Moderator attitude on the Soccer Forum

Sully

GuanYin wrote: »

I was talking about people bitching at each other about football.

Ah, it wasn't obvious.

In any case, you didn't seem too bothered yourself about the thread title because you took the opportunity to discuss in detail my attitude outside of the soccer forum which has nothing to do with my attitude in soccer.

I discussed both. I understand why in the Soccer Forum, and support it, but not outside. But, good point, perhaps stepping outside the soccer forum was off topic.

GuanYin

Sully wrote: »

Ah, it wasn't obvious.

It was in the context of Dudess and myself who I was replying to on the back of a chat we had about soccer. If you didn't know what my question to her was, why would it be obvious to you?

I discussed both. I understand why in the Soccer Forum, and support it, but not outside. But, good point, perhaps stepping outside the soccer forum was off topic.

Oh I expected nothing less. To be honest, it looked to me like a cheap shot from you looking to once again give your opinon of me.

I mean you talk to me about the topic title and proper behavior but obviously you were well justified in a little character attack that was nothing to do with the topic. Perhaps you'd like to comment on that sort of behavior.

Personally I don't think people should throw stones, no matter what sort of housing they are in.


Maybe one day I'll get to post my opinion of you.

Sully

GuanYin wrote: »

It was in the context of Dudess and myself who I was replying to on the back of a chat we had about soccer. If you didn't know what my question to her was, why would it be obvious to you?

Again, it wasn't obvious - at least to me. To me, it looked like Dudess was saying this whole debate about moderator attitudes was why she didn't post in Soccer and your reply seemed to show annoyance at this thread. If it was something I missed, my apologises to you for thinking that you could possible be criticising feedback.

Oh I expected nothing less. To be honest, it looked to me like a cheap shot from you looking to once again give your opinion of me.

Eh what? I don't recall having regular digs at your attitude. Id actually appreciate you sent me a PM showing me where, as I for one do not want to come across as a bully - which is exactly what that type of person is.

I mean you talk to me about the topic title and proper behavior but obviously you were well justified in a little character attack that was nothing to do with the topic. Perhaps you'd like to comment on that sort of behavior.

Iv already apologised for making the remark outside of the Soccer forum. I have removed that part, and left the part where I actually supported you and said you do a good job etc. It was not meant to offend.

Personally I don't think people should throw stones, no matter what sort of housing they are in.

Well, sometimes commenting might help. Ill expand on that below.

Maybe one day I'll get to post my opinion of you.

Your more then welcome to, and you can PM at any time to do so. Ill take your, and anyone elses, feedback on board as I have always done to try and improve - if at all possible.

EDIT: Iv removed off topic comments and what seems to be seen as a personal attack. Iv sent you a PM.

GuanYin

Sully wrote: »

Again, it wasn't obvious - at least to me. To me, it looked like Dudess was saying this whole debate about moderator attitudes was why she didn't post in Soccer and your reply seemed to show annoyance at this thread. If it was something I missed, my apologises to you for thinking that you could possible be criticising feedback.

Dudess wrote:

GuanYin, to answer your question: this is why I haven't requested access...

What question on this thread by me mentions Dudess and requesting access or could be related?

Eh what? I don't recall having regular digs at your attitude. Id actually appreciate you sent me a PM showing me where, as I for one do not want to come across as a bully - which is exactly what that type of person is.

If you think you're a bully, then maybe you should change your ways.

Iv already apologised for making the remark outside of the Soccer forum. I can remove that part, and leave the part where I actually supported you and said you do a good job etc. It was not meant to offend.

You do what feels best for you. You're the mike65 of feedback imo..oh...no...wait... (that was a joke btw).

Well, sometimes commenting might help. Ill expand on that below.

But then telling people to do what you say and not what you do might make you look a hypocrite, right? The housing I was referring to was specifically made of glass.

Your more then welcome to, and you can PM at any time to do so. Ill take your, and anyone elses, feedback on board as I have always done to try and improve - if at all possible.

I think I've inferred enough feedback not to have to have this conversation with you again (or perhaps any conversation).

But just in case, lets just say, I don't have the monopoly on condescending posts.

Sully

GuanYin wrote: »

What question on this thread by me mentions Dudess and requesting access or could be related?

I think your not grasping what I said. I'm unsure how I can explain it in simpler terms but ill try!

I took Dudess post as a way of addressing you directly stating "this" (as in the whole conversation in this topic) was the reason for not wanting to join the Soccer forum. When you responded, I thought you were stating that such a thread should not have been allowed. Hence, my comment.

If you think you're a bully, then maybe you should change your ways.

I don't, that's why I am offering you a chance to tell me if I am so ill correct that where appropriate.

But then telling people to do what you say and not what you do might make you look a hypocrite, right? The housing I was referring to was specifically made of glass.

Giving feedback helps the site. Giving your opinion, in a nice way, of a person, helps that person. Simple. Btw, I thought the housing wasn't supposed to be made of anything in particular?!

I think I've inferred enough feedback not to have to have this conversation with you again (or perhaps any conversation).

We did? When? Where?

But just in case, lets just say, I don't have the monopoly on condescending posts.

When? Where?

mike65

GuanYin you really are a tit. Seriously, you have to start to learn to read people better.

Mike.

Fajitas!

I propose Sully changes his name to Bully.



:pac:

GuanYin

Sully wrote: »

I think your not grasping what I said. I'm unsure how I can explain it in simpler terms but ill try!

I took Dudess post as a way of addressing you directly stating "this" (as in the whole conversation in this topic) was the reason for not wanting to join the Soccer forum. When you responded, I thought you were stating that such a thread should not have been allowed. Hence, my comment.

Maybe you shouldn't post on other peoples dialogue when you don't know the details?


In any case, I didn't see your PM when I replied (or it hadn't come). I appreciate the time it must have taken to write such a long PM and I replied.

No point in discussing whether your views of my personality flaws are food for feedback or not, or indeed my views in you, in a feedback thread.

( I like the name change suggestion )

copacetic

Des wrote: »

Actually.

The overwhelming majority of people who are up-in-arms about this are Liverpool fans.

Bitterness over the "Liverpool only" forum being rejected, I'd say. It looks like it may even be an organised backlash at this stage.

Grow up lads.

jesus, this crap again? the 'match' thread last weekend was a farce, when there are a few games on at the same time, pages and pages of intertwined posts are impossible to follow. It is nothing to do with liverpool fans, they just make up probably the largest grpuping.

There have been random mod actions on soccer that are a joke. Locking the original superthreads for no reason. Ignoring the opinions of most of the posters on soccer unless they argree with the mods random whims and displaying a shockingly bad attitude to fairness and honesty.

These latest rules seem designed to stifle the superthreads and prevent any kind of match discussion that is easy to follow. At the very least there should be a thread allowed for every game.

_blank_

copacetic wrote: »

These latest rules seem designed to stifle the superthreads and prevent any kind of match discussion that is easy to follow. At the very least there should be a thread allowed for every game.

There are seperate threads for Liverpool and ManYoo games weekend.

copacetic

Des wrote: »

There are seperate threads for Liverpool and ManYoo games weekend.

No there aren't. Not last weekend:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055356406


edit - or this weekend, possibly you thought the original seperate threads weren't merged?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055360705

This weeks one is already a farce.

leninbenjamin

copacetic wrote: »

No there aren't. Not last weekend:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055356406


edit - or this weekend, possibly you thought the original seperate threads weren't merged?

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055360705

This weeks one is already a farce.

one of the mods said early on that individual match threads were allowed, as long as there was interest in them.

edit: only saw there that they were merged. hmmm... maybe i was imagining that post. i'll try to dig it up.

edit edit: found them.

GuanYin wrote:

We can separate the "big club" match threads out. It will mean 2-3 threads extra a week and then nothing gets drowned.

You're really complaining about something you've never seen in action. Reserve judgement.

PHB wrote:

It's important though too.
Aside from the multiple discussions problem, it leads to people posting in respective superthreads and the inevitable bitching about get out of my thread etc.

In terms of the matches, a bit of common sense is all that's needed here.

Realistically the situation will occur that every single United, Arsenal, and Liverpool game is going to probably get a thread of its own. Then some other games probably will, and the rest will go into the weekend thread.

Also as for sub-forums, it's likely that tagging is going to be brought in before the start of the season, so that should solve the problem of clutter a lot.

Charlie

leninbenjamin wrote: »

one of the mods said early on that individual match threads were allowed, as long as there was interest in them.

In fairness, this week individual threads were started for both Liverpool and united, and they seemed quite popular. The Liverpool one was three pages long after only a few hours. However, sometime this evening they were merged into the weekend superthread.

copacetic

leninbenjamin wrote: »

one of the mods said early on that individual match threads were allowed, as long as there was interest in them.

Well apparently they changed their minds:

GuanYin wrote: »

Match week threads.

There will be no segregation of discussion of any teams games unless it is a major match (by the mods determination).

This is not open for discussion (ie. stay on topic or don't post).

GuanYin

copacetic wrote: »

jesus, this crap again? the 'match' thread last weekend was a farce, when there are a few games on at the same time, pages and pages of intertwined posts are impossible to follow.

This is something that would concern me. It is also something I've only seen mentioned twice, everyone else who posted or PM'd me said the opposite.

I looked at last weeks thread, every post had a reference either to a team or player so it read to me like commentary on action from around the games as it happens, which is the same as the shows you guys get on TV (we get the sky broadcast here on Fox Soccer).

Can you pick out specific posts from last weeks threads that were incoherent or didn't reference a game?

EDIT -

We're discussing the match thread situation at the moment.

For this week, it will be one thread.

The reason we started match threads was because of a perceived sense of ownership by certain groups of fans who literally told other posters they were not welcome to post their opinions. As some of these were regulars and should have known better, the idea caught on. Had this attitude not occured, we would not be having this discussion now.

Creating a Liverpool and United Match thread is effectively givingthe problem the opportunity to move on and in essence no different from a superthread.

In any case, we are discussing and will hopefully reach a consensus before next week's games.

leninbenjamin

copacetic wrote: »

Well apparently they changed their minds:

ah right, never saw that.

for what it's worth I disagree with this.

GuanYin

Actually, in retrospect I probably should have allowed those threads to continue to see if the same problem occured and it was probably hasty on my part to merge them.

As I said, we're discussing. Depending on the discussion, I may split the threads back out later.

Regardless, if we see the same problems in a match thread as a superthread, we will be having one thread.

copacetic

GuanYin wrote: »

Can you pick out specific posts from last weeks threads that were incoherent or didn't reference a game?

I looked in on sun when utd and villa games were on. There are a lot of intertwined posts about the two games, with litte team references for about 2 pages from here:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055356406&page=16

including what a save, get in, 1-1, etc etc etc.
maybe other people don't see it the same way, but I was out and about and had no radio and was gonna use boards to keep me up to date. I gave up and went to bbc sport instead.


edit - saw the edit - good news that discussions are ongoing. Personally I wouldn't mind every match having a thread which is only open for the weekend or something. I understand the attitude with special treatment of teams, but imo threads should be let live or die by the posters. Think what the place will be like on the 13th of sept if we don't have a few seperate threads.

Charlie

GuanYin wrote: »

Actually, in retrospect I probably should have allowed those threads to continue to see if the same problem occured and it was probably hasty on my part to merge them.

As I said, we're discussing. Depending on the discussion, I may split the threads back out later.

Regardless, if we see the same problems in a match thread as a superthread, we will be having one thread.

I think this is as fair as most can ask for.

leninbenjamin

copacetic wrote: »

I looked in on sun when utd and villa games were on. There are a lot of intertwined posts about the two games, with litte team references for about 2 pages from here:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055356406&page=16

including what a save, get in, 1-1, etc etc etc.

for what it's worth i personally had no problem knowing which was which.

i think individual match threads though will allow for more coherent pre match and post match discussion, where the match threads can be quickly dominated by one topic when the matches are over.

actually, i think the possibility of a matches forum should be re-examined. on top of allowing for greater organisation of the match discussions i think it could also be used to encourage people who travel over to report on the match day experience. we see this from time to time periodically, but it tends to get lost in the pure football discussions.

this is probably the wrong place for the above actually, but meh. i've written it already.

GuanYin

copacetic wrote: »

including what a save, get in, 1-1, etc etc etc.
maybe other people don't see it the same way, but I was out and about and had no radio and was gonna use boards to keep me up to date. I gave up and went to bbc sport instead.

I'm still not seeing what you're saying.

Any case I saw where a team was not directly referenced either followed up the post directly before or there was only one game on at the time.

Can you link specific posts?

edit - saw the edit - good news that discussions are ongoing. Personally I wouldn't mind every match having a thread which is only open for the weekend or something. I understand the attitude with special treatment of teams, but imo threads should be let live or die by the posters. Think what the place will be like on the 13th of sept if we don't have a few seperate threads.

I think having discussed the issue further, the United and Liverpool threads dominate the match threads enough to warrent separate threads. - I will unmerge later/tomorrow

The caveat will be that there is no attempt of fans at taking ownership of these threads and preventing others giving their opinions.

We will try it out for now anyway. Other teams playing big games may warrent threads too, but any that are created and don't have sufficient traffic will be remerged into the general match thread.

_blank_

Good stuff from the mods there.

Fair play.

copacetic

leninbenjamin wrote: »

for what it's worth i personally had no problem knowing which was which.

i think individual match threads though will allow for more coherent pre match and post match discussion, where the match threads can be quickly dominated by one topic when the matches are over.

actually, i think the possibility of a matches forum should be re-examined. on top of allowing for greater organisation of the match discussions i think it could also be used to encourage people who travel over to report on the match day experience. we see this from time to time periodically, but it tends to get lost in the pure football discussions.

this is probably the wrong place for the above actually, but meh. i've written it already.

Maybe, but I personally don't see why a utd fan or a villa fan has to read through 20 posts about the other game to get back to one about their game and vice versa. God help you if you are a fan of one of the teams with less posters on the soccer forum.

If anything I would have thought it is unfair for the less popular games that get drowned out altogther. Blaming the more popular teams for being popular is just trying to fight against nature imo.

As a pool fan I wouldn't be worried too much when a pool game is on, it will be all pool for most of the time. I'd imagine other fans wouldn't get anything out of the thread during that period, either that or it will turn into who can post more comp.

The only concern on my part was that you will never find the considered posts that other people may post about a match later in the day. I'm not familiar with what happened with redspider but he is one of the reasons I still bother at all with the soccer forum, and I always keep an eye out for his posts about the liverpool games. Not sure how they fit in with the new order.

The more 'noisy' posters who are constantly on the superthreads no matter what the team are the ones that appear to be the problem imo. There is only one person on boards I have ever even thought about having on ignore, one of these constant nigglers (yes, there is an L there)and close behind are some of the pool fans with similar shockingly bad attitude to other fans.


edit - feel free to ignore the above. been made to look silly by a good decision by the mods.

on the 'ownership' of the threads. I'd certainly back up harsh modding of any foolish crap from someone on a match thread, either by a fan or a neutral.

leninbenjamin

copacetic wrote: »

Maybe, but I personally don't see why a utd fan or a villa fan has to read through 20 posts about the other game to get back to one about their game and vice versa. God help you if you are a fan of one of the teams with less posters on the soccer forum.

there's two ways of looking at it. the other is that boards soccer forum is supposed to be fan neutral. hence measures like that could be seen as a method to get opposing fans interacting and to discourage the 'fanboyism' problems that arise.

copacetic

leninbenjamin wrote: »

there's two ways of looking at it. the other is that boards soccer forum is supposed to be fan neutral. hence measures like that could be seen as a method to get opposing fans interacting and to discourage the 'fanboyism' problems that arise.

I see what you mean, but the forum can seldom be fan neutral during games.

castie

why so seeerrriioooussss???

copacetic

GuanYin wrote: »

I'm still not seeing what you're saying.

Any case I saw where a team was not directly referenced either followed up the post directly before or there was only one game on at the time.

Can you link specific posts?

Maybe it is just me then. These posts are all in a row and imo it is hard to work out what is going on:

Neil3030 wrote: »

Stonewall peno, but totally avoidable if they'd been even remotely organised.

yayamark wrote: »

martins what a header

Bounty Hunter wrote: »

after seing that again it wasnt a penalty, no contact Johnson just missed the ball with 2 villa players trying to tackle him. lucky city

genericgoon wrote: »

CRAP CRAPIITY CRAP!

SantryRed wrote: »

Goal:D

Helix wrote: »

so bloody ropey at the back at the minute

mayordenis wrote: »

fletch lives

SantryRed wrote: »

another goal:mad:

leninbenjamin

copacetic wrote: »

I see what you mean, but the forum can seldom be fan neutral during games.

i'm not expecting every fan to be neutral or to withhold their affiliations. but what i'd like to see is more interaction between fan groups and a much greater element of respect between them than we see currently. that's what makes the forum interesting.

GuanYin

Hrmmm... I see.

However there were only two games going on for those posts and without looking back at the thread I can tell you which match most of those were about - in fact, genericgoon's post is the only one I'm unsure as to the reference, although I can guess .

genericgoon

GuanYin wrote: »

Hrmmm... I see.

However there were only two games going on for those posts and without looking back at the thread I can tell you which match most of those were about - in fact, genericgoon's post is the only one I'm unsure as to the reference, although I can guess .

Yes I was not well pleased with that goal.