Are the Motors>Motors mods too Lock happy?

Sandwich

Is this forum over censored ?

Alanstrainor

take it to feedback.

Vegeta

Well this thread will be, if you have a complaint take it to the Help Desk or Feedback.

peasant

Well ...maybe we ought to have a discussion "among ourselves" rather than let the feedback vultures (most of whom have nothing to do with motors) at it?

Owen

No: not enough mod control : too many threads out of control

Its been tried in the Motors Forum peasant, but the constant locking of threads just because Mods don't agree with what's being said is still going on. It's ridiculous, and ruining whats a poor Forum already and dragging it into obscurity.

Gary ITR

This thread and/or sandwich about to bit the dust: vote quickly

ned78 wrote: »

Its been tried in the Motors Forum peasant, but the constant locking of threads just because Mods don't agree with what's being said is still going on. It's ridiculous, and ruining whats a poor Forum already and dragging it into obscurity.

Hang on, it's not a poor forum. You haven't been around here for ages cos you got your knickers in a twist about the use of the freemasons crest and you come back and call it a poor forum?

There may have been some threads that were prematurely locked but not as many as people are making out. Any edits are usually to remove bad language, which is a mods job. So why don't you just crawl back under the rock you were hiding under for the last few months?

Zube

This thread and/or sandwich about to bit the dust: vote quickly

peasant wrote: »

Well ...maybe we ought to have a discussion "among ourselves" rather than let the feedback vultures (most of whom have nothing to do with motors) at it?

Moderation on all public forums is an absolute necessity. I have not been here very long, but the moderators seem to be on the ball to me.

What do I win?

Darragh29

No: not enough mod control : too many threads out of control

Yip, +1. What was that about the Freemasons???

Owen

No: not enough mod control : too many threads out of control

Onkle wrote: »

Hang on, it's not a poor forum. You haven't been around here for ages ... and you come back and call it a poor forum

It is a poor forum. It may be popular, but as far as content goes, it's inadequate. Just because I haven't been around for a while, doesn't mean I haven't been reading it. People are far too bitchy, and argument happy, and ready to fire of a stream of bitterness and a penny's drop ... just as you've done. There's no community spirit in this forum.

colm_mcm

No: not enough mod control : too many threads out of control

There is an awful lot of repetition on behalf of some regular posters here, and the same arguments and rivalries keep coming up over and over.
While this is a tad annoying, it's part and parcel of any forum that has regular contributors.

Personally I think a lot of threads are locked well before their time, and locking the thread often denies someone a right of reply, this moves the argument down the line only to be brought up again.

peasant

ned78 wrote: »

Its been tried in the Motors Forum peasant, but the constant locking of threads just because Mods don't agree with what's being said is still going on. It's ridiculous, and ruining whats a poor Forum already and dragging it into obscurity.

We have never, ever locked a thread because we personally don't agree with it. Threads are always locked for one of the following reasons:

1) the thread has drifted off topic (which in itself is no problem, really) and on top of that is going nowhere or round in circles

2) two or more posters in the thread have started to loose the plot, the insults are flying, posts are getting reported (which users normally don't see) and the discussion is getting personal instead of on topic. In my opinion (and I presume in that of the other mods as well) it is the least damaging option to lock the thread rather than trying to keep a lid on a box of frogs (which usually never works anyway) and having to hand out infractions or even bannings like candy in end. Locking the thread is annoying to those in the middle of the argument, I understand that, but I honestly belive that in the long run it is better than infracting / banning

3) a thread is in violation of the forum charter. (At the time the charter was developed, all users had a say in it)

4) an ancient thread has been dug up from the archives without any good reason.

Boards.ie (and motors as one of its busiest forums) is no longer a little niche on the internet for a certain group of people, but by now well into "mainstream". To a certain degree, this also means "middle of the road" (pardon the pun) when it comes to content. Posters of all ages and all walks of life and backgrounds use this forum, that has its good sides and some disadvantages ..but such is life.

Moderating such a forum is not easy ...because whatever you do (lock or leave it open for example) there will be a sizeable group of users that don't like that decision.

Overall, I think we are doing a fairly even handed job. But as I personally seem to be getting the most critcism here ...well, I'm willing to listen to it ...

Mitch Connor

i haven't been looking on here recently as much as I used to, but i honestly don't see too many threads being locked. There has been the odd occasion where I have seen a thread locked before I had got my point accross but in general I have found the threads that are locked are those that are just going round in ever more aggrivated circles.

peasant

ned78 wrote: »

People are far too bitchy, and argument happy, and ready to fire of a stream of bitterness and a penny's drop ... just as you've done. There's no community spirit in this forum.

Just pause for a minute and think what it would be like if we let everybody rant and rave? Or alternatively shut every ranter and raver up permanently with a ban?

neither option is desirable ...:D

Anan1

Onkle wrote: »

Hang on, it's not a poor forum. You haven't been around here for ages cos you got your knickers in a twist about the use of the freemasons crest and you come back and call it a poor forum?

There may have been some threads that were prematurely locked but not as many as people are making out. Any edits are usually to remove bad language, which is a mods job. So why don't you just crawl back under the rock you were hiding under for the last few months?

Has it never occurred to you that personal attacks like this are the reason many threads get locked in the first place?

Owen

No: not enough mod control : too many threads out of control

peasant wrote: »

We have never, ever locked a thread because we personally don't agree with it. Threads are always locked for one of the following reasons:

Actually, I owe you an apology. It seems from an outsider's perspective - outsider to moderating and all it entails - that they are personally motivated. But your explanation is much more detailed and explanatory than that simple conclusion. Sorry Peasant!

Darragh29

No: not enough mod control : too many threads out of control

peasant wrote: »

1) the thread has drifted off topic (which in itself is no problem, really) and on top of that is going nowhere or round in circles

This is the biggest problem right across boards. The slightest deviation whatsoever from the most popular line of discussion is cited as off topic discussion and that's the end of the discussion.

cantdecide

I don't post very much here any more- does that tell it's own story???

Very cliqusih at times.... That's no about the mods so technically it's off topic.

Wishbone Ash

...........and peasant may have ommitted to say that threads which are libellous or have the potential to be libellous need to be locked/deteted as soon as possible.

Darragh29

No: not enough mod control : too many threads out of control

Wishbone Ash wrote: »

...........and peasant may have ommitted to say that threads which are libellous or have the potential to be libellous need to be locked/deteted as soon as possible.

Maybe you need to step out of this thead for two seconds and drop in next door if this is the case...

Alun

Darragh29 wrote: »

This is the biggest problem right across boards. The slightest deviation whatsoever from the most popular line of discussion is cited as off topic discussion and that's the end of the discussion.

TBH that's a problem in any online forum, whatever the topic.

To a degree, it goes against human nature, in that normal 'offline' real-world conversations or discussions always drift from topic to topic in a fluid manner and nobody suggests that they go off and move into another room to continue the conversation there, which would be the real-world equivalent of, say, splitting a thread that was going off on a bit of a tangent into another thread.

On the other hand, if you just allow online fora to mimic real-life you may as well abandon the whole concept of threads, and have one great big humungous mega-thread, which is clearly also not a real option.

Like most things in life, you have to find a middle road, and that is what the mods job is, and one that they IMO do well under what can be trying circumstances.

Darragh29

No: not enough mod control : too many threads out of control

Alun wrote: »

TBH that's a problem in any online forum, whatever the topic.

To a degree, it goes against human nature, in that normal 'offline' real-world conversations or discussions always drift from topic to topic in a fluid manner and nobody suggests that they go off and move into another room to continue the conversation there, which would be the real-world equivalent of, say, splitting a thread that was going off on a bit of a tangent into another thread.

On the other hand, if you just allow online fora to mimic real-life you may as well abandon the whole concept of threads, and have one great big humungous mega-thread, which is clearly also not a real option.

Like most things in life, you have to find a middle road, and that is what the mods job is, and one that they IMO do well under what can be trying circumstances.

In the absence of an acommodation of differing viewpoints, discussion is not possible, which is what I thought boards was all about. Look at the thread next door that has just been locked. Why didn't a mod close the thread when the OP departed from the charter by mentioning the name of the business she had issue with. A perfectly decent discussion torpedoed because the charter was breached in the first sentence of the first post...

-Chris-

This thread and/or sandwich about to bit the dust: vote quickly

I think moderation is absolutely necessary and I appreciate those who do it.

I think locking is too quick and it causes frustration among posters.


I think the most important thing for mods is to make sure there are no lawsuits and to make sure that everything doesn't decend into petty personal squabbling and personal grudges.

If/when it gets personal then it's going to keep occurring in other threads so that can't be allowed to fester.

If (another) lawsuit happens, it'll cripple what we're allowed to do. We should all be discouraging people from starting "x are thieving gypsies, who else has had a bad experience with them?" threads.


I'd rather see mods hand out infractions and bans for people contravening the charter. I think it's important that threads are allowed to run and develop. Control individual posters rather than killing the threads.

Mods should guide threads and stop people going OT, that's really important. Let people know that they're off on their own buzz and not addressing the OP's concerns.

By locking the thread you're taking the toys away from the bold children. Instead, by giving bans and warnings, you're setting boundaries and letting them keep playing (or something...).


If an old (ish) thread is resurrected by the OP, probably with an update, that shouldn't be locked.

The thread I'm thinking of is RedorDead's VWGI thread, I think it's fair for him to give us an update on what's happening, and the conversation was continuing based on the new information.


I think we should expand the number of Stickies. If there was a "fog light" sticky and a "going slow in the overtaking lane" sticky then people could rant as they felt, but mods wouldn't have to lock or move the thread.

A big frustration for me is when I go to read a thread that has an interesting title only to find out it's the same old $hite.

As an example, I haven't read the VRT thread in ages. It's mainly because it's going around in circles and because most of the new posters in it haven't bothered to read the thread - they're just asking the same basic questions that were asked less than a page ago by a different lazy poster who also didn't bother to read the first post.

But because it's a sticky, I can ignore it safely and then read the other VRT threads in the hope that they're asking something new.


Users have a responsibility in this too. If we know we're off topic, we should reign ourselves in (or make our point and apologies). We should try not to swear, rather than saying cnut or fcuk or $hite and outsmarting the word filter. As the forum gets more mainstream, more impressionable people (or more easily offended people) may be joining in.

We should also try not to say things that may compromise boards.ie as an entity - if someone says the wrong thing and it gets taken up by the wrong person, this place'll be sued into the ground and we'll all lose the forum we love.


Edit: I'm a slower typer than I thought - in the time it took to type this post, most of the points have been covered... ah well!

ninty9er

I see a lot more locking these days and in general think there's too much, but having taken a look at a few of the threads closed in the last few days....I can see why they were....some people *ahem* double fog light thread offender *ahem* are lucky not to be spending a week or 2 in banland.

colm_mcm

No: not enough mod control : too many threads out of control

OT, but we seriously need a BMW forum, the amount of BMW queries here is unbelievable.

Volvoboy

colm_mcm wrote: »

OT, but we seriously need a BMW forum, the amount of BMW queries here is unbelievable.

+1

But there is alot of high-horsery goes on here, people are so desparate to be right all the time.

While back i replyed to a poster concerned what would happen if he got stopped by the po-po with no nct.

I gave the answer to the best of my knowleadge, a person corrected me and i appologised. Then 2 other posters tore me a new one for posting the wrong answer:rolleyes:

To be honest the place aint the same as it used to be.. sad but true.

TheBazman

Just wondering:

* Old Threads - don't resurrect old threads unnecessarily.

Why is this the case? Surely if you have something further to add on a topic already covered would it not be better to add it to an existing thread rather than create a new one?

Alanstrainor

A lot of responses to that question here: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055366865

peasant

TheBazman wrote: »

Just wondering:

* Old Threads - don't resurrect old threads unnecessarily.

Why is this the case? Surely if you have something further to add on a topic already covered would it not be better to add it to an existing thread rather than create a new one?

Yeees ..that is a bit of a difficult one ...how to define "unnecessarily" ...

Lately I have noticed, that even if the mods leave the thread open, more often than not users will jump in with posts like "ancient thread :eek:" or "in before the lock" and ruin the thread anyway leaving no choice but to lock it.

But there is room for more generous interpretations of "necessary", I would agree.

Darragh29

No: not enough mod control : too many threads out of control

colm_mcm wrote: »

OT, but we seriously need a BMW forum, the amount of BMW queries here is unbelievable.

Defo, the motors forum has very obviously been completely overtaken by BMW drivers, or more accurately, people who drive BMW's who want to tell everyone else in the world that they drive BMW's. Why can't they have a forum of their own in motors???

ninty9er

peasant wrote: »

Yeees ..that is a bit of a difficult one ...how to define "unnecessarily" ...

Lately I have noticed, that even if the mods leave the thread open, more often than not users will jump in with posts like "ancient thread :eek:" or "in before the lock" and ruin the thread anyway leaving no choice but to lock it.

I don't think comments like that make it necessary to close a thread, they just show the "in before the lock" people that they're not always right.

Lord Nikon

+1 on the BMW sub-Forum, but saying that there is already forums out there for BMW, within Ireland too.


I think too many threads pop up that have been covered WAY too much, and tbh the Motors forum tires me. ie VRT, fog lights, penalty points.

I would suggest Stickies just for these subjects alone, but be an instant improvement.