Your horse, your way! ;)

togster

AngelicRaindrop wrote: »

Also guys who here actually keeps their horses confined after a worm dose? i normally either keep them stabled or in one of the smaller unused paddocks for a few days after.

Well thats a good point. Not enough people realise how important it is to confine them for a day or two.

AngelicRaindrop

togster wrote: »

Well thats a good point. Not enough people realise how important it is to confine them for a day or two.

yeah its amazing how few people know that. even if theres a new horse coming in the 1st thing that happens is a worming and then stabled for a while before being let out in the fields

and its easy enough to do if you have the room

needadvice

Yeah very relevant the livery yard I'm in is very tight on that all liveries arriving grass or full must be dosed on day of arrival and no turnout for a day or two. And yes the principles of worming are varied and ever different as the wormers aren't good enough and the good ones can have unpleasant side affects, do you use tapeworm doses at this time of year.

EMZ0907

going to start using a chambon on my horse this week, anyone ever used one or had any issues with it??ive never used one before so im getting a good friend of mine who is well used to them and has been training horses for years to come show me a few times and work him with it first, i know only experienced people should use them thats why im getting her to work with me a few times with it so im doing it right!:D

has anyone any tips?ever used one before or have good or bad things about them?

togster

Like anything they are great if used properly. I presume you will lunge him with it?

The first thing to guage is why you need it? Are you attempting to get the horse to put his head down, or work in a true shape with good hind action.

Remember that although you are on the ground, the horse should still track up and work will up to the bridle.

The second thing to work out is how fit your horse is. Can he lunge without the chambon and is he responsive to your voice? I would suggest starting with the chambon very loose and lunge him for quite a short time. Gradually increase the tension and length of work over a period of time. I can't tell you exactly but you will know. Does he look free and flexible through his body, is he tracking up with good hind action, does he look comfortable. If so then it is working. If not reduce the tightness.

The next thing to relaise is that the chambin is an aid. It should not be used to hold a horses head in position. It should encourage correct shape but also allow him to raise his head if he really needs to.

People underestimate just how much a horse has to work under these circumstances so take your time and watch your horse.

EMZ0907

yup will be used on the lunge, he is very good on the lunge and listens to my voice commands.never have a whip, dont need one or want to use one!i want to try encourage him to work from behind in a correct shape.he is still very heavy on the foreleg, so i want to encourage him to lower his head and push from behind:) had a back doctor up and he was the one who recomended it to build up muscle in his neck and strengthen his back.he is a lil stiff and well....bless him he is a bit special and doesnt realise he has four legs!:P so just hope this will help build his fitness and for him to start using his hind and lower his head, strengthen his back and neck.......

thanks for the advice:D

needadvice

Why?

needadvice

Didn't read on you said why quite clearly. I'm a purist and despise gadgets frankly all that can be solved by good schooling practices with a good instructor sorry don't buy into into it at.

fits

Theres nothing wrong with certain schooling aids as long as they're used correctly. It sounds like EMZ has thought this through thoroughly and getting experienced help. She's looking for good work from behind to build correct musculature rather than a particular headset. And thats where most people go wrong imo.

EMZ0907

needadvice wrote: »

I'm a purist and despise gadgets frankly all that can be solved by good schooling practices with a good instructor.

ye im not one for alot of gadgets but at the end of the day if its whats gona work best for my boy ill do it!

MDFM

Try a bungee if all else fails. I have a horse that will not work in a chambon nor side reins..common enough problem actually, it terrifies him. but when i put on the bungee, he transforms into an all rounded, loose but a horse that is a pleasure to lunge. he is able to play around with the elasticity in the bungee & will work away quite happy in it. put on the chambon or side reins, he panics, he just doesnt like to be so restricted. artificial aids are brilliant imo if you know how to use them properly, without overusing them and from the ground level when you're lunging, you can get a better understanding of the horse's natural movement and what you are aiming to achieve when you're riding them, without the artifical aids. i would only advise just be careful with what you start with, every horse is different -chambons, bungees, side reins etc might not suit every horse.. play around with a few different gadgets until you find something that suits your horse and is he happy to work with.

EMZ0907

had side reins on him once and not a bother on him!but your right tho he may not like it:rolleyes: well he wont be forced!:) but thanks for the tip!ill keep it in mind if the chambon isnt his thing!:D

convert

While these aids can work well in certain cirumstances, and if used properly, I actually prefer to school my horses by riding rather than lunging. Like MDFM said, some horses don't like being restricted wtih side reins, etc. Moreover, I find that I can work my horses exactly as I want them when riding in a pelham or a double bridle, whether for getting a good head position or for musculature. Though like everything, bits like these can cause as many problems as they solve if they're used incorrectly, or by somebody who tends to have a heavy hand.

Let us know how you get on

fits

I think pelhams are fantastic for schooling in (with double reins obviously)

EMZ0907

thanks for the advice!im not a fan of lunging very often cause i know my boy gets a bit bored and annoyed!its just i want to have some involvement with his training while i cant ride, i adore my friends and think they are fantastic riders, but there is nothing like schooling your horse your way ya know?so they are doing great work with him and im just going to do some small amounts of lunging!:D havent started the lunging with the chambon or bought the bungee yet cause he has been doing so well with his flat and now debating wether or not to use the chambon at all?!

needadvice

Well I still find this subject uncomfortable even some wording is catching my eye. I'm definitely very puritanical have to admit and that was my training and I know I was lucky in those that worked with me.

You cannot replace good fundamental training in horse and rider. Straightness tempo rythym purity of pace good positive riding leg to hand will when carried out correctly and consistently at a pace that suits you both will work. ;)

You are working towards a balanced horse who carries himself.....the good 'head position' is not a term I'm easy with but know what you're getting at but it crucial to understand that he will carry his head well only when his propulsion straightness and rythym connect to allow his quarters to engage carry his weight and therefore he naturally carries his head as part of the correct way of going.

Overbitting is something to be very cautious of and a common misgiving. Better. to ride through and forward to a result than aim to force one.

Anyway I know there are times when corrections must be made and faults in a horse are beyond easy slow correction but please assess your choices slowly. I would always initiate any change with the least 'possible' damage in mind take the gentle route first and only resort to gadgetry when all esle fails.

End of lecture just my opinion on the matter not out to bug anyone.

needadvice

EMZ your post from last night wasn't there just read it and thrilled to hear is doing so well without the chambon you're obviously mad about him hope you're on board again soon.

EMZ0907

needadvice wrote: »

EMZ your post from last night wasn't there just read it and thrilled to hear is doing so well without the chambon you're obviously mad about him hope you're on board again soon.

thanks so much!he is my life and soul!cant live without him!:)

im not to bothered about the head carriage as such at the moment....my main focus is building up his muscle and getting him bending and moving from the hind rather than forgetting he actually has 4 legs! i know that the head will lower naturally from the bending work and impulsion when done correctly...was just hoping the chambon would help but decided to carry on as he is for the moment. dont want to introduce anything new while he is going so well.think if i hit a road block in the schooling ill be back on looking for more advice!!!

just want to thank everyone for there help!means alot!:D hes my first horse of my own and i just wana be the very best for him:rolleyes:

thanks again!

needadvice

I tell you he's a lucky horse he belongs to a thinker.....and sorry for lack of clarity you yourself made no reference to head carriage in the way to which I referred. Good luck with your back abd hope you have years of pleasure with him.

convert

needadvice wrote: »

Well I still find this subject uncomfortable even some wording is catching my eye.

I think wording always has the potential to cause discomfort in the horsey world. For example, there are a large number of people who dislike the use of the word 'breaking', and prefer to use 'starting', 'training', etc.

needadvice wrote: »

Overbitting is something to be very cautious of and a common misgiving. Better to ride through and forward to a result than aim to force one.

I think over-bitting is definitely a problem in a lot of cases. I feel there is, unfortunately, a huge tendency for people to say 'oh, you're horse is highly strung/excitable/hot, etc. put a flash/cavesson/drop noseband on him, add a martingale and change the bit'.

I went through pony club on a TB mare who was a little excitable when I started on her and the above was the advice I was given by instructors, dressage judges, etc. Luckily I had the common sense to realise that the more 'contraptions' you put on a horse, there is an increased potential for them to get worse. Instead, I put a vulcanite (rubber) snaffle on her (I had been using a standard snaffle) and it made a huge difference. Her head carriage was much better (ie - she lowered her head) and her whole way of going was much more relaxed and more rounded.

However, this is also the same mare I used to 'school' in a pelham (with double reins!!) every now and again, just to do some fine tuning if I felt it was needed, or in preparation for entering showing classes. Luckily I ride with a very light hand, so I don't need to worry about the bit having a negative impact on the horse, but I do think that a lot of thought should go into any consideration of using bits and 'gadgets' on horses. Nothing should be used unnecessarily.

togster

Has anyone ever had a horse with this breathing problem and had an operation done. I did last week. Cost 1,500 euro :mad: but it's worth it. He is currently having box rest and doped with drugs. Anyone have any tips on making it easier on him, pitfalls etc.

convert

Sorry, I haven't experience with looking after a horse just after it's had a wind op. But I'll mention it to a few people over the weekend and see if they've any tips, etc. From what I've heard it takes a while for the horse to recover and he needs stable rest for quite a while after. I have heard that wind ops tend to be pretty successful, though, which is great!

Hobbidance

togster wrote: »

Has anyone ever had a horse with this breathing problem and had an operation done. I did last week. Cost 1,500 euro :mad: but it's worth it. He is currently having box rest and doped with drugs. Anyone have any tips on making it easier on him, pitfalls etc.

Ooohhh yes! I'll never forget it one of the multitude of eye-opening expereinces I've had with prost-op horses.

Friend of mine bought a lunatic (mean it in a good way) of a horse for practically peanuts and a week afterwards found out why. Her wind was terrible and she called the vet immediatley. She was fine at rest and after about 10mins of canter she was a very fit horse. After a long trek though she went for an uphill canter and soon pulled up cooled down and called the vet. She had an inflammed trachea and and they loaded her up and sent her to the clinic. Turns out there was a massive infection and she had a trachestomy(sp?) which in lamens terms is a hole made in her windpipe so it was exposed. She was put on a course of antibiotics, anti-inflametries and pain-killers, he only doped her for two days after the op then had her hand walked 3 times a day. After a week she came home to my friend, and they had to change dressings and clean out the wound from puss. Even though there was still quite an amount of discharge the horse seemed even brighter than before and even though it got slightly confused whenever it neighed and there was a whistling noise. It took the infection almost 3 weeks to fully clear and Almost another month for it to fully heal.

Most I can advise is to keep it as clean as possible, try your best to minimize dust. Dust-free bedding, wet feeds and roughage. If you have a dusty arena, wet it down before excercising. (She was quite the excitable horse and after her infection cleared she was allowed 30mins excercise twice a day with intermittent bursts of trot no more than 10mins total)

The reason why this was so memorable for me was my friend is extremely squeamish and would throw up at the sight of puss and ooze >.< So she called me over when there was no one else to help her. It wasnt very pleasant at all. Also the funny whistling noise when she neighed was quite amusing.

EDIT: A trachestomy is a permenant hole in the windpipe but with this horse the hole was allowed to seal after the infection cleared. Just thought I'd add that.

cookerj

Just back to the horse being nervous of poles, I had a youngster like that who hated coloured poles so I used thick branches for a while. Decent sized-ones and I cut off most of the little branches coming out. It worked a charm and then I started adding other objects until he became very used to stepping over everything. I added a coloured pole one day and he didn't bat an eyelid.

clusterfuk

Good idea to start a thread about this! with young horse use grid work following another horse works well.... since this is an old thread, hope it worked out well

skink

togster wrote: »

Has anyone ever had a horse with this breathing problem and had an operation done. I did last week. Cost 1,500 euro :mad: but it's worth it. He is currently having box rest and doped with drugs. Anyone have any tips on making it easier on him, pitfalls etc.

I'm guessing it was a tie-back you had done, now while they are good in some ways they are not always the best remedy for bad wind. For the quickest route to recovery is always feed dry feed, spread it out over the floor to make them eat slower, and steer clear of beet pulp for the first, the reason for this that the wet feed will pool in the back of their throat and cause a nasal dicharge, and cause coughing, also once the box rest period is over try and get them out on grass or some kind of turnout as much as possible. Your main will be keeping the airway clear to prevent coughing and possible infections, if i think of anything else i will post it up.