The new avensis what do ye think ??

Zube

Avns1s wrote: »

If we are taking that narrow definition, do you really think that the manufacturers care about the "desirability" of their cars so long as they sell well and make loads of money for them?

Yes.

Stevie Dakota

Avns1s wrote: »

Look, bottom line here is that "desirability" is a subjective thing.

If you want to be pedantic then yes, but the reality people desire the Qashqai, and don't desire the Tiida, one sells well, the other does not. The lesson for the manufacturer is MAKE THE CAR DESIRABLE. And if you think manufactures don't car about making desirable cars you are very wrong.

ninty9er

MarkN wrote: »

Toyota do not make desirable cars, end of. They make good cars, nobody is saying they don't but I've never looked at one and said God I would love to own one of them someday. That is the point Unkel is making.

Not even a Supra??

Seth Brundle

I and others are talking in the present tense. The old MR2, Celica and Supra (and I'm sure there are others) were nice. However, there isn't anything currently within the Toyota range that is nice!

Barr

I think its a huge step forward .. far more modern than say the likes of the passat

Althogh the Mazda 6 is the best looker in the class

cvisser

very similar to the New Model Honda Accord due here shortly.

siralfalot

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO
OOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOORING!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :rolleyes:


It will sell like hot cakes to the usual Irish fianna fail voters and GAA lovers


mostly in beige..... just like my Dads :eek::P

egan007

BOOOOOOOOOOOOOO





RIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIIING

abitdazed

It smacks of the new Opel/Vauxhall Insignia. At least the rear half does from that picture anyway.

Zonda999

I just checked netcarshow.com right there(Was looking for a nice new wallpaper) and came accross this.I hadnt seen it before at all and netcarshow are usually fairly reliable.This is the actual production car, i gather


I think it looks pretty awful.I mean this is a promo shot, the chancto make a car look as good as it possibly can and its still horrible IMO.WHAT is with those door handles??This looks nowhere near as well as most of the other family cars.Try harder toyota FFS.

Ice_Box

regedit

That looks really nice.
Front Mondeo, Side Mazda and Lexus and back Volvo. Is this a photo-shopped pic or genuine.

Did a search and here's what I found. The article was published in autoweek.nl.
I did a google translation of the text

We had to wait long, but finally have the first photo of the new Toyota Avensis. The car debuts, along with two other new Toyota's, at the Paris Motor Show.
The new Avensis gets more powerful engines, which means lower CO2 emissions.
This is the limited information provided by Toyota.
In addition, Toyota promises a higher quality and a more comprehensive standard equipment.
The Avensis grew five centimetres in length and width. The buyer can choose in the first instance of three petrol engines: a 1.8 with 132 or 147 hp and 152 hp strong 2.0. On the diesel end, there is a 2.0-liter with 126 or 150 horsepower and a 2.2-liter four with 177 hp. The new Avensis comes in the second quarter of 2009 on the market.

BTW, Zonda 999, what are you talking about. You have the cover page of a magazine with a Pontiac on it.

Biro

regedit wrote: »

BTW, Zonda 999, what are you talking about. You have the cover page of a magazine with a Pontiac on it.

That's a 'vette. Get your cars straight boy!

ninty9er

Ice_Box wrote: »

Looks very well from that angle, I can't help but think that light cluster will age terribly though.

Edit: BTW one thing that bugs me that I hope they'll resolve; put 2 f*ing reverse lights on the damn thing!!

regedit

ninty9er wrote: »

Looks very well from that angle, I can't help but think that light cluster will age terribly though.

Edit: BTW one thing that bugs me that I hope they'll resolve; put 2 f*ing reverse lights on the damn thing!!

That does not concern me too much.
looking at the rear bumper, I can see that the reverse sensors are positioned quite low. Wondering if such, they would be more prone to getting damaged.

ninty9er

regedit wrote: »

looking at the rear bumper, I can see that the reverse sensors are positioned quite low. Wondering if such, they would be more prone to getting damaged.

I thought that too, but I suppose if you're using them properly it won't be an issue:D

Also...why release a side only profile??

Zonda999

regedit wrote: »

BTW, Zonda 999, what are you talking about. You have the cover page of a magazine with a Pontiac on it.

Biro wrote: »

That's a 'vette. Get your cars straight boy!

I had the right pic there alright when i first posted but sumthing must have happened it...

I still think this avensis will look awful when toyota ireland get their hands on it and put there lovely 16" hubcaps on it:D

ninty9er

Zonda999 wrote: »

I still think this avensis will look awful when toyota ireland get their hands on it and put there lovely 16" hubcaps on it:D

Was thinking the exact same.....wonder how big the wheel in the photo are?? It's highly unlikely they've overcome the massive wheel arches fetish in the design studio, is it?

Zonda999

ninty9er wrote: »

Was thinking the exact same.....wonder how big the wheel in the photo are?? It's highly unlikely they've overcome the massive wheel arches fetish in the design studio, is it?

I think they might be 17"s but i'm not so sure.

You can see that its basically the same as this


However, the changes theyve made to the door handles and the rear lights are awful IMO.I wonder what the front of this one looks like.I dont think it'll be as agressive as in the above picture.Maybe they were afraid it would be too alike the lexus IS??

E92

Zonda999 wrote: »

However, the changes theyve made to the door handles and the rear lights are awful IMO.I wonder what the front of this one looks like.I dont think it'll be as agressive as in the above picture.Maybe they were afraid it would be too alike the lexus IS??

+1

Btw I'm still not convinced that the Avensis will look as good as even the beige one - you know what Toyota are like at engineering bland and unimaginative cars.

They do seem to go out of their way to make cars as inoffensive and therefore dull as possible.

I also don't like the arse of it. It just looks a bit too fussy for me.

I'm delighted to see that it looks like Toyota are getting rid of the 1.6 litre engine. Not that there ever was going to be a need for a 1.6 litre engine in RHD now that we do tax on CO2 rather than engine size(though I note Opel still thinks we need a 1.6 Insignia:mad:!)

Though a 1.8 in 2 states of tune? That doesn't seem very Toyota like at all. The petrol engines are a new range of dual VVT-i engines, the ZR series first seen in the 1.6 Auris last year. The 2ZR-FE(1.8) has 137 bhp, while the 3ZR-FE(2.0) has 147 and the 3ZR-FAE has 158 bhp(also a 2.0), the 3ZR-FAE has something called "Valvematic", which apparently is variable lift, which makes me wonder why they didn't just bother calling it a VVTL-i like they normally do. Though I've seen reports claiming it is like BMW's now defunct Valvetronic.

I await colm_mcm's explanation on this;)!

Surprisingly, given that Toyota gets a lot of kudos for hybrids like the Prius, there's still no sign of direct injection petrols being rolled out, and if anything I've noticed that the new ZR engine partially replaces the AZ engine, and that did have direct injection in Europe at least, which means Toyota is going backwards rather than forwards:(, but because they make the Prius I suppose that's all OK:rolleyes:.

Also surprising is that the 2.0 diesel will be offered in 2 states of tune, another thing that Toyota rarely do. I hope Toyota Ireland follow Opel and resist the temptation to sell a lower powered Paddy special version of the engine, i.e. that we won't see a specially detuned for Ireland 100 bhp version of a 2.0 diesel or something like that. Means the new 1.8 D-4D won't be around for another while though then obviously.

Speaking to a Toyota dealer 2 weeks ago, I was informed that the current Avensis has in fact gone out of production and anyone who wants one can only get what's left in dealers, the new one will be "Lexus like" and has gone into production.

I was given the impression that they're trying to move the new one upmarket, so I wonder what will happen here, since the current one sold very well in the basic 1.6 guise?

Toyota won't want to be losing the title of the nation's favourite family car for too much longer, so are they going to start selling special low spec models here like they do with the Auris, and have done consistently over the years, or are they going to follow the rest of Europe, position it as something more upmarket, and insert larger engined and higher spec versions of the Corolla to fill the void that a more upmarket Avensis will create?

Zonda999

E92 wrote: »

+1

Btw I'm still not convinced that the Avensis will look as good as even the beige one - you know what Toyota are like at engineering bland and unimaginative cars.

They do seem to go out of their way to make cars as inoffensive and therefore dull as possible.

I also don't like the arse of it. It just looks a bit too fussy for me.

I'm delighted to see that it looks like Toyota are getting rid of the 1.6 litre engine. Not that there ever was going to be a need for a 1.6 litre engine in RHD now that we do tax on CO2 rather than engine size(though I note Opel still thinks we need a 1.6 Insignia:mad:!)

Though a 1.8 in 2 states of tune? That doesn't seem very Toyota like at all. The petrol engines are a new range of dual VVT-i engines, the ZR series first seen in the 1.6 Auris last year. The 2ZR-FE(1.8) has 137 bhp, while the 3ZR-FE(2.0) has 147 and the 3ZR-FAE has 158 bhp(also a 2.0), the 3ZR-FAE has something called "Valvematic", which apparently is variable lift, which makes me wonder why they didn't just bother calling it a VVTL-i like they normally do. Though I've seen reports claiming it is like BMW's now defunct Valvetronic.

I await colm_mcm's explanation on this;)!

Surprisingly, given that Toyota gets a lot of kudos for hybrids like the Prius, there's still no sign of direct injection petrols being rolled out, and if anything I've noticed that the new ZR engine partially replaces the AZ engine, and that did have direct injection in Europe at least, which means Toyota is going backwards rather than forwards:(, but because they make the Prius I suppose that's all OK:rolleyes:.

Also surprising is that the 2.0 diesel will be offered in 2 states of tune, another thing that Toyota rarely do. I hope Toyota Ireland follow Opel and resist the temptation to sell a lower powered Paddy special version of the engine, i.e. that we won't see a specially detuned for Ireland 100 bhp version of a 2.0 diesel or something like that. Means the new 1.8 D-4D won't be around for another while though then obviously.

Speaking to a Toyota dealer 2 weeks ago, I was informed that the current Avensis has in fact gone out of production and anyone who wants one can only get what's left in dealers, the new one will be "Lexus like" and has gone into production.

I was given the impression that they're trying to move the new one upmarket, so I wonder what will happen here, since the current one sold very well in the basic 1.6 guise?

Toyota won't want to be losing the title of the nation's favourite family car for too much longer, so are they going to start selling special low spec models here like they do with the Auris, and have done consistently over the years, or are they going to follow the rest of Europe, position it as something more upmarket, and insert larger engined and higher spec versions of the Corolla to fill the void that a more upmarket Avensis will create?

Interesting piece, especially about the engines.Will this mean that the basic petrol avensis will have 137 bhp??Thats quite a lot really when you consider the current 1.6 only has 109bhp or something like that


[/QUOTE]lower powered Paddy special version [/QUOTE]

LOL:D:D
I wouldnt put it past them to be honest.Although, in fairness the current 2.0 diesel avensis has 124bhp even in this country so they hardly are going to go below that. It is something i could see them doing in terms of a petrol engine, though

ninty9er

Ice_Box wrote: »

Colm inofmred me today that this(the beige one) is not the final production version...the rear light cluster is different, so there's bound to be a few more changes in final production.

E92

Zonda999 wrote: »

Interesting piece, especially about the engines.Will this mean that the basic petrol avensis will have 137 bhp??Thats quite a lot really when you consider the current 1.6 only has 109bhp or something like that


lower powered Paddy special version

LOL:D:D
I wouldnt put it past them to be honest.Although, in fairness the current 2.0 diesel avensis has 124bhp even in this country so they hardly are going to go below that. It is something i could see them doing in terms of a petrol engine, though

Well in more sane countries the base Avensis has 129 bhp, so that's only 8 more for everyone else.

As for the 2.0 D-4D, like you say it has 126 bhp, which was pretty OK even 2 years ago when it came out, but such is the pace of diesel technology these days anything less than 150 from a 2.0 looks decidedly weak. Even 150 is only average when VAG can get 170, BMW can get 177 and Renault can manage 180 bhp from the same size and 1 turbo.

FIAT now do a 1.6 diesel with only 6 less bhp, Ford have a 1.8 with 1 less bhp, similarly Opel have a 1.7 with only 1 less bhp than the 2.0 D-4D with 126 bhp.

So it'll do just fine as a base model, we really don't need anything less powerful! It'll be a big improvement on the present 1.6 I'm sure though, though in their quest to make it more upmarket, they'll probably have made it pile on plenty of pounds, which is probably why they appear not to be bothering with a 1.6 petrol(although low powered petrol cars sell very well in Turkey, where the existing Avensis is sold, totally off topic now but BMW sells a new 316i there - thanks to the VRT rules that car is now gone from here thanks be to God, and their website with the facelifted model shows that the entry engine for Ireland is indeed the 318i rather than the 316i:)).

ninty9er

E92 wrote: »

though in their quest to make it more upmarket, they'll probably have made it pile on plenty of pounds.

No bad thing, a bit of weight in the doors would be a good place to start!!

Though in their bid to fall into lower VRT bands they may detune engines, though we were told that the chipped diesel is more fuel efficient.

wil

Zonda999 wrote: »

I think they might be 17"s but i'm not so sure.

You can see that its basically the same as this


However, the changes theyve made to the door handles and the rear lights are awful IMO.I wonder what the front of this one looks like.I dont think it'll be as agressive as in the above picture.Maybe they were afraid it would be too alike the lexus IS??

Looks like a step backwards shapewise. They could have taken the current shape and well make it look, what can I say, less boring.
Instead they are taking their design pointers from