This is a stupid thread

Karmafaerie · 03-09-2008 2:39pm

Football = Contact sport!

Fall_Guy · 03-09-2008 2:39pm

podge018 wrote: »

Nowhere does he say Song walked out of training unable to continue either. You lads are just making stuff up!

Sorry podge, agreed, having read again, I realise that it says he limped off, doesn't say he didn't finish training. He does appear to be happy that a team-mate was no longer at 100% though

ffs, some real blouses on here, football is a mans game, nothing wrong with a player hitting someone hard

(which i would class as doing someone)

If you classify hitting someone hard as "doing" someone then are you saying that anyone who goes into a 50-50 with any conviction is intending to "do" someone? Look, clattering someone in a 50-50 is not "doing" them, attempting to take someone out of the game is doing them.

Dave! · 03-09-2008 2:41pm

Ahhhh..... Liverpool's pride and joy acted like a common thug, just like Roy Keane

I hope it didn't hurt him falling off that pedestal!

I'd better bookmark that article in case some Pool fan decides to call Keane a scumbag.........

Funny

Handsome Bob · 03-09-2008 2:43pm

It's strange that it never came out. I mean if it was that serious surely we would have heard about it. The club can't stop it from becoming public, just like what Barton did to Dabo became public knowledge, City couldn't stop it. Fair play to Song anyway, doesn't seem like he made a big song and dance out of it.

JimiTime · 03-09-2008 2:44pm

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Football = Contact sport!

This thread has opened my eyes! Yes, its a contact sport. So is rugby. In rugby I can plough into a guy running at top speed, its part of the game. If he gets injured, its an unfortunate incident, but a byproduct of the game. However, if I intend to go injure the player, thats a huge difference!

Take the eduardo case. Horrible challenge. Very negligent, and a terrible outcome. If Taylor comes out and says, 'he was slaggin me ma, so i decided to do him at the first opportunity', he'd be a thug! Not because of Eduardo's injury, but because of what his intentions were.

monkey9 · 03-09-2008 2:45pm

LZ5by5 wrote: »

It's strange that it never came out. I mean if it was that serious surely we would have heard about it. The club can't stop it from becoming public, just like what Barton did to Dabo became public knowledge, City couldn't stop it. Fair play to Song anyway, doesn't seem like he made a big song and dance out of it.

Simply cos it was a non-issue. Carragher went in for a 50/50 hard and Song felt it. Great tackle. Life went on, book came out, book is discussed, this thread pointlessly appears!

missingtime · 03-09-2008 2:46pm

LZ5by5 wrote: »

Fair play to Song anyway, doesn't seem like he made a big song and dance out of it.

he he he he

Fall_Guy · 03-09-2008 2:47pm

LZ5by5 wrote: »

It's strange that it never came out. I mean if it was that serious surely we would have heard about it. The club can't stop it from becoming public, just like what Barton did to Dabo became public knowledge, City couldn't stop it. Fair play to Song anyway, doesn't seem like he made a big song and dance out of it.

What would song say? "I have reason to believe that jamie meant to injure me?" A bit harder for joey barton to say "i didn't mean to land a five-punch combination to the head of dabo as he staggered away from me" than for jamie to say "what are you talking about, i was looking at the ball?"

JimiTime · 03-09-2008 2:49pm

Actually, to remove the Liverpool - Man U rivalry. Forget about comparrisons to keane. Would you defend the actions of Carra on this occasion. I.E. Setting out to intentionally hurt a player.

Mr Alan · 03-09-2008 2:51pm

Fall_Guy wrote: »

True, but I'm referring more to the intent to hurt someone rather then the method used to hurt the person. There have been tackles that have been more dangerous than roy keanes that have had far less intent.

Ok, Nasri intentionally kicked Barton at the weekend, he is the same? seen as he obviously had the intent by doing it in an off the ball incident?

Dave! wrote: »

Ahhhh..... Liverpool's pride and joy acted like a common thug, just like Roy Keane I hope it didn't hurt him falling off that pedestal!

I'd better bookmark that article in case some Pool fan decides to call Keane a scumbag.........

Funny

And here we have an example of why this thread was set up.

in response Dave, the two incidents are very different, unless Carra went over the top and broke his leg making no effort to go for the ball. which i can presume he didnt as Song was grand after it.

Handsome Bob · 03-09-2008 2:52pm

missingtime wrote: »

he he he he

Oh grow up.:p:D

What would song say? "I have reason to believe that jamie meant to injure me?" A bit harder for joey barton to say "i didn't mean to land a five-punch combination to the head of dabo as he staggered away from me" than for jamie to say "what are you talking about, i was looking at the ball?"

Maybe he could start by directly quoting Carragher, take that "you soft ****ing twat", I'm sure thee were plenty of witnesses.

Handsome Bob · 03-09-2008 2:53pm

JimiTime wrote: »

Actually, to remove the Liverpool - Man U rivalry. Forget about comparrisons to keane. Would you defend the actions of Carra on this occasion. I.E. Setting out to intentionally hurt a player.

No, never. It was a stupid thing to do by a young hothead. I'm not happy with this book, first he makes himself come off as slightly racist in yesterday's excerpt and now this today. Crazy.

_blank_ · 03-09-2008 2:54pm

Some questions for football fans.

Is it OK for a player to "do" a team-mate in training?

Is it OK for a player to write about it in a book?

JimiTime · 03-09-2008 2:56pm

Mr Alan wrote: »

Ok, Nasri intentionally kicked Barton at the weekend, he is the same? seen as he obviously had the intent by doing it in an off the ball incident?

Again, do you condone the behaviour of Carra? Forgetting one upmanship with man U fans or whatever. Do you condone the incident, and then the bragging of it in his book?

Handsome Bob · 03-09-2008 2:56pm

Des wrote: »

Some questions for football fans.

Is it OK for a player to "do" a team-mate in training?

Is it OK for a player to write about it in a book?

My previous post gives you an answer.:)

Fall_Guy · 03-09-2008 2:57pm

Mr Alan wrote: »

Ok, Nasri intentionally kicked Barton at the weekend, he is the same? seen as he obviously had the intent by doing it in an off the ball incident?

Carragher readily admits to wanting to hurt Song and was happy that he limped off after training. Having just gone to youtube to look at the nasri tackle (was at electric picnic, missed footy this weekend) you can't honestly tell me that he intended to do anything other than annoy Barton?

DeadSkin · 03-09-2008 2:57pm

monkey9 wrote: »

Simply cos it was a non-issue. Carragher went in for a 50/50 hard and Song felt it. Great tackle. Life went on, book came out, book is discussed, this thread pointlessly appears!

Great tackle

have you seen it

From reading Carra's words, for me it loosely translates to, Carra didn't like the fact he was been spoken about and he gets angry. He takes the oppurtunity to disguise a 50-50 tackle to take him out intentionally.

Karmafaerie · 03-09-2008 2:58pm

Des wrote: »

Some questions for football fans.

Is it OK for a player to "do" a team-mate in training?

Is it OK for a player to write about it in a book?

Question for you.

Define concisely exactly what Jamie Carragher meant by "do" as, as has been aptly demonstrated here, everyone has a completely different oppinion of what the term means!

And as such, nobody can answer your question.

JimiTime · 03-09-2008 2:58pm

LZ5by5 wrote: »

No, never.

Well thats good to hear.

Pighead · 03-09-2008 2:59pm

Des wrote: »

Some questions for football fans.

Is it OK for a player to "do" a team-mate in training?

Is it OK for a player to write about it in a book?

Question for Des.

Do you now accept that redspider hasn't posted in this thread?

JimiTime · 03-09-2008 3:02pm

Karmafaerie wrote: »

Questiuon for you.

Define concisely exactly what Jamie Carragher meant by "do" as, as has been aptly demonstrated here, everyone has a completely different oppinion of what the term means!

There is 'no' doubt that 'do' meant hurt. Otherwise the context of the piece makes no sense.

Handsome Bob · 03-09-2008 3:04pm

JimiTime wrote: »

Well thats good to hear.

That's not to say I'm condemning Carragher, I don't know what happened and as I've said already, I'm sure if Song thought very ill of what Carra did he would have gone public, like Dabo did with Barton.

monkey9 · 03-09-2008 3:07pm

DeadSkin wrote: »

Great tackle have you seen it

From reading Carra's words, for me it loosely translates to, Carra didn't like the fact he was been spoken about and he gets angry. He takes the oppurtunity to disguise a 50-50 tackle to take him out intentionally.

Nope, didn't see it. Nobody on this thread did. But it doesn't stop them from talking like they did

missingtime · 03-09-2008 3:07pm

Des wrote: »

Some questions for football fans.

Is it OK for a player to "do" a team-mate in training?

Is it OK for a player to write about it in a book?

I'm probably biased..but what the hell.

Q1 Morally no.
(but if he's been talking **** about you then yes)
Q2 Yea if he wants

JimiTime · 03-09-2008 3:07pm

LZ5by5 wrote: »

That's not to say I'm condemning Carragher

You are condemning what he did here though yes?

ibh · 03-09-2008 3:08pm

JimiTime wrote: »

There is 'no' doubt that 'do' meant hurt. Otherwise the context of the piece makes no sense.

Yea but you can 'do' someone by giving them a dead leg. They'll limp off in pain but it won't threaten their career..

Handsome Bob · 03-09-2008 3:10pm

JimiTime wrote: »

You are condemning what he did here though yes?

I'm condemning that moment of madness yes. Why do I say moment of madness? Because he has no record of seriously injuring players so I'm willing to give him the benefit of the doubt that he's grown up since then. But then again, two day of excerpts from his book and two days are bewildering admissions, it's stupid.

JimiTime · 03-09-2008 3:11pm

I suppose its like the old saying.
'Rugby is a thugs game played by gents. Football is a gents game played by thugs.' Though I'm sure there's a few rugby players who've had 'scrum thumb' that'd disagree:)

Pity.

JimiTime · 03-09-2008 3:14pm

ibh wrote: »

Yea but you can 'do' someone by giving them a dead leg. They'll limp off in pain but it won't threaten their career..

and? Thats still a nasty thing to do to player intentionally!

Karmafaerie · 03-09-2008 3:14pm

JimiTime wrote: »

This thread has opened my eyes! Yes, its a contact sport. So is rugby. In rugby I can plough into a guy running at top speed, its part of the game. If he gets injured, its an unfortunate incident, but a byproduct of the game. However, if I intend to go injure the player, thats a huge difference!

So by your reckoning there is no degree of difference.

Robbing an apple is the same as robbing a bank.
Slapping is the same as murder.
Going in hard on a tackle is the same as deliberately kicking a guy.
Getting mad and lashing out is the same as spending months planning something!

(Exageration for emphasis obviously.;))

Be resonable!

JimiTime wrote: »

Take the eduardo case. Horrible challenge. Very negligent, and a terrible outcome. If Taylor comes out and says, 'he was slaggin me ma, so i decided to do him at the first opportunity', he'd be a thug! Not because of Eduardo's injury, but because of what his intentions were.

Yes, we can take the Eduardo tackle, as we've all seen it.
Repeatedly.
Form lots of angles.
In slow motion.
In still frame!

None of us have seen the Carra tackle, so this is a ridiculous, pointless, and alltogether typical argument!

Mr Alan · 03-09-2008 3:15pm

JimiTime wrote: »

Again, do you condone the behaviour of Carra? Forgetting one upmanship with man U fans or whatever. Do you condone the incident, and then the bragging of it in his book?

If carragher didnt do him with a seriously bad tackle, over the top, into his knee/chest/face/back....and just went in hard bang and hit him after/with the ball, then yes i do condone it and would do the same myself.

and i will condone it and hope that he performs the same routine on Berba/Rooney/Tevez/Ronaldo/Nasri/Van Persie/Adebayour/Drogba etc over the course of the season.

also, whoever said carras comments were racist?!
i wasnt aware saying you thought foreigners had it too easy to get into a country and work when members of the british public were still unemployed was racist? politically incorrect at a push-but i dont want politically correct from a working class footballer, i want it from politicians.

i have some politically incorrect views myself.

copacetic · 03-09-2008 3:15pm

question for everyone, if I said I was gonna 'do' yore ma and you saw her walking funny the next day, would you think I was a scumbag?

ffs all, grow up, they put this in the extracts and books because they wouldn't sell otherwise. who the hell outside of us pool fans would know Carra was bringing out a book except for this rubbish? thought for all the usual anti liverpool people on the thread, not worried that falling for the controversy might help Carra sell an extra book or 7?

quarryman · 03-09-2008 3:16pm

Mr Alan wrote: »

for me, you are talking **** cause you havent seen Carraghers tackle.

and neither have you but you still feel you have the authority to say:

Mr Alan wrote:

I'm sure the tackle was nothing like that other tackle, evidenced by the fact it was not a career ending one and happened in training.

Alan, you are the most biased, rose-tinted, one-sided poster I've ever seen on these forums. Any posts even loosely related to Liverpool are completely worthless due to your inability look at things objectively. Thank god for the 'ignore poster' option since it will generally aid to the health of a thread and allow even opinion.

Your logic that the tackle could not have been bad due to the outcome is so idiotic. Players have suffered compound fractures in the most innocuous clashes. The fact that Carragher intended to hurt Song is in-excusable as many (non-biased) Liverpool fans have admitted in this thread.

Honestly, do yourself a favour, stop, think about a situation and analyse it without bias (even though I don't think you capable of it) and THEN post. I'm sick of seeing your ill-informed bias ruining what are otherwise, interesting threads.

ibh · 03-09-2008 3:18pm

JimiTime wrote: »

and? Thats still a nasty thing to do to player intentionally!

Yea but it's not scrabble were playing here.

Getting stuck in can include 'doing' somebody. It's when this is taken too far that people get really hurt.

Load of nonsense the whole debate tbh.

monkey9 · 03-09-2008 3:20pm

Mr Alan wrote: »

If carragher didnt do him with a seriously bad tackle, over the top, into his knee/chest/face/back....and just went in hard bang and hit him after/with the ball, then yes i do condone it and would do the same myself.

and i will condone it and hope that he performs the same routine on Berba/Rooney/Tevez/Ronaldo/Nasri/Van Persie/Adebayour/Drogba etc over the course of the season.

also, whoever said carras comments were racist?!
i wasnt aware saying you thought foreigners had it too easy to get into a country and work when members of the british public were still unemployed was racist? politically incorrect at a push-but i dont want politically correct from a working class footballer, i want it from politicians.

i have some politically incorrect views myself.

Woah!! Let's not go down the Morrissey/NME road!

missingtime · 03-09-2008 3:20pm

copacetic wrote: »

question for everyone, if I said I was gonna 'do' yore ma and you saw her walking funny the next day, would you think I was a scumbag?

I'd think you gave her a good time...and be very sad

podge018 · 03-09-2008 3:21pm

quarryman wrote: »

and neither have you but you still feel you have the authority to say:

Alan, you are the most biased, rose-tinted, one-sided poster I've ever seen on these forums. Any posts even loosely related to Liverpool are completely worthless due to your inability look at things objectively. Thank god for the 'ignore poster' option since it will generally aid to the health of a thread and allow even opinion.

Your logic that the tackle could not have been bad due to the outcome is so idiotic. Players have suffered compound fractures in the most innocuous clashes. The fact that Carragher intended to hurt Song is in-excusable as many (non-biased) Liverpool fans have admitted in this thread.

Honestly, do yourself a favour, stop, think about a situation and analyse it without bias (even though I don't think you capable of it) and THEN post. I'm sick of seeing your ill-informed bias ruining what are otherwise, interesting threads.

where does he say he set out to hurt him?

DeadSkin · 03-09-2008 3:22pm

missingtime wrote: »

I'd think you gave her a good time...and be very sad

ROFL, oh you are sick my friend, but funny!!!

DeadSkin · 03-09-2008 3:25pm

monkey9 wrote: »

Nope, didn't see it. Nobody on this thread did. But it doesn't stop them from talking like they did

How can you comment and say it was a great tackle?

Mr Alan · 03-09-2008 3:27pm

cause it was carra! all his tackles are great

monkey9 · 03-09-2008 3:28pm

DeadSkin wrote: »

How can you comment and say it was a great tackle?

The same way others can call him a scumbag and a thug! He went in for a 50/50, obviously went in hard and Song felt it. It was probably a great tackle, maybe it was a free, nobody knows.

Karmafaerie · 03-09-2008 3:28pm

JimiTime wrote: »

There is 'no' doubt that 'do' meant hurt. Otherwise the context of the piece makes no sense.

There is obviously loads of doubt, as demonstrated by all the people doubting it!!!!!!

Do could mean show up!
It could mean prove he was good enough to be an international fullback, as he said in the exerpt.

quarryman · 03-09-2008 3:31pm

podge018 wrote: »

where does he say he set out to hurt him?

The first chance I got, I did him.

he did HIM, not the ball, HIM. Are you trying to tell me it was a tackle designed to make him feel better somehow rather than hurt him?

pull the other one.

monkey9 · 03-09-2008 3:34pm

Anyway, this has gone off topic for the past ten or so pages. Back on topic.

So are people gonna buy this book and do you think it will sell well??

herbieflowers · 03-09-2008 3:36pm

maybe this whole thing never happened, and Carra ezaggerated something to sensationalise his book, and sell it.

Handsome Bob · 03-09-2008 3:37pm

monkey9 wrote: »

Anyway, this has gone off topic for the past ten or so pages. Back on topic.

So are people gonna buy this book and do you think it will sell well??

Yes I will buy it, but I am slightly nervous due to comments such as foreigners taking our jobs and take that you soft ****ing twat.:pac:

Karmafaerie · 03-09-2008 3:37pm

quarryman wrote: »

he did HIM, not the ball, HIM. Are you trying to tell me it was a tackle designed to make him feel better somehow rather than hurt him?

pull the other one.

When I manage to put the ball past a fullback and get a cross in, I call that doing the full back!

When I wash up after the dinner, I call that doing the dishes!

Didn't know it made me a scumbag thug!!!

JimiTime · 03-09-2008 3:37pm

Karmafaerie wrote: »

So by your reckoning there is no degree of difference.

Robbing an apple is the same as robbing a bank.

No. Both are wrong though. the story behind each event would need to be known in order to to empathise or crticise.

Slapping is the same as murder.

Going in hard on a tackle is the same as deliberately kicking a guy.

No, going into a tackle with the intention of hurting your opponent is the same as kicking a guy. Geez, its not rocket science!

Getting mad and lashing out is the same as spending months planning something!

Again, I've my opinion on this, but for the sake of not invoking team rivalries its best not to answer it. I'm neutral btw. I'm not a 'fan' of any club.

Be resonable!

I know no other way.

Yes, we can take the Eduardo tackle, as we've all seen it.
Repeatedly.
Form lots of angles.
In slow motion.
In still frame!

None of us have seen the Carra tackle, so this is a ridiculous, pointless, and alltogether typical argument!

No its not, its a point to show that intention is the key! We never seen the tackle, it matters not! Why? Because we don't need to. Carragher tells us he went out to hurt a fellow player, and was happy to see this player limp away due to it. Even if Carragher got the ball and it was a fair challenge, I'd still be very concerned with his attitude. He doesn't even look back with regret, though maybe and hopefully in the book he does at some point. Instead he wears it as a badge of honour. 'Look at me, I'm hard'. Reeks of insecurity, juvenile stupidity. He had his England call up. He had his Liverpool place. So let Song laugh all the way out of the club while he goes on to play a vital role in Liverpools history. His attitude was poor, and indefensible!

Xavi6 · 03-09-2008 3:38pm

Who the hell started this shite?

And how has it stayed open this long?

My eyes were bleeding after the first twenty posts. Talk about a bomb waiting to go off.

Anyone been banned yet? I can't be arsed reading all the way back.

herbieflowers · 03-09-2008 3:38pm

Karmafaerie wrote: »

When I manage to put the ball past a fullback and get a cross in, I call that doing the full back!

When I wash up after the dinner, I call that doing the dishes!

Didn't know it made me a scumbag thug!!!

Oh come off it.

He was pissed off cos Song (apparently) insulted him by looking "astonished" and was subtely "pointing" at Carra and laughing at him. Context is completely different.

This is a stupid thread

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