The England Squad - discuss

Savman

Answers on a postcard please.

Goalkeepers:
David James (Portsmouth), Paul Robinson (Blackburn), Joe Hart (Manchester City)
Defenders:
Wayne Bridge (Chelsea), Ashley Cole (Chelsea), John Terry (Chelsea), Wes Brown (Manchester United), Rio Ferdinand (Manchester United), Glen Johnson (Portsmouth), Jonathan Woodgate (Tottenham), Matthew Upson (West Ham)
Midfielders:
Theo Walcott (Arsenal), Gareth Barry (Aston Villa), Joe Cole (Chelsea), Frank Lampard (Chelsea), David Beckham (Los Angeles Galaxy), Steven Gerrard (Liverpool), Michael Carrick (Manchester United), Stewart Downing (Middlesbrough), David Bentley (Tottenham),
Strikers:
Wayne Rooney (Manchester United), Jermain Defoe (Portsmouth), Emile Heskey (Wigan)

As a Villa fan, Ashley Young being overlooked is absolutely criminal.

Also, Micah Richards anyone?

leninbenjamin

thinking about it some more the only thing i can think of is that Capello has seen enough of Young and the others (he did attend a fair few Villa games last season iirc) and wants to see a few others before the competative games start.

if this isn't the case though i'm stumped...

Savman

leninbenjamin wrote: »

thinking about it some more the only thing i can think of is that Capello has seen enough of Young and the others (he did attend a fair few Villa games last season iirc) and wants to see a few others before the competative games start.

if this isn't the case though i'm stumped...

So he hasn't seen enough of Wayne Rooney, Gerrard or Lampard? Arsebiscuits :eek:

leninbenjamin

Savman wrote: »

So he hasn't seen enough of Wayne Rooney, Gerrard or Lampard? Arsebiscuits :eek:

i said it was the only thing i could think of :P

carlop

Very surprised Beckham's still in there, I mean surely Capello doesn't plan on bringing him to the World Cup, and while some may argue he can contribute in qualifying, I personally think there'd be more sense in blooding talent like Young

MagicMarker

I think any team in the world right now would like a player like Beckham to come on for the last 10 minutes of the game. He can still change a match with one kick of the ball.

I for one am happy he's there.

Xavi6

Can't believe both Young and Richards were overlooked. Richards is a better player than Brown, Upson and Johnson. Probably Woodgate too. Ridiculous.

At least Hart made it.

LuckyLloyd

Xavi6 wrote: »

Can't believe both Young and Richards were overlooked. Richards is a better player than Brown, Upson and Johnson. Probably Woodgate too. Ridiculous.

At least Hart made it.

wat

Wreck

I can't believe Heskey is in there. I'm sure Ashton would have got that place if he wasn't injured, but I would take Crouch over Heskey any day of the week.

Don't understand why Beckham has been selected.

PHB

Brown in all fairness was an essentail part of the best defence in the world last year, so you can understand his inclusion over Richards, but Upson or Johnson, they just aren't up to that quality. Surprised Neville ain't there either.

Ashley Young not being there makes absolutely no sense to me. Is there somethign i'm missing about him? I was shocked when none of the big 4 made a move for him, do lots of people think he was a one season wonder?

mike65

Typically conservative selection. Crouch will feel aggrieved, Capello was at the West Ham v Wigan game so thats why Heskey is in.

Mike.

PHB

Also on a side note, I really hope Carrick is ****e for England in these matches if he even plays. I want Capello to keep overlooking him. Because when he realises that Carrick could actually make England a good footballing side and that the best midfield he can play is Carrick and Hargreaves with Gerrard in front of them, United will have another player playing for England.

Carrick getting overlooked was one of the best things of last season Our midfield was always the freshest after the international break, with both Carrick and Scholes staying in Manchester.

PHB

mike65 wrote: »

Typically conservative selection. Crouch will feel aggrieved, Capello was at the West Ham v Wigan game so thats why Heskey is in.

Why Heskey and not Ashton I don't think I'll ever understand English national team managers

mike65

Ashton picked up a knock! (yeah I can hardly belive it either )

Mike.

Boggles

Xavi6 wrote: »

Richards is a better player than Brown,

Richards is nowhere near reaching the level Brown attained last year, if he had he would have gone for 20 odd million this year.

Richards is a young player with alot of potential, potential that needs to be realised in performances before he can even be consider equal or better than some of the players you mentioned, you can't pick an international squad on potential and hype.

mayordenis

I think he might have reservations about richards fitness but he'll be a big part of the squad throughout qualifying

Chong

Yup Ashton took an unfortunate knock at the end of y'days game.

Raskolnikov

carlop wrote: »

Very surprised Beckham's still in there, I mean surely Capello doesn't plan on bringing him to the World Cup, and while some may argue he can contribute in qualifying, I personally think there'd be more sense in blooding talent like Young

It'll either be Bentley or Beckham playing on the right. Both are completely different players, which gives Capello flexability on who to bring on depending on how the game goes. A wise decision if you ask me.

Savman

Ashley Young is by no means a one season wonder. This isn't good news for the players left out:

Sky Sports wrote:

Fabio Capello is looking for a performance from his troops against Czech Republic on Wednesday after stating the time to experiment is over

"I have to check on the form before the qualifiers but experimenting is finished," explained Capello. "I know the players very well now.
"It is an important game because I hope to get the answers from the players that I hope to achieve. I hope to get what I expect.

As for Richards, his omission is astounding, one of the brightest prospects England have. I should mention Gareth Barry has barely played a game all summer whereas Ashley Young scored a screamer against Odense to get Villa thru the UEFA tie last month and he also pulled all the strings last Thursday in Iceland (a game Fabio flew out to watch oddly enough)

Although I've no national allegiance to ingerland, this squad reeks of conservatism which was the primary cause of the downfall of both Sven and McClown. People were lauding Capello's arrival because everyone thought he'd actually have the balls to drop the big names and pick players on merit.

Xavi6

Boggles wrote: »

Richards is nowhere near reaching the level Brown attained last year, if he had he would have gone for 20 odd million this year.

Richards is a young player with alot of potential, potential that needs to be realised in performances before he can even be consider equal or better than some of the players you mentioned, you can't pick an international squad on potential and hype.

Hype my bollox.

Have you actually seen Richards play? I'm sure you saw the derby at Old Trafford where he was immense.

HalloweenJack

Richards and Young are both outstanding young players and you can only see them going on further. They should both be in the squad, though I think Richards has been struggling for fitness since the end of last season.

Bubs101

Capello in only picking three strikers shock. This is going to be a boring England team but it's nice to see Heskey back. Always felt that he was unfairly scapegoated for Sven's reign. Can't see why he didn't pick Richards though

Xavi6

HalloweenJack wrote: »

Richards and Young are both outstanding young players and you can only see them going on further. They should both be in the squad, though I think Richards has been struggling for fitness since the end of last season.

How has he been struggling for fitness? He's been fit since May and has a full preseason behind him, same as any player.

HalloweenJack

Xavi6 wrote: »

How has he been struggling for fitness? He's been fit since May and has a full preseason behind him, same as any player.

That was my guess really, hence the use of the phrase "I think". I'm sorry for not having a running update on the Man City treatment room.

Xavi6

No problem, glad to be of service.

Kold

Heskey? I'd prefer to see Crouch. Also.. That's quite a few CBs, I should think a 4th striker would be more important.

glenjamin

Can anyone tell me why Wayne Bridge still gets his spot when hes not playing at all??? The lad is quality but there are more left backs out there that should be ahead of him due to the fact they're playing regulary.

Crouch FOR Heskey
Young FOR Beckham
Lescott FOR Bridge
Green FOR Hart
Kirkland FOR Robinson
Milner FOR Walcott

Bounty Hunter

Goalkeepers:
David James (Portsmouth), Robert Green(Blackburn), Joe Hart (Manchester City)
Defenders:
Joleon Lescott (Everton), Ashley Cole (Chelsea), John Terry (Chelsea), Micah Richards (Manchester City), Rio Ferdinand (Manchester United), Glen Johnson (Portsmouth), Jonathan Woodgate (Tottenham), Matthew Upson (West Ham)
Midfielders:
Gareth Barry (Aston Villa), Joe Cole (Chelsea), Frank Lampard (Chelsea), David Beckham (Los Angeles Galaxy), Steven Gerrard (Liverpool), Ashley Young (Aston Villa), Stewart Downing (Middlesbrough), David Bentley (Tottenham),
Strikers:
Wayne Rooney (Manchester United), Jermain Defoe (Portsmouth), Peter Crouch (Portsmouth) Gabriel Agbonlahor (Aston Villa)

---

Is Heargreaves Injured? He would also make it ahead of either Carrick or Beckham for me if fit. and I cant think of a quality English CB to replace Upson with but in sure there is better available

Boggles

Xavi6 wrote: »

Hype my bollox.

Have you actually seen Richards play? I'm sure you saw the derby at Old Trafford where he was immense.

Did you see him today?

If your refering to the Derby where City took the lead in the 25th minute and spent the rest of the match in their own box, yeah he was immense because he had 9 other centre halves beside him.

Mr Alan

i think most people, incl Utd fans, would choose Richards over Brown.

He is quite an excellent player and getting better. Brown is a very good player all the same. But not as good as Richards imo.

PHB

International football isn't about potential. Richards isn't at the top level yet, and imo won't be until he moves to a big club and develops his game at the highest level.

Whether Brown or Richards is a better player is something of a mute point though, since they are both better than Upson and Johnson.

Boggles

Mr Alan wrote: »

i think most people, incl Utd fans, would choose Richards over Brown.

He is quite an excellent player and getting better. Brown is a very good player all the same. But not as good as Richards imo.

It always amuses me that people can make an assumtion about 2 players, one who is proven he can do it while the other hasn't come close to proving himself at any sort of high level but the assumtion is that he is and will be better.

Mr Alan

wat are you talking about Boggles?

Richards has been excellent for City very consistantly for 2 years. imo, he was as good as Brown last year, if not better, just because Brown plays in a better team does not give him the right to the place.

Brown only featured for Utd last year due to injuries, albeit long term injuries! He did very well, but was playing for the best team in Europe who rarely spend much of any game under much pressure from teams constantly attacking them.

most Utd fans dont think he is good enough to be your first choice right back if Neville cant get back to fitness.

to make it even funnier, Richards is the man mentioned most to fill the role!:)

Boggles

Mr Alan wrote: »

wat are you talking about Boggles?

Richards has been excellent for City very consistantly for 2 years.

Richards has played in a defence that has leaked nearly 100 goals in 2 seasons.

Mr Alan wrote: »

Brown only featured for Utd last year due to injuries, albeit long term injuries! He did very well, but was playing for the best team in Europe who rarely spend much of any game under much pressure from teams constantly attacking them.

What does it matter what circumstance Brown played in the team, United last season was the best team in Europe and England, Brown made more appearances than any other United defender. You should watch the Barcelona game in the Camp Nue to see how Brown coped under pressure. Add to that he had Ronaldo playing in front of him who has a royal pardon from defending, it makes it even more impressive.

Mr Alan wrote: »

to make it even funnier, Richards is the man mentioned most to fill the role!:)

The only funny thing about that is City would sell to United. Big Fail this evening Mr. Alan.

Mr Alan

Boggles wrote: »

Richards has played in a defence that has leaked nearly 100 goals in 2 seasons.

As i said, he plays for a club that really stuggled two years ago, but improved last year, Utd are better than City and will always concede far less goals, there is no one arguing that. But individually, i think Richards is better than Brown.

United last season was the best team in Europe and England, Brown made more appearances than any other United defender.

Brown was undoubtedly the weakest of the defenders though, and the one that Utd fans in the main hoped would be replaced this year.

I could throw Arbeloa into the Utd defence last year and you would most likely still have won the league and CL, doesnt mean that he is more deserving of his place in the national side than ramos or whoever though.

--Richards---Ferdinand---Vidic----Evra--

is far superior to....

--Brown---Ferdinand---Vidic----Evra--

imo.

estebancambias

But Richards doesn't play right back anymore.

Boggles

Mr Alan wrote: »

Brown was undoubtedly the weakest of the defenders though, and the one that Utd fans in the main hoped would be replaced this year.

Your defense is only was strong as your weakest link.

Brown was no more or less culpable defensively than Vidic, Ferdinand or Evra, attacking wise he had a better end product than all 3 of them.

Capello has the same opinon of me, maybe we are both wrong. :rolleyes:

Mr Alan wrote: »

--Richards---Ferdinand---Vidic----Evra--

is far superior to....

--Brown---Ferdinand---Vidic----Evra--

imo.

How can you say that is far superior, real world the defence with Brown was the best in Europe last season, it is a giant leap of faith to suggest Richards who is unproven would improve it so much to suggest it would be "far superior", botherline nonsense.

estebancambias

Savman wrote: »

Answers on a postcard please.


As a Villa fan, Ashley Young being overlooked is absolutely criminal.

Also, Micah Richards anyone?

No its not. Do you think England played friendlies in May for the laugh?

Young was **** in those matches, giving the ball away all the time, Capello was visibly angered by this, thus he fails to get a call up.

eagle eye

Ashley Young should be in there imo. Agbonlahor will be watched closely after the way he played against Man City. What about Aaron Lennon? I'd put him ahead of Bentley and he can play on both sides.

Savman

estebancambias wrote: »

No its not. Do you think England played friendlies in May for the laugh?

Young was **** in those matches, giving the ball away all the time, Capello was visibly angered by this, thus he fails to get a call up.

And all those other players performed flawlessly did they? :rolleyes:
Deep down I don't really care that Young isn't in the squad, purely for selfish reasons but I do know that the squad is weaker with him not in it. Anyone who pulls all the strings for a Top 6 Premiership side deserves a call up.

PHB wrote:

International football isn't about potential.

Huh? Holland were one of the standout teams of the Euros, primarily because Van Basten had the balls to get rid of the stiff old guard and blood some youth into the side. You can flog your Beckham horses til they retire but sooner or later you have to introduce fresh legs, especially into what has become a seriously stale England team.

The Richards argument is quite simple, he should be in there, period.

estebancambias

Savman wrote: »

And all those other players performed flawlessly did they? :rolleyes:
Deep down I don't really care that Young isn't in the squad, purely for selfish reasons but I do know that the squad is weaker with him not in it. Anyone who pulls all the strings for a Top 6 Premiership side deserves a call up.

Huh? Holland were one of the standout teams of the Euros, primarily because Van Basten had the balls to get rid of the stiff old guard and blood some youth into the side. You can flog your Beckham horses til they retire but sooner or later you have to introduce fresh legs, especially into what has become a seriously stale England team.

The Richards argument is quite simple, he should be in there, period.

sorry yeah i get that. obviously it doesn't bother you cause first young stays fresh and your not english(at least i hope not:D)

but as i said young played bad in those games, so that could be it. england have a large pool of players, they can afford this.

Kold

I think it looks like the weakest squad England have had in a few years.

OPENROAD

estebancambias wrote: »

but as i said young played bad in those games, so that could be it. england have a large pool of players, they can afford this.

Know England have a much larger pool of players and so chances to play are harder if you have a bad match than someone in the same position for ireland but if he keeps his form he certainly deserves another opportunity. Also surprised Agbonlahor was not called up.

estebancambias

openroad were you agreeing with me there?

Savman

The main reason I started this thread, apart from being horrified at Young being ignored, is because the English FA and entire media machine went into overdrive when they were presenting Fabio Capello as their new manager. I remember they were all waxing lyrical about how he'd shake things up and how he wasn't afraid to 'drop some big names'. At the time I thought it was a great appointment for the ingerlish and was slightly envious that they were finally going in the right direction when our excuse for an FA were arse about face.

As it turns out, Capello has clearly gone back with the usual suspects, perhaps his conservative Italian roots got the better of him and he just wants the experienced pros, even if some of those old pros haven't performed for England on any kind of consistent level in a long time, if ever.

If that's the way it is, so ends any remote interest I had in following Capello's reign. If he's gonna make the same mistakes as all the previous managers, he must have some ace up his sleeve to succeed where they have failed.

I guess what I'm getting at is that change was obviously needed because they couldn't even reach the last major tournament. Half those players have no hunger when they play for their national team, and a lot could do with some time in the wilderness to rediscover their passion because they've just looked like a bunch of playboys for the last few years that badly needed a serious kick up the arse.

Bah what do I care.

OPENROAD

estebancambias wrote: »

openroad were you agreeing with me there?

Kind of in that it is much harder to cement your place for a team like England i.e you are expected to take your chance when you get it becuse if you don't their are likely to be other players who can come in next time which I don't agree with,Young is doing enough for Villa to at least get in the squad again.

estebancambias

Kold wrote: »

I think it looks like the weakest squad England have had in a few years.

Its a lot better than than the 2002 squad....that was horrific on paper...quarter final was a success...a major success.

i guess though that was 'years'

estebancambias

OPENROAD wrote: »

Kind of in that it is much harder to cement your place for a team like England i.e you are expected to take your chance when you get it becuse if you don't their are likely to be other players who can come in next time which I don't agree with,Young is doing enough for Villa to at least get in the squad again.

well to be honest, i think young should get a chance but i probably didn't make it clear. the reason i didn't know if you agreed with me cause i thought you meant no rather than know.

Helix

leninbenjamin wrote: »

thinking about it some more the only thing i can think of is that Capello has seen enough of Young and the others (he did attend a fair few Villa games last season iirc) and wants to see a few others before the competative games start.

if this isn't the case though i'm stumped...

thats definitely it imo

he wanted to pick a strongish squad and give a few players a chance, hence no young

and to be fair with it being the last friendly before it gets going for the wcqs, who can blame him

Helix

estebancambias wrote: »

No its not. Do you think England played friendlies in May for the laugh?

Young was **** in those matches, giving the ball away all the time, Capello was visibly angered by this, thus he fails to get a call up.

hes proven time and time again for villa that hes far and away the best in the league at what he does. anyone who even attempts to argue with that is braindead. its as simple as that

event

Savman wrote: »

As it turns out, Capello has clearly gone back with the usual suspects, perhaps his conservative Italian roots got the better of him and he just wants the experienced pros, even if some of those old pros haven't performed for England on any kind of consistent level in a long time, if ever.

If that's the way it is, so ends any remote interest I had in following Capello's reign. If he's gonna make the same mistakes as all the previous managers, he must have some ace up his sleeve to succeed where they have failed.

did you really think that lampard, gerrard, terry, cole etc werent going to get into the england squad?
they are still the best players england have, who else should be in there?

he could still pick a team of

---

hart

---

Cole - woodgate - upson - johnson

downing - carrick - barry -gerrard

---

heskey--defoe

---

that would be a very different team than any previous ones, but would that really be the answer?
i dont believe he would be afraid to drop any of the big names, but only if there is someone to really come in. perhaps he wants to give them one chance, perhaps he believes he is better than all other managers and he can get them playing well.