Car makers that lie about their cars . . . WHY !

Zube

Frenchdayz wrote: »

you'll find most cars on the roads today that have a 2.0L NA engine produce 110-140BHP,

I think that's low, so I'll look up the Ford Mondeo and VW Passat as two profoundly unsporty family 2 litres: The only 2.0 Passat is a turbo with 200 bhp. The normally aspirated 1.8 throws out 160. Fords 2.0 FFV Mondeo puts out 145 bhp. The 1.6 puts out 110.

So, I'd say your a year or two behind the times with those power figures, before we even go to sportier marques like Alfa, BMW or Honda.

-Chris-

A year or two? When I did vehicle engineering 10 years ago we were given 60-70bhp per liter (normally aspirated) as a rule of thumb. It's definitely moved on by now!

Frenchdayz

Zube wrote: »

I think that's low, so I'll look up the Ford Mondeo and VW Passat as two profoundly unsporty family 2 litres: The only 2.0 Passat is a turbo with 200 bhp. The normally aspirated 1.8 throws out 160. Fords 2.0 FFV Mondeo puts out 145 bhp. The 1.6 puts out 110.

So, I'd say your a year or two behind the times with those power figures, before we even go to sportier marques like Alfa, BMW or Honda.

Most of the cars on our roads arent what you'd call sporty, most cars are also a couple of years old, those are great engines and many do produce almost 100bhp per litre but most of them dont.

F**K we're really getting off the point ! Can someone tell me why the BMW 316i is a 1.9L, why isnt it a 1.9i ?

MCMLXXXIII

Not to pick on your post in particular, BUT...

Zube wrote: »

Also bear in mind that the manufacturers try to keep their model designations unique. Peugeot stopped Porsche from releasing a model called the 901, since they claim all model numbers with a 0 in the middle, like 402, 305, 607 and so on. Even so, they are running low, and are now using 1007, 4007 for unusual models.

There are only so many 3 digit numbers for BMW to use, and sticking strictly to engine size will quickly use them up, while confusing the hell out of the heirarchy of models within each range.

BMW, without putting zeros in the middle, still has about 900 name options using just numbers.

A BMW 3 series with a 2.5L engine should be a 325. Want a petrol version? 325i. Diesel? 325d. All-wheel drive = 325Xi.

There's no reason to have anything else under a different name. If they start making a new 2.5L engine...still just call it a 325. If they start making a 2.6L engine, simply change the name to 326.

...is it really that hard?

colm_mcm

MCMLXXXIII wrote: »

A BMW 3 series with a 2.5L engine should be a 325. Want a petrol version? 325i. Diesel? 325d. All-wheel drive = 325Xi.

There's no reason to have anything else under a different name. If they start making a new 2.5L engine...still just call it a 325. If they start making a 2.6L engine, simply change the name to 326.

...is it really that hard?

What happens if they have different hp and emissions figures for the same engine size?
also, I don't think BMW ever made the link between their badging and the cars engine sizes

Balfa

Frenchdayz wrote: »

F**K we're really getting off the point ! Can someone tell me why the BMW 316i is a 1.9L, why isnt it a 1.9i ?

I don't see a 1.9L 316i. I only see 1.6L and 1.8L 316is and 1.9L 318is.

I'd say the reason they used a 1.8L and still called it a 316i was to "leave the guessing of the engines to hardcore BMW fans". Maybe the 316i gained weight and to give the sort of performance people expect from a BMW 316i, they opted for a 1.8L engine. Which isn't a big deal, because everyone knows that a 318i will perform better than a 316i of the same generation regardless of engine size.

So yeah, just like you wanted, they're simplifying things for the masses.

.Longshanks.

Frenchdayz wrote: »

Ferrari could push out well over 200bhp from a 2.0L NA engine but other companies find a balance between BHP and Torque (which is becoming more important to people for some reason), so you'll find most cars on the roads today that have a 2.0L NA engine produce 110-140BHP, unless those roads are in Monaco

Ferrari?? No need to look so exotic for a 2.0L N/A 200bhp car - Honda have been at it for years!

alias no.9

Frenchdayz wrote: »

F**K we're really getting off the point ! Can someone tell me why the BMW 316i is a 1.9L, why isnt it a 1.9i ?

Because its just a f**cking name, get over it. The 316i is the long established entry level model in the 3 series range. Similarly the 320i has long had a 2.2 liter engine but the 320i is the long established entry level 6 cylinder model in the 3 series range. All I can see here is someone who appears to be feeling sorry for themselves, having made a fool of themselves, possibly when trying to make a fool of someone else. Were you trying to make a joke of the puney 1.6 litre engine in your mates car?
Anyway, get over it, move on, there's more important things in life.

NewApproach

alias no.9 wrote: »

Anyway, get over it, move on, there's more important things in life.

+1

ninty9er

zAbbo wrote: »

Where do they lavel it as a 6300cc?

All I'm seeing is a model number, I think in insurance terms, a 6208cc engine would be insured as a 6300cc

Sorry if this has been done already, but I was getting bored with the comments on this thread

6150-6249cc = 6.2l
6250-6349cc=6.3l

Anan1

Frenchdayz wrote: »

Can someone tell me why the BMW 316i is a 1.9L, why isnt it a 1.9i ?

What exactly do you mean?

Balfa

ninty9er wrote: »

6150-6249cc = 6.2l

I thought 6150 - 6249 = -99

.Longshanks.

Frenchdayz wrote:

Can someone tell me why the BMW 316i is a 1.9L, why isnt it a 1.9i

I want to know why the volve S40 isn't a 4.0L. Stands to reason based upon some of the reasoning in this thread:rolleyes:

Johnny Utah

alias no.9 wrote: »

Other examples of blatant lies include the Suzuki Swift, Mitsubishi Carisma, and Skoda Rapid amongst others. Where's the outrage about these?

Lionel Hutz: "That's the most blatent form of false advertising since the Neverending Story Part 2!"

Frenchdayz

Longshanks100 wrote: »

I want to know why the volve S40 isn't a 4.0L. Stands to reason based upon some of the reasoning in this thread:rolleyes:

Volvo dont use the model numbers to indicate the engine size, i will phone BMW and find out because i think there is a better reason out there

Frenchdayz

Balfa wrote: »

So yeah, just like you wanted, they're simplifying things for the masses.

I dont want it simplified, and i understand the whole thing better now but i still think its stupid, change the name to a 319i !

colm_mcm

Frenchdayz wrote: »

Volvo dont use the model numbers to indicate the engine size,

But neither do BMW!

NewApproach

Frenchdayz wrote: »

Volvo dont use the model numbers to indicate the engine size, i will phone BMW and find out because i think there is a better reason out there

Ah man are ya taking the piss altogether.
You must be having us on, it couldnt possibly mean this much to you...

.Longshanks.

Frenchdayz wrote: »

Volvo dont use the model numbers to indicate the engine size, i will phone BMW and find out because i think there is a better reason out there

please do.......and can you then print a transcript of the phone conversation - we're all looking forward to a good laugh!!!
Seriously man, just give it up

alias no.9

Frenchdayz wrote: »

Volvo dont use the model numbers to indicate the engine size, i will phone BMW and find out because i think there is a better reason out there

Frenchdayz wrote: »

I dont want it simplified, and i understand the whole thing better now but i still think its stupid, change the name to a 319i !

Why? Do you really think BMW are going to entertain a request to change their nomenclature from a long established formula just to prevent you making a fool out of yourself? All you're doing here is making a bigger fool out of yourself. There's an old saying that you'd do well to heed...
When you're in a hole, stop digging!

Frenchdayz

Im just saying, why do they make it right for some BMW models but not others ?

Frenchdayz

NewApproach wrote: »

Ah man are ya taking the piss altogether.
You must be having us on, it couldnt possibly mean this much to you...

I read in TopGear magazine that one of the columnists knows the reason why but couldnt be arsed explaining it ! I cant contact him, so i looked for answers in this thread but no-one has enlightened me.

Anan1

Frenchdayz wrote: »

I read in TopGear magazine that one of the columnists knows the reason why but couldnt be arsed explaining it ! I cant contact him, so i looked for answers in this thread but no-one has enlightened me.

IT'S JUST A BADGE. IT SOMETIMES, BUT NOT ALWAYS, INDICATES ENGINE SIZE. WHAT PART DON'T YOU GET??

alias no.9

Frenchdayz wrote: »

I read in TopGear magazine that one of the columnists knows the reason why but couldnt be arsed explaining it ! I cant contact him, so i looked for answers in this thread but no-one has enlightened me.

You could try queries.tgmag@bbc.co.uk but I'd bet you'll be disappointed even if they do explain it to you.

peasant

Gentlemen ...I'm of the firm belief that you've been had for 70 odd posts. Nobody but a (good, hats off!) troll could be so obsessive-compulsive about a badge on a car

Fighting Irish

frmo my experience, people who notice these things, can't afford the cars anyways

Frenchdayz

alias no.9 wrote: »

You could try queries.tgmag@bbc.co.uk but I'd bet you'll be disappointed even if they do explain it to you.

Thanks ! will do

Frenchdayz

Fighting Irish wrote: »

frmo my experience, people who notice these things, can't afford the cars anyways

For all you know i drive a 2004 Mazda RX-8 1.3

Biro

Frenchdayz wrote: »

For all you know i drive a 2004 Mazda RX-8 1.3

You mean the RX8 doesn't have an 8 litre engine? Strange. Many many posts on such a strange topic!

Frenchdayz

Biro wrote: »

You mean the RX8 doesn't have an 8 litre engine? Strange. Many many posts on such a strange topic!

Smart-arse :rolleyes: ! Im only talkin about 1 manufacturer

Balfa

Frenchdayz wrote: »

Im only talkin about 1 manufacturer

Then why is your thread titled "Car makers" with an "s", and why did you mention two different manufacturers in your OP?

Sometimes, feeding the trolls can be fun

MCMLXXXIII

colm_mcm wrote: »

What happens if they have different hp and emissions figures for the same engine size?
also, I don't think BMW ever made the link between their badging and the cars engine sizes

It's historically been close enough to tell the engine size. Different companies get different HP out of engines depending on how they tweak them, and it's easier to badge the cars with a 1+2 system rather than a 1+3...because 4 numbers is just too much. Plus, too many model options in a showroom confuse customers...especially when the only difference is in HP.

All high-end manufactureres use letter/number naming systems, and they usually mean something, whether it's the chasis/design of a car, the size of the engine, or the combination of both.

Personally, I would rather drive a Suzuki Swift instead of a misleadingly badged car.

ninty9er

MCMLXXXIII wrote: »

Personally, I would rather drive a Suzuki Swift instead of a misleadingly badged car.

Oh the irony...it hurts:D:D:D:D

-Chris-

Biro wrote: »

You mean the RX8 doesn't have an 8 litre engine? Strange. Many many posts on such a strange topic!

I presumed RX8 meant R x 8 (8 rotary engines). Was is mistaken?


:D:rolleyes:

Frenchdayz

Balfa wrote: »

Then why is your thread titled "Car makers" with an "s", and why did you mention two different manufacturers in your OP?

Sometimes, feeding the trolls can be fun

THE ONLY CAR MAKER I HAVE MENTIONED THAT USES THE MODEL NUMBER TO INDICATE THE ENGINE SIZE IS BMW ! DONT CUT HALFWAY INTO A FORUM AND COMMENT LIKE A SMART-ARSE WITHOUT EVEN KNOWING WHAT EXACTLY IS BEING DISCUSSED

In regard to "trolls" i havent the faintest idea what you're talking about.

Frenchdayz

AudiChris wrote: »

I presumed RX8 meant R x 8 (8 rotary engines). Was is mistaken?


:D:rolleyes:

Not a bad assumption !

Balfa

Frenchdayz wrote: »

DONT CUT HALFWAY INTO A FORUM AND COMMENT LIKE A SMART-ARSE WITHOUT EVEN KNOWING WHAT EXACTLY IS BEING DISCUSSED

It'd be funnier for everyone else reading if you pointed out that you PM'd me three times yesterday about this thread

Troll feeding's getting boring now. I'm done here.

Anan1

Balfa wrote: »

It'd be funnier for everyone else reading if you pointed out that you PM'd me three times yesterday about this thread

Troll feeding's getting boring now. I'm done here.

Funnily enough, he PM'd me too. Anyone else?

peasant

yepp ...after my last post

-Chris-

I feel kinda left out now...

.Longshanks.

I got one too....and no, I'm busy tomorrow night:D

Frenchdayz

Balfa wrote: »

It'd be funnier for everyone else reading if you pointed out that you PM'd me three times yesterday about this thread

Troll feeding's getting boring now. I'm done here.

Ive only PM'd 3 people and 4 messages since ive opened my account, and i might add you replied, if this is boring find someone else's thread to butt into !

peasant

time to call it a day methinks

closed