The EVIL is coming, micro FourThirds announced

nilhg

http://www.dpreview.com/news/0808/08080501microfourthirds.asp

Electronic Viewfinder, Interchangable Lens.

Looks as if the high end P&S/Bridge market is going to get a shakeup, it seems as if Olympus/Panasonic will be able to make cameras much smaller than the E4xx series with comparable image quailty, the trade off is the loss of the mirror/ optical viewfinder.

Not sure what it means for the future of the current FourThirds range though.

DaireQuinlan

Its a bit of a schizophrenic idea, I can't decide whether it'll kill the olympus thing altogether or whether its a stroke of genius (I mean its practically the same NAME but its a -completely- different mount, adapter-compatible with existing 4/3ds lenses but not the other way 'round). I've been waiting for some company to do this though, release a P&S range with interchangeable lenses. Apparently Nikon was thinking along these lines aswell before the shakeup that led to the D700. A P&S with an F-mount. *Sigh* :rolleyes:

Stephen

Gotta hand it to them for the great acronym though. EVIL indeed

fguihen

i have had a camera with electronic viewfinder and i dont like them one bit. you need to be able to see what is actually comming through the lens, not what teh camera thinks is comming through.

this will sell well, but there will always be people who require a mirror.

i dont count cameras with this technology as SLR's. more like point and shoots with interchangable lens's

DaireQuinlan

fguihen wrote: »

i dont count cameras with this technology as SLR's. more like point and shoots with interchangable lens's

Thats what the acronym stands for

"Electronic Viewfinder Interchangeable Lens"

Although somehow I doubt it was themselves who came up with it

magicbastarder

since micro generally means a millionth, does 'micro four thirds' mean 'four three millionths'?

Mellor

The thing is, people here will say that they don't like not having a viewfinder, but its not aimed at this market. Its a high end P&S.
I know plenty of people who have P&S camera that never use the viewfinder instead us the "liveview" lcd screen

nilhg

fguihen wrote: »

i have had a camera with electronic viewfinder and i dont like them one bit. you need to be able to see what is actually comming through the lens, not what teh camera thinks is comming through.

this will sell well, but there will always be people who require a mirror.

i dont count cameras with this technology as SLR's. more like point and shoots with interchangable lens's

The thing about all these cameras is the budget, if you dont have to put in a mechanical mirror assembly then presumably you can spend the money on a very good EVF. I would imagine that when the first examples are introduced they won't be skimping on the quality.

Mellor wrote: »

The thing is, people here will say that they don't like not having a viewfinder, but its not aimed at this market. Its a high end P&S.

I wouldn't be quite sure about that, its going to be light, and small with much better than P&S image quality, I can see it having a future, maybe as a second camera for travel, gigs or even candid street type stuff.

311

It looks interesting ,it probably won't be as noisey/soft as the original four thirds.
Fair play to them.

Alun

nilhg wrote: »

I wouldn't be quite sure about that, its going to be light, and small with much better than P&S image quality, I can see it having a future, maybe as a second camera for travel, gigs or even candid street type stuff.

I agree .. I'm quite looking forward to seeing cameras using this system. I currently carry a small P&S with me when I'm out hiking, and wouldn't dream of taking my D70s with me .. way to heavy and bulky on top of all the other (more essential) gear I carry with me. It is however very limiting, and something like this could offer a very good alternative.

fguihen

i bring my 400D with 17-70 lens out hiking, although im very aware its in my pack and am super careful i dont find it too much of a hindrance. the most annoying thing is taking it out and putting it back into its waterproof sack.

i must admit though, something smaller would be a lot nicer.

lenco75

I like this idea, I currently use a nikon D200, I'm happy enough with the iq but the viewfinder is tiny, same as on all crop factor dslrs and it's only 95%.
I would change to a D700 only for the larger vf and easier focussing with mf lenses. but the new nikons have much higher resolution lcds, 3 times the normal- I'd hope for nikon to produce a 'full frame' camera with a 3" hi res screen- no mirror box or pentaprism. the money saved on this would offset the cost of the full frame sensor, Ai linkage so you can use all those old mf beauties. This camera would be perfect for landscape/still life/macro - the kind of stuff about half of us shoot, for the birds,sport and action a dslr is the answer.
When you think about it reflex technology is outdated anyhow. I'd rather compose shots on a high quality 3 or 4" screen that had a pop up shade than a tiny tunnel like vf. It's much easier to pre visualise with a big image.
It will be interesting to see how this develops.

Mellor

lenco75 wrote: »

I like this idea, I currently use a nikon D200, I'm happy enough with the iq but the viewfinder is tiny, same as on all crop factor dslrs and it's only 95%.
I would change to a D700 only for the larger vf and easier focussing with mf lenses. but the new nikons have much higher resolution lcds, 3 times the normal- I'd hope for nikon to produce a 'full frame' camera with a 3" hi res screen- no mirror box or pentaprism. the money saved on this would offset the cost of the full frame sensor, Ai linkage so you can use all those old mf beauties. This camera would be perfect for landscape/still life/macro - the kind of stuff about half of us shoot, for the birds,sport and action a dslr is the answer.
When you think about it reflex technology is outdated anyhow. I'd rather compose shots on a high quality 3 or 4" screen that had a pop up shade than a tiny tunnel like vf. It's much easier to pre visualise with a big image.
It will be interesting to see how this develops.

I don't know how many would agree with you there. Yu can compose on the screen via live-view. But few use it.

I find the viewfinder far better. For a start if you compose with the VF, you keep it steadier. Which means a better pic. Using live view will also run down the battery quicker. I think that you have much more control over the settings when holding it in the VF position (compared to live view postion)

Mellor

nilhg wrote: »

I wouldn't be quite sure about that, its going to be light, and small with much better than P&S image quality, I can see it having a future, maybe as a second camera for travel, gigs or even candid street type stuff.

Sorry, I was refering to it being a main camera. Obviously it would be far better than a P&S for travel and would easily replace the SLR for long trips for handyness.

lenco75

I agree that composing with an optical viewfinder is far better, but the optical vf in most digital cameras is pants. The vf in any film slr is far superior to those on cropped dslrs, my comparison would be analogous to a view camera- instead of using the ground glass one would have a hi-res display. For contemplative photography I think this would work. john

punchdrunk

if they can make it with a pancake 50mm 1.8 equiv and a 28mm 2.8 equiv i'd buy it in a heartbeat as a travel camera

fguihen

do you use your camera enough to warrant owning one just for travel? i only use my camera when out "travelling", hiking and holidays and other such things. if i got a new one just for those events, id almost never use the 400d as they are the only times i use it anyway

nilhg

And the first camera is announced,the Panasonic Lumix G1.

I haven't time to read all the info, but a quick scan looks promising, DPReview seem to be impressed anyway...

DadaKopf

punchdrunk wrote: »

if they can make it with a pancake 50mm 1.8 equiv and a 28mm 2.8 equiv i'd buy it in a heartbeat as a travel camera

Right on. What I really want is a high quality digital akin to a rangefinder. If this did the trick, with lens quality the same as Zeiss rangefinder lenses, and resolution the same as an SLR with a good signal-to-noise ratio, I'd be happy as a pig in shizzle. I'm not sure a 'digital viewfinder' would bother me, I don't like looking through my 400D viewfinder. I suppose I got used to it, but I personally prefer basic P&S viewfinders, separate from the lens, like rangefinders, Lomo LC-As etc.

This Lumix isn't small enough, though. I'll keep an eye on this.

DaireQuinlan

DadaKopf wrote: »

This Lumix isn't small enough, though. I'll keep an eye on this.

Yeah agreed, Its like a scaled down SLR or big bridge camera or something. I was hoping for something a lot more compact. It actually looks bulkier than my FE-2 for crying out loud :rolleyes:

duffarama

Some interesting lenses lined up for next year though.

The 20mm f1.7 and the 7-14mm f4.0 being the most intriguing to me.

Can't wait to see the first Olympus body and what lenses they plan for this system.

Morrisseeee

New G1 : 124 mm x 84 mm x 45 mm
E510 : 136mm x 92mm x 68 mm

ie. not that much smaller......

DaireQuinlan

Morrisseeee wrote: »

New G1 : 124 mm x 84 mm x 45 mm
E510 : 136mm x 92mm x 68 mm

ie. not that much smaller......

My diminuitive FE2 ...
142width 90mm height and 57mm depth
And thats a full frame SLR

duffarama

This is the first of many bodies though and Panasonic have stated they designed this camera to look like it's an SLR as that's what their market research indicated folk would want.

What surprises me though is that it's 5 grams heavier than an E-410 with equivalent lens attached!!

Kintarō Hattori

http://www.engadget.com/2009/03/03/olympus-micro-four-thirds-camera-launching-this-summer/

I wonder what the pricing will be like with this. If it's not too pricey (and if the lenses are half decent) I'd be tempted to pick one up when I don't want to take my DSLR out and about with me.

nilhg

Panasonic announced the GH1 yesterday, if it's half as good as it looks on paper, and the price is not silly, it's going to put the cat among the pigeons in a big way IMHO, there is loads of technical innovation and some really cool new features.

ThOnda

This one looks even nicer... micro four thirds system

nilhg

ThOnda wrote: »

This one looks even nicer... micro four thirds system

Yeah, but that's only a mockup as yet, no specs or even reliable timeframe for release.

DaireQuinlan

nilhg wrote: »

Yeah, but that's only a mockup as yet, no specs or even reliable timeframe for release.

Same mockup as they had at the initial announcement aswell by the looks of things. If they actually manage to release something this small it'll be tempting. micro 4/3rds -> f-mount adapter and theres a tiny camera to stick all my nikon glass onto

ThOnda

Exactly, if they reduce size and make it sooo sexy, it'll kick behind to most of the compact cameras. G10 could become one of the endangered species

Fajitas!

Looks rockin'.

duffarama

ThOnda wrote: »

Exactly, if they reduce size and make it sooo sexy, it'll kick behind to most of the compact cameras. G10 could become one of the endangered species

The G10 should already be an endangered species as the LX3 is a better smaller camera with a better lens.

ThOnda

Fajitas - almost like older cameras. I like the style. Canonette style

Morrisseeee

micro 4/3rds -> f-mount adapter and theres a tiny camera to stick all my nikon glass onto

...fcek, I'll need to put a tripod/monopod on my Nikon 135mm lens so !!!!!!

rabbitinlights

magicbastarder wrote: »

since micro generally means a millionth, does 'micro four thirds' mean 'four three millionths'?

Mycroft H

After going to a ovf i dont think i could use a evf no matter how good it is, they just dont seem 'real' to me.