Legality of Garage Insurance

Darragh29

Mr.Diagnostic wrote: »

Thats the point of the clause. The customer is covered even though he was not driving or in control of the car.

That was my point, that the customer wasn't driving, but a mechanic driving the customers car is covered on the customers policy.

Mr.Diagnostic

Darragh29 wrote: »

What I'm talking about is compliance with the Road Traffic Act.

Thats the point I was making. It does not comply with the traffic act is so far as it just covers the owner from third party liability arising for motor trade use.

BTW Are you really paying 10k for your trade policy?
Is that PL, road risk, workmanship, equipment, theft, etc. How many employees?

Darragh29

Mr.Diagnostic wrote: »

Thats the point I was making. It does not comply with the traffic act is so far as it just covers the owner from third party liability arising for motor trade use.

BTW Are you really paying 10k for your trade policy?
Is that PL, road risk, workmanship, equipment, theft, etc. How many employees?

Yeah I agree with you, the owner is covered, which is fu*k all consolation to him or her if a mechanic total's his/her car in a public place and it is the owners policy number that is handed over at the scene, with an embarrassed "look, I am relying on this little clause here in this person's policy, ya see I'm not the policy holder, I'm just the mechanic".....!!!

Yeah, that's for public liability, employers liability, road risk, defective workmanship, building & contents insurance, tool & machinery theft & 24/7 recovery based on 5 staff covered. It's come down by about 4K due to no claims but we started off at 10K.

ninty9er

Darragh29 wrote: »

Yeah I agree with you, the owner is covered, which is fu*k all consolation to him or her if a mechanic total's his/her car in a public place and it is the owners policy number that is handed over at the scene, with an embarrassed "look, I am relying on this little clause here in this person's policy, ya see I'm not the policy holder, I'm just the mechanic".....!!!

Yeah, that's for public liability, employers liability, road risk, defective workmanship, building & contents insurance, tool & machinery theft & 24/7 recovery based on 5 staff covered. It's come down by about 4K due to no claims but we started off at 10K.

That's fairly low for public liability inclusive! How much does it cover...I know most medium companies would be covered up to €7 million for employee and €14 million for public in any one year.

Darragh29

ninty9er wrote: »

That's fairly low for public liability inclusive! How much does it cover...I know most medium companies would be covered up to €7 million for employee and €14 million for public in any one year.

I'll have to check it, I think the public liability is for 13 million cover or something close to that. I often wonder how on earth I would need such cover. What on earth could happen that I'd need 13 million cover for???

ninty9er

Darragh29 wrote: »

I'll have to check it, I think the public liability is for 13 million cover or something close to that. I often wonder how on earth I would need such cover. What on earth could happen that I'd need 13 million cover for???

If 3 people slip on some oil and freakishly loose an eye, a finger and a leg below the knee in one day and then you have 3 or 4 more days like that it'd soon add up:eek:

caesar

Darragh29 wrote: »

I'll have to check it, I think the public liability is for 13 million cover or something close to that. I often wonder how on earth I would need such cover. What on earth could happen that I'd need 13 million cover for???

I did a 6 months college work placement in the insurance industry up to July and you'd be surprised by the kind of liability claims that come in. We might only have a small population in this country but there are some seriously big liability cases out there......the claims on the increase too it seems.

Oh ya and 13 million would be your limit of indemnity, if you want more you'd wanna get your self co-insured.....another 10k should do it

Henry Ford III

ninty9er wrote: »

+1. My aunt and cousins have garage "company cars" though none are directors and only 1 is an employee of the garage.

The non employee is on dodgy ground Insurance wise there, in the event of a claim, I reckon.

NewApproach

Of course it is possible for this person to be insured, I know an 18 year old who is insured on a RR and an M3 through a business policy

ninty9er

Henry Ford III wrote: »

The non employee is on dodgy ground Insurance wise there, in the event of a claim, I reckon.

Not sure how it works, but there may be a 0 balance p60 issued to each of them which would negate the issue, or it may work in the way in which spouses can be named on company policies.

Maf180

I work in insurance and just a couple of quick points on various items mentioned above.

1) Under a Motor Trade policy, drivers have to be specified for either business use, social use or both. Employees own vehicles wouldnt be covered, only vehicles owned by the company, directors or garage owner would be covered in addition to customers vehicles.

2) €13m Public Laibility cover is high, I think you might be thinking about Employers Liability cover for which €13m is standard. Saying that if a young lad of 15 is injured on your premises and has to spend the rest of his life in hospital, undergoing numerous operations and receiving specialist medication until he reaches old age then €13m woulddnt go very far.

3) If I was paying €10k for garage insurance, I would definatley going through a broker (not just saying that cos I am one), but its more for piece of mind. The direct insurers just ask you a few questions and do what the comuter in front of them tells them, as with a broker you get professional advice and have some one to fall back on when claims occur and should there be a problem.

Darragh29

Maf180 wrote: »

I work in insurance and just a couple of quick points on various items mentioned above.

1) Under a Motor Trade policy, drivers have to be specified for either business use, social use or both. Employees own vehicles wouldnt be covered, only vehicles owned by the company, directors or garage owner would be covered in addition to customers vehicles.

2) €13m Public Laibility cover is high, I think you might be thinking about Employers Liability cover for which €13m is standard. Saying that if a young lad of 15 is injured on your premises and has to spend the rest of his life in hospital, undergoing numerous operations and receiving specialist medication until he reaches old age then €13m woulddnt go very far.

3) If I was paying €10k for garage insurance, I would definatley going through a broker (not just saying that cos I am one), but its more for piece of mind. The direct insurers just ask you a few questions and do what the comuter in front of them tells them, as with a broker you get professional advice and have some one to fall back on when claims occur and should there be a problem.

Well, I had dealt with a broker previously and got so sick of them I switched. What is of benefit to me as someone running a business is a quick and painless decision with minimal paperwork and something that does what it says on the tin. When dealing with a broker, I found I couldn't contact the insurance company directly with a query on my level of cover (I tried this once when I had a query regarding if I am covered to recover a vehicle in the north and they told me if I wasn't a broker, they couldn't give me any info about my own policy). This closed shop mentality really did my head in. If I'm a 40 year old female driver paying 380 Euro a year, I can ring my insurance company if I have a query but if I am running my own business and paying thousands of Euro a year for insurance, I have to ring someone who has to ring someone who has to ring someone. With my current set up, I get to talk to someone in the insurance company, end of story.

Maf180

Fair enough.

The only concern I would have is if you have a dispute on a claim. It is then just you against the insurance company. A broker would carry more sway with an insurer than an indivdiual.

Quazzie

I didn't thoroughly read through this but I'm just curious as to what is stopping say ten 17 year old lads coming together, saying they own a garage and then getting garage insurance? As long as they jointly own all ten cars whats to stop them? do ya have to have a trading name or company number? Neither are that hard to get

Maf180

They would find it near on impossible to get quotes, and you would also have to prove that you are motor trader, in the form of letter heads, accounts etc.

It would also be prohibitively expensive if anybody were to quote.

L-M

Maf180 wrote: »

They would find it near on impossible to get quotes, and you would also have to prove that you are motor trader, in the form of letter heads, accounts etc.

It would also be prohibitively expensive if anybody were to quote.

I know a lad who has trade insurcance, he's a mechanic. He has it out on his own policy, i think he's 23 and it's about 2000k. His next renewal is around €1340. How bad.

Darragh29

Maf180 wrote: »

Fair enough.

The only concern I would have is if you have a dispute on a claim. It is then just you against the insurance company. A broker would carry more sway with an insurer than an indivdiual.

Thankfully I haven't been there yet. If I was though, I wouldn't be relying on any goodwill that might or might not exist between my broker and my insurance company. We all know the rules, and if you claim you get cruxified on the next occasion. I imagine the issue of whether there is a claim or not is out of my hands, if a customer slips or if a mechanic gets injured, they are going to claim, unless you can pay them off in cash not to claim. Here's the funny bit...! If I find myself in a situation where there is a claim coming at me, my insurance company offers me an incentive to settle any claim before the solicitors get involved. If I help them settle a claim or as they put it "avoid legal costs", I get favourable treatment from them, I can't exactly remember what that favourable treatment is, I'll have to look up the policy again... And you wonder why labour rates are so high!!!

Maf180

You get half your excess back if you claim quickly with Quinn.

Its to keep solicitors cost as low as possible. I have dealt with claims in the past whch were settled at over €100k, and of that claim €40k went to solicitors for there involvement. Thats what pushes prices up.

Darragh29

Darragh29 wrote: »

Well, I had dealt with a broker previously and got so sick of them I switched. What is of benefit to me as someone running a business is a quick and painless decision with minimal paperwork and something that does what it says on the tin. When dealing with a broker, I found I couldn't contact the insurance company directly with a query on my level of cover (I tried this once when I had a query regarding if I am covered to recover a vehicle in the north and they told me if I wasn't a broker, they couldn't give me any info about my own policy). This closed shop mentality really did my head in. If I'm a 40 year old female driver paying 380 Euro a year, I can ring my insurance company if I have a query but if I am running my own business and paying thousands of Euro a year for insurance, I have to ring someone who has to ring someone who has to ring someone. With my current set up, I get to talk to someone in the insurance company, end of story.

Brokers usually are cheaper. Well that has been my experience over the last few years ringing around.
In addition because they tend to generate a large amount of business with a given insurer they can get a better deal.
You are also less likely to have an insurer screw you out of a claim on a technicality because some vacuous call centre insurer made a typo.