Sound Moderators

Magnusd

Where can you buy sound moderators in Ireland ?

Will the dealer ask to see that you have permission to own one ?

bitemybanger

Where can you buy sound moderators in Ireland ? In any firearms dealer

Will the dealer ask to see that you have permission to own one ? No, its up to you to obtain a permit from your firearms officer.

Magnusd

Whats the best one for a 22LR ? Are SAK any good ?

CJhaughey

Magnusd wrote: »

Will the dealer ask to see that you have permission to own one ?

My dealer did, and I produced it.
Better to stay on the RSOTL.

jimbo 22

When we are on the subject of sound mods

Whats the consequences of not declaring a sound Mod on a Centerfire T8 )


Is it an addition to your fire arm cert ie a separate piece of paper or whats the set up?

Do the FO make a big deal of it?


Has anyone had any bother getting one?

Grizzly 45

Not declaring it...Technically guilty of an "offence".What said offence is never really clear in the law.

ASFIK,it is a seperate piece of paper stating you are entitled to posses this to that guns serial number.

The FO making a deal of it??more like your Super.And wether he grants it or not depends on how many recent movies he has seen with silencers been used.:rolleyes: What he has heard about them,how many hitmen have used them in Ireland and the UK in gang shootings:rolleyes:.or that he is actually knowedgeable about them and realises their positive uses,like hearing protection,not spooking livestock etc.

Getting one with bother or no varied sucesses around the country.

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Not declaring it...Technically guilty of an "offence".What said offence is never really clear in the law.

Actually the offence is exceptionally clear in the law, it's possession of a firearm without a licence and the penalties are rather steep;
Section 2(2A):

(2A) A person who is guilty of an offence under this section is liable—
(a) in case the firearm is a restricted firearm or the ammunition is restricted ammunition—
(i) on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding €5,000 or imprisonment for a term not exceeding 12 months or both, and
(ii) on conviction on indictment, to a fine not exceeding €20,000 or imprisonment for a term not exceeding 7 years or both, and
(b) in any other case—
(i) on summary conviction, to a fine not exceeding €2,500 or imprisonment for a term not exceeding 12 months or both, and
(ii) on conviction on indictment, to a fine not exceeding €10,000 or imprisonment for a term not exceeding 5 years or both.

The FO making a deal of it??more like your Super.And wether he grants it or not depends on how many recent movies he has seen with silencers been used.:rolleyes:

Unfortunately true, but that doesn't change the legal requirement for his permission for a moderator (and soon you'll have to go to the Commissioner's office for a centrefire moderator).

Sikamick

Sparks as a matter of interest what is the position on people that have sound Mod for pistols.

Sikamick

cavan shooter

Sikamick wrote: »

Sparks as a matter of interest what is the position on people that have sound Mod for pistols.

Sikamick

I know you directed this at Sparks, howver I would have thought a Super giving you permission to put a mod on a pistol would be equivalent to a "snowballs chance in hell"

Sikamick

cavan shooter wrote: »

I know you directed this at Sparks, howver I would have thought a Super giving you permission to put a mod on a pistol would be equivalent to a "snowballs chance in hell"

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I would think the same, but seemingly some of them are out there. One would wonder as to why anyone would want a sound mod for target shooting.

Sikamick

Sparks

The legislation for moderators says nothing about what kind of firearm they're attached to; if you can get permission for it, you can have it. I would imagine, however, that whatever leeway someone might get because they didn't know about needing permission for the moderator they have on their .22lr bunnywhacker CZ, there would be absolutely none for someone who had a moderator for a centrefire pistol without permission. I'd also imagine that Cavan's right; the odds of getting permission would be very low. Gardai have said that pistol licences will only be granted for target shooting; it's hard to come up with a good reason for a moderator for a target shooting pistol when you can just wear ear defenders anyways.

Grizzly 45

Your'e right Sparks.Forgot that we had been updated on this.:o

RE suppressors on pistols. yes it could be done in certain circumstances.Certain people CANNOT wear ear defenders,belive it or not,or put things in the ear channel.Somthing to do with ear bone and skull structure.But that will require some good medical expertise to explain it.
Also,I suppose with some legal foolery of applying for a 9mm pistol carbine,taking the stocks off,and shorter barrel type thing.

Personally,Iwould rather use a suppressor than ear defenders,[uncomfortable damn things]as it usually turns your semi auto into a single shot anyway.As the whole concept of a suppressed pistol is for single shots not rapid fire.

Sikamick

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Your'e right Sparks.Forgot that we had been updated on this.:o

RE suppressors on pistols. yes it could be done in certain circumstances.Certain people CANNOT wear ear defenders,belive it or not,or put things in the ear channel.Somthing to do with ear bone and skull structure.But that will require some good medical expertise to explain it.
Also,I suppose with some legal foolery of applying for a 9mm pistol carbine,taking the stocks off,and shorter barrel type thing.

Personally,Iwould rather use a suppressor than ear defenders,[uncomfortable damn things]as it usually turns your semi auto into a single shot anyway.As the whole concept of a suppressed pistol is for single shots not rapid fire.

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As the whole concept of a suppressed pistol is for single shots not rapid fire.[/QUOTE]Grizzly 45

Reply Sikamick:What about the Walther p22 suppressed, it fires semi auto.

Again Grizzly why would one want a suppressed pistol, Authorized club ranges are inherently public, I don't think the use of suppressed pistols from a public perception point of view would do the sport any good.

Red Renard

Sikamick wrote: »

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As the whole concept of a suppressed pistol is for single shots not rapid fire.

Grizzly 45

Reply Sikamick:What about the Walther p22 suppressed, it fires semi auto.

Again Grizzly why would one want a suppressed pistol, Authorized club ranges are inherently public, I don't think the use of suppressed pistols from a public perception point of view would do the sport any good.[/quote]

Personally,Iwould rather use a suppressor than ear defenders,[uncomfortable damn things]as it usually turns your semi auto into a single shot anyway.As the whole concept of a suppressed pistol is for single shots not rapid fire. [/quote Grizzly 45]

Revolvers wont get turned into single shot. If you are unlucky to have head and ear difficultys (eyes?) that wont let you use plugs or ear defenders you are unfortunate, standing on the firing line with a silencer as the only means of ear protection is a no brainer, dont do it, see a doctor for help and advice.:o

clivej

Yes I agree with Sparks here on this one.
I have put in for permission to use a mod on my CZ 22lr just waiting for an answer now.

Grizzly 45

Sikamick wrote: »

________________________________________________________________

Reply Sikamick:What about the Walther p22 suppressed, it fires semi auto.

Again Grizzly why would one want a suppressed pistol, Authorized club ranges are inherently public, I don't think the use of suppressed pistols from a public perception point of view would do the sport any good.

Sika,
The Walther 22 is a .22 rimfire cartridge pistol,and there are plenty of 22lrs that work well suppressed .I was applying this to centerfire pistols.Which are a different matter altogether.
One other advsntage that I forgot to mention and is apprently a benefit is RECOIL reduction.Suppressed pistols cut recoil by somthing like 20/25%.So it could also have the benefit for new shooters or first timers.
Well, public perception,Hollywood has the silencer as somthing sinister and evil.I think if it was brought out of the closet so to speak,alot of the stupid mistique surrounding it would disapper.It would show that

1] They are not silly little 6in tubes that can be screwed onto everything from a 22 rifle to a 50 Cal BMG.

2]There is an art and sicence to matching up a correct suppressor to a firearm,you cant just hang any ol can on certain pistols or rifles and get them to function properly.Usually this ends up as being 2/3rd the length of the pistol.Try that on a 45 Colt 1911 and try lifting and aimingit.You would be better off then with a carbine.So hardly the deadly covert killer tool we are all lead to belive.
3
]Anything IMO that reduces noise is of benefit wether you wear hearing protection or not is ,and eventually HSE will require it to be considerd more by Superintendants.Shooting with members of the public watching.What did YOU DO to protect their hearing would be a question?

4] They are not the favourd assasin tools the Media would like to think they are.Most pros wont ever use them on a pistol.If you have to be that close to your mark things haven't been planned right. Nor are they that quiet.without going into a lengthy explanation of areas of deception and discovery.a suppressor/silencer will dull the report enough to make people think the noise was somthing else other than a gunshot or where it came from.

5] They cannot be fitted to a revolver[Red Renard take note.]
Bar the Russian Mosin Nagant [18 somthing] model,as it presses each round into the barrel before firing.Revolvers have a space between drum and barrel/frame,which allows escaping gases and noise.Another Hollywood myth that could be dispelled.

6]They are expensive and difficult enough to export/import.So it is only somone dedicated enough who would want one.IMO the govt could make more money on this by simply making a 1000 Euro ownership and transfer tax on these like in the USA.

7] They are available as well and easy enough with good reason in the EU.So why cant we adapt some more EU customs as well,seeing we can be ala carte Europeans when it suits.

Red Renard

Yes,yes there is a tiny number of revolvers that can effectively be
silenced like some of the negant revolvers with a tight gas seal
testing your general knowledge Grizzly, but why risk joe public / joe
duffy and the Doj having seizures at the taughts of pistol shooters
fitting silencers using sub-sonic hollow point ammunition. Looks and sounds sinister.:rolleyes:

freddieot

Moderators for pistols are a no-win. If you manage to get a cert for one - well done ..

Love to see a court case transcript on this one. eg number 1:-

Why do you want a silencer for your 9mm ?

Response : I can't wear ear protection.

Response : Get another hobby ! Have you informed your club about this as allowing someone who cannot wear ear protection to shoot will invalidate their insurance. Is it an authorised club , have they put in their safety procedures that they allow shooting without ear defenders -was this pointed out to the Range Inspector ?

eg number 2 -

Why do you want a silencer for your 9mm ?

Response : It helps reduce recoil dramatically and allowes me to shoot targets more effectively.

Response: You can do that more effectively with barrel porting and \ or recoil reducing accessories. Won't the weight of the moderatror not throw out the balance of your pistol ? It appears about 100% of IPSC shooters and other pistol disciplines for example can hit a target without the need for a silencer ?

Sikamick

(QUOTE)Grizzly 45
Sika,
The Walther 22 is a .22 rimfire cartridge pistol,and there are plenty of 22lrs that work well suppressed .I was applying this to centerfire pistols.Which are a different matter altogether.

___________________________________________________________________

Grizzly what benefit would it be if one or two club members are using Sound Moderators with no hearing protection and the rest of the shooting detail are wearing hearing protection while shooting, there would be no logic in that.

The public perception of pistols with silencers being evil exists, whether you like it or not.

Sikamick

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

One other advsntage that I forgot to mention and is apprently a benefit is RECOIL reduction.Suppressed pistols cut recoil by somthing like 20/25%.So it could also have the benefit for new shooters or first timers.

First timers shouldn't have an entire magazine loaded up for their first shots for fairly obvious reasons; and if there's no second shot, then recoil isn't much of a problem.

I think if it was brought out of the closet so to speak,alot of the stupid mistique surrounding it would disapper.

It would - if every member of the public was a shooter.
In reality they're not, and they'd do a lot more harm than good.

Anything IMO that reduces noise is of benefit wether you wear hearing protection or not is ,and eventually HSE will require it to be considerd more by Superintendants.

So we're going to be required to have something on the pistol that you're saying makes it harder to shoot?
Doesn't sound good for the sport to me.

Shooting with members of the public watching.What did YOU DO to protect their hearing would be a question?

This opens a nasty can of worms. What are the public doing unsupervised on your range? And if they are supervised, what are you doing not issuing them with club ear defenders? And if you don't have any, what are you doing bringing in members of the public without any safey kit available for them?

They are not the favourd assasin tools the Media would like to think they are.Most pros wont ever use them on a pistol.

How many times has a mod got to say it in here? This is a sports forum. I don't care if there are military or police shooters out there, they can get their own forum, and if you want to talk about their equipment go find the Military forum. There's even one on boards, go have fun. But not in here.
Seriously. I see more of this crap, I'm issuing infractions.
:mad:

If you have to be that close to your mark things haven't been planned right.

Are you ****ing kidding me? You want to talk about how to assassinate people in here? :mad: :mad: :mad:

They are available as well and easy enough with good reason in the EU.So why cant we adapt some more EU customs as well,seeing we can be ala carte Europeans when it suits.

Grizzly, they are available here. If you have a good reason for wanting one. Problem is, there really isn't any such thing as a good reason for a pistol silencer.

Red Renard

Grizzly, many states in the US do not permit silencers or if they do you require a permit, strict conditions can also apply depend on the state you
live in. Example below and the advice given.

Your friend with his FFL will not be able to sell it to you unless he has the class 3 lic. You need to find a class three dealer to purchas your suppressor from. You have to have a background check and pay a $200 tax (Tax stamp). This will allow the BATF to come to your house atleast once a year to inspect your storage and safety for this class 3 item. You have to go to your local SO or PD and have your finger printes taken. You also need to check state and local laws regarding suppressors.

Grizzly 45

freddieot wrote: »

Moderators for pistols are a no-win. If you manage to get a cert for one - well done ..

Love to see a court case transcript on this one. eg number 1:-

Why do you want a silencer for your 9mm ?

Response : I can't wear ear protection.

Response : Get another hobby ! Have you informed your club about this as allowing someone who cannot wear ear protection to shoot will invalidate their insurance. Is it an authorised club , have they put in their safety procedures that they allow shooting without ear defenders -was this pointed out to the Range Inspector ?

IF You have a court full of knowledgeable people on firearms that is,and how many people would know about porting or recoil accessories???????????
WHYshould somone have to chang e their hobbies because of a disability these days.VERY UN PC and discriminitory against the physically challenged..Get yourself in right messes these days suggesting that.Especially in a court of law.

Grizzly 45

The public perception of pistols with silencers being evil exists, whether you like it or not.

So wether I like it or not.It is better to hide in the closet about it then???kinda goes against the whole idea of shooters being open about things isnt it??:rolleyes::rolleyes:

Grizzly 45

[

quote=Sparks;57091852]First timers shouldn't have an entire magazine loaded up for their first shots for fairly obvious reasons; and if there's no second shot, then recoil isn't much of a problem. It would - if every member of the public was a shooter.

Uhmm why ever not if they are being supervised???

In reality they're not, and they'd do a lot more harm than good.So we're going to be required to have something on the pistol that you're saying makes it harder to shoot?

Didnt say it makes it harder to shoot,said it makes recoil easier to handle.
Get used to the fact HSE will play more of a role in shooting than most people think.Wether WE like it or not!!!

Doesn't sound good for the sport to me.This opens a nasty can of worms. What are the public doing unsupervised on your range? And if they are supervised, what are you doing not issuing them with club ear defenders? And if you don't have any, what are you doing bringing in members of the public without any safey kit available for them?

Who said anything about them being unsupervised??So sound stops at our backwalls does it????Doesnt travel outside the range either???:rolleyes:Going to get everyone within the neighbourhood to wear ear defenders as well???FACT is as land gets built up around ranges,we WILL have to take noise levels into consideration,and honestlyI cant see why shooters are so negative about somthing that might save their sport or make it more tolerable to neighbours.:(

How many times has a mod got to say it in here? This is a sports forum. I don't care if there are military or police shooters out there, they can get their own forum, and if you want to talk about their equipment go find the Military forum. There's even one on boards, go have fun. But not in here.
Seriously. I see more of this crap, I'm issuing infractions.

Yes mummy we know all this .Can YOU personally differentiate between an EXAMPLE and an ADVOCATION?????Most rational and sane people can actually do this....And sorry, but things especially on suppressors etc DO cross the linebetween sporting ,military and police use.So maybe you should make suppressors another BANNED subject as noone seems to be able to discuss it rationally without everyone getting their panties in a twist!!!!:mad::mad::mad:

:mad:Are you ****ing kidding me? You want to talk about how to assassinate people in here? :mad: :mad: :mad:

Sparks,PLEASE try and get a grip on reality here ,would ya???:(
I am not advocating or telling people how to shoot anyone.If they want to find that out there is the internet and plenty of books on this.This is a QUOTE not an instruction on the matter by somone who did that kind of work..It is an illustration to show that criminals do not use the damn things asd much as people belive or is portrayed.

So to sum this all up.
1]We would rather hush this up and keep sthum about the things as they are nasty and best not discussed.And best because of Hollywood and media negativity we had better toe the line on this and not try and improve an aspect of public misinformation to positive side.

2] They have no sporting purposes,or use.So therefore best not discuss them either.
3] It is not going to happen that noise reduction will become a big issue here in the future re ranges or open shooting grounds.So anything nasty and unknown and the public is afraid of is best not discussed either.
Head in sand and erect arses spring to mind.

Grizzly, they are available here. If you have a good reason for wanting one. Problem is, there really isn't any such thing as a good reason for a pistol silencer.

[/QUOTE]

Well,Sparks that is your opinion.However if a some people have them.we must ASSUME that they provided good reason to their Supers to aquire them legally ????? So all we are doing here is SURMISING what it might be here.

Sparks

Grizzly 45 wrote: »

Uhmm why ever not if they are being supervised???

Safety. No slamfires, no taking a shot and being so excited that they turn round with the pistol in their hands, no silly stuff. Which is what you have to watch for when someone's starting off. And by the time you don't have to watch for it, the recoil isn't an issue anymore, they've experienced it and gotten used to it.

Didnt say it makes it harder to shoot

Yes, you did:

Usually this ends up as being 2/3rd the length of the pistol.Try that on a 45 Colt 1911 and try lifting and aimingit.You would be better off then with a carbine.

Get used to the fact HSE will play more of a role in shooting than most people think.Wether WE like it or not!!!

It will, and H&S will require all spectators to have hearing protection. Which frankly, they should have anyway. Silencers aren't going to be the solution, because it's far easier and cheaper and safer for everyone to wear earplugs/ear defenders than it is to ensure everyone firing has a moderator in place.

Yes mummy we know all this .Can YOU personally differentiate between an EXAMPLE and an ADVOCATION?????Most rational and sane people can actually do this....And sorry, but things especially on suppressors etc DO cross the linebetween sporting ,military and police use.

Let's get this clear here and now, shall we? If you want to use a moderator in this country as a civilian, you're either target shooting or you're hunting. This forum is a sports forum. If you want to talk about moderators for target shooting or for hunting, go right ahead. But check the military/police stuff at the door, it's not in the charter and there are other places for it.

I am not advocating or telling people how to shoot anyone. If they want to find that out there is the internet and plenty of books on this.

And that's it, we're done.