Private Clampers!!

mcwhirter

maidhc wrote: »

No. If you have an open area without any warning signs or fence, then irrespective of the legal ownership it is a public place.

If you have a front garden, without a wall, and without a warning sign, then it would essentially be illegal for you to clamp someone in that garden.

What about the travelling community, does that apply to them too?

dioltas

Just buy four of these http://www.aldi.ie/ie/html/offers/58_5891.htm

And put one on each wheel! ha

I think Im gonna go out and invest in a bolt cutters...

markpb

maidhc wrote: »

No. If you have an open area without any warning signs or fence, then irrespective of the legal ownership it is a public place.

If you have a front garden, without a wall, and without a warning sign, then it would essentially be illegal for you to clamp someone in that garden.

That's a bizarre notion. It's either legally public or legally private - there's no fluffy grey area in between. If it's private (but open), why should I not have a say in where and how people park in it?

smash

I know someone that works on a building site and got clamped at the enterance, he told the clamper to take it off and the clamper told him he was parked illegally on private land. My friend told the clamper that it was his site, he was managing it and he didn't have a contract with any clampers. The clamper told him it was a public access road to a private appartment block so he was leaving it there till the fine was paid!

my friend got an angle grinder, cut it off and left it on the ground beside the car so when the clamper came back he said they'd take him to court. My friend then produced the building plans which showed the site boundry which he was parked in and told the clamper that he had illegally clamped him on a private building site so it was his issue, and if he didn't get the clamping van outside the site boundry that he'd cut the roof off.

The clamper drove off with his tail between his legs and my friend put in 2 complaints to the clamping company:

1 - tresspassing on private land
2 - immobilising a private vehicle on private land which they didn't have a contract with and in turn blocking works access to the site

mcwhirter

steve06 wrote: »

I know someone that works on a building site and got clamped at the enterance, he told the clamper to take it off and the clamper told him he was parked illegally on private land. My friend told the clamper that it was his site, he was managing it and he didn't have a contract with any clampers. The clamper told him it was a public access road to a private appartment block so he was leaving it there till the fine was paid!

my friend got an angle grinder, cut it off and left it on the ground beside the car so when the clamper came back he said they'd take him to court. My friend then produced the building plans which showed the site boundry which he was parked in and told the clamper that he had illegally clamped him on a private building site so it was his issue, and if he didn't get the clamping van outside the site boundry that he'd cut the roof off.

The clamper drove off with his tail between his legs and my friend put in 2 complaints to the clamping company:

1 - tresspassing on private land
2 - immobilising a private vehicle on private land which they didn't have a contract with and in turn blocking works access to the site

Thats more like it,

dioltas

steve06 wrote: »

I know someone that works on a building site and got clamped at the enterance, he told the clamper to take it off and the clamper told him he was parked illegally on private land. My friend told the clamper that it was his site, he was managing it and he didn't have a contract with any clampers. The clamper told him it was a public access road to a private appartment block so he was leaving it there till the fine was paid!

my friend got an angle grinder, cut it off and left it on the ground beside the car so when the clamper came back he said they'd take him to court. My friend then produced the building plans which showed the site boundry which he was parked in and told the clamper that he had illegally clamped him on a private building site so it was his issue, and if he didn't get the clamping van outside the site boundry that he'd cut the roof off.

The clamper drove off with his tail between his legs and my friend put in 2 complaints to the clamping company:

1 - tresspassing on private land
2 - immobilising a private vehicle on private land which they didn't have a contract with and in turn blocking works access to the site

That's brilliant.

Our man in Havana

steve06 wrote: »

I know someone that works on a building site and got clamped at the enterance, he told the clamper to take it off and the clamper told him he was parked illegally on private land. My friend told the clamper that it was his site, he was managing it and he didn't have a contract with any clampers. The clamper told him it was a public access road to a private appartment block so he was leaving it there till the fine was paid!

my friend got an angle grinder, cut it off and left it on the ground beside the car so when the clamper came back he said they'd take him to court. My friend then produced the building plans which showed the site boundry which he was parked in and told the clamper that he had illegally clamped him on a private building site so it was his issue, and if he didn't get the clamping van outside the site boundry that he'd cut the roof off.

The clamper drove off with his tail between his legs and my friend put in 2 complaints to the clamping company:

1 - tresspassing on private land
2 - immobilising a private vehicle on private land which they didn't have a contract with and in turn blocking works access to the site

You can be sure that he was one of the many rogue clampers that the UK is exporting to Ireland.

maidhc

markpb wrote: »

That's a bizarre notion. It's either legally public or legally private - there's no fluffy grey area in between. If it's private (but open), why should I not have a say in where and how people park in it?

Because that is how the law is.

e.g. I legally own out to the centre of the road (as do most people), but people can still drive and park there.

As mentioned above, the notion of private clamping is grounded on the law of contract. If you put a clamp on someone elses property you must be able to justify it accordingly.

mcwhirter

Bond-007 wrote: »

You can be sure that he was one of the many rogue clampers that the UK is exporting to Ireland.

Why would he be from the UK?

Our man in Havana

Educated guess. There are very few Irish involved in the clamping game.

smash

Bond-007 wrote: »

You can be sure that he was one of the many rogue clampers that the UK is exporting to Ireland.

he was Polish

Our man in Havana

I stand corrected.

mcwhirter

steve06 wrote: »

he was Polish

See, he was polish, mr moderator

cormie

Can we get a summary of this so, just so I know what to say if I'm clamped. I was told to park somewhere near an apartment block today by one security guard, then another 2 came along with clamps and I had to tell them I had permission to park there, if I hadn't of been at my van, I probably would have been clamped. They clamped another 2 vehicles.

Our man in Havana

They is basically no law allowing for private clamping. There have been court cases where private clamping has been ruled unlawful.

I suggest reading the legal discussion topics on clamping.

cormie

taken from the other thread:

A person has no right to interfere with another person's vehicle, regardless of where it's parked.

You can clamp on private land all you like, but you're obliged to remove it without charging the person and without any delay. Otherwise they could take you to court for detaining their vehicle, and someone else suggested extortion as an additional possibility - demanding money to remove a clamp is akin to demanding money with menaces; "Pay me money or I won't release your car."

If someone was really bull-headed, they could take you to court for simply putting the clamp on in the first place.



It boils down to the law of contract and tort.

You put up a sign saying "Clamping in operation". You have to make sure that the sign is conspicious enough to be seen by any driver. So basically the driver is agreeing to a contract by parking.

Also any release fee must be reasonable and reflect the damages caused. I would say that the damages would be nominal and not the hundreds of euro that some clampers demand for release.

-Chris-

So wait a moment...

If there's a clear sign up that clamping is in force, clamping is legal and enforcable?

Does that then negate the previous paragraph that states the they're obilged to remove a clamp when requested without charge or delay?

dioltas

Seems to be alot of conflicting opinions on the subject...

maidhc

AudiChris wrote: »

So wait a moment...

If there's a clear sign up that clamping is in force, clamping is legal and enforcable?

Does that then negate the previous paragraph that states the they're obilged to remove a clamp when requested without charge or delay?

Yes.

-Chris-

So back to the OP's question, is it ok to cut the clamp off your car if you come back and find it there?

You're on private land in a carpark, parked against the parking guidelines detailed on the signposts
The signposts are up (and are clear & legible)
The charge is reasonable
There's no damage to your car

In that case, they're allowed to clamp you and within their rights to detain your vehicle until you pay a reasonable release fee.

They have the right to clamp you, you don't have the right to damage their equipment that they're using in the course of doing their job.

Is that all correct?

Climate Expert

If you ask them to remove the clamp free of charge then and they refuse you can go to town on the clamp.

Our man in Havana

Almost.

It must be shown that the driver saw and read and agreed to the contract as detailed on the signs. That is usually a matter for the courts to decide.

Our man in Havana

Climate Expert wrote: »

If you ask them to remove the clamp free of charge then and they refuse you can go to town on the clamp.

On what basis?

Climate Expert

Bond-007 wrote: »

On what basis?

There is a clamp on your wheel and you don't want it there.

craichoe

Oh ffs .. just cut the thing off and ignore any letters you get bar a summons.

Anan1

markpb wrote: »

That's a bizarre notion. It's either legally public or legally private - there's no fluffy grey area in between. If it's private (but open), why should I not have a say in where and how people park in it?

Because many people don't care that it's yours, and feel entitled to park on your land regardless of your wishes.

Our man in Havana

craichoe wrote: »

Oh ffs .. just cut the thing off and ignore any letters you get bar a summons.

+1

maidhc

AudiChris wrote: »

So back to the OP's question, is it ok to cut the clamp off your car if you come back and find it there?

You're on private land in a carpark, parked against the parking guidelines detailed on the signposts
The signposts are up (and are clear & legible)
The charge is reasonable
There's no damage to your car

In that case, they're allowed to clamp you and within their rights to detain your vehicle until you pay a reasonable release fee.

They have the right to clamp you, you don't have the right to damage their equipment that they're using in the course of doing their job.

Is that all correct?

yes

smash

cormie wrote: »

taken from the other thread:

A person has no right to interfere with another person's vehicle, regardless of where it's parked.

You can clamp on private land all you like, but you're obliged to remove it without charging the person and without any delay. Otherwise they could take you to court for detaining their vehicle, and someone else suggested extortion as an additional possibility - demanding money to remove a clamp is akin to demanding money with menaces; "Pay me money or I won't release your car."

If someone was really bull-headed, they could take you to court for simply putting the clamp on in the first place.



It boils down to the law of contract and tort.

You put up a sign saying "Clamping in operation". You have to make sure that the sign is conspicious enough to be seen by any driver. So basically the driver is agreeing to a contract by parking.

Also any release fee must be reasonable and reflect the damages caused. I would say that the damages would be nominal and not the hundreds of euro that some clampers demand for release.

Then what's the deal with a public road where you've paid for parking, your ticket runs out and they then clamp you?

Another thing is that at my office block there's clamping in operation which is €90 fine, if you pay cash it's €90 but if you pay on the phone there's another €5 admin fee! They also clamp cars which are not parked in official parking spots or blocking other cars in - would the cars that are being blocked in have a case to get the clamp removed free of charge as they're holding up people leaving the office and therefor the clampers are detaining the vehicle?

meathstevie

Most clamps have a padlock, so what if you cut the lock and left a replacement lock on the clamp. The keys can be delivered for a charge of 90 euro:D.