Can you define a country's people by the music it produces?

BarryCreed

well, what do you think?
America, UK, Ireland, Sweden maybe top the list....

Like if someone says "shur you only have to look at the (contemporary) bands Italy gave to the world, and that'll tell you lots about them"...

So being into music, you look at what the UK has produced or certain parts of the USA, even Sweden.

Then, for example Australia. Some great bands, but they can't seem to shake off the AC DC pub rock influence. Is that a reflection of their culture to a degree, the "straight up tell it like it is ozzie"..??

Agree/ disagree....?

Phlann

I dunno. Never really thought about it.

I'd like to think Ireland is a little better than the drab stadium/indie/wuss rock we've been churning out for the last 30 years... but maybe not.

Most of the creativity these days seems to be in experimental music, post-rock (starting to wane at this stage, tbf), minimal electronic and hip-hop. Those scenes don't really exist in this country.

For some reason Irish acts are still confining themselves to the same old crap we've heard thousands of times before. And we've usually heard it done better. It's a shame there's so little willingness to branch out among Irish musicians. Seems like being the guy with the guitar is still the ideal here for some reason.

So maybe in keeping with the theme of the thread, Irish people are a little too comfortable with what's familiar to them. Fear change a little, perhaps.

meditraitor

No way,

ZakAttak

U2 and snow patrol might be sh1te but its not just irish bands that try to be like them. coldplay are english and so are all those other clone bands.

Back in the 70s you had Thin Lizzy, Horslips etc. they took alot of influence from trad music. Bands wouldn't do anything like that these days, they're too busy jerkin off to their joy division records.

The Irish actor Gabriel Byrne made an interesting observation about youth culture in this country- I think I read this interview in the rte guide - he said that slowly but surely young people are all speaking in the same accent, listening to the same music and wearing the same clothing, not just in Ireland but all over the world,they're all doing the same thing. goodbye individual tradition, hello globalised and uniformed culture.

BarryCreed

monsieur byrne aint that far off the mark. you have teenage girls talking in american accents, and all look like something off the OC...

being involved in a radio show, I do find there are quite a few unsigned, and probably never to be mainstream bands/singers in Ireland making some interesting music.

I suppose, look at Iceland, it's population, and look at their most famous bands and singers, and the quality of them (sigur ros, bjork...).

Now, compare that again to Italy, population 60 million...

all the stars

ZakAttak wrote: »

Back in the 70s you had Thin Lizzy, Horslips etc. they took alot of influence from trad music. Bands wouldn't do anything like that these days,

actually see :
www.myspace.com/soundsofsolari

Dare i say - you are a lil bit wrong with that comment...

DenMan

There is no reason why we should not be producing great music. A lot of the amateur acts that are coming through here seem to be badly advertised and don't get signed up. RnB, Hip Hop, Dance and Indie seem to be the most popular genre's here in Ireland, on the surface anyway. If you want good music then you have to go underground. Being a huge metal fan myself I can say that there is no shortage of good talent out there, waiting to be found. I mean just take a look at Ireland's recent entries for the Eurovision Song Contest and that gives a true reflection of how we are perceived in Europe regarding our music output. It's not great news, is it?, and every year it seems to get progressively worse.

I think the problem lies in the songwriting department, or lack thereof. There is only so much of the likes of Paddy Casey, Damien Rice that people can take. Read some of Richard Barrett's poetry for inspiration and compare that to what we currently have, there is no comparison! Phil Lynott was a brilliant songwriter and sadly he died well before his time. Regarding the undeground scene unfortunately that is where a lot of them stay here as they can't make that break, they need to be supported and encouraged.

The internet really is the future for bands to get noticed. A good track put together and edited in Cubase and uploaded for people to see will get the attention of the worlds best record labels. That is the industry standard for production and if done properly can equal a recording studio because the tools and talent are already there. If you look on youtube you will find most of the labels are listed as members, not just to promote their own bands signed up but they are also on the lookout for new talent.

Hope I didn't bore everyone with this.

Kold

You can tell a country's subversive cultures from their subversive music I suppose. That's why I have this subversive fetish, it's not that I'm trying to be snobbish, I just have an interest in the underbelly. I'd love to get a list of 'scenes' here. Just to see where the most vibrant musical scenes are in the world.

For techno, I hear Berlin and Detroit are the places to be. Dubstep and Warp records special brand of IDM in England as well as some of the most talented rock and beyond bands of the last few years. Hip hop will be everywhere. They seem to be pretty big on their death metal in Scandinavia. London, you'll find has pretty much anything. Iceland are interesting in that their biggest exports have been Sigur Ros and Bjork. Canada have hosted some big names of recent years and some of my favourite hiphop acts have come out of there. Big electro and hip hop scenes in France. A lot of this faux punk scene in the states.

ZakAttak

all the stars wrote: »

actually see :
www.myspace.com/soundsofsolari

Dare i say - you are a lil bit wrong with that comment...

==>I can't access that link for reasons I won't go into. but let me guess; is it a bunch of bands no one has heard of? People know who Thin Lizzy are, same with the horslips. When I say band I mean well known popular bands. not a pile of crap cobbled together by some audio engineering student.

Phlann

ZakAttak wrote: »

U2 and snow patrol might be sh1te but its not just irish bands that try to be like them. coldplay are english and so are all those other clone bands.

Maybe, but the big difference is that once you scratch the surface in many other countries you'll find thriving underground music scenes. Alternative hip-hop, minimal, ambient, dubstep etc... there's bugger all like that here. Scratch the surface of U2 and Paddy Casey clones in Ireland and for the most part you'll find... more U2 and Paddy Casey clones.

The problem is there's few labels in this country that were set up purely for their love of music and which are looking to actively promote unusual artists. Elsewhere you've got Ninja Tune, Warp, Rough Trade, Kompakt, Em:t (revived and now dead again, unfortunately), Stone's Throw, DFA, Carpark... all labels that were set up with the sole intent of fostering small (and usually not very profitable) artists.

If you don't fit snugly into the familiar radio-friendly genres in this country you haven't a hope of getting signed.

all the stars

ZakAttak wrote: »

==>I can't access that link for reasons I won't go into. but let me guess; is it a bunch of bands no one has heard of? People know who Thin Lizzy are, same with the horslips. When I say band I mean well known popular bands. not a pile of crap cobbled together by some audio engineering student.

But of course... complain about "mainstream" bands being rubbish and un-inspired not using Trad like their pre-decessors, then when i just give a link to show the unknown acts out there that are doing just that - shoot it down... nice & quick.
And no, no audio eng. students...

oooohh... the small minded-ness of it all - if it aint on the radio its not relevant. pah ! i dont listen to radio anymore coz its KE-RAP! (well, seen as i live outside the cities and an limited to bog fm, or bog 2 etc...;) either cascada on or flippin kid rock...:()

ZakAttak

oooohh... the small minded-ness of it all - if it aint on the radio its not relevant.

==>Got it in one right there, if nobody's heard of it- it don't mean sh1t. You're link is about as useful as Anne Frank's Drum kit.

ZakAttak

If you don't fit snugly into the familiar radio-friendly genres in this country you haven't a hope of getting signed.[/quote]

==>to be fair, you don't hear much Kila on the radio-but they're still a successful group (even if only in this country and the odd gig in Birmingham).

Irish culture became entwined with radical nationalism during the troubles in the North, and so it became unfashionable. Irish people these days go through great lenghts to ignore the fact that this peaceful place was built on bloodshed and violence- they'd rather talk about Mary Robinson and Bono saving the world.

all the stars

ZakAttak wrote: »

==>Got it in one right there, if nobody's heard of it- it don't mean sh1t.

Indeed... coz the like of u2 just arrived into the world as international superstars... they were never just a group of nobodys trying to play misic... :rolleyes:

all the stars

ZakAttak wrote: »

==>to be fair, you don't hear much Kila on the radio-but they're still a successful group (even if only in this country and the odd gig in Birmingham).

Yeah... they had to leave this country and all its small minded-ness in order to be successful... and to be straight most people i know have never , ever heard of them... and they dont get played on the radio... so to quote you

"if nobody's heard of it- it don't mean sh1t"

ZakAttak wrote: »

Irish culture became entwined with radical nationalism during the troubles in the North, and so it became unfashionable. Irish people these days go through great lenghts to ignore the fact that this peaceful place was built on bloodshed and violence- they'd rather talk about Mary Robinson and Bono saving the world.

No, some people just decided to live our lives by moving forward ... I dont consider anything the wolf tones have to say useful or relevant to my life...

HalloweenJack

Don't agree with the OP at all.

You can't generalise people like that. Ireland's top bands are all rock but nowadays hip-hop, dance and "R'n'B" are the most popular genres in the shops.

The States and the UK are too varied to pin down to one generalisation. The music produced in those countries is a pretty big cross-section of styles.

Someone said Australia is most famous for the AC/DC sound, well when I think of Australian music names like Kylie & Danni Minogue, Jason Donovan, The BeeGees, INXS and The Easybeats. None of them fit into the AC/DC mould.

humberklog

BarryCreed wrote: »

well, what do you think?
America, UK, Ireland, Sweden maybe top the list....



So being into music, you look at what the UK has produced or certain parts of the USA, even Sweden.

You may be missing an obvious observation on your Top of you Pops here. Language. Swedish bands (on the whole) sing in English.
France has produced some of the finest music in the last century but as it's mostly in French there is a dis-connection with a wider audience. Israel, Italy, Iceland have plenty going on with a far more varied pool than Ireland's rather sluggish and boring run of the mill bed-wetters. Ireland's definately the weak link in your OP and can't figure out how it'd be put into any list of coutries doing decent music (ever). Paddypish.
Disagree too with Australia. I'd have connected them more with catchy licks (Crowded house (yeah, yeah NZ born, so what) and Go-betweens, gabriela Cilmi etc) than with thunderdome ranthouse. Mind you I wouldn't put Jason, Kylie or the Bee-Gees into the Oz category as there music has a far bigger connection with the British and US pop industry than it has with the place of said artists hometown(yeah, yeah the gibbs were born in Britain).

However when considering traditional music from countries around the world then, perhaps, there is something in the OP. But U.S, Britain?and (IMO) Ireland wouldn't even crack into the Top 100 pig's bladder pipe band world music chart explosion. There one my look to the Eastern skies for a richer history, culture, education and indeed influence on a grand, grand scale.

BarryCreed

humberklog wrote: »

You may be missing an obvious observation on your Top of you Pops here. Language. Swedish bands (on the whole) sing in English.
France has produced some of the finest music in the last century but as it's mostly in French there is a dis-connection with a wider audience. Israel, Italy, Iceland have plenty going on with a far more varied pool than Ireland's rather sluggish and boring run of the mill bed-wetters. Ireland's definately the weak link in your OP and can't figure out how it'd be put into any list of coutries doing decent music (ever). Paddypish.
Disagree too with Australia. I'd have connected them more with catchy licks (Crowded house (yeah, yeah NZ born, so what) and Go-betweens, gabriela Cilmi etc) than with thunderdome ranthouse. Mind you I wouldn't put Jason, Kylie or the Bee-Gees into the Oz category as there music has a far bigger connection with the British and US pop industry than it has with the place of said artists hometown(yeah, yeah the gibbs were born in Britain).

However when considering traditional music from countries around the world then, perhaps, there is something in the OP. But U.S, Britain?and (IMO) Ireland wouldn't even crack into the Top 100 pig's bladder pipe band world music chart explosion. There one my look to the Eastern skies for a richer history, culture, education and indeed influence on a grand, grand scale.

dunno about Italy mate. I lived there for 2 years, and for a country of 60 million, they produced some amount of w@nk. They loved cheesey guitar solos ala bryan adams. There were and are a few very good bands singing in Italian imo (bluvertigo, marlene kuntz, giardini di miro, nuccini), but I don't ever take lyrics into account anyways. On the whole, the UK has far more bands full stop doing the rounds.

Lately the ozzies have given us wolfmother and airboune, pub rock bands.
Lots of rubbish in Ireland as well, but the quality hasn't been bad (kevin shields etc)

irish_bob

bryan adams , avril lavigne and nickleback , yep i think canada deserves its stereotype

jill_valentine

irish_bob wrote: »

bryan adams , avril lavigne and nickleback , yep i think canada deserves its stereotype

Dude, Death From Above 1979 cancel that stereotype out single-handedly.

BarryCreed

Do Make Say Think = great canadian band.

I suppose how come the "youth" or music listeners gravitate towards a certain type of music in certain countries, using "Western" countries as an example, as I don't really know about African countries or Asia...

like, how you can get a group of musicians together in Iceland, and Sigur Ros comes out of it, but in Italy, you may never get this type of band. Is it just the stars aligining, and those guys happened to be in Iceland. A previous poster mentioned different styles that are popular in different places. e.g. electro in France, singer songwriter stuff here, metal in scandinavia...etc etc

Back to my Italian example. Eros Ramazotti = big in Italy, sounds like brendan keeley singing in Italian...

ZakAttak

all the stars wrote: »

Yeah... they had to leave this country and all its small minded-ness in order to be successful... and to be straight most people i know have never , ever heard of them...

==>and yet, you've heard of them.

No, some people just decided to live our lives by moving forward ... I dont consider anything the wolf tones have to say useful or relevant to my life...

==>never said they did.

ZakAttak

irish_bob wrote: »

bryan adams , avril lavigne and nickleback , yep i think canada deserves its stereotype

==>you forgot celine dion.

all the stars

ZakAttak wrote: »

==>never said they did.

i can spell this
'Lost Cause'

ZakAttak

all the stars wrote: »

i can spell this
'Lost Cause'

==>Good, now you can bugger off.

all the stars

ZakAttak wrote: »

==>Good, now you can bugger off.

right after you