

Babel had 6 assists last season.
5 in games he started.
1 in a game where he was a sub.

He had 72 attempts at goal.
48 in games he started.
24 in games where he was a sub.

He had 10 goals.
3 in games that he started.
7 in games where he was a sub.

So how does this make him more effective from the bench?
Yes he's scored more, but that's down to the fact that in most of those games where he scored from the bench, he came on as a forward.
Chelsea, Besiktas, Marseilles, and Arsenal.
He scored in all of those games as a sub, but he was playing up front after coming on, not from the left.
That's the reason, not some "supersub" cliche.

In every other aspect of the game, that can be quantified with stats (hard to find stats for gameplay;)), he has a better record when he starts than when he comes off the bench.

He's deployed from the start as a wide player.
And his assist ratio is 5:1 in favor of him starting.

His attempts on goal ratio is 2:1 from when he starts.

His goal ratio is skewed as he scores in games where he comes on as a forward (except Newcastle and Bolton where I'm fairly sure he was on the left).

So yes, I was wrong about his ratio of subs/starts at the end of the season.
But I'm not wrong about the fallacy of the subersub myth.
And there're the cold hard facts to back it up.

~Rebel~

to be fair, his 'shot attempts' is better from the bench from what you've just shown in that he has half as many attempts in a third of the time (very rare that he comes on with more then a third of the game left, usually much less then that.

Last season for the first half to 3/4's of the season he was a better player from the bench. Facts schmacts, he had a greater input into the game. Far too often from the start he would be good for a while and then drift in and out before become largely anonymous and being subbed off. When he came from the bench he would be consistently electric for the full time he was on the pitch. Towards the end of the season, the last 1/4 he was much better all round, had adapted much better to the league and was simply a better player both from the start and the bench.

copacetic

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Fair enough.
I'm hardly the most eloquent at the best of times, never mind while drunk posting at 4am after a club.:p

But lets use the link you just supplied to investigate Babels "supersub" credentials.

Babel had 6 assists last season.
5 in games he started.
1 in a game where he was a sub.

He had 72 attempts at goal.
48 in games he started.
24 in games where he was a sub.

He had 10 goals.
3 in games that he started.
7 in games where he was a sub.

So how does this make him more effective from the bench?
Yes he's scored more, but that's down to the fact that in most of those games where he scored from the bench, he came on as a forward.
Chelsea, Besiktas, Marseilles, and Arsenal.
He scored in all of those games as a sub, but he was playing up front after coming on, not from the left.
That's the reason, not some "supersub" cliche.

In every other aspect of the game, that can be quantified with stats (hard to find stats for gameplay;)), he has a better record when he starts than when he comes off the bench.

He's deployed from the start as a wide player.
And his assist ratio is 5:1 in favor of him starting.

His attempts on goal ratio is 2:1 from when he starts.

His goal ratio is skewed as he scores in games where he comes on as a forward (except Newcastle and Bolton where I'm fairly sure he was on the left).

So yes, I was wrong about his ratio of subs/starts at the end of the season.
But I'm not wrong about the fallacy of the subersub myth.
And there're the cold hard facts to back it up.

Not disagreeing with you on the general argument. Like Tusky it just gets to me when people quote facts that aren't true to back up their argument, theres no need to do it.

Those espn stat links are pretty cool though. like them, just need to have access to them for pub arguments now!

Karmafaerie

~Rebel~ wrote: »

to be fair, his 'shot attempts' is better from the bench from what you've just shown in that he has half as many attempts in a third of the time (very rare that he comes on with more then a third of the game left, usually much less then that.

Last season for the first half to 3/4's of the season he was a better player from the bench. Facts schmacts, he had a greater input into the game. Far too often from the start he would be good for a while and then drift in and out before become largely anonymous and being subbed off. When he came from the bench he would be consistently electric for the full time he was on the pitch. Towards the end of the season, the last 1/4 he was much better all round, had adapted much better to the league and was simply a better player both from the start and the bench.

I'm sorry, but surely I'm not the only person who see's the irony here!
I get complained about (and rightly so) for not checking my facts while drunk.
So I go and check the facts, come back with them, and what do I get?

"facts schmacts"

You gotta be kidding me here!:pac:


One thing effected Babels improvment more than anything else.
Liverpool switching to the 4-2-3-1.

Liverpool played really well after the switch.
Babel was playing in the position (well almost) that he played in Ajax.
He didn't have the same defensive duties.
Babel played better.
He's not a winger. everyone can see that.
He was in and out of games when stuck out on the left, but when given the liscence of a wing-forward, he improved.

And I see you address the attempts on goal stat, but ignore the other two.
Babel has 5 times as many assists from when starting.
5 of his 7 goals from the bench came when he was deployed as a forward, and not from the left.

You can't compare his record as a sub up front, to his record starting on the left.
Different kettle of fish.
Babel wants to play up front, and thinks it's his best position.
The only times he's gotten the chance to play there have been as subs.
Maybe it's an indication that he's better up front, more so than that he's better from the bench.

Come back to me when Babel is starting up front and we can talk.;)

And anyway, last season is last season.
I got annoyed as a poster was suggesting that Babel proved again today that he's a supersub.
He hasn't started a game yet this season, so what is he comparing it with!
I'm sure that Babel will be a lot better this season than last.
Come back to me about his impression from the bench, after he's actually started a few games.

copacetic wrote: »

Not disagreeing with you on the general argument. Like Tusky it just gets to me when people quote facts that aren't true to back up their argument, theres no need to do it.

Those espn stat links are pretty cool though. like them, just need to have access to them for pub arguments now!

Normally I check facts before posting them, but as I said I was pissed last night.
I'm surprised I managed to stay on topic at all!:p
For some reason I had an image of Babel starting less towards the end of last season.
Obviously wrong there.

Coincidentally I always use the ESPN sight myself!:D

Tusky

He had 72 attempts at goal.
48 in games he started.
24 in games where he was a sub.

He had 10 goals.
3 in games that he started.
7 in games where he was a sub.

Using the stats you posted, I gather that he is better from the bench. More than twice as many goals and plenty of attempts even though he often only came on for the last 20 minutes.

Even without using stats I could have told you that. If you picked Babels top 5 performances last year, they would all be games in which he came from the bench...maybe one would have been a game he started.

Most of the time when he started, he would struggle to get into the game and usually be subbed in the second half.

This doesnt mean that I think he should only be played from the bench. I think the more game time he gets, the more he will improve.

[edit] Ive just noticed something. Babels last 3 goals were against Manchester United, Chelsea & Arsenal!

jesus_thats_gre

We shouldn't have got rid of Heskey in the first place!!

~Rebel~

Karmafaerie wrote: »

I'm sorry, but surely I'm not the only person who see's the irony here!
I get complained about (and rightly so) for not checking my facts while drunk.
So I go and check the facts, come back with them, and what do I get?

"facts schmacts"

You gotta be kidding me here!:pac:


One thing effected Babels improvment more than anything else.
Liverpool switching to the 4-2-3-1.

Liverpool played really well after the switch.
Babel was playing in the position (well almost) that he played in Ajax.
He didn't have the same defensive duties.
Babel played better.
He's not a winger. everyone can see that.
He was in and out of games when stuck out on the left, but when given the liscence of a wing-forward, he improved.

And I see you address the attempts on goal stat, but ignore the other two.
Babel has 5 times as many assists from when starting.
5 of his 7 goals from the bench came when he was deployed as a forward, and not from the left.

You can't compare his record as a sub up front, to his record starting on the left.
Different kettle of fish.
Babel wants to play up front, and thinks it's his best position.
The only times he's gotten the chance to play there have been as subs.
Maybe it's an indication that he's better up front, more so than that he's better from the bench.

Come back to me when Babel is starting up front and we can talk.;)

And anyway, last season is last season.
I got annoyed as a poster was suggesting that Babel proved again today that he's a supersub.
He hasn't started a game yet this season, so what is he comparing it with!
I'm sure that Babel will be a lot better this season than last.
Come back to me about his impression from the bench, after he's actually started a few games.

I didn't mention the other 2 stats as there was nothing to mention. you posted them, I agree, therefore whats to say beyond just repeating you? I just pointed out that the attempts one was actually better from the bench in terms of minutes played, which is obviously quite important. Someone getting 5times as many assists from the start doesn't make them 5 times better from the start considering minutes on pitch, though it does still work out better.

In terms of 'facts schmacts' I was pointing out that in the actual games, he wasn't great from the start for the first 3/4's of the season. He wasn't getting into the game as much as he did from the bench. That much was clear to see for anyone watching. Im not talking about getting goals or assists or shots or anything here, simple in terms of actually showing for the ball and actually being involved in the game. After all its very possible to have a very good game without contributing to the stats and likewise have a very poor game while scoring a goal.

Also I think you might be missing the point that im largely agreeing with you, that for the latter 1/3rd or 1/4 of the season he was much better both from the start and from the bench, that he was just a better player again in terms of overall contribution to the game. The system helped, and he obviously had adapted better to the league, using his strength more effectively.

gixerfixer

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

We shouldn't have got rid of Heskey in the first place!!

Do you really think that? IMO Heskey is one of the worst strikers we have had in the last 20 years.

LuckyLloyd

gixerfixer wrote: »

Do you really think that? IMO Heskey is one of the worst strikers we have had in the last 20 years.

Wha?

I hate stupid and misinformed comments like the above. The man turned in 219 appearances for the club over four and a bit seasons and scored 59 goals. Not great, but not awful considering that he was played out of position by Houllier a lot after his first two seasons at the club.

He was always honest and worked hard for the team and us fans. We've had a whole heap of players over the past twenty years who shortchanged us much more than Emile Heskey. His performances during our treble cup winning season are also conveniently forgotten.

I think much of the media ire Heskey has received in the past five years is down to the fact that people thought he could have been GREAT. Instead, he only was able to manage being a solid, above - average premiership starter. But to claim he was ever a bad player is grossly incorrect.

Malice

gixerfixer wrote: »

Do you really think that? IMO Heskey is one of the worst strikers we have had in the last 20 years.

I'd say he was being sarcastic. In fairness though, when he was fully-confident and fully-fit, Emile Heskey was unstoppable. He was fast, strong and able to score from inside and outside the box. The 2000-2001 season review is a good example of this. He hit a couple of patches that season where he scored in practically every game.

Now the problem is that Heskey is rarely fully-confident and fully-fit so his career has never quite hit the heights that it should have.

mike65

I was big fan of Ivanhoe even as he did my head in, not that he is coming back. I suspect an agent is at work!

Mike.

Karmafaerie

Tusky wrote: »

Using the stats you posted, I gather that he is better from the bench. More than twice as many goals and plenty of attempts even though he often only came on for the last 20 minutes.

Even without using stats I could have told you that. If you picked Babels top 5 performances last year, they would all be games in which he came from the bench...maybe one would have been a game he started.

Most of the time when he started, he would struggle to get into the game and usually be subbed in the second half.

This doesnt mean that I think he should only be played from the bench. I think the more game time he gets, the more he will improve.

[edit] Ive just noticed something. Babels last 3 goals were against Manchester United, Chelsea & Arsenal!

How can you judge his performances if he's a sub?
I'd say that the biggest effect Babel had last season was in the Arsenal game.
But he played 12 mins IIRC.
That's not enough to judge his performance.
And, as I said, he was playing up front, not from the left.
He came on for Crouch and played off Torres, and then Kuyt.

For me his best allround performance was against Inter.
He showed great drive, and controlled the left flank for the game.
Besides that however, all of his best performances have been when he was used up front.
He looked most lively against Arsenal, Besiktas, Marseilles, and to a lesser extent Chelsea.
It's not cause he's coming on as a sub, but cause he's more advanced.

~Rebel~ wrote: »

I didn't mention the other 2 stats as there was nothing to mention. you posted them, I agree, therefore whats to say beyond just repeating you? I just pointed out that the attempts one was actually better from the bench in terms of minutes played, which is obviously quite important. Someone getting 5times as many assists from the start doesn't make them 5 times better from the start considering minutes on pitch, though it does still work out better.

In terms of 'facts schmacts' I was pointing out that in the actual games, he wasn't great from the start for the first 3/4's of the season. He wasn't getting into the game as much as he did from the bench. That much was clear to see for anyone watching. Im not talking about getting goals or assists or shots or anything here, simple in terms of actually showing for the ball and actually being involved in the game. After all its very possible to have a very good game without contributing to the stats and likewise have a very poor game while scoring a goal.

Also I think you might be missing the point that im largely agreeing with you, that for the latter 1/3rd or 1/4 of the season he was much better both from the start and from the bench, that he was just a better player again in terms of overall contribution to the game. The system helped, and he obviously had adapted better to the league, using his strength more effectively.

Fair enough, but as I said above, I'd place his position well above him being a sub as the reason for his big impact.
What'll be immense for Ryan this year is Robbie Keane IMO.
He didn't have that kind of clever link up player to work with last year.
Huntelaar and Babel had started to make a great partnership in Ajax, and Keane is in the same mold as Klass.

Karmafaerie

I must admit.
I was always in the group who thought little of Heskey.
But looking back over season reviews, and compilations.
It really is impressive how much of the link up play he was involved in.
He did a great job with Michael Owen.

Tusky

Karmafaerie wrote: »

What'll be immense for Ryan this year is Robbie Keane IMO.
He didn't have that kind of clever link up player to work with last year.

Err, Gerrard ?

Karmafaerie wrote: »

How can you judge his performances if he's a sub?

Easy. Babel comes on for 20 minutes, plays really well. Performance Judged.

The fact of the matter is:

-He usually plays very well when he comes on as a sub.

-Rarely plays very well when he starts.

I dont even understand how this is up for arguement. Everyone can see that the above is true.

Guy:Incognito

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

We shouldn't have got rid of Fowler in the first place!!

I agree.

jesus_thats_gre

Stekelly wrote: »

I agree.

I also agree with that...

Dub13

I just sobered up after the game....what a win.And Ryanair are tools,they left a plane load of lads stuck on the runway in Dublin for 2 hours 45min the told them the flight was put back to 14:45....sure the game was over by then.

So I got the spare tickets from the lads are passed them out in Liverpool.

zing

After claiming death threats against him a few months back Gillet now claims to be surprised about ill feeling towards him ?

George Gillett fails to pacify critics of American ownership
Oliver Kay and Tony Evans

As thousands of Liverpool fans mobilised for a protest march around Anfield on Saturday, George Gillett Jr, one of the club’s owners, was launching a belated and fairly calamitous charm offensive, instigating a meeting with supporters and expressing surprise upon learning of the ill feeling towards him and Tom Hicks, his estranged business partner.

Members of the Spirit of Shankly (SOS) group, which was formed in January as a protest against the club’s American owners, were contacted last week to inform them that Gillett wished to meet them while on a rare visit to Merseyside. The meeting took place on Saturday morning, before kick-off against Manchester United and just before an SOS demonstration against the Americans’ ownership. Gillett had come to believe that the supporters’ group was being directed in the protest by Amanda Staveley, the head of the Dubai bid to buy Liverpool, a notion that was quickly shot down.

Gillett admitted that communication between himself, Hicks, Rick Parry, the chief executive, Ian Ayre, the commercial manager, and Rafael BenÍtez, the manager, could have been better. The American claimed that the club is in a healthy financial state and its situation is no worse than other Premier League clubs. When questioned why he and Hicks had, contrary to an earlier pledge, taken the club into debt with a £350 million refinancing package in January and had failed to deliver the funds to build a new stadium, Gillett blamed the global credit crunch.

The union delegation outlined their objections to the club’s ownership and reiterated their desire for Gillett and Hicks to end their involvement with Liverpool. These sentiments were underlined during the protest, when upwards of 3,500 fans marched to the stadium chanting “get out of our club”.

http://www.timesonline.co.uk/tol/sport/football/premier_league/liverpool/article4754194.ece

jesus_thats_gre

****ing planks!!!!

The Rooster

Team selection for the next couple of games will be interesting. Skrtel, Keane and Benayoun all played on Saturday and started 2 internationals last week - they'd be the obvious contenders to be rested on Tuesday, and to come back into the team for Stoke. Kuyt was involved for Holland twice too, so I don't see him playing against both Marseilles and Stoke.

I'd like to see Babel get the odd game on the right, with the instruction to hug the touchline (I know its not his natural game, but doesnt mean he couldnt do it well), and to try and get by the full back, get to the end line and get crosses into the box.

I don't think Skrtel will be rested for Marseilles, but I would like to see Agger being more involved. I hope there is nothing untoward about him not being in the squad v the mancs, maybe he'll play v Stoke. I'd like to see Dossena back in - confidence should be high enough after playing 90 mins for Italy last week.

I presume Mascho is out for Marseilles, so that should be Lucas straight in. I'd stick with Riera on the left and I'd like to see Babel and Gerrard alternating between right wing and the hole behind Torres, though I'd bet on it being Kuyt and Gerrard.

Mr Alan

Message from the union.

Spirit Of Shankly, the Liverpool Supporters' Union last week called for two victories. For a large, and loud passionate march to take place prior to the Manchester United game, and for fans to then take that anger and passion inside and convert it into supporting the team during the game. We all know what went on inside the ground, and the fans were magnificent.Outside of the ground, it was a resounding victory. Thousands of fans gathered at the Liverpool FC Supporters' Club on Lower Breck Road, to take park in the march. Seeing such a massive show of red strength marching up the road, in protest at the owners Tom Hicks and George Gillett, was an inspiring sight, and as such even more fans joined in along the route. By the time the march reached The Kop, the numbers had swelled to around 4,000 and George Gillett inside the ground, Tom Hicks in America, and the rest of the world will have no doubt heard our message - Enough is Enough, Hicks and Gillett, Out Now! We would like to thank all those fans who took part in the march, and all those who backed it but were unable to make it. To those who stood and applauded - the march is just as much for you as it is for anyone else. We appreciate the support, but next time, feel free to join in. It's my football club, your football club, his football club, her football club. It is OUR football club. So lets fight for it. And we will keep on fighting for it. It needs it. We wish it didn't but it does, so lets keep up the fight - We can win it! Prior to the march taking place on Saturday, George Gillett asked for a meeting to take place with Spirit Of Shankly. A decision was made to accept the request and meet with him. The meeting took place at Anfield prior to the march and a small delegation met with Gillett. He made a number of claims during the meeting. However, he gave no indication as to what his or Tom Hicks' future plans for the club were. He claimed that the club was financially sound, and was in no worse a situation than any other football club. He also claimed that the banks were responsible for the debt being put onto the football club as a result of the credit crunch. He admitted communication at the top level of the football club was not as it should be, between himself, Hicks, Ian Ayres, Rick Parry, and more importantly the manager, Rafael Benitez. In answer to stories reaching us to the contrary, it was made absolutely clear to Gillett that we were not running our campaign against the current owners at the instigation of Amanda Staveley or anybody else connected to Dubai. Make no mistake - This is a victory for the Union. One man who we have campaigned so vociferously against wanted to meet with us. No one has been taken in by anything Gillett had to say. The meeting provided us with an ideal opportunity to tell him about what we believed was wrong with the football club, primarily how they have ran it since the takeover. We also reminded him that we, as a Union, wanted both himself and Tom Hicks to sell up and leave. Further detail on what went on during the meeting will be sent out to members shortly. Finally - Thanks again for the support on Saturday. If we stand together, we can and we will win!

Spirit Of Shankly

One would have to wonder if the tiny media coverage the protest recieved in comparrison with the protest in Newcastle would have anything to do with the massive PR contract Hicks has recently taken out with a London firm.

gixerfixer

Mr Alan wrote: »

Message from the union.



One would have to wonder if the tiny media coverage the protest recieved in comparrison with the protest in Newcastle would have anything to do with the massive PR contract Hicks has recently taken out with a London firm.

Yeap. Got that Email myself this morning. Hicks and Gillete have indeed a PR firm in operation who are attempting and succeeding in drawing attention away from the fans distain for them. The protest on Saturday is believed to be 3000 strong and was at large completly ignored by the media whilst it is a fact that the Newcastle fans protest on the days following keegan resigning was nowhere near that figure. The selective coverage by the news organisations (im looking at you murdoch) is pathetic and is worrying to say the least. On the bright side of things it now looks like there will be a total meltdown of the american banking sector and i hope in some way this puts pressure on them to sell up asap.Get the **** out of our club.

raven136

dic to buy newcastle?reports today that Dubai is the new link for Newcastle.

I really want share liverpool to work but am also afraid of missing the Dubia and being left way behind the others

Mr Alan

cant see there being any truth to that tbh.

_blank_

Mr Alan wrote: »

cant see there being any truth to that tbh.

Why not.

Premiership club for sale, and they don't seem to be getting a look in from the yanks at Liverpool.

Even with it's debts, Newcastle would probably be a cheaper buy than Liverpool.

It doesn't matter what club these guys buy, they have ~500 BILLION pounds, that is enough to make any club a new Chelsea.

And don't be fooled by the "DIC are Liverpool fans" spin. They aren't. They're Arabs.

Tusky

Des wrote: »

And don't be fooled by the "DIC are Liverpool fans" spin. They aren't. They're Arabs.

Boggles

Des wrote: »

And don't be fooled by the "DIC are Liverpool fans" spin. They aren't. They're Arabs.

Can an Arab not be a fan of a football club?

_blank_

Nobody can grow up that far from a place, and claim to be a fan.

whatawaster

Des wrote: »

And don't be fooled by the "DIC are Liverpool fans" spin. They aren't. They're Arabs.

What a ridiculous thing to say.

And nobody is saying DIC are all Liverpool fans. But their Chief Executive is, has been for many years and regularly attends matches.

Mr Alan

I'll bite Des

I would speculate that they are interested in attaching their name to Liverpool- the brand, its history, and the prestige that the club holds within European football.

They have had plenty of opportunities to purchase other cheaper premiership clubs since the collapse of their bid, and long before that too. They have never tried.

In fact, a while back when there was rumours of them buying another club (newcastle?city?) they actually came out and denied it saying that their goal is still to own Liverpool and they have no intention of purchasing another club.

I am not pretending for a second they are hardcore Liverpool fans who'll be belting out Scouser Tommy at the back of the Kop or anything of the sort.....but at least one of the major players does hold an affinity with Liverpool, having attended University in the City being a regular match goer for much of the 70's and 80's-when the initial deal collapsed he himself said, it wouldnt leave a sour taste in his mouth and he would still be attending matches whenever he could, which he has continued to do.

even with all that said, perhaps DIC may buy another club and i could of course be wrong. all i have done above is outline my reasons why i think they wont buy another one.

PiE

Des wrote: »

Nobody can grow up that far from a place, and claim to be a fan.

When you have that much money, distance isn't much of a factor.

whatawaster

Des wrote: »

Nobody can grow up that far from a place, and claim to be a fan.

Absolute rubbish.
Anybody, no matter where they are from, can claim to support whoever they like. It's all about what each person is passionate about, and you're certainly not qualified to decide whether those passions are legitimate or not.

Tusky

Des wrote: »

Nobody can grow up that far from a place, and claim to be a fan.

This is a thread for Irish Liverpool fans on an Irish message board. I doubt many will agree with your comment.

mike65

First off, DIC are no longer looking to buy Liverpool. They are an investment company with an investment companies hard-ass view regarding return on investment after a given period (about 7/8 years), the head of
DIC has apparently decided that Liverpool would not be appropriate buy and instead should be bought with the private money of Sheikh Mohammed Al Maktoum. One can only presume either he is a fan or he was willing to be talked into this by Sameer Al Ansari who is a fan and is the CEO of DIC.

Mike.

Nalz

whatawaster wrote: »

legitimate or not.

Very true. Its not like people are coming into work this morning talking about the up and coming big Derby in Dublin (Rovers vs Bohs). Its "we scouse bet yee mancs" etc etc (which is a bit stupid to use words like that lets be honest).

As much as I'd love all the United and Pool fans to have an League of Ireland team to support also, there is still nothing wrong as such with supporting anyone you want.

Karmafaerie

Tusky wrote: »

Err, Gerrard ?

So you're saying that Gerrard is like Huntelaar?!!

Yeah, you have fun wwith that, there's no need to even try and argue that on my part.:rolleyes:

Tusky wrote:

Easy. Babel comes on for 20 minutes, plays really well. Performance Judged.

The fact of the matter is:

-He usually plays very well when he comes on as a sub.

-Rarely plays very well when he starts.

I dont even understand how this is up for arguement. Everyone can see that the above is true.

He usualy plays well when he comes on as a sub as a forward not a winger.
I've said that about 5 times in the last few pages, but still you ignore it and act like he has these great games from the left wing.

Babel is a great player, or will be, but he'll never be a great winger.

mike65

Karmafaerie and Tusky really need to reslove er resolve this tension I think!

Mike

Karmafaerie

mike65 wrote: »

Karmafaerie and Tusky really need to reslove er resolve this tension I think!

Mike

He turns down all my "advances".

zing

As mike65 said - from the reports we've seen of late it's not DIC that have been trying to buy the club these days. The interest appears to be coming from further up the food chain (although how high is unclear but Maktoum himself does appear to have some involvemnt). DIC possibly just facilitated the talks given Al Ansari's personal connections within the club's hierarchy.

There's been chances for them to buy other clubs over the last couple of years if they so wanted but their interest seems to be very much be focused on just Liverpool. Their last bid is said to still be on the table and they appear to be playing the waiting game atm to see what happens to G&H with regards to the current financial situation. Anytime there are reports of another club going up for sale the UK media immediately link them to that club but there's been little or nothing to suggest any interest on their behalf.

Whether Dubai is the answer to G&H is anyones guess though

Karmafaerie

Quite possible that they are floating around stories in order to force G & H's hand.

gixerfixer

Des wrote: »

Why not.

Premiership club for sale, and they don't seem to be getting a look in from the yanks at Liverpool.

Even with it's debts, Newcastle would probably be a cheaper buy than Liverpool.

It doesn't matter what club these guys buy, they have ~500 BILLION pounds, that is enough to make any club a new Chelsea.

And don't be fooled by the "DIC are Liverpool fans" spin. They aren't. They're Arabs.

What's being an Arab got to do with anything? Are they not allowed be fans because they are Arabs?

Boggles

Tusky wrote: »

This is a thread for Irish Liverpool fans on an Irish message board.

No it's not.

raven136

dic confirm they have no plans to buy liverpool or any other premiership team.

Does this mean the shiekh will use his own money or can we take from it that the price the clowns want is too high?

~Rebel~

raven136 wrote: »

dic confirm they have no plans to buy liverpool or any other premiership team.

Does this mean the shiekh will use his own money or can we take from it that the price the clowns want is too high?

DIC as an entity have been out of the running for a good while, according to the likes of tony barrett and ollie kay, but the potential deal is still there, it will simply be from another investment vehicle or straight in the sheikh's name. DIC is a profit making investment wing of Dubai and as such has a rule that they have to believe they can make a certain percentage of profit within a short time to invest, which would be impossible at Liverpool given that its a more long term investment. Money needs to go in before it can come back and the stadium costs alone mess up DIC's charter.

gixerfixer

Good move from D.I.C. Now H&G will start to really panic. They can't take liverpool forward as the stadium plans are gone up in flames and they know it. RBS will call in the loans in January and they will take control of the club. D.I.C. will then offer RBS 400m for the club which is a hell of a lot less than the 750m tom and jerry are looking for at present. Win win all round. To think D.I.C. offered them 450m few months ago for the club and they said no. What a couple of planks. It would have really annoyed me to see them make any money from buying us.

Mr Alan

Gillette accidentally confirmed in the meeting with SoS that Dubai still want the club by accussing them of being behind the recent Union activity :rolleyes: clueless yank

machiavellianme

Surely this mornings Wall St meltdown mustve affected G & H's financial position? Maybe that might force their hand more than any fan protests or poor results ever could?

bUILDERtHEbOB

Dubai Holdings want to buy Liverpool not DIC, whatever that means I don't know though.

~Rebel~

bUILDERtHEbOB wrote: »

Dubai Holdings want to buy Liverpool not DIC, whatever that means I don't know though.

Dubai Holdings can just buy. DIC need to be able to produce profit in the short and long term to buy. Just different types of investment vehicles.

Karmafaerie

Anyone know what date Dumb and Dumbers loans are up in Jan?
The earlier Dubai can buy them out, the more chance of some aquisitions in Jan.
A friend was saying he thinks it's 15th Jan.

That would be the best birthday present I ever got!:p