Advice on passenger airbag

unionman

This may well be one of those FAQs but here goes:

New baby due November, first few months the baby seat rides in the front passenger seat. The passenger side airbag needs to be disabled while the baby seat rides up front.

BUT, I drive an 01 Renault Laguna, and spoke to a dealer yesterday who told me the airbag cannot be disabled on anything older than an 05 model. He said the whole airbag sytem can be disabled by removing a fuse but a dealer couldn't do that for me (fair enough).

Just wondering if anyone has had the same problem and can make any suggestions as to the safest way to approach the problem?

craichoe

unionman wrote: »

This may well be one of those FAQs but here goes:

New baby due November, first few months the baby seat rides in the front passenger seat. The passenger side airbag needs to be disabled while the baby seat rides up front.

BUT, I drive an 01 Renault Laguna, and spoke to a dealer yesterday who told me the airbag cannot be disabled on anything older than an 05 model. He said the whole airbag sytem can be disabled by removing a fuse but a dealer couldn't do that for me (fair enough).

Just wondering if anyone has had the same problem and can make any suggestions as to the safest way to approach the problem?

Only an option from new i believe .. I'd say your best off disabling the whole thing !

Henry Ford III

I'd say never disable airbags. They weren't installed for a laugh.

I realise it's trickier for the driver, but babies should travel in the back, properly seated and restrained.

BrianD3

Passenger airbag on my 2003 Laguna can be disabled by moving a switch located on the side of the dash (where it meets the door card) I would have thought that a 01 would be the same but perhaps it isn't. But it does sound like the dealer gave you wrong info if he said only 05 cars and onwards can have the airbag disabled.

Honey-ec

Just put the baby in the back seat - it's far, far safer.

I used to work for Renault, and when demonstrating the passenger airbag "switch off" we were always told to advise the customer to put a child seat in the back regardless.

milltown

Baby in the back and get a mirror from Argos that attaches to the rear headrest so you can keep an eye on him or her with the rear view mirror.

Or else change the car.

bazz26

Most dealers will not touch it for legal implications in the event of an accident.

If you did get it disabled then you would have to notify your insurance company that a safety device has been disabled. They will probably get you to sign some sort of disclaimer and may also want the engineer who disabled it to sign something saying that they did it as per the manufacturer's directions. Could be lots and lots of legal stuff around this.

Plus from a safety aspect the child is better off in the rear.

ninty9er

I wouldn't agree that the child is safer in the back, nor in the front, but for convenience it's probably better to have the child in the front.

Change the car.

unkel

unionman wrote: »

He said the whole airbag sytem can be disabled by removing a fuse but a dealer couldn't do that for me (fair enough)

It's a one minute job if you know the car. He wouldn't do it for you because it has insurance implications

ninty9er wrote: »

I wouldn't agree that the child is safer in the back

Let me guess, you don't have children?

As the others said, put the child in the back. Safer, especially for a newborn in a rear facing childseat

alias no.9

My first is due in the next few weeks. My biggest concern regarding the baby and driving is that my wife would attempt to tend to the baby while driving. A baby in the front seat will draw your attention away from the road. For this reason the baby is going in the back seat behind the driver.

Honey-ec

ninty9er wrote: »

I wouldn't agree that the child is safer in the back, nor in the front, but for convenience it's probably better to have the child in the front.

It's not a matter of opinion, I'm (not) sorry to tell you.

ninty9er

Honey-ec wrote: »

It's not a matter of opinion, I'm (not) sorry to tell you.

Actually it is a matter of opinion. The legal phrasing is "rear-facing child restraints must not be used in seats protected with an active frontal air-bag."

Behind the driver is probably the worst place considering driving on the left means you're more likely to get hit on that side than from the passenger side and the middle generally is a non runner both practically and fixing wise.

I don't have kids, but ffs I'd much prefer to be able to know the child was breathing, not choking etc. which you can't tell when he/she is behind you facing rearward. Fair enough putting the seat in the rear if there's going to be someone back there to mind the child.

unkel

alias no.9 wrote: »

My first is due in the next few weeks.

Best of luck!

alias no.9 wrote: »

My biggest concern regarding the baby and driving is that my wife would attempt to tend to the baby while driving. A baby in the front seat will draw your attention away from the road. For this reason the baby is going in the back seat behind the driver.

She should be able to keep an eye on the baby (via the mirror milltown described). She should not tend to the baby at all! The best position for your newborn baby is behind the passenger

unkel

ninty9er wrote: »

I don't have kids, but ffs I'd much prefer to be able to know the child was breathing, not choking etc. which you can't tell when he/she is behind you facing rearward.

You don't have kids, but you do have common sense. Fair play to ya!

Big_Mac

milltown wrote: »

Baby in the back and get a mirror from Argos that attaches to the rear headrest so you can keep an eye on him or her with the rear view mirror.

+1, Have one myself

unionman wrote: »

This may well be one of those FAQs but here goes:

New baby due November, first few months the baby seat rides in the front passenger seat. The passenger side airbag needs to be disabled while the baby seat rides up front.

BUT, I drive an 01 Renault Laguna, and spoke to a dealer yesterday who told me the airbag cannot be disabled on anything older than an 05 model. He said the whole airbag sytem can be disabled by removing a fuse but a dealer couldn't do that for me (fair enough).

Just wondering if anyone has had the same problem and can make any suggestions as to the safest way to approach the problem?

Bad bad bad bad bad idea.
My daughter was only four weeks old at the time. My missus was headin home one evening and some dumb bint pulled out in front of her. She smashed straight into her. Thankfully my family were safe (Don't care about the other driver for obvious reasons tbh) Both airbags were deployed and the force from the airbags shattered the windscreen. So, even if you do disable the airbag and put the baby in the front seat and god forbid have an accident they would get covered in splinters of glass from the drivers airbag. With the baby in the back she was perfectly safe and nothing at all happened to her. Its manufacturers recommendations, you really should go with them

Trust me, I am speaking from experience.

ninty9er

I'm not saying disable the airbag system, but there are cars (I think the 206 was the first) that could have just the front passenger airbag disabled. If there wasn't a safety reason for disabling the airbag, it wouldn't have happened.

There are arguments for front and back I suppose, but for me it would be the front. Infant seats are designed to be rear-facing, and the maze of mirrors you would need to see a child's face in the back while rear-facing, would pose a significant handicap to the standard of one's driving, whereas you should glance at your wing mirrors regularly at which time you could continue looking forward and see the child.

This argument will become redundant soon enough anyway as the next logical step in car safety is rear lateral airbags.

Victor_M

It is most definitely safer to have a rear facing child seat in the back of the car behind the passenger seat.

Most car manufacturers are removing the ability to disable the passenger air bags for this reason.

The distraction a young baby in the front can cause increases the likelyhood of a crash in itself.

The amount of of times I've seen mums doting over their kids in the front whilst driving is disgraceful.

And it has been shown that in the event of a serious crash that the back seats are the safest place for a small child properly restrained to be.

according to this 72% of all serious crashes occur towards the front or front sides of a vehicle

Henry Ford III

ninty9er wrote: »

I'm not saying disable the airbag system, but there are cars (I think the 206 was the first) that could have just the front passenger airbag disabled. If there wasn't a safety reason for disabling the airbag, it wouldn't have happened.

There are arguments for front and back I suppose, but for me it would be the front. Infant seats are designed to be rear-facing, and the maze of mirrors you would need to see a child's face in the back while rear-facing, would pose a significant handicap to the standard of one's driving, whereas you should glance at your wing mirrors regularly at which time you could continue looking forward and see the child.

This argument will become redundant soon enough anyway as the next logical step in car safety is rear lateral airbags.

I'm struggling to think of any safety reason why a passenger front airbag should be disabled Carrying a valuable curry perhaps?

All infant seats aren't designed to be rear facing either. As others have rightly said, infants and all children are safer in the back.

alexmcred

My two were always in the back when carried in the car. A lot of faward facing child seats are suitable from birth so i would put one of those in if i were to have another one.

jamesO

I'm involved in running a large taxi business and had this problem some time ago. We have various insurance companies involved and were informed by them all, that insurance does not cover a child in the front seat using a spiecally designed seat period. Some countries still alow this but most EU countries don't. Turning off an air bag also invalidates your insurance period.

jO

ninty9er

jamesO wrote: »

I'm involved in running a large taxi business and had this problem some time ago. We have various insurance companies involved and were informed by them all, that insurance does not cover a child in the front seat using a spiecally designed seat period. Some countries still alow this but most EU countries don't. Turning off an air bag also invalidates your insurance period.

jO

Just been through my current and previous policies and neither state anything of the sort. Taxis are exempted from the rules for children over a certain age.

It's all on the RSA website.

Disabling a safety system (the whole airbag system in this case) may invalidate your insurance, but taking a precaution of temporarily disabling 1 airbag that could in the event of a collission prevent further bodily harm could not possibly invalidate insurance. I'd imagine the opposite would be the case.

If the airbag can't be disabled then the child has to travel in the back, if it can then the child may travel in the front.

jamesO

Ok the rules for taxis only vary when it comes to a taxi having to supply 4 different sizes of seats which is not possible as their's not enough space.

Be careful about the black and white of what a policy will tell you trust me!

Try this and the get back to me -

Call your insurance company and ask them, they will say no!!

If they happen to say yes then ask for it in writing.

Let me know how you get on

jO

Seth Brundle

alexmcred wrote: »

A lot of faward facing child seats are suitable from birth so i would put one of those in if i were to have another one.

It is strongly recommended that babies under 13Kg are kept in rear facing seats. Anyone who has kids should opt for the safest option if they really love them!
http://www.carseatsite.com/statistics.htm
http://www.car-safety.org/rearface.html
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/9916868/

jamesO wrote: »

I'm involved in running a large taxi business and had this problem some time ago. We have various insurance companies involved and were informed by them all, that insurance does not cover a child in the front seat using a spiecally designed seat period. Some countries still alow this but most EU countries don't. Turning off an air bag also invalidates your insurance period.

jO

Nonsense! They can't start creating rules if its not explicitly stated within the paperwork that was agreed upon at the time the policy contract was made! They may be allowed to change the terms of the contract with a notification period but not on the spot. Otherwise then they would do this for all claims made!

ninty9er wrote: »

If the airbag can't be disabled then the child has to travel in the back, if it can then the child may travel in the front.

The RSA, etc. recommend the rear because its the safer option statistically. However, because its impractical to make it illegal to ban child seats in the front, this option is left there

-Chris-

My limited experience of this was when I was working with Mazda. To disable the passenger airbag they'd provide a resistor that fooled the car into believing the airbag was still active, while simultaneously disabling it.
To have it done, you had to sign a contract to say it was done at your own will and that Mazda weren't legally liable for any damages that ensued from having it disabled.
They also provided you with stickers that you had to stick on the passenger side to inform any adult passengers that you didn't have a working airbag.

Nowadays a lot of cars have the ability to disable and re-enable the passenger airbag with your key. In terms of the Audi range, it's standard on everything from A4 upwards. I don't know if the insurance companies penalise our cars for having this ability.

ninty9er

jamesO wrote: »

Ok the rules for taxis only vary when it comes to a taxi having to supply 4 different sizes of seats which is not possible as their's not enough space.

Be careful about the black and white of what a policy will tell you trust me!

Try this and the get back to me -

Call your insurance company and ask them, they will say no!!

If they happen to say yes then ask for it in writing.

Let me know how you get on

jO

I sent:

Hi there,

Just a general policy query. My car is fitted with a front passenger airbag that can be disabled independent of the other airbags using the car key. Quite obviously the owners manual says that a rear facing child seat shouldn’t be placed in the front with the airbag activated. Are there any insurance implications of disabling that one airbag (i.e. all other airbags still working) to put a rear facing child seat in the car?

Kindest regards,

I received:

Hi ninty9er,

Thank you for your e mail,

Yes this is fine to remove the airbag for the rear faceing child seat as per our underwriting department.

Any further queries please contact or call us on 1890 33 22 11.

Kind Regards,

Sales support team.

:P

Henry Ford III

There is more than one insurance underwriter.

ninty9er

Henry Ford III wrote: »

There is more than one insurance underwriter.

If you read jamesO's post it states:

"they will say no"

They didn't, and they are probably the one of, if not the largest underwriter in the country.

*And I did get it in writing!

Henry Ford III

I read his post. My point still stands however.

jamesO

Just to let you know an email is "not in writing" so I take it you got headed paper from the underwriter in the post? only then can you be sure your covered. Be careful insurance companies are famous for doing U turns on emails and phone calls when you are involved in an accident.

jO-)

TheMaxDaddy

Anybody know about using a child seat in a large commercial van like a Ford Transit?
I'm hiring one this weekend for moving and I'm sure I'm not the only parent who drives a Transit. Anybody know? I mailed Britax (first class SI seat), but I guess I could be forever waiting for a response.

Seth Brundle

I presume that there isn't but is there a passenger airbag?

The fixings will depend on the type of child seat I guess - is it a baby seat or a child booster seat?

You would also need to check with your insurance company to see if its allowed!