Disapproval towards meat eaters?

Mark Hamill

Nailz wrote: »

It would be a great blow to the worlds foods if Argentina didn't make the stuff they make!

Yes, it would be major blow to see all of the Argentinian restaurants in Ireland close:rolleyes:.

Nailz wrote: »

No, I eat it also as most of it is good for iron as sportsmen like myself have to be strong and take no prisoners, and it's worked so far! And not to mention I'm allergic to a few veggies and fruits, and I hate the taste of vegetables!

Wheat, oats, cereals, beans, lentils, soy, mustard and dried fruit are all good sources of iron too. I'm a fussy bastard, but I still get enough iron in my diet to train 5 days a week with no problems.

ztoical

Emerald Lass wrote: »

nailz, it looks to me entirely that you are trolling. As I said, justify with supportive arguments why you eat meat. other than saying you like its taste and what a shame it would be if Argentinian food was lost. Not very convincing in my book - at least we veggies have given some solid logic to our choices other than, well it tastes nice and I like it.

I wasn't going to respond to this thread as I think Lass might be right and the OP is just trolling or trying to stir sh!t - I mean you've come into the vegan/veggie forum and demanded we justify ourselves in our own forum. No one here has gone to any of the other forums and demanded people stop eating meat or insulted them for doing so. Your one example comes for PI of all places, was taken out of context, and involved someone with an eating disorder.

Nailz do you have veggie friends who have given you abuse for eating meat? if not then whats your problem? I have far more meat eating friends who give me a hard time for being veggie. I've never judged/questioned/abused anyone for eating meat but I've had people give me abuse over my choice not to eat meat.

You say meat tastes good and you don't like to eat veggies well why can't it work the other way I think veggies taste great - the fresher the better - and don't like meat. Can you not accept that others have a different moral code to yours?

KhanTheMan

Moonbaby wrote: »

How can anyone say they hate the taste of vegeables there are hundred of them and they all taste different.

I'm one of those poeple.
The only vegetables i can stomach are spuds and carrots in small doses. Ive tried so many of them and just cant enjoy the taste of them.

Peanut

It's not all about the vegetables really..

Tar.Aldarion

KhanTheMan wrote: »

I'm one of those poeple.
The only vegetables i can stomach are spuds and carrots in small doses. Ive tried so many of them and just cant enjoy the taste of them.

The only vegetable i liked was potatoes until they were cooked right, just took 22 years fro me to like vegetables. :P

slap/dash

Tara Le d'Arion wrote: »

The only vegetable i liked was potatoes until they were cooked right, just took 22 years fro me to like vegetables. :P

yeh no kiddin, cooking veggies well is not an irish culinary strongpoint

ztoical

KhanTheMan wrote: »

I'm one of those poeple.
The only vegetables i can stomach are spuds and carrots in small doses. Ive tried so many of them and just cant enjoy the taste of them.

before I went vegetarian I ate very few veggies, pretty much just spuds and mushrooms - my diet was mainly meat and spuds and the same types of meat over and over, no adventure in me at all for different foods. When I went veggie I was pretty stuck either start trying new things or live on spuds for the rest of my life and I have to say I've not looked back, I tried food I never would have tired before from all over the world. I do think if I was still eating meat I'd still be eating the same food day in and day out. My attitude to food really changed and I'll now try anything once [as long as its meat free of course] Haven't liked everything I've tired, broccoli is just pure evil, but I did find some things that I just love.

Tar.Aldarion

slap/dash wrote: »

yeh no kiddin, cooking veggies well is not an irish culinary strongpoint

So very true. Even when I have stir frys or roast veg it was horrible. Just gotta cook it better and it is delicious, couldn't believe it.

Recon

My girlfriend is a vegetarian, I love to eat meat. She doesn't give me **** about eating meat, I don't give her **** about not eating meat. We both respect that the other person can have their own point of views and don't force our opinions on each other. And I don't think it's fair for anyone to try to force their opinions on others. Whether it's about being a vegetarian or religion or whatever.

If you want to be a vegetarian (for whatever reason) good for you! But if you see someone eating a steak and start giving them **** about how the animal was fed or the conditions it loved in or whatever don't be too surprised to be told to **** off.

Emerald Lass

Recon wrote: »

If you want to be a vegetarian (for whatever reason) good for you! But if you see someone eating a steak and start giving them **** about how the animal was fed or the conditions it loved in or whatever don't be too surprised to be told to **** off.

Recon, I didn't notice anyone giving **** to anyone, except Nailz. This is a veggie and vegan forum - people chat here about many things regarding vegetarianism and veganism, not just why they changed their eating habits. There are many reasons why people do it, and on a fourm dedicated to this type of diet we are entitled to discuss issues, exchange info and ideas, and even have the odd rant at meat eaters - this does not mean we are giving meat eaters **** - it is just discussing things amongst like minded people, which annoy us (like sausage waving in front of your nose at a BBQ! lol).

Nailz came on here and asked us to justify our resaons for being veggie (on a forum for veggies I might add), but he was not prepared to reasonably justify his meat eating behaviour - why should I explain myself and my reasons to someone who is obviously trolling?

I think most posters on here would agree that whilst we are always happy to explain and educate about Vegetarianism and veganism to people with an open mind who are happy to listen, not many of us can be bothered to give **** to meat eaters, and lecture them on their habits. If someone is a steadfast meat ester, but genuinely shows an intrest as in me being veggie and is prepared to listen to my reasons without judging and scoffing, then I am happy to chat about it. If they are only going to make me justify my position then I won't bother.

As a veggie you learn early on that some people will never understand and will never even be prepared to see your point of view. I don't bother explaining myself to people like that. Being a veggie is a personal choice, and whilst I do try to do my bit for charities and groups I support, on a day to day level I just get on with my own thing, and don't waste energy trying to convert the whole meat eating population. In an ideal world IMO everyone would be veggie and farming and food production in general would be much more ethical and practical. But I realise that I can't change the world, but I can do my own bit and that eases my conscience.

All of my friends are decent respectful people, they respect my choices and would never wave a sausage past my nose like some people do. Likewise I would never sit at a meal with them and preach and lecture them about where their food came from - but if they asked me in a different context I would discuss it with them. No one on here has advocated lecturing and guilt tripping every meat eater they know! I have friends who are meat esters and they wouldn't be friends for long if I behaved that way - likewise if they preached and lectured me about why I should eat meat our friendship would be on rocky ground!

As the partner of a veggie you must understand the frustration and annoyance we veggies experience when eating out, or when confronted by someone who just wants to judge and justify our choice not to eat meat? So in that regard I find your post confrontational - as if we members of this forum spend all our time lecturing and guilt tripping everyone we know who eats meat! As if!

Recon

Nailz' post at the start of this topic.

Hi everybody, I'm not too regular to this part of the fora as I'm a meat eater whom dislikes vegetables with the only exception of a potato, therefore I'm the very opposite. But this particular question came to me while I was reading a particular thread on PI. This girl was bullimic (SP?) so then had to eat her fair bit of meat and fish, but her Vegan Boyfriend (before he knew of her illness) showed a good share disapproval on what she was eating, mainly pointing out why you should and shouldn't do this and that!

I'm sorry if I don't fully understand your point of view on eating meat or understand why you eat vegetables, but as I see it, no matter what your point of view is, I think that's bad form and a completely rotten way of going on!

Like, do any of you carry on like this? Do you see anything wrong with the way he's going on, and do you think he's right?

Again, I'm sorry if I come across like big bad meat-eating bastard, but I'm only curious.

Thanks.

Just since you mention it. But I don't see where he was giving vegetarians **** in this post.

As for my post. I never mentioned that anyone here was giving meat eaters ****. I simply said that I don't think vegetarians should give meat eaters any lectures on eating meat. And at the same time I don't think meat eaters should give vegetarians **** about not eating meat.

Emerald Lass wrote:

As the partner of a veggie you must understand the frustration and annoyance we veggies experience when eating out, or when confronted by someone who just wants to judge and justify our choice not to eat meat?

Not really.I've found that by simply telling the person that it's none of their business and to go away, works pretty well.

I have been lectured at by vegetarians and vegans in the past. I told them to **** off and they went away.

My girlfriend has had people give her some **** in the past about not eating meat and she simply told them to go away or that it wasn't any of their business and they left.

The main frustration my girlfriend has when we go out is the limited selection she has when we go to a "normal" restaurant (not vegetarian one).

My main point of view on all of this is: if you want to eat meat, good for you. If you want to not eat meat, good for you. But I don't think either group has the right to give the other group **** for their choice.

Emerald Lass

Recon wrote: »

Just since you mention it. But I don't see where he was giving vegetarians **** in this post.

As for my post. I never mentioned that anyone here was giving meat eaters ****.

So you don't see Nailz giving sh!t and you don't see the people here giving sh!t so what exactly ws the point of your post?

And IMO it is a form of giving sh!t when someone comes onto a veggie/vegan forum and asks us to justify why we are veggie and then is not prepared to accept our reasons as our own (no one asked him to be a veggie or gave him sh!t for being a meat eater,but he asked why, various people told him why and then he started arguing the point and talking about bloody Argentine food!)

ztoical

Emerald Lass wrote: »

So you don't see Nailz giving sh!t and you don't see the people here giving sh!t so what exactly ws the point of your post?

And IMO it is a form of giving sh!t when someone comes onto a veggie/vegan forum and asks us to justify why we are veggie and then is not prepared to accept our reasons as our own (no one asked him to be a veggie or gave him sh!t for being a meat eater,but he asked why, various people told him why and then he started arguing the point and talking about bloody Argentine food!)

+1 the motivation behind posting this thread still escapes me. They saw a post in PI of all places about a girl with an eating disorder and a vegan boyfriend who disapproved of her eating meat [I can't find the thread in question as it wasn't linked to and PI is a busy place but according to some posters here it was taken way out of context] The OP never claimed they themselves had been given crap for eating from veggies or vegans and said "I want to see why you're a veggie, just so I can (or can't) understand your point of view." Several people have explained their reasons [or asked the OP to just read other threads on the forum as there are a few that cover the topic of way you went veggie] When told that some people people chose to be veggie due to ethical reasons the OP replied with "That one's a no-no for me." For me thats not a very nice reply, people have taken the time and effort to reply with their reasons and the OP just dismissed it - was that not the whole point of them starting this thread? The OP has made it clear that going veggie or vegan would not suit their choice of lifestyle and thats fine but they seem unwilling to accept that others do chose this lifestyle, lead healthy lives without giving anyone else crap over it.

Nailz

Jesus H. Christ!!! I've quite a few people giving me shïte, with one that stands out, and I will address their... annoyances as soon as I can, probably tomorrow (depending...).

Slaphead07

Nailz wrote: »

Jesus H. Christ!!! I've quite a few people giving me shïte, with one that stands out, and I will address their... annoyances as soon as I can, probably tomorrow (depending...).

take your time... I stopped reading your Trolling nonsense quite some time ago.

rockbeer

Recon wrote: »

I don't think either group has the right to give the other group **** for their choice.

The trouble with this is it assumes that eating meat and not eating meat are somehow ethically analogous. This, as I pointed out before, simply isn't the case. Forget about animal welfare a minute - have a read of this for a different slant on why meat is not such a good thing.

So when you say people shouldn't give each other **** for their choices, how far do you take that? Do you think all choices should be exempt from ethical comment? Setting fire to live cats? Paedophilia? Torture? Rape?

It strikes me as a very simplistic and unconsidered position, to assert that eating meat and not eating meat are somehow equivalent and are equally free of consequence.

Recon

rockbeer wrote: »

The trouble with this is it assumes that eating meat and not eating meat are somehow ethically analogous. This, as I pointed out before, simply isn't the case. Forget about animal welfare a minute - have a read of this for a different slant on why meat is not such a good thing.

So when you say people shouldn't give each other **** for their choices, how far do you take that? Do you think all choices should be exempt from ethical comment? Setting fire to live cats? Paedophilia? Torture? Rape?

It strikes me as a very simplistic and unconsidered position, to assert that eating meat and not eating meat are somehow equivalent and are equally free of consequence.

Are you serious!?! The "choice" in my previous post was about eating (or not eating) meat, which just happens to be perfectly legal.

Setting fire to live cats? Paedophilia? Torture? Rape?

They all just happen to be illegal.

And yes. The choice to eat (or not to eat) meat is a very simple choice and doesn't really need to be considered very much. Yum I like meat, I think I'll have a steak. Or no, I don't like meat (for reasons x, y and z) so I won't eat meat. Easy.

rockbeer

You're obviously a very unthinking being, Recon, and I can't see much value in any further discussion if you base the ethicality of an action purely on its legality.

How strange to let someone else make all your ethical decisions on your behalf.

Recon

rockbeer wrote: »

You're obviously a very unthinking being, Recon, and I can't see much value in any further discussion if you base the ethicality of an action purely on its legality.

How strange to let someone else make all your ethical decisions on your behalf.

I actually do think a lot about things, just now about how ethical it is to eat meat. You seem to like over-thinking things.

As for the legality of things. I don't "let someone else make all your ethical decisions on your behalf". So there's no need to be a dick.

Peanut

Recon wrote: »

And yes. The choice to eat (or not to eat) meat is a very simple choice and doesn't really need to be considered very much. Yum I like meat, I think I'll have a steak. Or no, I don't like meat (for reasons x, y and z) so I won't eat meat. Easy.

The choice is simple because society has already made it for you. However as Rockbeer was suggesting, people don't necessarily have to follow the habits of the masses.

rockbeer

Recon wrote: »

I actually do think a lot about things, just now about how ethical it is to eat meat. You seem to like over-thinking things.

As for the legality of things. I don't "let someone else make all your ethical decisions on your behalf". So there's no need to be a dick.

:rolleyes:

How I do like a good intelligent level of debate.

So... let's just stop a minute and think about what you said:

The ethicality of meat eating cannot be questioned because it's legal.

Therefore everything legal is by definition ethical.

Therefore you have decided that law-makers are the final arbiters of ethical behaviour.

You can't have it both ways Recon, either you think for yourself or you don't. (Resorting to personal insults when challenged would suggest that it probably doesn't come that naturally to you.)

Oh, and who the hell are you to set yourself up as the yardstick of how much thinking is the right amount?

Slaphead07

Recon wrote: »

I actually do think a lot about things...

any evidence of this? Anything at all?

Macha

This is very odd logic, Recon . So you have such blind faith in our law makers and believe them to have encapsulated the complex and varying subject of ethics and managed to translate it perfectly into legislation? And how do you account for legal differences in different countries? Do you suddenly switch to considering the death penalty perfectly acceptable the minute you step off the plane in the US? Can you not think for yourself? Is your only guiding stick in your everyday life, whether something is legal or not?

Ethics does not equal the law. The law is there to tell you what you can or cannot do without being fined/thrown in jail. End of story. And it is a truism that property is 9/10ths of the law -the bulk of our law, historically, is largely concerned with protecting private interests. Ethics rarely comes into it.

I am not a vegetarian but I think about where my food comes and make ethical choices. I find the idea of not allowing animals to express their natural instincts unethical and so I only buy minimum free range chicken & eggs, preferably organic. I also refuse to eat fish because stocks are dangerously low and I like the idea of my grandchildren living in a world that still has fish in the sea.

These are actions that guided by my own personal ethics, not by whatever a particular set of clowns we call politicians has decided is in or out over the years.