Aston Villa Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

JPA

Helix wrote: »

theyre not guaranteed a semi place

if atlante beat them 2-0, and we beat atlante 3-0 we go though

Villa's Peace Cup hopes are still alive following Atlante's win over Malaga.

MON's men must now beat the Mexicans by two clear goals to qualify for the semi-finals.

Atlante defeated the La Liga team 3-1 this evening.

Villa's fate will be decided when they play the Mexicans on Wednesday night.

Helix

i see no reason why we shouldnt beat them by a couple if we actually turn up this time

JPA

Helix wrote: »

i see no reason why we shouldnt beat them by a couple if we actually turn up this time

Hopefully but they are a good team, unknown but good.

Neil3030

Heskey will score a double brace, we'll win 6-2.

UTV

matrim

In one way I'd like us to get through for the extra high profile pre-season games. But in another I'd like us to go out so that the whole squad can properly train together (including new signings hopefully)

JPA

matrim wrote: »

In one way I'd like us to get through for the extra high profile pre-season games. But in another I'd like us to go out so that the whole squad can properly train together (including new signings hopefully)

Well if we're not knocked out we likely have some back up friendlies lined up.

matrim

JPA wrote: »

Well if we're not knocked out we likely have some back up friendlies lined up.

Well there's one against Oxford on the 4th of August already arranged.

Neil3030

If we get knocked out of the peace cup we should just should arrange a few friendly matches against Heskey. That'd be a decent warm up.

Savman

MON wrote:

We are some numbers down but we are looking to put that right.

Oh look, it's 2006.

Neil3030

Ah now it's hardly 2006. The overall squadsize will remain largely unchanged on last year, but the difference will hopefully be that our bench won't be anywhere near as weak.

And by the by, I think making a 500k profit on a player like Zat Knight is pretty good going!

death1234567

Neil3030 wrote: »

The overall squadsize will remain largely unchanged on last year, but the difference will hopefully be that our bench won't be anywhere near as weak.

+1. Numbers in a squad are always the same for nearly every team, 23-27 players. Its about how good those players are, if you have 15 good players and the rest are kids then your not going to do well. Villa need 20 really good players who can go straight into the first team and contribute, right now I would guess that we have maybe 15-16 of those players.

Tomthepost

Savman wrote: »

Oh look, it's 2006.

But there is no sign of the Celtic Lion or Tiger (God can't remember its been so long since I have seen him)
That bright yellow thingie in the sky used to be around a bit in July in 2006 also I think.
Linked with a 6m battle with Spuds for Stephen Warnock. Would be a solid signing I guess.
Finger out time this week.

Neil3030

Warnock would be a solid signing, if nothing else to provide competition for Bouma.

MON, FINGER, GET IT OUT TA F**K.

matrim

uke Young has flown home after struggling to shake off a troublesome thigh injury.

The versatile full-back will now have treatment back at Bodymoor Heath as he bids to recover from the niggling problem.

Martin O'Neill told AVTV: "It's been a really frustrating pre-season for Luke.

"He looked like he was going to be fit on a number of occasions but he has had set-backs.

"He trained exceptionally hard two days ago and then yesterday he didn't last too long.

"He was looking forward to the Atlante game - he would have been playing in the match - but now he has had to pull out. We have sent him home now to do some rehabilitation work. We think that is the best thing to do.

"He can be very satisfied with the way he played last season. We signed him as a right-back but he played a lot of games at left-back. I thought he did very well indeed.

"He had a foot injury at the end of that season which curtailed his appearances in the last couple of weeks - and for that reason alone he was definitely looking forward to a break ahead of this pre-season. So it's been desperately frustrating for him."

Wilfred Bouma, meanwhile, is a "few weeks" away from returning to training.

The manager added: "Freddy is doing pretty well. It was a set-back some months ago to find out he had floating particles in his ankle - nothing to do with the operation he had - but that has been cleared out now.

"It's just taking a little bit of time and that is frustrating for Freddy and for us too. He will be a few more weeks yet

So it looks like Shorey is still our only fully fit full back at the moment and possibly for the next couple of weeks.

We really need to sign a backup right back, and hopefully do an exchange of warnock for shorey + a few million

Also The Fonz got 2 goals for the England U19 last night

slingerz

Warnock would be a good signing and TBH Bouma would be backup to him. If MON could bring in some quality defenders like Hangeland then Villa would have a strong case. Still missing a world class striker though think Man City want them all

orourkeda

Have we had a minutes silence for Zat Knight yet?

Villain

In Malaga now looking forward to tomorrow nights game, I'll report back after it.

Up the Villa

Neil3030

What an unbelievably sh** day.

Helix

distin set to stay at pompey now apparently

we could look very silly on saturday fortnight (yes, saturday fortnight, thats when the season starts boys and girls)

orourkeda

Relax. Its cool. Plenty of time

Neil3030

O.K....... <deep breath> I'm going to try one last time to remain optimistic before I start demanding MON's blood.

If missing out on Distin means we sign in Warnock and a dedicated CB, I'd prefer that. Part of me was speculating MON wanted Distin to both back up Freddie and the CBs.

Helix

orourkeda wrote: »

Relax. Its cool. Plenty of time

its not plenty of time

mon is giving out that fonz is away for the u19s, saying that him not being with the villa will affect his preseason

itll be 10 times worse for a new signing, plus you have to factor in that we're on about plan F at this stage

there isnt plenty of time. there was plenty of time in may

Helix

Neil3030 wrote: »

O.K....... <deep breath> I'm going to try one last time to remain optimistic before I start demanding MON's blood.

If missing out on Distin means we sign in Warnock and a dedicated CB, I'd prefer that. Part of me was speculating MON wanted Distin to both back up Freddie and the CBs.

we still need a left back, a right back, 2 center backs, a creative central midfielder, a replacement for sidwell/reo coker and a goal scorer... minimum... to stand still

Neil3030

Helix wrote: »

its not plenty of time

mon is giving out that fonz is away for the u19s, saying that him not being with the villa will affect his preseason

itll be 10 times worse for a new signing, plus you have to factor in that we're on about plan F at this stage

there isnt plenty of time. there was plenty of time in may

Helix what do you think MON's reasons are for being such an infuriatingly slow mover in the transfer market? Do you think Randy is at all a factor?

orourkeda

Helix wrote: »

its not plenty of time

mon is giving out that fonz is away for the u19s, saying that him not being with the villa will affect his preseason

itll be 10 times worse for a new signing, plus you have to factor in that we're on about plan F at this stage

there isnt plenty of time. there was plenty of time in may

The signings will be either good or they wont. No big mystery. Does it make any difference if they are made on the 31 Aug at 23.59.

Neil3030

orourkeda wrote: »

The signings will be either good or they wont. No big mystery. Does it make any difference if they are made on the 31 Aug at 23.59.

How long have you been a Villa fan? How often have you heard the excuse of a player missing preseason to explain their shoddy performance early on in (and in some cases right through the entirity of) a season?

It makes an enormous difference.

Helix

Neil3030 wrote: »

Helix what do you think MON's reasons are for being such an infuriatingly slow mover in the transfer market? Do you think Randy is at all a factor?

randy isnt a factor coz mon was just as slow at celtic

orourkeda wrote: »

The signings will be either good or they wont. No big mystery. Does it make any difference if they are made on the 31 Aug at 23.59.

yeah, it does make a difference

if they sign at the stroke of the deadline theyll have had no preseason with villa, theyll have zero settling in time, theyll have no idea of their team mates or their system, they wont be used to the manager, theyll have to move their family into a new house, theyll have to adapt to new surroundings...

you know, the stuff preseason should be used for

orourkeda

Neil3030 wrote: »

How long have you been a Villa fan? How often have you heard the excuse of a player missing preseason to explain their shoddy performance early on in (and in some cases right through the entirity of) a season?

It makes an enormous difference.

It doesnt. Its only fair that a player needs a certain amount of time to settle in. This is normal. However, to use lack of pre season to write off a whole season wont wash. The players will either be up to the standard or they wont be

Neil3030

orourkeda wrote: »

It doesnt. Its only fair that a player needs a certain amount of time to settle in. This is normal. However, to use lack of pre season to write off a whole season wont wash. The players will either be up to the standard or they wont be

You didn't answer me though. How often have you heard that excuse?

Helix

orourkeda wrote: »

It doesnt. Its only fair that a player needs a certain amount of time to settle in. This is normal. However, to use lack of pre season to write off a whole season wont wash. The players will either be up to the standard or they wont be

id have to question your knowledge about football based on that comment

you think that if a player is good enough, he'll magically and telepathically know precisely how his teammates play from the start? he'll know when hes being covered and when hes not? he'll know what runs the players around him will make and what positions theyll take up etc?

and if he doesnt magically know this, its simply that hes not good enough? not that he didnt have a chance to learn these things in preseason training and matches?

orourkeda

Helix wrote: »

id have to question your knowledge about football based on that comment

you think that if a player is good enough, he'll magically and telepathically know precisely how his teammates play from the start? he'll know when hes being covered and when hes not? he'll know what runs the players around him will make and what positions theyll take up etc?

and if he doesnt magically know this, its simply that hes not good enough? not that he didnt have a chance to learn these things in preseason training and matches?

I never suggested for one second that any player will walk straight into the villa team know how his teammates will play from the start. I said they need time to settle. Doesnt this com from playing games too?

My point is that the club shouldnt stop trying to make signings after the 15th August just because the season has started.

Helix

orourkeda wrote: »

I never suggested for one second that any player will walk straight into the villa team know how his teammates will play from the start. I said they need time to settle. Doesnt this com from playing games too?

it does, and preseason games are ideal for that... matches that allow the players to adjust and settle without the risk of losing precious points

orourkeda wrote: »

My point is that the club shouldnt stop trying to make signings after the 15th August just because the season has started.

no the club shouldnt, but to say that there's plenty of time left is just making excuses. there is a little over 4 weeks left, the league season starts in 2 weeks, we're 4 men down on last season including 2 of our most influential players, and our sole signing wont play til christmas. whether you want to admit it or not, right now, at this point in time things are in a very very bad way at aston villa. this time tomorrow they might be in a better way, but right now they are not. this is cause for concern especially when we're getting outbid on a player who was transferred for £2.7m

orourkeda

Helix wrote: »

it does, and preseason games are ideal for that... matches that allow the players to adjust and settle without the risk of losing precious points



no the club shouldnt, but to say that there's plenty of time left is just making excuses. there is a little over 4 weeks left, the league season starts in 2 weeks, we're 4 men down on last season including 2 of our most influential players, and our sole signing wont play til christmas. whether you want to admit it or not, right now, at this point in time things are in a very very bad way at aston villa. this time tomorrow they might be in a better way, but right now they are not. this is cause for concern especially when we're getting outbid on a player who was transferred for £2.7m

Theres over a month. I just hope the club arent forced to something foolish or regrettable in the market.

I'd rather the club signs nobody that spend outlandish sums on ridiculously overrated players.

I cant see the need for panice at the moment. We're not exactly Newcastle

Helix

orourkeda wrote: »

Theres over a month. I just hope the club arent forced to something foolish or regrettable in the market.

I'd rather the club signs nobody that spend outlandish sums on ridiculously overrated players.

I cant see the need for panice at the moment. We're not exactly Newcastle

where do you think the squad as it is would finish this season with no more additions?

orourkeda

Helix wrote: »

where do you think the squad as it is would finish this season with no more additions?

It's obvious that a sixth place finish may nt happen again. Maybe mid table. (9th 10th). But i'd still expect them to be difficult to beat

Our nearest rivals have been relatively inactive too. This gives me some cause for hope. Arsenal have weakened also. Spurs need to sell before they can buy and Everton have been quiet too.

Manchester City are killing everybody in the transfer market and even having them linked to a transfer will affect its price.

Helix

i think 9th or 10th would be a big ask with the squad as it is. tbh with that squad, over the course of a season, we'd be looking at ~15th

any injuries at all and we'd be absolutely screwed, moreso than ever

if we go into the season with a smaller squad than we had last season, mon is guilty of gross mismanagement of the club

orourkeda

Helix wrote: »

i think 9th or 10th would be a big ask with the squad as it is. tbh with that squad, over the course of a season, we'd be looking at ~15th

any injuries at all and we'd be absolutely screwed, moreso than ever

if we go into the season with a smaller squad than we had last season, mon is guilty of gross mismanagement of the club

I thinks there more than 5 clubs in a worse position. Mismanagement seems a harsh assessment

Time Magazine

Let's put our football knowledge penises on the table then and predict today where we'll finish the season. I know you're all going to say "It depends on transfers" and of course it does, but let's see it now just for record. Why? Because this time last season we were all moaning and people predicting we'd finish bottom of Division 2 and had MON done a bit better in January we could have come 4th. So let's see: where do you think Aston Villa will finish next season?

I say 5th.

orourkeda

I'm going to say 6th again

matrim

The Economist wrote: »

Let's put our football knowledge penises on the table then and predict today where we'll finish the season. I know you're all going to say "It depends on transfers" and of course it does, but let's see it now just for record. Why? Because this time last season we were all moaning and people predicting we'd finish bottom of Division 2 and had MON done a bit better in January we could have come 4th. So let's see: where do you think Aston Villa will finish next season?

I say 5th.

With the current squad I'd say around 10th - 13th

But I still expect us to make signings so depending on their quality I'd say somewhere between 5th - 8th

Helix

orourkeda wrote: »

Mismanagement seems a harsh assessment

if we go into the season with less players than we had last season i dont see how it could possibly be anything else

we have the incredible shrinking squad, and despite being told every single window that its a big problem, we never seem to address it. mon is into his 4th year, so the situation really needs to be addressed now or its going to be clear he either cant or wont

Time Magazine

matrim wrote: »

With the current squad I'd say around 10th - 13th

But I still expect us to make signings so depending on their quality I'd say somewhere between 5th - 8th

There's a big gap between 5th and 8th though.

Helix

The Economist wrote: »

Let's put our football knowledge penises on the table then and predict today where we'll finish the season. I know you're all going to say "It depends on transfers" and of course it does, but let's see it now just for record. Why? Because this time last season we were all moaning and people predicting we'd finish bottom of Division 2 and had MON done a bit better in January we could have come 4th. So let's see: where do you think Aston Villa will finish next season?

I say 5th.

with the current squad 14th
with a few "typical mon" signings, 11th
with a good last 4 weeks in the market, 8th
with an AMAZING end to the transfer window, 6th

matrim

The Economist wrote: »

There's a big gap between 5th and 8th though.

Yes but there are too many unknowns when us, Everton and Spurs all still have to fully reach into the transfer market to strengthen our squads. Plus on top of that not knowing how Man City will gel next year.

As it stands I think we can still make the signing to take us above anything spurs do and also Everton.

For me Man City are the main big unknowns for us finishing higher that 6th. We just don't know how they will play this year with so many new signings.

Time Magazine

The Economist wrote: »

I know you're all going to say "It depends on transfers" and of course it does, but let's see it now just for record.

Helix wrote: »

It depends

matrim wrote: »

It depends

:rolleyes:

I know it depends. I want you to put it on record where you think Villa will finish, even with the uncertainty about transfers. Your best guess. The point is to measure your dis-satisfaction/pessimism/whatever. Then we can use it in six months' time to see how perceptions have changed and if the transfers have lived up to what we expected, not hoped for.

Go on. Be brave. A number between 1 and 20 won't hurt.

Helix

The Economist wrote: »

:rolleyes:

I know it depends. I want you to put it on record where you think Villa will finish, even with the uncertainty about transfers. Your best guess. The point is to measure your dis-satisfaction/pessimism/whatever. Then we can use it in six months' time to see how perceptions have changed and if the transfers have lived up to what we expected, not hoped for.

Go on. Be brave. A number between 1 and 20 won't hurt.

i gave you 4 scenarios and a prediction to fit each

Esse85

I've nothing positive or optimistic to post.

MementoMori

orourkeda wrote: »

Our nearest rivals have been relatively inactive too. This gives me some cause for hope. Arsenal have weakened also. Spurs need to sell before they can buy and Everton have been quiet too.

Manchester City are killing everybody in the transfer market and even having them linked to a transfer will affect its price.

Check out the state of the respective Arsenal and Spurs squad - both of them are in a much much healthier state when you compare the players who'd be ranked 15th to 30th (which is were squad depth comes into things).
Even Everton who have spent about £40m less on their squad than Villa are in a stronger position in terms of the depth of their squad, which is particullarly damming with regard to MON.

How many players have City signed that were linked to Villa?

Tevez - nope
Adebayor - nope
Roque Santa Cruz - nope
Toure (most likely) - nope

The only two players City have been linked to were both Barry and Tayor who were signed from Villa's squad. Given how things have gone since are there any people who think MON should have hung on to Barry for a year and let him go for free in a year?

On where Villa will finish I think a lot will depend on what happends with the Europa Cup. At the moment I think Villa will have no choice but to throw their hand in and field a team of youngsters. If they do that they might be might manage to battle for 6th/7th. On the basis of the current squad and if any sort of effort is made towards the Europa Cup, I would say more than likely somewhere around the 8th to 10th spot. I would also feel the potential for a disaster of a season (with Villa ending up in the bottom half of the table) is much greater than the possibility of challenging the top four, especially if circumstances go against Villa.

orourkeda

MementoMori wrote: »

Check out the state of the respective Arsenal and Spurs squad - both of them are in a much much healthier state when you compare the players who'd be ranked 15th to 30th (which is were squad depth comes into things).
Even Everton who have spent about £40m less on their squad than Villa are in a stronger position in terms of the depth of their squad, which is particullarly damming with regard to MON.

How many players have City signed that were linked to Villa?

Tevez - nope
Adebayor - nope
Roque Santa Cruz - nope
Toure (most likely) - nope

The only two players City have been linked to were both Barry and Tayor who were signed from Villa's squad. Given how things have gone since are there any people who think MON should have hung on to Barry for a year and let him go for free in a year?

On where Villa will finish I think a lot will depend on what happends with the Europa Cup. At the moment I think Villa will have no choice but to throw their hand in and field a team of youngsters. If they do that they might be might manage to battle for 6th/7th. On the basis of the current squad and if any sort of effort is made towards the Europa Cup, I would say more than likely somewhere around the 8th to 10th spot. I would also feel the potential for a disaster of a season (with Villa ending up in the bottom half of the table) is much greater than the possibility of challenging the top four, especially if circumstances go against Villa.

Manchester City have one of the biggest budgets in world Football. Personally, I hope they turn into another Leeds United or Newcastle. I'm surprised youre not complaining that Kaka or Ronaldo werent interested in signing for Villa. They're are operating on a whole different level.

Time Magazine

Helix wrote: »

i gave you 4 scenarios and a prediction to fit each

Yeah but...

Helix wrote: »

with a few "typical mon" signings, 11th
with a good last 4 weeks in the market, 8th
with an AMAZING end to the transfer window, 6th

is debatable. I mean would signing Warnock, Distin, some RB who can cover CB, Delph, and Catermole be considered a few typical MON signings or a good last 4 weeks? Very easily be argued either way. Say you dropped Delph, and added Ruud Van Nistelrooy and Upson. Would that count as amazing or just good?

I don't think I'm going to get an answer off you so nevermind tbh.