Aston Villa Team Talk/Gossip/Rumours Thread

DSB

Helix wrote: »

i had somewhat, but their performances have been very very disappointing

friedel: not the keeper he used to be
shorey: improving, but nowhere up to first team standard
young: cant really argue with his signing, hes been brilliant
cuellar: played out of position for most of the season, now looks like he cant remember how to play center back
davies: back to looking like a pub player
milner: cant fault that one
heskey: dont rate the lump in the slightest. his signing forced a change to our system which played a part in a sub par run
guzan: looks like he'll be a good signing in a few years to come
sidwell: has looked absolutely dreadful

now, thats 9 players signed since the end of last season with a lot of money spent, and only 2 of them who have performed to any sort of level that would have you not considering replacements again this summer

thats not good enough

hopefully its just a case of adjusting for them all, but i suspect there might be more to it

Sidwell and Shorey are the only 2 of those I'd really criticise to be honest, and both may come good next season. Davies has a great future ahead of him. After the hype surrounding us this season, we'll be in a much more advantageous situation to attract players next season, even if it ends up 6th again it'll have been some improvement for the stature of the club, and this summer that needs to be taken advantage of, it definitely was last summer, but for one reason or another it just fell apart.

JPA

The thing is, one player would change the whole defence. (Laursen)
We can't say the players are crap, they are playing crap at the moment but they are not crap.
Well, you can argue one or 2 I suppose!
MON doesn't need to go out and replace them all in an instant, he needs to get a leader into that defence again, he needs to work with them, and iron out the problems.

It's easy to write players off but invariably they will prove you wrong.

Helix

JPA wrote: »

We can't say the players are crap, they are playing crap at the moment but they are not crap.

we can say that theyre perhaps not the right players for us tho

for any manager to go out and sign that many players and have the majority of them performing sub par isnt a good sign

JPA

It's not realistic to buy a new defence. It won't happen after the money spent on it last summer.
The defence are too exposed these days and are being shown up.
I don't know why Heskey wasn't replace by NRC or Gardner today, seemed obvious to me.


It needs to be worked out on the training field not in the transfer market.

Neil3030

Luke Young and Friedel are the only two I'd keep out of today's defence. Shorey fell over unchallenged and even committed a foul throw ffs; cuellar and davies were muck, absolute muck. Granted defensive pairs need time to develop consistency and communication etc but dear god they nearly gave away 10 goals today.

However, one promising thing I saw today was Petrov and Barry making regular runs into the space created in the middle by the double teaming of Young. Granted they didn't do a whole lot with their opportunities but more of that can only lead to good things.

JPA

Neil3030 wrote: »

However, one promising thing I saw today was Petrov and Barry making regular runs into the space created in the middle by the double teaming of Young. Granted they didn't do a whole lot with their opportunities but more of that can only lead to good things.

Ya massive opportunities for counter attacking by the opposition. :pac:

jesus_thats_gre

Adding 9 players to a squad at one go is extreme disruptive and is always going to take more than a season to bed in. Villa are on the way up and are doing it the right way. Just be patient.

JPA

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Adding 9 players to a squad at one go is extreme disruptive and is always going to take more than a season to bed in. Villa are on the way up and are doing it the right way. Just be patient.

It's what I believe but this bad run is making people mad,pissed off and confused. All villa fans.

mirwillbeback

Ok, i've thought long and hard abouit making this post, one that I would not have considered 4 months ago.

I know it's only 3 years since we were fighting relegation. I know it's been on the whole an excellent season for us. But now I'm going to say the unthinkable to many.....

I think it's time in the summer for O Neill to go :eek:

We are at a level now, top 6 in the Premiership where we need to push on and I don't think Martin is the man to do it. We need someone with a world class reputation, who can attract international players. It's all very well with the " buy English " policy, but there's a good reason why Ferguson, Wenger, Benitez in general ( I know there's exceptions ) stick to foreign players.
Villa need to find more for us to make the breakthrough to the top 4. O Neill isn't tactically astute and too loyal to his players who aren't performing.
I really, truly appreciate what he's done for the club, it's gotten my interest back in the Villa after the O Leary debacle, but enough is enough.
There's been millions spent for what is almost a carbon copy points total from last season, despite Arsenal being under strength for months, Liverpool no great shakes, and Chelsea all over the shop under Scolari.
We had our chance, totally totally blew it, and for the forseeable future will not have it again - Man City with their money, Everton will actually have strikers next season, and the top four will be even more well off with another season's Champs League money.
So in my humble opinion, thanks for all you've done Martin, we wish you well as you're a very dignified man, but goodbye.

[ prepares for backlash ]

Mr Alan

I really can't believe a Villa fan would want O'Neill gone shocking tbh

shoutman

mirwillbeback you are absolutely right!!

that's what you'd like me to say

If Villa sacked MON during the summer it would be nothing short of a disgrace. MON has done more for this club during the last three years then anybody else in over twenty years. He has more or less singlehandedly brought us from a middle of the table nothing club to a club whereby not getting into Europe would be an absolute disaster.

Yes he has done things wrong, but so does everyone. You give examples of Wenger and Benitez. Wenger took over at a club who were among the top three in the premier league at the time, yes he brought them great success with their fa cups and their premier league but he has still to bring any european glory to the club, Benitez likewise, he has failed to bring domestic glory and has had two epic european cup runs brought about largely imo by one man, Steven Gerard. Benitez had that gem there when he took over. I don't think either are better managers then our Martin.

So what has Martin done so far. He's signed players, some good, some bad. Ashley Young was got for under 10million, at the time I was a bit shocked as I hadn't heard a lot about him, but look at him now (despite his poor present form). He was an absolute steal at that price and it took MON to see that. Petrov also, I was pleased with his signing, unfortunately he didn't perform during his first season at the club, but MON's loyalty and faith in his own talent spotting abilities has allowed Petrov to become arguably our best player this season!.
MON also performed some magic by tricking Lyon to give us Carew in exchange for that pile of waste Milan Baros, genius stroke it must be said.
Cuellar and Davies both look like decent defenders, Davies is still only a sprog and will no doubt develop into a quality cb given a bit more experience, he has the physical attributes just has to develop the mental side of the game.
Luke Young and Milner were also two signings who I hope will get to play a few hundred games for the club. Reo-Coker likewise, he has had to play so many games out of position and has performed admirably, I think he will get a few caps for england, not a world beater but has the potential to be a very good player.
Heskey and Friedal were got on the cheap. Friedal has been great for us, Heskey less so but everyone knows on his day he can be unplayable for defenders.

The bad has been an under performing Sidwell (a signing I was very excited about), a bad overpriced leftback by the name of Shorey (prove me wrong) and other players who we payed over the odds for, Harewood and Knight. Both of whom have provided Villa fans with some great moments (Liverpool away and chelsea goals).

MON has his pitfalls, he has arguably made a lot of tactical errors, but so have the majority of managers. But it can not be argued that the progression the club has made during his tenure is near miraculous. The fact that we are pissed off because we wont be getting Champions League football would of been laughable 5 years ago.
I'm not saying that it isn't disappointing and in retrospect things could of been different had we gone all out for the Uefa Cup and not put out our reserves (we haven't won a match since getting knocked out), but MON played it that way and at the time I felt it was the right decision, imagine we got to the semi's of the Uefa cup, lost and also choked up in the premier league due to the fatigue of the players. It would of been a lose lose situation.

MON has gotten unlucky also, the Laursen injury was an obvious blow to the side. Also the last few matches we had shouts not going our way, penalty incident at the end yesterday a clear example. I urge everyone to give MON at least another season, even if we finish sixth we will still be in Uefa again next season, fifth is still within our grasps.

And for those who would want MON to go I ask you who would you have instead? I hear Steve Staunton is looking for a job...

JPA

Mrwillbeback, I'm not going to write a big post like the one above, I'll just saying I completely disagree with you.
Your expectations seem completely unrealistic, that we even competed among the top 3 and 4 is amazing.
Talk about a lack of patience. Do we really want the 3 season managerial cycle to start again, it looks like some Villa fans are eager to see it back again.

Time and patience are the key.



ps: Who knows, maybe you'll be proved right, I have faith in MON and maybe it will prove misplaced but you're not even giving him a fair chance.

Savman

mirwillbeback wrote: »

I think it's time in the summer for O Neill to go :eek:

Son, stay off the drugs.

mirwillbeback

Mr Alan wrote: »

I really can't believe a Villa fan would want O'Neill gone shocking tbh

and your opinion regards Villa matters why?

Doodee

mirwillbeback wrote: »

it's gotten my interest back in the Villa after the O Leary debacle, but enough is enough.

I never lost interest.
Nor would I now. We used to have a very tight arsed chairman. We no longer do. We used to get some of the managerial dregs, now we have a potential replacement for Ferguson. I think we are playing some of the best football ever to be seen at Villa park.
Please remember that as far as the MON plan goes we were ahead of schedule in qualifying for Champs league. I think it was unfortunate that we lost Laursen at the back, and that there wasn't anyone there to replace him but that's football. I remember us getting the Belgian striker (His name escapes me). He broke his leg and never turned out for the Villans again IMSMC.

I'll be happy whereever we finish this season. It has been a great performance from the team. An Gunners fan friend of mine put it perfectly when talking about their last games. Arsenal are not afraid to play the top 4. I think that after our display this season neither will we. You live, you learn, you improve.

Lets hope we takes another one on the chin and go out and win next week.

Frisbee

mirwillbeback wrote: »

and your opinion regards Villa matters why?

So only Villa fans can have an opinion on Aston Villa?


:rolleyes:

Mr Alan

mirwillbeback wrote: »

and your opinion regards Villa matters why?

they don't matter, per say, but i like football so can comment when fans have foolish opinions. you're entitled to it, but i'm entitled to call you on it.

mirwillbeback

shoutman wrote: »

mirwillbeback you are absolutely right!!

that's what you'd like me to say

If Villa sacked MON during the summer it would be nothing short of a disgrace. MON has done more for this club during the last three years then anybody else in over twenty years. He has more or less singlehandedly brought us from a middle of the table nothing club to a club whereby not getting into Europe would be an absolute disaster.

Yes he has done things wrong, but so does everyone. You give examples of Wenger and Benitez. Wenger took over at a club who were among the top three in the premier league at the time, yes he brought them great success with their fa cups and their premier league but he has still to bring any european glory to the club, Benitez likewise, he has failed to bring domestic glory and has had two epic european cup runs brought about largely imo by one man, Steven Gerard. Benitez had that gem there when he took over. I don't think either are better managers then our Martin.

So what has Martin done so far. He's signed players, some good, some bad. Ashley Young was got for under 10million, at the time I was a bit shocked as I hadn't heard a lot about him, but look at him now (despite his poor present form). He was an absolute steal at that price and it took MON to see that. Petrov also, I was pleased with his signing, unfortunately he didn't perform during his first season at the club, but MON's loyalty and faith in his own talent spotting abilities has allowed Petrov to become arguably our best player this season!.
MON also performed some magic by tricking Lyon to give us Carew in exchange for that pile of waste Milan Baros, genius stroke it must be said.
Cuellar and Davies both look like decent defenders, Davies is still only a sprog and will no doubt develop into a quality cb given a bit more experience, he has the physical attributes just has to develop the mental side of the game.
Luke Young and Milner were also two signings who I hope will get to play a few hundred games for the club. Reo-Coker likewise, he has had to play so many games out of position and has performed admirably, I think he will get a few caps for england, not a world beater but has the potential to be a very good player.
Heskey and Friedal were got on the cheap. Friedal has been great for us, Heskey less so but everyone knows on his day he can be unplayable for defenders.

The bad has been an under performing Sidwell (a signing I was very excited about), a bad overpriced leftback by the name of Shorey (prove me wrong) and other players who we payed over the odds for, Harewood and Knight. Both of whom have provided Villa fans with some great moments (Liverpool away and chelsea goals).

MON has his pitfalls, he has arguably made a lot of tactical errors, but so have the majority of managers. But it can not be argued that the progression the club has made during his tenure is near miraculous. The fact that we are pissed off because we wont be getting Champions League football would of been laughable 5 years ago.
I'm not saying that it isn't disappointing and in retrospect things could of been different had we gone all out for the Uefa Cup and not put out our reserves (we haven't won a match since getting knocked out), but MON played it that way and at the time I felt it was the right decision, imagine we got to the semi's of the Uefa cup, lost and also choked up in the premier league due to the fatigue of the players. It would of been a lose lose situation.

MON has gotten unlucky also, the Laursen injury was an obvious blow to the side. Also the last few matches we had shouts not going our way, penalty incident at the end yesterday a clear example. I urge everyone to give MON at least another season, even if we finish sixth we will still be in Uefa again next season, fifth is still within our grasps.

And for those who would want MON to go I ask you who would you have instead? I hear Steve Staunton is looking for a job...

Good post mate, and you make a good lot of valid points. As I said in my post, it's not something I've thrown out there lightly.
But you also have to look at the fact we haven't won a Premiership game in eight, and O Neill doesn't seem to have the answers in any way. Granted Laursen has been out, but everyone on every Villa message baord knew he struggled and no cover was bought in January. Speaking of January, I can actually understand why he bought Heskey, but he has been a total flop. He looks lethargic, disinterested and could have sealed the game for us yesterday if he wasn't so wasteful.
Regarding over payment for player, I agree Knight and Harewood gave us rare moments of joy, but sure David Nugent scored against Liverppol for Pompey, should we buy him too?
To be honest, I can put up with some of the bad signings as you never know what will happen, but it's the tactical side of things that is really starting to get to me. We are SO one dimensional it's untrue. Ball to Ashley / Milner on the wings, cross it, hope someone gets a head on it.
Then we have the players who make their good names in a position being bought and played in every position but the one they are comfortable in. I just don't get it.
I really aren't on here to moan and groan ( no doubt it seems that way ) but we are one of the biggest supported teams in the league, we have money, a great chairman and the foundation to really kick on. It just is so so frustrating that we had our chance this year, bought one player in January when it was clear we needed more, and we might not get as good a chance again.

mirwillbeback

[QUOTE
I remember us getting the Belgian striker (His name escapes me). He broke his leg and never turned out for the Villans again IMSMC.

QUOTE]

that was Luc Nilis, he scored a cracker for us the week before

invincibleirish

Nah i don't think MON should be sacked, but he is not immune from criticism either. Whether its the iffy substitutions, the leaky CB partnership that cost nearly £20m or other crappy signings that might come good, the 442/451 dilemma, or the constant murmurs he falls out with players.

The 4th spot was always going to be tough without Laursen, but to go 2 months and 10 games without a win is pretty shocking tbh, its not as if a MON Villa team hasn't went on one of these kind of doom laden runs before, but i certainly would never have thought we'd go one when we were sitting pretty in 4th.

Celtic fans on here & on VT a while ago said exactly what i said above, tactical naivety & iffy signings being his hallmark. I don't expect anything to change come summer or next season.

Savman

mirwillbeback wrote: »

and your opinion regards Villa matters why?

Grow up man ffs. Silly silly reply :rolleyes:

I'd say if any football fans got wind of a 'MON out' campaign, no matter how small and insignificant, they'd be poking fun at stupid Villa fans deluding themselves and rightly so. Criticize, hell yes, but replace? Why are we having this discussion? :mad:

shoutman

It's never going to happen, but I would be interested to see what names would be on peoples lips when it comes to a replacement for MON.

We are never going to have 'the special one' José M as the next manager at VP.

MON has his pitfalls but he is by far and away the best manager we could of hoped for at the time and the best manager we could currently have.

Yes it sucks we haven't won in eleven, but you have got to bear in mind that we have gotten unlucky along the way, timing is everything and at the moment its all going against us. I really felt looking at yesterday that there was a real lack of morale amongst the players with a few exceptions. A few months back when Ash got on the ball everyone knew he was going to beat his man or do something special at the moment even when he gets the ball he doesn't seem to think he can do that.

Mark my words, if we win the next game emphatically or someone scores a special goal things could all change and we could go on a 5 game winning streak to end the season.

DenMan

As an Arsenal fan I wonder did getting knocked out of Europe do more harm to Villa than their current league run? I think it contributed to it imo. A few months ago Villa were riding hig(er) in the league, in the UEFA cup and for a team not expected to do as well as they did, were having a great time. Then MON decides that his focus is on securing a place in next seasons Champions League and decides to field a weakened team in the UEFA cup and it backfired on him. Villa imo should still be in Europe and very possibly could have won it now. It affected the players and things have gone bad for them since then. A great run in Europe would have helped the players, especially Barry, Young, Heskey and Carew who have been immense for them. It would have given them so much more confidence and the desire to pick up the league points when it really mattered. Injuries are a part of every club and you just have to deal with it.

If Villa want to be club that participates in Europe every season then you have to take the rough with the smooth. Look what happened to Arsenal last year, come Feb/Mar they where still top of the league, then injuries decimated the club. They went off the top, out of Europe at the business end of the season, not fair but this happens all the time.

shoutman

I have to agree denman, in hindsight I'd have no doubt that MON would of dealt with the UEFA cup differently, at the time I thought it was the right option.

Also Heskey was never immense for us.....

DenMan

He could have got some goals under his belt in Europe and carried it into the league. Just refreshed the BBC page and Man City are 2-0 up against West Brom. Granted they went out of Europe but were very unlucky as they should have won. Gave them a great confidence boost heading into the league game today.

mirwillbeback

shoutman wrote: »

Yes it sucks we haven't won in eleven, but you have got to bear in mind that we have gotten unlucky along the way

On balance I think we've had more than our fair share of luck this season, the games at West Ham, Hull and Everton come to mind.

Fingers crossed that we get things back on track.

mirwillbeback

Ok lads, one quick question re the future - do you think that we will be a position to break top four in next year or two ? And if so, how will we do it.

JPA

mirwillbeback wrote: »

Ok lads, one quick question re the future - do you think that we will be a position to break top four in next year or two ? And if so, how will we do it.

If we are then it will be through sustained improvement. Obvious I would think.
But just realise that Villa have finished in the top 4 just 3 times since we won the league in 81. So to achieve a top 4 finish will take a lot of work and perseverance.
It's very very difficult.

Helix

Doodee wrote: »

we have a potential replacement for Ferguson

i say this in complete seriousness, but if martin o'neill was given the manchester united job he'd be run out of manchester within six months. theres no way whatsoever that united fans would stand for his style of play, poor tactics, questionable signings and lack of knowledge of the transfer market

none at all

ive had this conversation with a few celtic supporters who completely agree with it. martin o'neill has a great reputation, but i think it gets in the way of the reality of his abilities. he is not, nor will he ever be a good enough manager for manchester united

Helix

mirwillbeback wrote: »

Ok lads, one quick question re the future - do you think that we will be a position to break top four in next year or two ? And if so, how will we do it.

maybe

we'll need one of 3 things tho

1) mon gets a director of football

2) mon stops treating the club's money like his own and actually spends over the odds when he's needed to

3) mon is replaced with a more tactically intelligent manager who knows the transfer market a better

JPA

Helix wrote: »

maybe

we'll need one of 3 things tho

1) mon gets a director of football

2) mon stops treating the club's money like his own and actually spends over the odds when he's needed to

3) mon is replaced with a more tactically intelligent manager who knows the transfer market a better

He has done that several times. It's not a bottomless pit though is it.

Helix

JPA wrote: »

He has done that several times. It's not a bottomless pit though is it.

he hasnt done it often enough

the chairman's wealth in pounds sterling took a massive increase this year without him actually doing anything due to the exchange rate. theres plenty of extra money there without costing the chairman any more

shoutman

Helix you are talking through your arse if you think MON hasn't paid over the odds for almost every player he has signed. Friedal and Heskey were the only two players that looked in any way like a bargain, Friedal is very old and Heskey's contract is almost up.

Also Director's of Football just do not work. You have one guy going out and buying a player who the manager doesn't want, the manager picks the team and wont play the player that has just been bought and it ends in a big mess.
MON has always been very particular about the players he wants and I've no problem with that, believe it or not it is working! Look at how far we have come in three seasons FFS!
And could someone please tell me where we can find a manager who is better then MON at the moment. Just one name will do.

JPA

Helix wrote: »

he hasnt done it often enough

the chairman's wealth in pounds sterling took a massive increase this year without him actually doing anything due to the exchange rate. theres plenty of extra money there without costing the chairman any more

Whether that is true or not, Villa isn't his plaything, I'm sure there is some kinda cap on spending. There is only maybe 2 clubs, United and Chelsea (not even them anymore) who can pay whatever a club demands. Oh and City I suppose.

Milner, both Youngs, Davies were overspent on.

Helix

shoutman wrote: »

Helix you are talking through your arse if you think MON hasn't paid over the odds for almost every player he has signed. Friedal and Heskey were the only two players that looked in any way like a bargain, Friedal is very old and Heskey's contract is almost up.

im talking about paying more than mon wants to spend. the cases where mon gets told how much a player is, puts in a lower bid, then walks away

shoutman wrote: »

Also Director's of Football just do not work. You have one guy going out and buying a player who the manager doesn't want

thats not how theyre meant to work tho is it? if its done right the manager identifies targets and the dof goes and gets them

shoutman wrote: »

And could someone please tell me where we can find a manager who is better then MON at the moment. Just one name will do.

sven goran erikson
avram grant

JPA

Helix wrote: »

thats not how theyre meant to work tho is it? if its done right the manager identifies targets and the dof goes and gets them

But I can't think of any occasion it has ever worked in English football.

shoutman

Helix wrote: »

im talking about paying more than mon wants to spend. the cases where mon gets told how much a player is, puts in a lower bid, then walks away
That is a ludicrous comment, MON has constantly paid over the odds for players, if he just accepted whatever the asking price was he would 1)be held to ransom for every player he bid on and 2) would have a chairman with dwindling piles of cash
thats not how theyre meant to work tho is it? if its done right the manager identifies targets and the dof goes and gets them
I think it has been shown that in England it doesn't work. Also I don't think we aren't getting players because MON is a bad negotiator.
sven goran erikson
avram grant
Sven would demand a few million a year and I don't think he is any better then what we currently have.
Avram Grant, taking the piss yea?

.

Helix

JPA wrote: »

But I can't think of any occasion it has ever worked in English football.

it hasnt worked at any high profile clubs because its never done right. egos always get in the way

Helix

shoutman wrote: »

Sven would demand a few million a year and I don't think he is any better then what we currently have.
Avram Grant, taking the piss yea?

sven would go out and try to get a higher calibre of player to the club, a calibre of player i think martin o'neill is unable to bring

and why would i be taking the piss about grant? he proved last year hes a bloody good manager. methinks you listened to the media too much rather than making your own mind up about him

Kinetic^

We need a similar defender to laursen to come in. Someone who will command the back line. I think Cuellar/Davies/Young/Bouma(if he ever comes back from injury) are capable of serving us well provided that they have the right leadership back there.

We'll need a new keeper this summer or next, at the latest. Poor brad will be picking his zimmer frame up soon.

We'll just have to wait and see what's going to happen with Barry, would love to see him stay but very unlikely at this stage.

Helix wrote: »

sven goran erikson
avram grant

You're on crack if you think either of them would do better then MON, a lot of it too.

Helix

Kinetic^ wrote: »

You're on crack if you think either of them would do better then MON, a lot of it too.

either of them could take us further than mon, sven especially

mon is an exceptionally limited manager, people need to realise that. he is tactically retarded, doesnt use substitutions properly, plays his favourites rather than the form players, plays players out of position constantly, is unimaginative in the transfer market, is incapable of changing things if his plan A isnt working and is too stubborn to admit hes wrong until its too late.

i dont think any of those things can be questioned by anyone apart from the most blinkered of fans

that said, i think he should definitely get at least another year on the offchance that he can somehow adjust and fix some of these things

shoutman

Jaysus Helix, did the man sleep with your mother or missus or something...

MON is an exceptional manager. Yes he has his limitations as does every manager. I think you are crazy if you honestly believe that Avram Grant is a better manager then MON. If it was the case why do you think he hasn't achieved in football. He was number 1 in Israel but thats not a big deal. He did reasonably well at chelsea without excelling himself despite having a cracking squad available to him.

As for Sven, he did nothing special in england. Do you think if he had remained in charge City would be a top four club? He bought in a host of players at City, some good some bad and got them to ninth.

Bounty Hunter

firstly MON is the best manager for Villa atm and hes already there so thats the way it should stay for me and id say 90% of Villa fans (gotta account for Mrwillbeck and Helix and the crazy's )

Secondly and i know a lot of people might disagree with this but, im going to defend Emile "Ivanhoe" Heskey! In my opinion (and most peoples when we signed him) he was a good signing at a good price and he hasnt done much wrong tbh despite not really being fit yet. Its not hes fault if hes picked ahead of people id play first or if the team plays 442 to accomodate him and tbh in the form Carew is in now id expect Heskey to be rotated not be a starter as he has been so far when Gabby is fit again and that ill be happy with and wanted in the first place.

Sven is a good manager but tbh they only place were imo he is argueably better than MON is the transfer market and im not even sure if he is better there hes just less reluctant to look abroad

Helix

shoutman wrote: »

Jaysus Helix, did the man sleep with your mother or missus or something...

MON is an exceptional manager. Yes he has his limitations as does every manager.

i dont think most managers who are claimed to be exceptional have a list of limitations as long as mons

he is NOT an exceptional manager

hes a good midtable manager, who will never, ever, ever be good enough for one of the top jobs, and should he get one of them he'll be shown to be ridiculously out of his depth

Bounty Hunter

Helix wrote: »

i dont think most managers who are claimed to be exceptional have a list of limitations as long as mons

he is NOT an exceptional manager

hes a good midtable manager, who will never, ever, ever be good enough for one of the top jobs, and should he get one of them he'll be shown to be ridiculously out of his depth

i dont consider 5th to be midtable and MON's aston Villa can be improved on with him in charge too so um... i disagree

Bounty Hunter

Everton knocking united out of the FA cup will give them momentum but hopefully like Portsmouth last year and with a Uefa spot guaranteed they willl focus on the cup game now

shoutman

Yea I think everton playing 120mins and winning today can only be a good thing for Villa.

Also Helix, dig up, fifth is not a midtable position. I don't think any other manager could have done for Villa what he has.
He has transformed us from a lowly midtable club to champions league contenders. That can not be denied!

Helix

shoutman wrote: »

I don't think any other manager could have done for Villa what he has.
He has transformed us from a lowly midtable club to champions league contenders

brian little, john gregory and david o'leary all did the same

none of them were backed with as much funding as o'neill either and each ones managerial tenure fell apart through not being backed financially by the chairman, something mon doesnt have to worry about

i dont think mon could get us any further than 5th. hes not inventive enough

invincibleirish

shoutman wrote: »

He has transformed us from a lowly midtable club to champions league contenders. That can not be denied!

No team that has only won 4 out of their 17 home games this season could be considered genuine contenders for a CL spot. MON has taken Villa back to where they were 10 years ago in the league, and thats to the upper echelons of mid-table.

Helix

apparently the least we've ever won at home in a season before now is 6 so unless we win the next 2, thats going to be a horifically embarrassing stat to live with