Lesnar versus Couture..it's official!

Fozzy

Deleted User wrote: »

Fozzy you're taking physical attributes far far too much into consideration.

If you think that then I think that you're underestimating Brock's physical attributes

If it does end up going to the third round or more, just wait and see who's the one that's sucking in air in their corner. From what I've seen there's just no way that Randy can end up in better condition than Brock as the fight goes on

And I know the saying about never betting against Randy Couture :pac: But I never have until now!

Pride Fighter

Fozzy wrote: »

Thought I'd get that :pac: I amn't



Randy's been taken down before, and by guys smaller than Brock. I really don't think that Brock will face a massive challenge to get Couture down if he does get within range for a takedown



I'd disagree completely there. Brock is much better conditioned. Couture was very tired during the Sylvia fight, and Sylvia wasn't imposing his weight on Randy like Brock is likely to do. The only way I can see Brock ending up more tired is if Randy manages to keep dodging him on the feet. Also, the 14 year age gap has to be taken into account



We'll see :pac:

Yes we will:pac:

What you are predicting is what most people are predicting. That is a big mistake when it comes to Couture, he loves being the underdog and will take home the strap.

helimachoptor

I've watched a lot of MMA recently and but would be a green horn, I'm undecided on this fight.

Randy is a war horse, he'll keep going until he's knocked out cold which Lesnar has the capacity to do.

Lesnars physicality is really impressive and he seems focused as does Randy.

Either way I'm expecting a great fight and will narrowly go for a Lesnar win.

t-ha

My prediction:
Mostly stand-up/feeling out for the first part of round 1 with a few stuffed take-down attempts by Brock and a couple of shots landed by Randy. Eventually Brock will get the take-down and control to the end of the round, delivering some ham-fists and taking a few elbows to the head in return.
Round 2 Randy will get Brock to the cage and get going with some dirty boxing. Some take-down attempts but Brock will manage to stuff them and maybe reverse position on the cage as well. However the knees and elbows eaten while clinched with Randy will take their toll.
Round 3 more of the same except Randy will finally manage to take the worn down Brock to the ground up by the cage where he will feed him pain. Brock might manage to get up again but will be taken immediately down again and fed some more pain.
Round 4 Fight will finish by doctor stoppage due to Mr.Lesnar looking like a giant chip dipped in ketchup.

If this prediction proves correct I want serious kudos on calling it!

Evil_Clown

Deleted User wrote: »

What time does it start at on Setanta sports on saturday night(sunday morning)??

Starts at 3.00am Sun Morn and goes until 6.00am on Set Sports 1
The countdown show will be on before at 2.00am to kill some time
Looks like Sunday is a write off

FutureGuy

t-ha wrote: »

... Mr.Lesnar looking like a giant chip dipped in ketchup.

If this prediction proves correct I want serious kudos on calling it!

Even if you are wrong, you make me laugh with that description

I'm going for a Lesnar win.

Dancor

Brock to win by decision

davmol

I dont think Brock has the experience or all roundedness to beat Randy.
Hes realtively new to MMA and AFAIK he woldnt have near the skills on the ground,striking skills,experience that randy whos been at MMA years n years.
Grant it Brock has awesome size and explosive power but randys technique,experience and dirty boxing I think will be too much for Brock.
Randy by submission.

Fozzy

Fozzy wrote: »

If you think that then I think that you're underestimating Brock's physical attributes

I'm not but that's the only attribute I think Brock has an advantage in.

Fozzy wrote: »

If it does end up going to the third round or more, just wait and see who's the one that's sucking in air in their corner. From what I've seen there's just no way that Randy can end up in better condition than Brock as the fight goes on

Can I just ask what you base this on? Because he went 3 rounds with Heath Herring? We don't know how Brocks cardio truly is because it has never been tested. A lot of his game has never been tested.

Fozzy wrote: »

And I know the saying about never betting against Randy Couture :pac: But I never have until now!

Bet the house on Couture! Front choke off the shot!

Charlie3dan

As long as there is no ring rust and Randy comes in fit I think he's gonna take it. Randy has shown that fighting big guys isn't a problem and even though this is the biggest guy, he's not the greatest fighter.

Although, I saw this today and it's the first time I've seen randy look old: http://www.mmatko.com/randy-couture-says-he-is-ready-for-brock-lesnar-espn/

LeoGilly

One thing we've not seen with Brock is how will he react to punches to the head. Does he have a chin??

Seriously cannot wait for this fight!!!

rovert

LeoGilly wrote: »

One thing we've not seen with Brock is how will he react to punches to the head. Does he have a chin??

The fact he wasnt murdered or seriously injured by this I think speaks a lot for Brock's hardiness:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-ggcVe0V2w

Watch from the 4.35 mark.

My pick is Brock Lesnar but dont think it will be a straight forward victory.

Red Sleeping Beauty

rovert wrote: »

The fact he wasnt murdered or seriously injured by this I think speaks a lot for Brock's hardiness:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8-ggcVe0V2w

Watch from the 4.35 mark.

My pick is Brock Lesnar but dont think it will be a straight forward victory.

Murdered ? By whom ? Angle's rib cage ? The canvas ?

Can't watch that in work rovert but if thats the vid of him feckin up a rasslin move all Ill say is its easier to recover in a situation like that than it is in a heat of the battle fight situation where you can't take a breather becuase the other guy is trying to take your head off. MUCH easier.

Evil_Clown

Here is the pre UFC 91 press conference from Thursday

http://www.mmarated.com/videos/v/20081113/ufc_91_press_conference-6124.html

rovert

Deleted User wrote: »

Can't watch that in work rovert but if thats the vid of him feckin up a rasslin move all Ill say is its easier to recover in a situation like that than it is in a heat of the battle fight situation where you can't take a breather becuase the other guy is trying to take your head off. MUCH easier.

He wont be in a situation like that unless that fight takes a strange turn.
Im showing how strong Brock's neck muscles are along with how strong and relilstant. That one botched move had more impact than a succession of really well landed punches IMO.

rovert

rovert wrote: »

He wont be in a situation like that unless that fight takes a strange turn.
Im showing how strong Brock's neck muscles are along with how strong and relilstant. That one botched move had more impact than a succession of really well landed punches IMO.

Unless he's been training with Krazy Horse!

And it took him about 40 seconds to get it together I believe? he slowly staggered and got it finished IIRC?

In 40 seconds a fighter will do a lot of things to you.

rovert

Deleted User wrote: »

Unless he's been training with Krazy Horse!

And it took him about 40 seconds to get it together I believe? he slowly staggered and got it finished IIRC?

In 40 seconds a fighter will do a lot of things to you.

He won’t be landing on his head will all his body weight behind him after flying 15-20ft in the air in the fight! The fact is he didn’t break every bone in his face or blood didn’t start spilling out from it. Any other wrestler would have broken there neck after the move but not Brock. All this is testament to how tough and resilient Brock is. He isnt a tomato can.

rovert

rovert wrote: »

He won’t be landing on his head will all his body weight behind him after flying 15-20ft in the air in the fight! The fact is he didn’t break every bone in his face or blood didn’t start spilling out from it. Any other wrestler would have broken there neck after the move but not Brock. All this is testament to how tough and resilient Brock is. He isnt a tomato can.

Maximum 10 feet. But I get what you mean. Thing is its not as simple as that. A well executed punch on the button will make a man fold 10 times quicker than a faceplant.

Only way we're gonna see his chin tested is when someone hits him. Using pro wrestling spots gone wrong only proves that he's not afraid to keep going and is tough. It doesn't prove he has any kind of a chin.

Never said he was a can....I said he's unproven when canyons in his skillset. From the way some people hhave talked on this thread you'd think Couture was a can though.....

rovert

Deleted User wrote: »

Maximum 10 feet. But I get what you mean. Thing is its not as simple as that.

Never said it was, all that video was a demostration of what Brock is able to survive. Also a demonstration of his athleticism.

Deleted User wrote: »

A well executed punch on the button will make a man fold 10 times quicker than a faceplant.

Give it more credit than it being just a faceplant.

Deleted User wrote: »

Only way we're gonna see his chin tested is when someone hits him. Using pro wrestling spots gone wrong only proves that he's not afraid to keep going and is tough. It doesn't prove he has any kind of a chin.

Well sorry but we dont have much fight film to go on. It does prove he has a chin to a point as it wasnt damaged nor were other bones in his face. Brock is an all around tough MFer and I dont think he has a magic achillies heel. He is all round tough IMO.

rovert

rovert wrote: »

Well sorry but we dont have much fight film to go on. It does prove he has a chin to a point as it wasnt damaged nor were other bones in his face. Brock is an all around tough MFer and I dont think he has a magic achillies heel. He is all round tough IMO.

And the fight film we do have to go on I could see holes in the way he strikes and in his grappling that an A level fighter would horribly punish.

His wrestling is solid but bar one time from, Herring nobody has really defended and made him work for a takedown. How he reacts to the heat of battle when it gets down and dirty cannot be proven by something that happened in a pro wrestling match where at the end of the day the other guy is trying to make it look like he hurt you without actually hurting you. i.e - he's not gonna wade in on you when you daze yourself whereas if Brock gets dazed he'll have to handle a barrage of punches as well as trying to recover from the initial strike.

I agree he's clearly tough but I feel he has a massive achilles heel in his technical skillset. Don't forget it took Mir 90 seconds to beat him.

rovert

Deleted User wrote: »

His wrestling is solid but bar one time from, Herring nobody has really defended and made him work for a takedown. How he reacts to the heat of battle when it gets down and dirty cannot be proven by something that happened in a pro wrestling match where at the end of the day the other guy is trying to make it look like he hurt you without actually hurting you. i.e - he's not gonna wade in on you when you daze yourself whereas if Brock gets dazed he'll have to handle a barrage of punches as well as trying to recover from the initial strike.

Again Brock wont be doing any shooting star presses. Yes technically Brock has a lot to work on but his physical attributes are overwhelming.

Deleted User wrote: »

I agree he's clearly tough but I feel he has a massive achilles heel in his technical skillset. Don't forget it took Mir 90 seconds to beat him.

After the ref broke up Brock from clearly defeating Mir. Ive seen fairer Special Guest Refs in Wrestling.

rovert

rovert wrote: »

Again Brock wont be doing any shooting star presses. Yes technically Brock has a lot to work on but his physical attributes are overwhelming.

He's not the first physical specimen to step in the ring. He's quick, he's huge, he's an ox. I know that. Like I said earlier, he holds that as an advantage but Randy holds the rest.

rovert wrote: »

After the ref broke up Brock from clearly defeating Mir. Ive seen fairer Special Guest Refs in Wrestling.

I've seen this said before and it's so far beyond laughable. Just a quick reminder, striking the back of the head is illegal and fighters get called for it all the time, and no, Brock does not get special privilages even if it annoys a bunch of WWE fanboys who are making excuses for him.

rovert

Deleted User wrote: »

He's not the first physical specimen to step in the ring. He's quick, he's huge, he's an ox. I know that. Like I said earlier, he holds that as an advantage but Randy holds the rest.

Brock is also younger, a top class wrestler and has in fact a similar win/loss record to Randy.

Deleted User wrote: »

I've seen this said before and it's so far beyond laughable. Just a quick reminder, striking the back of the head is illegal and fighters get called for it all the time, and no, Brock does not get special privilages even if it annoys a bunch of WWE fanboys who are making excuses for him.

The referee in question apologised for the call and as a result he wont be referring the fight Saturday.

rovert

rovert wrote: »

Brock is also younger, a top class wrestler and has in fact a similar win/loss record to Randy.

Randy is a technically better striker. Randy is better at submissions. Randy didn't ever stop wrestling to do anything else. Randys been in the game a LOT longer. but yes Brock is younger and is also a top class wrestler.

rovert wrote: »

The referee in question apologised for the call and as a result he wont be referring the fight Saturday.

It was a good call. Take off the blinkers. He may have apologised due to pressure applied from Lesnars camp and the high profile nature of the fight in question but Herb supported him and most real MMA fans at the time defended the call.

Power is irrelevent, they were to the back of the head. End of story.


The point deduction was harsh but if you get subbed inside of 90 seconds you cannot use a point deduction as an excuse.

Bubs101

Deleted User wrote: »

Can't watch that in work rovert but if thats the vid of him feckin up a rasslin move all Ill say is its easier to recover in a situation like that than it is in a heat of the battle fight situation where you can't take a breather becuase the other guy is trying to take your head off. MUCH easier.

I'm assuming that's a video of the Mania match where he tries the moonsault and falls vertically head first but if it is, I'm pretty sure that I heard either Kurt or Brock say that for a few minutes after that Kurt had to call the whole thing in the ring and use kid gloves because Lesnar was dazed. Having said that, don't think Couture could get as much momentum behind his punch as the weight of Lesner's body

rovert

There is some interesting notes Dave Meltzer put up after seeing Brock at the weigh in

It was a very different Brock Lesnar the past two days in Las Vegas.

You couldn't help but notice the worried look in his eyes at the weigh-in today, and the nervousness at yesterday's press conference.

Lesnar tipped the scales at 265 pounds, the upper limit of the heavyweight division, as expected, for the weigh-in this afternoon at the MGM Grand Garden Arena. UFC heavyweight champion Randy Couture came in a 220 pounds without any weight or water cutting, ironically the same weight Anderson Silva was a few days before his match with James Irvin before cutting water to make 205.

While much smaller and 14 years older, Couture, a slight underdog as far as the gambling lines are concerned, looked noticeably more muscular of the two, something of a surprise, as well as seeming more confident.

But Lesnar did not look physically like the muscular gigantic near freak as he did in his previous two UFC appearances, let alone the monster from his tenure in WWE. Whether that's an injury in training that was kept quiet, or a training camp where he did less lifting weights and concentrated more on buliding stamina, which may be a major key in how the fight turns out, is unknown. But he was not as lean, nor as thick as usual. Lesnar was hovering all week between 265 and 270, so he did not cut much if any water weight and won't be going into the cage much over 265.

This was not the fire-breathing caged lion that went into two NCAA tournaments and three prior MMA fights. Whether it's a new level of pressure, or just an attempt to keep calm, is unknown. But it was a stark contrast to the always smiling Couture, raving about his training camp and conditioning without seeming like any of it is bluster. It's the highest profile event Couture has ever been in as well, but in other ways it's similar to the more than a dozen championship matches he's had over hte past 11 years.

Someone on the message board called bull**** on this report posting two pictures one from the weigh in and another from the weigh from the previous fight where to the poster Brock looked in the extact same shape:

You're comparing flexing pictures with gut sucked in.
Relaxed,Brock's waist is larger, bloated a little, even though his weight is down (265 without any cutting vs. 265 while cutting 15 pounds). He looked significantly softer. Shoulders smaller. Arms smaller, but less cut. Calves noticeably smaller which means he probably hasn't been sprinting as much. Couldn't tell about the thighs. Maybe less weight work, but increased cardio work would have lowered the body weight, but if that's the case, body fat would be down and he'd have maintained muscularity just with less muscle pump. Even if muscles are a little down from not doing as much lifting, bodyfat is up. He may still win because anything can happen and he is the stronger guy and with his size, should be the better wrestler, but physically he went from looking like a freak of nature to a Steve Mocco style big college heavyweight.
.

Dave has been a bodybuilder for decades so he knows about this kind of stuff.

Fozzy

rovert wrote: »

There is some interesting notes Dave Meltzer put up after seeing Brock at the weigh in

He's just annoyed at Brock for calling his question stupid at the conference call :pac:

He didn't look quite as big as before, but he's cutting less weight this time

mirwillbeback

rovert wrote: »

After the ref broke up Brock from clearly defeating Mir. Ive seen fairer Special Guest Refs in Wrestling.

Lesnar struck Mir to back of the head, check the UFC rules when you have a second.
:rolleyes: