Looks like McCain has picked his VP...

bobbyjoe

Sesshoumaru wrote: »

Obama thinks all that the terrorists need is a big group hug!

The propoganda news is working on you.
Resist!!

Pocono Joe

Well, I watched Sarah Palin's speech last night. I've got to be honest; I found the whole thing disappointing.

But I think I've had an epiphany. I get it now!

How in the world can she expect to be both a mother and President of the United States? Talk about big cahonies! Who does she think she is?

And this is the new millennium. Qualifications for the presidency have evolved. Being governor of a state is so Carter/Reagan/Bush. How passe! Got to get up with the times man. Authoring a couple of memoirs is where it's at. No single major law or reform in either the state or US senate means diddily anymore. Not when you can give a rousing speech. And hey, she was only governor of Alaska! We all know the person who shoots the biggest moose is automatically sent to the governor's mansion, right?

And I get the economy now. That's where we taxes from, right?

Hey, Russia invades a few other countries... BUMMER. Iran gets new-clear weapons and shuts down a fifth of the worlds oil supply... CHANGE IS GOOD. Do we really need electricity or automobiles? Don't you think I would look good in a sweater in sub freezing temps? And I need a new bike anyway. At least the Caribou will be happy.

And thank god for our media. I use to think their jobs were to report on newsworthy stories. I didn't realize the unparalleled level of responsibility it has become to be the appointed agent of research for unfounded rumors on the Daily Kos. I mean, how can we expect them to report on Barak Obama's help getting into Harvard and shaping his career by an individual who blasted the Jewish culture and Christianity and preaches the virtues of Islam (and who was principle adviser to one of the world's richest men), when they have to put all their resources into examining belly bumps? (google Khalid Al-Mansour + Obama if you must, but it's probably too much trouble... it is for the media... oh what the hell... http://townhall.com/columnists/AmandaCarpenter/2008/08/26/another_radical_obama_association). But why bother, it's not like his wife got a DUI at 22. Life is tough, hand me another Latte. And I now know it's true that being a Washington outsider and spending your time on running a state and committing to reform, rather than appearing on "Meet the Press," or having luncheons with the media elite certainly discredits any level of credibility as a public servant. I can't wait until the press does an in depth analysis comparing Palin's hair to Joe Bidens. Oh wait! Breaking news just in,,, My life is complete!
http://news.bostonherald.com/news/2008/view.bg?articleid=1116858&srvc=2008campaign&position=8

Oooooops, I just realized, Sarah Palin isn't running for Prez... she's running for vice prez... MY BAD!


(done in notepad, how does it look?)

LolaLuv

Oh come on, Pocono, there's no need to be so patronizing. Have a discussion!

norbert64

her speech kinda sounded more like a celebrity roast, with Obama as the special guest, lol.

Hobbes

Pocono Joe wrote: »

Qualifications for the presidency have evolved. Being governor of a state is so Carter/Reagan/Bush.

In fairness now the Republican party did say her experience in being part of a PTA would help in being a VP. Something Carter/Reagan/Bush don't have.

Hey, Russia invades a few other countries... BUMMER. Iran gets new-clear weapons and shuts down a fifth of the worlds oil supply... CHANGE IS GOOD. Do we really need electricity or automobiles? Don't you think I would look good in a sweater in sub freezing temps? And I need a new bike anyway. At least the Caribou will be happy.

Well if you watch Palins pastors speech you will see that Palins church are ready to look after the survivors when the end of the world comes. Praise jeebus

snow scorpion

Here's the basic problem for the Democrats (as far as Palin is concerned): even with her admittedly limited executive experience (mayor of a town of 5000 for six years and governor of 700,000 for less than two years), that experience still makes her infinitely more qualified to be President than Obama. (And she's not even running for President.)

That fact is going to be a constant thorn in the side of Democrats and drive them nuts for the next nine weeks as they try to argue that their guy is the better candidate.

Hobbes

snow scorpion wrote: »

that experience still makes her infinitely more qualified to be President than Obama. (And she's not even running for President.)

How exactly? I keep seeing that quote but the fact is when she was a mayor she actually hired an adviser to do the work for her.

Does she have years of knowledge/qualifications in constitutional law?

This is the woman who asked "What does a VP actually do?".

snow scorpion

Hobbes wrote: »

How exactly?

Uh, 8 years of executive experience vs. 0 years of executive experience.

8 > 0.

(And she's running for Vice-President.)

And the question remains: why are the Dems comparing their Presidential nominee to the Reps Vice-Presidential nominee?

CivilServant

Sand wrote: »

Paradoxically, a popular political play in US politics seems to be to run "against Washington", or to "take Washington back" from corrupt insiders etc etc for ordinary Americans struggling with taxes and so on.

When Obama and Co demean Alaska, they demean all other small states in the US. With Obama already on record as describing middle America as bitter, and struggling to shake an elitist image and connect with people without a degree he really, really, really doesnt need to help Palin anymore with convincing middle america that she and McCain will represent them more than Obama will.

Thats why laughing at Palins small town, her state and sneering at her degree is...well, frankly stupid. The Dems have been hitting her on these points trying to score points and she just flipped it round and used their attacks against them. Easy, obvious ploy and its weird the Democrats never considered it.

If they had simply acknowledged Palin as an interesting choice, hit her on her creationism views, and then waited for her apparent inexperience and failings to reveal themselves on campaign then they would do much better than what theyve done so far.

In fairness Sand, Alaska is what it is. A state of 700,000 people in the far corner of America where nothing really happens. It isn't Pennsylvania, Florida, or California. She wasn't governating anything more difficult than when hunting season should begin.

Manic Moran

Hobbes wrote: »

How exactly? I keep seeing that quote but the fact is when she was a mayor she actually hired an adviser to do the work for her.

Given the state of Wasalia these days, that seems to have proven to be a good thing.

If she's going to take the rap for her staffers doing bad things such as the Troopergate issue, I don't see why she shouldn't get credit for her staff doing good things. After all, the advisor is not responsible for the state of the city, even if the advisor does everything. The Mayor is. It's the old saw about "You can delegate authority, but you cannot delegate responsibility"

NTM

FatherTed

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J8uGenNjOAI

Funny stuff on the Daily Show last night (First 10 seconds are messed up but the rest is great)

FatherTed

snow scorpion wrote: »

Uh, 8 years of executive experience vs. 0 years of executive experience.

8 > 0.

(And she's running for Vice-President.)

And the question remains: why are the Dems comparing their Presidential nominee to the Reps Vice-Presidential nominee?

If we're going to play that game of 8>0 then John McCain also have 0 years of executive experience. So lets install Governor Palin as President right now and be done with it.

I didnt think her speech was all that great. A lot of bashing of Obama but wheres the beef? No talk of health care, immigration, foreign policy, etc, her tax talk was flawed as more americans will benefit from the Obama plan versus McCain's. Plus the "Drill Baby Drill" chants were amusing considering recent events.

Hobbes

Manic Moran wrote: »

If she's going to take the rap for her staffers doing bad things such as the Troopergate issue, I don't see why she shouldn't get credit for her staff doing good things.

o_O how can you even compare the two? She abused her power to try and get around a ruling she didn't like and then replaced the guy she fired for not obeying an order she shouldn't of given. Then to add to that employs a guy known for sexual harassment then gives him 10K severance after a couple of weeks not doing anything at all.

Yes her brother-in-law is a douche, but it doesn't in anyway excuse her actions.

To compare the two is a piss-take tbh.

Pocono Joe

Hmmmm, why is it no one here is talking about Joe Biden's son the lobbyist? Obama publically condems Lobbyists, but no one talks of HIS earmarks.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/08/27/politics/washingtonpost/main4388540.shtml?source=RSSattr=HOME_4388540


OUR MAMMA CAN BEAT YOUR OBAMA!

Hobbes

Pocono Joe wrote: »

Hmmmm, why is it no one here is talking about Joe Biden's son the lobbyist? Obama publically condems Lobbyists, but no one talks of HIS earmarks.
http://www.cbsnews.com/stories/2008/08/27/politics/washingtonpost/main4388540.shtml?source=RSSattr=HOME_4388540


OUR MAMMA CAN BEAT YOUR OBAMA!

Make a new thread for it, and we can let it rip. But as mentioned before saying "What about ....". What about them. The argument isn't if they are any better but that she isn't good enough to be VP.

CPT. SURF

That John Stewart piece is classic. The hypocrisy of Hannity, O'Reilly, and McCain's policy adviser is quite amazing. Clearly contradicting themselves on camera. Unbelievable that people still like them

Sand

Hobbes

Which Repubs are playing. which is funny because Democrats only held house/senate since Jan 2007 and Bush vetoes/signing statement anything he doesn't like.

Its probably an easier ploy to play when you aren't sneering at people who haven't gone to Yale, laughing at pictures of town halls that arent palaces and making fun of peoples accents.

Really, Democrats seem perplexed at how George Bush got elected two terms in a row by Americans who haven't gone to Yale, haven't got town halls that remind you of palaces and people who have rustic accents. They never consider why they ever believed they had a chance...

I say this as a somewhat disineterested observer [ Id prefer McCain over Obama from a purely Irish-free trade/world stability point of view, but Obama might not be a complete **** up for ordinary Americans, and he talks the talk so he might walk the walk too ]...if Democrats want to win the election, stop sneering at the lowest common denominator. They tend to hold the majority of the votes...Stop insulting them.

Christ, Fianna Gael, inept as they are, never make the mistake of calling culchies culchies or making fun of Bertie's accent.

I thought the best line of the speech was this:

Snow Scorpion

Quote:
Al Qaeda terrorists still plot to inflict catastrophic harm on America ... [Obama is] worried that someone won't read them their rights.

That was like a Mike Tyson hook to the kidney.

Overall, it was an excellent speech. Its hard to choose the highpoint when she was the first to really go at Obama and aim to leave bruises - personally I liked the slag against the "community organiser" credentials of Obama. McCain has been fairly respectful and admiring of Obama, whilst questioning, great and all as he is, if hes ready to lead...[ choke...], but Palin is free to go in there and get dirty whilst McCain remains above it all, in presidential style.

The genius of the Palin VP pick is that Obama has a tough time to justify himself in experience terms against McCain's VP pick, let alone challenging Mccain's credentials.

The frightening thing for the Dems is their presidential pick isnt qualified to be the Republican VP pick...

Hobbes

Well if you watch Palins pastors speech you will see that Palins church are ready to look after the survivors when the end of the world comes. Praise jeebus

Whilst her apparent [ I say apparent because I havent seen the details of her views , and like all good cynics I distrust the Daily Kos] creationist views are lolworthy, they arent going to lose votes for McCain. Whereas Obamas pastors view "God Damn America" will lose and has lost votes for Obama.

Remember, politics isn't about whose right. Its about who tells you what you want to hear.

Does she have years of knowledge/qualifications in constitutional law?

Reminds me about that joke about the Germans wondering why the Americans even bothered to have an election when the contest was between a lawyer, married to a lawyer, who beat another lawyer married to another lawyer vs a war hero married to a brewery heiress with great tits.

Yes, apparently the Germans do have a sense of humour!

But to be serious, people aren't looking for lawyers...they're looking for leaders. Is Obama going to represent Americans he describes as "bitter" better than Sarah "ordinary hockey mom" Palin will? And shes the VP FFS. Idiots sneering at her small town roots aren't helping Obama.

Civil Servant

In fairness Sand, Alaska is what it is. A state of 700,000 people in the far corner of America where nothing really happens. It isn't Pennsylvania, Florida, or California. She wasn't governating anything more difficult than when hunting season should begin.

We are talking about the VP pick here. And she has more executive experience than Obama. I know there's denial of that, because quite simply the Democrats don't want to wake up in the middle of the night thinking "FFS, I gave my car keys to a guy with no drivers license!!!!!"

Alaska is what it is. A US state, with the relevant powers and more citizens than many countries - Palin for example visited the Alaskan national guard on deployment in the middle east. Its not the Waterford county council. You sneer at Alaska, you sneer at all the other US states that arent Pennsylvania, Flordia or California. And that is registered, however dimly by the voters in those states who get the message that they are hicks as far as the Dems are concerned and not deserving of a "real" governor for a "real" state.

If the Dems keep that **** up, theyll sleepwalk into a walloping at the polls. Thats why Palin is an exceptional pick. She highlights all thats wrong with the Democrats and why they lost the Angry White Male vote and will never recover it so long as theyre calling the Angry White Male voters hicks. Theyre angry after all.

Father Ted

No talk of health care, immigration, foreign policy,

Highlighted the important bit. Talk? If there was talk youd be satisfied?

Sand

Just googled Palin and Creationist there for lulz and came across this article. Her views come across as political .... sitting on the fence.

This quote struck me...

Palin's children attend public schools and Palin has made no push to have creationism taught in them.

Neither have Palin's socially conservative personal views on issues like abortion and gay marriage been translated into policies during her 20 months as Alaska's chief executive. It reflects a hands-off attitude toward mixing government and religion by most Alaskans.

"She has basically ignored social issues, period," said Gregg Erickson, an economist and columnist for the Alaska Budget Report.

I.E. - personal morality remains personal, public policy remains for all citizens regardless of personal morality. Which tbh, I find rather agreeable. I honestly dont care what two adults get up to in the privacy of their own bedroom, nor do I care what fools might believe about alternate theories to evolution - so long as they dont attempt to impose those beliefs on public discourse via their political credentials.

If Palin can be a Christian taliban fundamentalist without introducing religious fundamentalist law into Alaska [ and by extension the US]... grand.

jank

Why do you say that? If its an "experience factor," then the same argument could be made about Obama. If it is "decision factors" then where is the traditional media’s tough reporting on Obama’s relationship with Bill Ayers, the convicted and unrepenting terrorist, or his spiritual adviser Rev. Wright.

Palin is news now but it was a risky move. We wont know if it pays off till the election.

How often has that been asked of a man running for office?

I dont know but a woman said that not a man

Have you read anything about Sarah Palin? The same what?

The same GOP, bible bashing message about the love of the flag but nothing real.

Ah, I know that vision well… TAXES, TAXES AND MORE TAXES.?

Well we know thats a lie!

When the poll differences are greater then the number of houses John Kerry has, then maybe I might be worried (see, two can play that game).

Whats does that mean, im just pointing it out!

Maybe, but we’ll just have to wait and see, won’t we. It won't be too long of a wait.

True!

Punt?

Sorry?

Don’t be so sure of that. Obama will have a tough time with McCain. Look at the post Saddleback analysis. It will be hard for Biden to control himself, and Palin isn’t referred to as "Barracuda" for nothing.

Biden will chew her up like a pitbull. What he has to be careful off is that not to go in too hard!

After Kerry lost, there was a lot of talk that the Dems had to stop putting flaming liberals on the Presidential ticket. And where are they now? They fail to realize the hard line liberals come out early and hard in the primaries with momentum and ride for all it’s worth. Hillary sure made a charge, albeit too late, at the end… didn’t she?

Thats is the problem with these elections. Its either black or white! no pun intended

I think they may alread have!

It will be a tight race but i havent seen anything to tell me otherwise, but palin in fairness has made it interesting.

KJ_2008

Sand wrote: »

Palin is an exceptional pick.

If you keep repeating that you might actually start believing it yourself. Keep *trying Sand, keep trying.

(* or did I mean digging?)



Meanwhile.....what staying power!

By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS
Published: September 4, 2008
Filed at 8:11 p.m. ET

SPOKANE, Wash. (AP) -- Republican vice presidential candidate Sarah Palin seems to have switched colleges at least six times in six years, including two stints at the University of Idaho before graduating from there in 1987.

Federal privacy laws prohibit the schools from disclosing her grades, and none of the schools contacted by The Associated Press could say why she transferred. There was no indication any were contacted as part of the background investigation of Palin by presidential candidate John McCain's campaign.

''Our office was not contacted by anyone,'' said Tania Thompson, spokeswoman for the University of Idaho in Moscow.

Palin, the governor of Alaska, was born in Idaho. Her family moved when she was only a few months old to Alaska, where she was raised.

According to a biography -- ''Sarah'' by Kaylene Johnson -- Palin and three friends went to the University of Hawaii at Hilo after graduation from high school in Alaska in 1982. But they left after a few weeks because of the constant rain there, the book said.

The registrar at Hawaii-Hilo has no record that she ever enrolled, school officials said Thursday.

Palin, then known as Sarah Louise Heath, and a friend then traveled to Honolulu and enrolled at Hawaii Pacific University, a private, nonsectarian school. She attended only as a freshman during the fall of 1982, school spokeswoman Crystale Lopez said.

She was in the business administration program as a full-time student, Lopez said Thursday.

snow scorpion

Tearing down Palin is not going to make Obama more competent.

/Just saying.

Hobbes

snow scorpion wrote: »

Tearing down Palin is not going to make Obama more competent.

So your not refuting that she is not capable to be a VP. I mean the way the GOP is trying to spin her she may as well be president as she appears to have more experience then McCain.

So you have the following. Which of those is most qualified to be president? Because from where I see it Obama appears to be the main choice.

Obama
- Occidental College - two years.
- Columbia University - B.A. political science with a specialization in international relations.
- Harvard - Juris Doctor (J.D.) magna cum laude

Biden
- University of Delaware - B.A. in history and B.A. in political science.
- Syracuse University College of Law - Juris Doctor (J.D.)

McCain
- United States Naval Academy - class rank 894 of 899

Palin
- Hawaii Pacific University - 1 semester
- North Idaho College - 2 semesters - general study
- University of Idaho - 2 semesters - journalism
- Matanuska-Susitna College - 1 semester
- University of Idaho - 3 semesters - B.A. in journalism
(6 years to get a 4 year degree)

is_that_so

Hobbes wrote: »

So your not refuting that she is not capable to be a VP. I mean the way the GOP is trying to spin her she may as well be president as she appears to have more experience then McCain.

So you have the following. Which of those is most qualified to be president? Because from where I see it Obama appears to be the main choice.

Obama
- Occidental College - two years.
- Columbia University - B.A. political science with a specialization in international relations.
- Harvard - Juris Doctor (J.D.) magna cum laude

Biden
- University of Delaware - B.A. in history and B.A. in political science.
- Syracuse University College of Law - Juris Doctor (J.D.)

McCain
- United States Naval Academy - class rank 894 of 899

Palin
- Hawaii Pacific University - 1 semester
- North Idaho College - 2 semesters - general study
- University of Idaho - 2 semesters - journalism
- Matanuska-Susitna College - 1 semester
- University of Idaho - 3 semesters - B.A. in journalism
(6 years to get a 4 year degree)

This type of thing would be equally useless in a job interview and spanks of pure elitism which ignores what any of the candidates have done with their lives. It will come down to who people trust.

CivilServant

Sand wrote: »

...
Civil Servant


We are talking about the VP pick here. And she has more executive experience than Obama. I know there's denial of that, because quite simply the Democrats don't want to wake up in the middle of the night thinking "FFS, I gave my car keys to a guy with no drivers license!!!!!"

Alaska is what it is. A US state, with the relevant powers and more citizens than many countries - Palin for example visited the Alaskan national guard on deployment in the middle east. Its not the Waterford county council. You sneer at Alaska, you sneer at all the other US states that arent Pennsylvania, Flordia or California. And that is registered, however dimly by the voters in those states who get the message that they are hicks as far as the Dems are concerned and not deserving of a "real" governor for a "real" state.

If the Dems keep that **** up, theyll sleepwalk into a walloping at the polls. Thats why Palin is an exceptional pick. She highlights all thats wrong with the Democrats and why they lost the Angry White Male vote and will never recover it so long as theyre calling the Angry White Male voters hicks. Theyre angry after all.

...

Eh no, the majority of nations have more citizens than Alaska. And yes she has executive experience, she has more executive experience than Obama and McCain, so what. That experience is irrelevant when it comes to the quality of a presidential candidate. Bush has 8 years experience and I don't think anyone in their right mind would consider his experience as an asset in his CV.

I think most people will have enough wits about them to see through the sham that is Sarah Palin. If not then God help you all.

BenjAii

I think media flim-flams over "my experience as a mayor of a town of 8,000 people makes me more qualified to be President than a community organizer" -ignore what matter, and scares the Republicans - the issues.

It was striking McCain had nothing concrete to say policy wise in his speech.
On almost every issue that matters to voters the Republicans track record is of failure and incompetence. The best McCain & Palin can come up with is blaming it on "the Washington elite" and positioning themselves as outsiders and candidates for change; that might get the crowds in the convention roaring but fools almost no one else.

Though it did make smile when Palin said she didn't know what a community organiser does - as she's admitted she doesn't know what a Vice President does; presumably by now someone in the GOP has given her a quick run down.

bobbyjoe

BenjAii wrote: »

I think media flim-flams over "my experience as a mayor of a town of 8,000 people makes me more qualified to be President than a community organizer" -ignore what matter, and scares the Republicans - the issues.

It was striking McCain had nothing concrete to say policy wise in his speech.
On almost every issue that matters to voters the Republicans track record is of failure and incompetence. The best McCain & Palin can come up with is blaming it on "the Washington elite" and positioning themselves as outsiders and candidates for change; that might get the crowds in the convention roaring but fools almost no one else.

Though it did make smile when Palin said she didn't know what a community organiser does - as she's admitted she doesn't know what a Vice President does; presumably by now someone in the GOP has given her a quick run down.

It's funny when they say "that Washington elite" the Washington elite are Republicans.

Hobbes

is_that_so wrote: »

This type of thing would be equally useless in a job interview and spanks of pure elitism which ignores what any of the candidates have done with their lives. It will come down to who people trust.

Elitism? When you are picking people for possibly the most powerful job in America if not the world then you want the best.

But lets talk Elitism. How does Obama working with the Community come as Elitist? How about not knowing how many houses you own? Is that Elitist? What about wearing $300K clothes to the RNC (Cindy McCain), is that Elitist?

"I do not think that word means what you think it means."

BenjAii

bobbyjoe wrote: »

It's funny when they say "that Washington elite" the Washington elite are Republicans.

Its even funnier when someone who can't remember how many houses they own (for the record - its eight !!) rails against a black man raised by a single mother as a "member of the elite".

Burning Eclipse

FatherTed wrote: »

Funny stuff on the Daily Show last night (First 10 seconds are messed up but the rest is great)

I wish I could 'thank you' twice for that clip. Sums up the GOP and it's supporters perfectly.

jank

Saw on CNN that the majority of Delegates attending the RNC earns more then 500k a year! Salt of the earth guys really!:p