Laser Card Daily Linit Reduced to €100!!!!

Carrigman

I was in Spain for the last couple of weeks. Last evening there I tried to withdraw €200. Got a message on the ATM screen to say that the limit had been exceeded and to check with my bank. My wife tried to do the same on her card and got the same message. Initially I thought that our accounts had been hacked but a quick check on the internet showed that everything was OK and there was plenty of credit on the accounts. So what was up? A glitch on the Spanish ATM system?

When we landed in Cork this morning I tried again. Got the same message. I rang the Bank Of Ireland helpline and after waiting about 20 mins I eventually got through to an agent who told me that the daily limit had been reduced to €100 becuase of "a security issue".

I was fuming at this stage. How dare they decide to limit my access to my own money to such a small amount without any prior notification.

I demanded to speak to a manager and after another long wait a lady came on to reiterate that a security issue had been discovered "in the last few days" resulting in the need to limit what customers could draw out on a daily basis.

That is piffle. The banks have been aware *to my certain knowledge* of a problem with probably 100,000+ Laser cards since at least February. Their security has been "compromised" to use their own description. I don't know what exactly that means and the banks are trying to keep a lid on the whole thing (to avoid panic I expect).

Why didn't they move months ago to cancel and re-issue Laser cards to the customers affected? Why wait until peak holiday season to reduce the limits to a laughable €100 per day to all customers? Thousands of customers abroad are in for a nasty shock, especially if they don't have credit cards. My son is one such - he is in the south of France and can only get €100 per day. I now have to either wire him money by Western Union (I haven't the faintest idea how!) or get him back to Ireland well before his holiday is due to end.

There is something deeply wrong with the Irish banking system. This is an issue that they have been aware of for months ( DO NOT believe their spin that will no doubt be disseminated over the next few days) yet they decided to keep silent about it and now thousands of people at home and especially abroad are going to suffer because of their arrogance and their incompetence.

Regards,

John

Guy:Incognito

Carrigman wrote: »

- he is in the south of France and can only get €100 per day. I now have to either wire him money by Western Union (I haven't the faintest idea how!) or get him back to Ireland well before his holiday is due to end.

Wh the hell would you have to do either. If he cant survive on €100 a day theres something wrong with him.

Wertz

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/56764/Thieves-crack-chip-and-pin-bank-accounts

This has very little to do with the Irish Banking system and a lot to do with fraudsters and thieves possibly having access to your accounts, which you say are in healthy credit....just the type of account these f8ckers go after. If your account was to be compromised and a lot of mney taken you'd probably be one of the first on here giving out that no-one tried to stop them or limtit the amount they could steal...

Guy:Incognito

Sunday Express wrote: »

Gangs are hiding devices inside card readers to reveal customers’ pin numbers.

This was discussed in AH. there a lot of scaremongering going on. Your money cant just be taken and it needs someone on the inside to be plantign the machines in shops then taking them out again. Nothing can be secure when something like that is possible. Theres nothign wrong with the security.

Wertz

I'd have thought that even the possibility that fraud could be commited on an account or accounts, would be taken fairly seriously by any bank, particulalry when dealing with daily requests for cash from a foreign ATM. I won't pretend to know what measures are or aren't in place or how widespread it is, but there must be a fairly good reason for limiting customer access to cash. I'd be fairly confident that if this is happening in the UK then it's probably happening here too...

jor el

Is this effecting Laser payments aswell as ATM withdrawals? I use Laser to pay a lot of my bills online, limiting it to 100 a day will be a pain in the orifice.

Ian Beale

Yes how dare they.Read your terms and conditions you gave them every right to do that if theres suspect transactions or a security risk.If your account had money taken from it and the bank thought it looked suspicious and waited to contact you i'm sure you'd be delighted knowing the limit wasnt reduced and in the mean time someones ran off with a few thousand from your account.
Yup how dare they.

Gillo

Carrigman wrote: »

That is piffle. The banks have been aware *to my certain knowledge* of a problem with probably 100,000+ Laser cards since at least February. Their security has been "compromised" to use their own description. I don't know what exactly that means and the banks are trying to keep a lid on the whole thing (to avoid panic I expect).

"To your certain knowledge" so what exactly do you know? and assuming it's not public knowledge how do you know?

latenia

Stekelly wrote: »

Wh the hell would you have to do either. If he cant survive on €100 a day theres something wrong with him.

Well €100 wouldn't go far in that part of the world anyway but say for example you went to pay a hotel bill for €1000 at the end of your stay. You have plenty in your account to cover it but can't access it. Your flight leaves in 3 hours and the staff are getting a bit shirty while you desperately try to get through to BOI at 5AM. Or how about you fill your car for €70 then spend 45 minutes walking around Tesco doing your weekly shop to find you can't pay?

craichoe

latenia wrote: »

Well €100 wouldn't go far in that part of the world anyway but say for example you went to pay a hotel bill for €1000 at the end of your stay. You have plenty in your account to cover it but can't access it. Your flight leaves in 3 hours and the staff are getting a bit shirty while you desperately try to get through to BOI at 5AM. Or how about you fill your car for €70 then spend 45 minutes walking around Tesco doing your weekly shop to find you can't pay?

AFAIK this doesn't affect PASS, only Maestro/Laser ?

Jip

http://www.rte.ie/news/2008/0818/fraud.html

Some banks have said that you should check with them before you travel to ensure that your card either hasn't been restricted for use abroad, or has been limited as what happened to the op.

jor el

Yeah, just heard on the news that it only effects use abroad, and not domestic. Still, if you're heading foreign, make sure to bring enough cash, and also don't be depending on large withdrawals on any one day.

Carrigman

I'm glad to see that the Irish Examiner published a story on this matter this morning following my phone call to them yesterday.

See: http://www.irishexaminer.ie/irishexaminer/pages/story.aspx-qqqg=ireland-qqqm=ireland-qqqa=ireland-qqqid=70122-qqqx=1.asp

They quoted the Bank Of Ireland as saying that 3,100 of its debit/credit cards were affected. If so, why did they reduce the withdrawal limit to €100 for ALL its customers abroad?

Why not just cancel,or reduce the limit on,the 3,100 cards? (And likewise of course the other banks if the total number of cards for all banks was 20,000?)

I now see that the BoI website is quoting a daily withdrawal limit of €250 which is a bit more reasonable. This, no doubt, is as a result of the bad publicity they have received and customer pressure. (They had to draft in additional staff to their call centre yesterday to cope with the volume of calls).

Why didn't they issue a press release over the weekend to let us know what was happening? People traveling abroad could have seen the details on the internet. But no, they decided to keep it quiet for as long as possible and only issued a statement as a result of media questioning.

Isn't it amazing that they could have organised an IT team at seemingly short notice to reduce the limits and yet they couldn't get their PR people to let the public know? Unbelievable arrogance and contempt for their customers.

There have been problems with large numbers of Laser cards being "compromised" since at least February last. This isn't just something that happened within "the last 48 hours" as the banks would have us believe.

Guy:Incognito

latenia wrote: »

Well €100 wouldn't go far in that part of the world anyway but say for example you went to pay a hotel bill for €1000 at the end of your stay. You have plenty in your account to cover it but can't access it. Your flight leaves in 3 hours and the staff are getting a bit shirty while you desperately try to get through to BOI at 5AM. Or how about you fill your car for €70 then spend 45 minutes walking around Tesco doing your weekly shop to find you can't pay?

It's €100 a day , not a€100 total, It doesnt matter how much stuff costs , you can survive on €100 a day anywhere. He wa ssayign he woul dhave to pull the plug on his sons holiday early and get him out like he was in some sort of warzone.

He's on holiday and now knows his limit is €100 a day. Most people on holiday dont do weekly shops. Why would you fill your car then go doign your shopping in Tesco (in the south of France?) . If he is that stuck for the hotel bill (which he knows he has to pay in a week or 2 or whatever time he has left, he has pletny of time to organise it. The OP could just ring th hotel with cc details and pay it. My point stands.

Bluetonic

Stekelly wrote: »

It's €100 a day , not a€100 total, It doesnt matter how much stuff costs , you can survive on €100 a day anywhere. He wa ssayign he woul dhave to pull the plug on his sons holiday early and get him out like he was in some sort of warzone.

He's on holiday and now knows his limit is €100 a day. Most people on holiday dont do weekly shops. Why would you fill your car then go doign your shopping in Tesco (in the south of France?) . If he is that stuck for the hotel bill (which he knows he has to pay in a week or 2 or whatever time he has left, he has pletny of time to organise it. The OP could just ring th hotel with cc details and pay it. My point stands.

You can of course survive on 100 euro a day, however you may not be able to enjoy your holiday.

Guy:Incognito

Bluetonic wrote: »

You can of course survive on 100 euro a day, however you may not be able to enjoy your holiday.

It'll be a lot more enjoyable than coming home early.


Anyway, are we seriously at the stage when someone thinks they cant enjoy themsleves with "only" €100 a day? (this is not price related because €100 a day is still more than enough money

Random

Stekelly wrote: »

It'll be a lot more enjoyable than coming home early.


Anyway, are we seriously at the stage when someone thinks they cant enjoy themsleves with "only" €100 a day? (this is not price related because €100 a day is still more than enough money

On holidays I would often spend far more than €100 a day as would many others. I would feel hard done by too and feel the need to rant a little if I suddenly found I was capped too.

Arciphel

Stekelly, is this you on holidays? :pac:

the_syco

Stekelly wrote: »

Anyway, are we seriously at the stage when someone thinks they cant enjoy themsleves with "only" €100 a day? (this is not price related because €100 a day is still more than enough money

Cos I'd go through that in the pub. And that's not including food, or going sightseeing/quad biking/etc.

professore

Stekelly wrote: »

It's €100 a day , not a€100 total, It doesnt matter how much stuff costs , you can survive on €100 a day anywhere. He wa ssayign he woul dhave to pull the plug on his sons holiday early and get him out like he was in some sort of warzone.

He's on holiday and now knows his limit is €100 a day. Most people on holiday dont do weekly shops. Why would you fill your car then go doign your shopping in Tesco (in the south of France?) . If he is that stuck for the hotel bill (which he knows he has to pay in a week or 2 or whatever time he has left, he has pletny of time to organise it. The OP could just ring th hotel with cc details and pay it. My point stands.

You're missing the point ... it's his money, he should have proper access to it. Maybe he's doing a course and needs it to pay fees, he's taking lessons for something, or even just wants to blow it in a casino ... so what, he should have access to his own money. It amazes me how people are willing to stand up for the banks even when they have demonstrated they have no clue what they are doing.

By the way this also happened to a friend of mine on holidays in Italy with his wife and 3 kids. And they have no Visa cards. Pretty unpleasant - and don't tell me € 100 a day is more than enough for them all especially when it happens with no warning.

Also what if you are on a business trip entertaining important clients .... that would look well if you paid for a meal and then your card was rejected.

Guy:Incognito

random wrote: »

On holidays I would often spend far more than €100 a day as would many others. I would feel hard done by too and feel the need to rant a little if I suddenly found I was capped too.

Youd have a bigger rant though if someone cleaned out your account and the bank just shrugged.€0 a day is a lot less to survive on than €100.

My point was not that I dotn manage to spend more than €100 some days or that I could drink €100 in a night, Thats not the issue. My point was that anyone can survive on €100 a day. Its not a crisis situation that requires immediate evac with a chance of death.

professore wrote: »

By the way this also happened to a friend of mine on holidays in Italy with his wife and 3 kids. And they have no Visa cards. Pretty unpleasant - and don't tell me € 100 a day is more than enough for them all especially when it happens with no warning..

It's enough that your not in danger of dying. Anyway thats not the issue and not what I was replying too. I was replying to the specific person who has a (presumably young adult) son on his holidays, not a family or a person out entertaining clients.

And again. If the account had been cleared out and the bank said, well we thought you'd give out if we restricted access what would peoples opinion be then?

dub45

Stekelly wrote: »

Youd have a bigger rant though if someone cleaned out your account and the bank just shrugged.€0 a day is a lot less to survive on than €100.

.........................................

And again. If the account had been cleared out and the bank said, well we thought you'd give out if we restricted access what would peoples opinion be then?

I think people's opinion might be that the banks are not really up to the task of providing adequate security in the cashless society that they are pushing people relentlessly towards. And often through this failure people have not only cash stolen but also their identities with who knows what consequences further down the line? For example suppose thieves strike and get personal information that is not used for a considerable time how is the affected party to prove that that was stolen at a particular time etc etc?

We are constantly being pushed towards cards efts etc and for example in this case many people will be seriously inconvenienced through absolutely no fault of their own.

Guy:Incognito

dub45 wrote: »

I think people's opinion might be that the banks are not really up to the task of providing adequate security in the cashless society that they are pushing people relentlessly towards. And often through this failure people have not only cash stolen but also their identities with who knows what consequences further down the line? For example suppose thieves strike and get personal information that is not used for a considerable time how is the affected party to prove that that was stolen at a particular time etc etc?

We are constantly being pushed towards cards efts etc and for example in this case many people will be seriously inconvenienced through absolutely no fault of their own.

The security of the system is fine. The scammers need to physically get at the terminals. The issues are down to stupid people in shops letting anyone who walks in and says they are from the bank tamper with the terminals.

dub45

Stekelly wrote: »

The security of the system is fine. The scammers need to physically get at the terminals. The issues are down to stupid people in shops letting anyone who walks in and says they are from the bank tamper with the terminals.

The 'system' should include adequate protection for the terminals in situ surely? - any proper security audit of the system should surely take into account that people will always be stupid and make adequate provision in the system to cater for such stupidity?

c - 13

Ahhh, this explains a lot.

I came back to Bahrian for work this week and couldnt work out why I couldnt take out more than E100.

Not a bloodly lot of good to me, I have to do the weekly shop and fill the car each week etc and I dont have the time to be running to a bank multiple times per week to make sure I have enough cash.

Does anyone know if their credit cards are affected in the same way ?

Also is there anyone I can contact to get my limit re-raised or is my local branch the best bet ?

EDIT: Also shouldn't the bank have informed its customers ? I hadn't a ****ing clue what was happening until I stumbled across this thread.

Ian Beale

Can no one read at all?If your limit was reduced that means you used an atm that was tamperd with,to get your limit back go down to your branch and they'll issue you a new card.
As for the bank not having bad security they did what they could when they found out it was shop owners that were at fault not them.

c - 13

Ian Beale wrote: »

Can no one read at all?If your limit was reduced that means you used an atm that was tamperd with,to get your limit back go down to your branch and they'll issue you a new card.
As for the bank not having bad security they did what they could when they found out it was shop owners that were at fault not them.

Where did you see that one ? I must have missed it completely thanks.

EDIT - Reread says ALL customers limits have been set to 100. I dont even use a chip and pin card, mine is a normal Cirrus.

Not an ideal solution for those of us living out of the country.

juvenal

Has anyone found a resolution to this? I'm abroad and tried taking out cash today, and lo and behold my "financial institution declined the transaction".

A quick google search brought me here and to a news article in the IT regarding the scam. I won't be home for a while and need access to a large amount of cash (~€1,000) over the next few days.

I can't call my bank at the moment as it's after midnight Irish time, I'll be on to them first thing tomorrow. Has anyone succeeded in getting them to raise the limit back to previous levels for cash withdrawals?

Surely if I can get through to the bank using my various PINs and passwords they know it's me and I haven't been compromised.

craichoe

Anyone with a credit card thats been affected, call your Credit Card company and request a temporary emergency replacement, this will take 12 - 24 hours to get to you and will give you access to cash without a limit in banks only with a valid ID .. i.e. Passport.

Anyone with a Debit card, could you possibly transfer cash via online banking to your credit card ? This way you won't pay anything on withdrawl fees or interest.

Anyone living out of the country long term (like me) why are you still using your Irish bank account ? Do you not have a local bank account ? If you do, why not just transfer money via Bank Transfer ?

I'd be more worried about all the foreign cards have been skimmed, did they notify banks with customers from other countries :rolleyes:

Can someone not confirm with the bank if its CASH withdrawls only ? If not you can still use Maestro to pay for items in Shops etc and use Cirrus to Withdraw money.

For example, on my ABN Amro card I can spend 1000 euros on card purchases but can only withdraw 500 euros per day.

egan007

Switch bank....what's the problem.

juvenal

I'm abroad on holidays, and it appears that it was an ATM malfunction as opposed to a security feature. When I entered the withdrawal amount, the ATM tried to request the funds, but then gave me an error saying that my bank had denied the withdrawal.

I've just spoken to the bank, and they say it should be refunded within 24hrs. If not, my branch will chase it up with the branch here as it's obviously a mechanical error.

Also, Permanent TSB told me that they have not changed the limit for either cash withdrawals or Laser purchases.