A Question for Non-LoI Fans

corban

i'm a newspaper cork city fan, i keep track via the net and the dailies....the reason for this is that the standard of football is very poor

i've been to turners cross on numerous occasions in the past and to different games in dublin, but eventually got fed up with having to pay to watch some awful football.

the epl has some teams that traditionally play a terrible style of football...bolton, wimbledon in the past, and maybe stoke atm, however these were in the minority..counteracted by the style and flair of arsenal, man u, pool, villa etc

in the el the majority of teams play an unattractive style of football....

in my opinion the only way crowds will return to the el is if all the clubs sit down together and decide to play attractive attacking football on the ground...

i know people will say that maybe we dont have the top quality players to do this, but i disagree, even the most average players can pass the ball and make runs, i think fans would even appreciate the effort...

i think if every team just togged out and went for it from the kickoff, playing a nice passing game, (no endless hoofs up the pitch) there would be more goals and a more exciting brand of football. then you would have a product to market..

if i thought there was a chance of being entertained/excited by the el each week, then i would give up my season ticket at old trafford....

OhNoYouDidn't

corban wrote: »

i'm a newspaper cork city fan, i keep track via the net and the dailies....the reason for this is that the standard of football is very poor

i've been to turners cross on numerous occasions in the past and to different games in dublin, but eventually got fed up with having to pay to watch some awful football.

the epl has some teams that traditionally play a terrible style of football...bolton, wimbledon in the past, and maybe stoke atm, however these were in the minority..counteracted by the style and flair of arsenal, man u, pool, villa etc

in the el the majority of teams play an unattractive style of football....

in my opinion the only way crowds will return to the el is if all the clubs sit down together and decide to play attractive attacking football on the ground...

i know people will say that maybe we dont have the top quality players to do this, but i disagree, even the most average players can pass the ball and make runs, i think fans would even appreciate the effort...

i think if every team just togged out and went for it from the kickoff, playing a nice passing game, (no endless hoofs up the pitch) there would be more goals and a more exciting brand of football. then you would have a product to market..

if i thought there was a chance of being entertained/excited by the el each week, then i would give up my season ticket at old trafford....

But Corban, the entire point of this thread is that the LoI is no longer like that. When was the last time you went to a game, or even watched one on tv? Or an hour a week watching MNS? The percentage of hoofball teams in the LoI is less than the EPL.

Of course the quality of player is different, but to say the likes of Pats, Cawk and much as I hate to say it, the D7 shower don't play on the ground attacking football is pure ignorance.

ntlbell

SectionF wrote: »

Why not?

If they hated been irish why would they be at the game?

surely they'd be all at wembley no?

corban

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

But Corban, the entire point of this thread is that the LoI is no longer like that. When was the last time you went to a game, or even watched one on tv? Or an hour a week watching MNS? The percentage of hoofball teams in the LoI is less than the EPL.

Of course the quality of player is different, but to say the likes of Pats, Cawk and much as I hate to say it, the D7 shower don't play on the ground attacking football is pure ignorance.

i've watched a few games on the box, and tune into mns when i can, but cant agree with u totally, of course there are teams who try but they are in the minority imo..... went to see the drogs at the begining of the seaon and nearly tore my hair out...

i like a flutter and the el is one of the easiest leagues to make a few bob off, a few bob on under 2/2.5 goals is usually a banker.... the japanese love a bet on the el because of this and the low scoring draws..

look i just think that the el can spend millions on marketing, but unless u have a good product u may as well just throw the money in the bin...

if they froze the leagues for one seaon, no promotion or relegation just hefty financial rewards for the clubs, and told teams to go out there and play nice carefree, attacking, freeflowing football to the best of their ability, it would be interesting to see what would happen....

unrealistic but could be interesting

Jazzy

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Nice edit. :rolleyes:

Why not have the patas bravas they serve in spain? best in the world and only slightly further away....

Its the logical conclusion to the 'quality' argument.

yeah it was. pity i had to tho... sure wasnt wat i was talking about edited and deleted anyway?

the difference of quality between the pl and la liga is so incredibly close that it doesnt matter. they are both as good as each other tbh. the difference of quality between the LoI and the PL is a Pacific sized gulf... so there ya go. a pacific sized gulf of quality. thats wat sorta stops ur 'conclusion' to the quality arguement.

bigger names, more advertising, more live matches on the box, more analysis, more fans, more money, grander scale, champions league...
i dunno tho, its sorta like each to their own in football. wat i do find funny tho is some of the LoI'rs on here who have this martyrdom syndrome where they act as if they are doing penance for all our sins. just as sad as the ppl on here who endlessly go on about pool vs. utd.

of course i cant wait to be called a shallow football fan for some inane reason. because i follow a big club of course. all the "real" football fans will know better then me. well lads, enjoy doing ur hail mary's for my sins.

therecklessone

What a lot of LOI fans are missing is that they are asking people to try something new in attending games (for the most part) and like anything new you need something to catch their attention. I'm sorry to say this, but the standard of football in the LOI is not that catch. You'll counter by saying that if that's the case then why don't PL fans all go and watch La Liga, to which I'll reply "because I've been following Spurs since 1984 and I've a bit more invested in it to just walk away now". You wouldn't walk away from the team you support because they play sh1t football, would you?

What might succeed in drawing in fans and retaining them is the whole matchday experience. It's been mentioned above, the few pints before/after/during a game, the banter, sitting/standing with people you know etc etc. So why aren't some of you actively encouraging posters on this forum to join you for a game or two, and exposing them to the bits that can't be replicated on TV? I know from four years as a ST holder at Spurs that it the friendships I've made over the years travelling to home and away (in my case away and away ) ties that have sustained me when I've felt like missing a game. I came off nights the morning of our home game vs Sunderland, flew to London at 11am, flew back after the game at 7:30 and was back in work again at 11pm. You think I did that to watch us lose 2-1? Fcuk no, I did it so I could see mates I haven't seen in three months.

I'll say this, it is very unlikely that a person would persist watching league football in this country without the other bits that come with the match experience, certainly not one who is late to the party. Watching football is a social experience, people need to interact with others in the stands or on the terraces to feel connected to what's happening on the pitch, otherwise it's just 22 men running around after a ball, isn't it?

I'm a Shels fans as well as Spurs, started going with a mate in our teens, and I haven't gone anywhere near as often as I should recently because I would be going on my own, and that ain't fun. I wouldn't even know where to go for a beer with other Shels fans before a game tbh.

The Rooster

Section F, the answers are generally obvious (although I think you've been overly simplistic), but its how to apply that to the LOI that will take a bit of imagination, and a root and branch overhaul IMO

SectionF wrote: »

Because of the media hype of the former, and the ignorant contempt in media for the latter.

It would work if Irish people were a little less brainwashed and showed more loyalty to their own clubs. That's what being a football supporter is about.

The blame culture as per a couple of your responses above plays a large part in keeping LOI in its current limbo IMO. The media do what the public want. And if the public are "brainwashed" by English soccer, what's been stopping Irish soccer trying to "brainwash" them? You need to put the horse before the cart.

You made a key point in "own club". Only a small minority of sports fans in Ireland have an "own club" in LOI. And that's not the people's fault that's the clubs' fault.

elshambo

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

I was having a conversation with a fan of a smaller LoI club, Cork, about why Irish people ignore their own professional league and follow teams from overseas. I'm not talking here about the irregular visitor to live domestic football or even the watcher of MNS.

I do not want to open up a 'my right to chose' debate again, lets assume you are right in your choice etc. For those who stoically ignore the LoI I have one simple question. Why?

Is it the product? The perception? Are you not that big a fan and don't need the hassle of cost, travel etc? Or is it simply because all your brothers were Liverpool fans?

Explain yersleves.

Answering AS a LOI fanboy

The Problem with the Irish sporting public who grew up watching GAA and going to England once a month to see their english team is that they have the "Big day out mentality" when it comes to going to sport, This has increased with Munster/Leinster rugby teams in europe.

The "great Irish sporting fan" has no want for the drugery of getting off his/her ar*e every week (sun/wind/rain/snow)to go see Cork/Sligo/Waterford that the English have for going to see Rochdale/Exeter/Crewe.

Seeing as your average sports fan in this country has this mentality what are the LOI doing to attract them and more importantly are they attractable, me thinks not!

How many of these "soccer" fans would go see manu or the pool every week if they could

ps i f**kin hate "soccer" and by extension the gaaa or at least i would if i knew what it was;)

OhNoYouDidn't

therecklessone wrote: »

What a lot of LOI fans are missing is that they are asking people to try something new in attending games (for the most part) and like anything new you need something to catch their attention. I'm sorry to say this, but the standard of football in the LOI is not that catch. You'll counter by saying that if that's the case then why don't PL fans all go and watch La Liga, to which I'll reply "because I've been following Spurs since 1984 and I've a bit more invested in it to just walk away now". You wouldn't walk away from the team you support because they play sh1t football, would you?.

Do you honestly not see the inconsistancy in your position?

noodler

Saying that LOI quality is proven because they knocked out a team consisting of a couple of Swedish internationals is pointless.

I mena come on, Liverpool won the CL and people persist in calling it a fluke (you can win the CL in 7 games-League in 38 etc). The fact is 95% of the season they are playing other LOI teams.

Its the Celtic argument all over again.

The Rooster

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

Do you honestly not see the inconsistancy in your position?

LOI won't attract people because of great standards.

A real supporter won't abandon his team because they play poorly.

Where's the inconsistency?

BTW, you seem to have totally missed the point of his post.

OhNoYouDidn't

The Rooster wrote: »

LOI won't attract people because of great standards.

A real supporter won't abandon his team because they play poorly.

Where's the inconsistency?

"iIm not going to go and see my local side I because I reckon they are poor, but my own foreign side are poor but I can't abandon them".

In your own time. :rolleyes:

noodler

Any football fan will tell you you can't abandon a club you support just cause their quality dips. Clearly we are saying the quality isn't there to attratc people in the first place.

OhNoYouDidn't

noodler wrote: »

Any football fan will tell you you can't abandon a club you support just cause their quality dips. Clearly we are saying the quality isn't there to attratc people in the first place.

It was, but it dipped....

The Rooster

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

"iIm not going to go and see my local side I because I reckon they are poor, but my own foreign side are poor but I can't abandon them".

In your own time. :rolleyes:

Thats not what he said FFS!

English comprehension is not your strongest subject

I'll relent and explain it to you.

He said:

You will not attract new fans to LOI by pretending the standard is great. Its not. They'll know your lying, or they'll know after one game. You attract them by getting them into the social aspect. Making an event of it. Then they'll go back. Might even make friends. They'll enjoy themselves. They'll come to have an affinity with the team and then it will be "their team". And even if they don't play great football, he'll stick with them.

Jazzy

the PL and LoI are both easily accessible in this country right. but one is of far poorer quality then the other. the PL also gets far more media attention and coverage. so therefore more ppl support the PL.

its pretty simple really. ppl are fickle and watnot yada yada yada but they shouldnt be looked down upon because they support a team from another country (albeit another country who share our language and whos culture mirrors ours far more then ppl would like to think).

the martyr LoI fans are just as annoying and foolish as the Rose Tinted Liverpool fans or the cocky and obnoxious Utd fans... though they wouldnt like to admit to that its easier to put urself on a pedestal simply because of an opinion you have. makes ya feel good

OhNoYouDidn't

The Rooster wrote: »

Thats not what he said FFS!

English comprehension is not your strongest subject

Try reading it again, slowly.

thats exactly what he said.

reckless bloke wrote:

you need something to catch their attention. I'm sorry to say this, but the standard of football in the LOI is not that catch..

he doesn't feel the standard is high enough but admits he will follow his foreign team if the standard they play falls as low, or in Leeds fans case, lower.

its a peculiar logic.

DSB

Jazzy wrote: »

the PL and LoI are both easily accessible in this country right.

I wouldn't have thought so. I know I couldn't afford to travel to England 38 times a year plus match tickets and not to mention cup or European games.

The Rooster

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

thats exactly what he said.



he doesn't feel the standard is high enough but admits he will follow his foreign team if the standard they play falls as low, or in Leeds fans case, lower.

its a peculiar logic.

Perfect logic actually. I'd edited my post above to explain while you were posting. Do you get it yet?

elshambo

I know the point of these threads is not to answer questions;)
I did however answer the question above:D if anyones interested

Its a small league in a small country and paying 4 grand a week to the likes of Joe Gamble when he would make less than half that across the pond thus putting your club in the toilet doesnt improve the league it makes a joke of it

League needs to fix itself before it worries about the "barstoolers"
IF you build it they will(might!) come!

ps LOI nuts calling people barstoolers as a term of abuse doesnt make them want to be your friend and come watch your friends play

monkey9

The Rooster wrote: »

Thats not what he said FFS!

English comprehension is not your strongest subject

I'll relent and explain it to you.

He said:

You will not attract new fans to LOI by pretending the standard is great. Its not. They'll know your lying, or they'll know after one game. You attract them by getting them into the social aspect. Making an event of it. Then they'll go back. Might even make friends. They'll enjoy themselves. They'll come to have an affinity with the team and then it will be "their team". And even if they don't play great football, he'll stick with them.

If you go to see a team week after week, whether they are sh!te or not will give you some sort of affinity with the team. It's just a matter of whether someone could be bothered or not to do that or just watch football on the tv.

DSB

elshambo wrote: »

I know the point of these threads is not to answer questions;)
I did however answer the question above:D if anyones interested

Its a small league in a small country and paying 4 grand a week to the likes of Joe Gamble when he would make less than half that across the pond thus putting your club in the toilet doesnt improve the league it makes a joke of it

League needs to fix itself before it worries about the "barstoolers"
IF you build it they will(might!) come!

ps LOI nuts calling people barstoolers as a term of abuse doesnt make them want to be your friend and come watch your friends play

Plenty of locals from Manchester or Liverpool treat the OOTs with utter contmept, funnily enough that doesn't have the same effect?

Jazzy

DSB wrote: »

I wouldn't have thought so. I know I couldn't afford to travel to England 38 times a year plus match tickets and not to mention cup or European games.

there is this amazing thing called television. its like that internet thing you have there dude.


are u really great too and praying for my sins of sky sports by sticking it out and going to see ur local team? i need redemption!!! the demon Andy Gray has poisoned my mind!! im stupid now and i dont know how to enjoy football... please save me Obi-Wan, your my only hope!

therecklessone

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

he doesn't feel the standard is high enough but admits he will follow his foreign team if the standard they play falls as low, or in Leeds fans case, lower.

its a peculiar logic.

You're missing my point by a huge margin tbh.

I'm hooked on supporting Spurs, I got hooked at the tender age of 6. Most people on this island who support PL sides over LOI or the IL do so because they became hooked in their formative years.

I've 25 years invested in supporting Spurs. You may not call it support, but I do. I've endured the slagging, given it back, cried when we've lost, cried when we've won. I won't walk away from that, regardless of what ever lows come along the way.

Imagine I'm not a Shels fan. I've nothing invested in LOI football. I go to a game, and watch a fairly sh1te 90mins of football. I know nobody in the ground, go to the game on my own, and travel home on my own.

Do you really have difficulty with the idea that in the latter case, I'm unlikely to return for more of the same?

The "catch" that will retain new fans to the domestic game is not the 90mins of football, it is everything that surrounds the 90mins. A little anecdote if I may...

My mate brought a mate of his to Spurs vs Wigan last season. Bloke was a GAA nut, football and hurling, he didn't consider himself a soccer fan but he'd watch a game if it was on the box. We took him into our regular boozer in Edmonton, introduced him to our mates, had a few beers. It was a pretty good day out all told. Went to the game, 45mins of turgid football, followed by a quick beer in the concourse at half time. Sang a few songs, introduced him to some more mates (including one fairly infamous chap who has a bit of a colourful history) then back into our seats for another 45mins of turgid football. Back to the boozer after the game for another few beers, and this bloke who had never been to a PL game in his life is leading the singing in a pub full of Spurs nuts. I asked him on the flight home how his day was, sh1t game but great day out was his reply. He's been back since.

Do you think he'd go back if all he got was the football?

I've ST holding mates both Irish and English who describe a match day as a great day out ruined by 90mins of football.

elshambo

DSB wrote: »

Plenty of locals from Manchester or Liverpool treat the OOTs with utter contmept, funnily enough that doesn't have the same effect?

I love the wool attitude in england, i always tell them that they are right and that outsiders should leave their club alone, wait for the smile and then list said out of towners:
Shankly,Paisley,Rush,Busby,Ferguson,Best etc
Smiles turn to something else then:D

AS for the abuse:
OBIVOUSLY:eek: The difference is that they want rid of something that wont go away whereas the loi wants to attract something that wont come

Shouting f**k off at a rat will not get rid of it, neither will it attract the hot blond at the end of the bar

MarkOShea

A typical footballing weekend would go something like this:

Friday: League of Ireland. If I'm down in Wexford and we're at home it's out to see The Youths. If I'm up in college I'll catch a game in Dublin. Love going to see the Youths as plenty of the players are around my age and I've played with or against nearly all the squad. It's only €5 in for students and €10 for adults. The atmosphere is usually alright. A bit subdued when we play the likes of Athlone and Monaghan maybe, but the Supporters Club always come up with a few good chants nonetheless. We average a gate of around 900, which is decent enough compared to others in the first division. As far as the football goes: what you see is what you get. Only a step up from junior level maybe, but I can guarantee you that our lads have as much pride in their jersey as the likes of Ronaldo, Berbatov, Torres etc. One point to note is that an adult season ticket costs just €150 ffs. How much would the average Irish football "supporter" spend on a trip across the water?

Saturday: If I'm not working I might catch a schoolboys game in the morning if my club are playing at home. Nearly always focus my attention across the water then. Either head down to the pub to catch a game or watch Soccer Saturday at home. Nothing wrong with that. Might be contributing to the clubs with my Sky package but gone are the days of (my father and I) heading across the water to fill the coffers of some PLC.

Sunday: Junior football! The season has just started but that will keep me occupied until next April or May. We got relegated from the Premier last year so big push for promotion now. Won our first game, a local derby, 1-0 without playing too well.

Don't manage to get the 3 days in all the time mind! The advent of summer soccer might see me relying soley on my LOI fix for a couple months seen as there's nothing else on. And then there's work/college etc.

The one thing I would say in defense of the "barstoolers" is that, for a n outsider looking in, the league is not run very well. Cork, Waterford, Sligo, Finn Harps, Galway, Cobh........all with money problems this year. And Drogs and Bohs are relying on money which may not actually he there. Paying players crazy money is not sustainable.

stovelid

therecklessone wrote: »

We took him into our regular boozer in Edmonton, introduced him to our mates, had a few beers. It was a pretty good day out all told. Went to the game, 45mins of turgid football, followed by a quick beer in the concourse at half time. Sang a few songs, introduced him to some more mates (including one fairly infamous chap who has a bit of a colourful history) then back into our seats for another 45mins of turgid football. Back to the boozer after the game for another few beers, and this bloke who had never been to a PL game in his life is leading the singing in a pub full of Spurs nuts. I asked him on the flight home how his day was, sh1t game but great day out was his reply. He's been back since.

What makes you think that this story (except the hoolie worship bit of course) is in any way different to your average LOI fan's Friday night?

Believe it or not, some of them also sing and go for a few beers before, during and after the game too.

DSB

Jazzy wrote: »

there is this amazing thing called television. its like that internet thing you have there dude.


are u really great too and praying for my sins of sky sports by sticking it out and going to see ur local team? i need redemption!!! the demon Andy Gray has poisoned my mind!! im stupid now and i dont know how to enjoy football... please save me Obi-Wan, your my only hope!

Do you really have this twisted notion that if you make something sound sarcastic enough it'll actually become believable? LOI football is hardly a chore.

therecklessone

stovelid wrote: »

What makes you think that this story (except the hoolie worship bit of course) is in any way different to your average LOI fan's Friday night?

Believe it or not, some of them also sing and go for a few beers before, during and after the game too.

Please read both of my posts in their entirety.

OhNoYouDidn't

therecklessone wrote: »

Imagine I'm not a Shels fan. I've nothing invested in LOI football. I go to a game, and watch a fairly sh1te 90mins of football. I know nobody in the ground, go to the game on my own, and travel home on my own.

I stopped reading at that point. You would be all alone at a game in Dublin, so instead travel to London on your own and make new friends there.

My head hurts reading some of this.

Dave!

For me personally it's not to do with the standard, as I don't watch it so don't know what the standard is.

But since I was a child, Man United has been the team that was bred into me, and English football has been ubiquitous in the house, on TV, in the papers, in conversation, etc., whilst Irish football... German football... Dutch football... have gotten little mention.

And so, I've been following English football since I was a child, picking up knowledge about it along the way.

I've invested years of 'support' into Man United, and have enjoyed it.

I have no knowledge of Irish football, so it's hard to just turn to it and expect to take to it like I do to English football, of which I have years of experience. I don't know any of the players, few of the teams, etc.

But furthermore, I have no desire to turn to it just because it's Irish... I'm content with following the EPL and sticking with the one team in that. I don't feel compelled to support an Irish team or watch Irish football.

I'm happy enough to support United, watch most matches in the pub with other supporters, and get over to Manchester as often as I can. I don't view football as serious business. It's entertainment. You pick a team for whatever reason (for me it was picked for me when I was a kid) and stick with it or don't. Just because you live closer to one team doesn't mean you should support them.

I make no apologies for it tbh, nor do I care if eL fans think less of me for it Get over it, it's just a sport

therecklessone

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

I stopped reading at that point. You would be all alone at a game in Dublin, so instead travel to London on your own and make new friends there.

Yet again ignoring the central point of my posts:

I have supported Spurs for 25 years, of course I would be more likely to persevere when I have invested that amount of time already. As a person with no attachment to a LOI club, I would be less likely persevere, and therefore less likely to be exposed to the other bits that make supporting a club worthwhile.

I don't think that is difficult to understand.

stovelid

therecklessone wrote: »

Please read both of my posts in their entirety.

I'm sorry, but the 'matchday experience' line just sounds like another excuse, albeit more complicated than the usual ones.

Are you saying that every PL fan that goes to England gets the day out you are describing. For most, it's flight-game-flight. Would you stop supporting Spurs if you didn't know any other fans over there?

Also, I've lost count of the friends (Manchester United fans, as am I) I've brought to games here. Obviously we have beers, chat with other fans, and head out after. Most have not come back either.

OhNoYouDidn't

therecklessone wrote: »

Yet again ignoring the central point of my posts:

I have supported Spurs for 25 years, of course I would be more likely to persevere when I have invested that amount of time already. As a person with no attachment to a LOI club, I would be less likely persevere, and therefore less likely to be exposed to the other bits that make supporting a club worthwhile.

I don't think that is difficult to understand.

But the reasons you are giving for not going to your local team are the reasons you are giving for going abroad. Its entirely inconsistant.

OhNoYouDidn't

Dave! wrote: »

I don't view football as serious business. It's entertainment. You pick a team for whatever reason

Get over it, it's just a sport

I think Irish football can live without you....

Jazzy

DSB wrote: »

LOI football is hardly a chore.

yes, i know that. but im ripping the piss outta the attitude of certain LoI fans here that they are somehow "better" then us "barstoollers".
as in i was saying how both the PL and LoI are easily accessible and then u come out saying how "its really hard to get to 38 games a year blabla" so ur referencing how we cant get to live games and stuff... but ya see ur trying to play this higher pompus hand about how ur so great that u get to go to every game and ur a "real" football fan because of it and im just a cheap imitation whos being suckered in by sky sports. get off ur high horse there matey. u damn well know that the PL is very very easily accessible here... u just wanted to make urself sound super duper by saying how u can actually go to games really easily and us lowly PL fans dont know how to follow football. well done, thats super great.
if only i could support a LoI team and become a high level football fan, then i can really stick it to the paupers

therecklessone

stovelid wrote: »

I'm sorry, but the 'matchday experience' line just sounds like another excuse, albeit more complicated than the usual ones.

I don't need to make excuses, I don't care whether people feel I need to justify my support for an English side. I'm offering a suggestion as to what will encourage people to attend the domestic game, and what might just retain their attention for long enough so that they develop an affinity for a club. I do not believe what I see on the domestic pitch is enough to do that, but I do believe if random punter gets immersed in the experience other than the 90mins then there is more chance they will want to stick around.

stovelid wrote: »

Are you saying that every PL fan that goes to England gets the day out you are describing. For most, it's flight-game-flight. Would you stop supporting Spurs if you didn't know any other fans over there?

Most of the Irish Spurs I know that travel anyway regularly would have a similar match day routine to my own. The one-trip-a-year fans are much less likely to do so.

I wouldn't stop supporting the club, but I would travel much less regularly, and would probably have ditched my season ticket at this stage (plus I wouldn't do away games)

stovelid wrote: »

Also, I've lost count of the friends (Manchester United fans, as am I) I've brought to games here. Obviously we have beers, chat with other fans, and head out after. Most have not come back either.

That's a pity, but I'm not offering guarantees here. Honest answer time, what do you think would be more likely to get your mate's to come back, them attending games with you and being exposed to all of the above, or going on their own simply to watch the game?

stovelid

Jazzy wrote: »

yes, i know that. but im ripping the piss outta the attitude of certain LoI fans here that they are somehow "better" then us "barstoollers".

The attitude is shared by your actual scousers and mancs (believe me, I know). Although they like to see you in the club shop, at best, they probably view you with the bemusement they save for fans in the "target Asian markets" and at worse, they probably despise you far more than LOI fans do.

You're better of with us as most of us support a PL team as well. :P

DSB

Jazzy wrote: »

yes, i know that. but im ripping the piss outta the attitude of certain LoI fans here that they are somehow "better" then us "barstoollers".
as in i was saying how both the PL and LoI are easily accessible and then u come out saying how "its really hard to get to 38 games a year blabla" so ur referencing how we cant get to live games and stuff... but ya see ur trying to play this higher pompus hand about how ur so great that u get to go to every game and ur a "real" football fan because of it and im just a cheap imitation whos being suckered in by sky sports. get off ur high horse there matey. u damn well know that the PL is very very easily accessible here... u just wanted to make urself sound super duper by saying how u can actually go to games really easily and us lowly PL fans dont know how to follow football. well done, thats super great.
if only i could support a LoI team and become a high level football fan, then i can really stick it to the paupers

Childish babble aside, I don't think there'd be a huge percentage of this forum that consider watching a team on the TV as equal to actually being there supporting the club. Talk about moral high grounds all you want, but thats just the way it is.

therecklessone

OhNoYouDidn't wrote: »

But the reasons you are giving for not going to your local team are the reasons you are giving for going abroad. Its entirely inconsistant.

Sweet Jebus...:(

If you have an affinity for a club you accept the highs and the lows, yes? That's part and parcel of being a football fan, you celebrate when you win, and mope around when you lose. The quality of football you see on the pitch rarely affects your support, it might p1ss you off to watch 11 cloggers, but you follow on regardless.

If you have no affinity to a club, but just turn up to watch them play for 90mins, if you stand there on an empty terrace and watch those same 11 cloggers, you don't get frustrated, you get bored.

I'm not saying that the quality of football isn't an issue, I'm saying that unless you feel something for a team you are not exactly going to stick around and watch sh1t football, are you?

We all endure to some extent, but that is what being a fan is all about. If I'm not a fan, then what is there to encourage me to endure?

stovelid

therecklessone wrote: »

I don't need to make excuses, I don't care whether people feel I need to justify my support for an English side.

Not knocking the support of a PL team. I do too, and it goes against what football is about to dump a team you grew up with and put your heart into. Nobody here seems to be denying that, just that some people seem to really hate their own league in tandem.

therecklessone wrote: »

Honest answer time, what do you think would be more likely to get your mate's to come back, them attending games with you and being exposed to all of the above, or going on their own simply to watch the game?

Obviously the latter, even though I don't think it's that hard to get chatting to people at LOI given the size of the crowds.

The problem is obviously deeper though.

Jazzy

DSB wrote: »

Childish babble aside, I don't think there'd be a huge percentage of this forum that consider watching a team on the TV as equal to actually being there supporting the club. Talk about moral high grounds all you want, but thats just the way it is.

going to a football match is more fun then watching it on telly? f**k me i never knew that.
doesnt stop u from trying to rub it in ppls faces tho does it? and thats exactly wat im ripping the piss outta, the attitude. it is very very lame

monkey9

To be honest, i think the general answer to this thread is that people have been following their teams since they were kids. I've been following Liverpool since i was seven simply because i got a red football kit for my birthday and when told that Liverpool wore red, they then became my team.
That's my reason, others have their own reasons for supporting clubs. But the main thing is that after a period of time supporting whatever team people do, that club will almost run through the supporter's veins. It's now within you and you're hooked and you see no reason to justify why you support that club. You just do! It's your club and always will be, good or bad!
But a while ago i also took the decision to start going to LOI games as well. Pat's had been my Irish team since a young age as my Dad supported them and took me to a few matches when they played at Harold's Cross for a while.
I'd keep an eye for their results and such, but for some reason never went to the games. Then, i just decided to go and now i'm hooked. A regular season ticket holder, i pretty much love St Patrick's Athletic more than Des's ma!!
So, i have absolutely no problem with people who just support English and Scottish teams, or wherever. Most of my mates are the same, they're Liverpool, Spurs, Celtic etc.
What i would say is, even if you do support British clubs, why not go to your local LOI club for a few matches. Not just once, go a few times in a row. You never know, you might get hooked and where's the harm in that.

DSB

Jazzy wrote: »

going to a football match is more fun then watching it on telly? f**k me i never knew that.
doesnt stop u from trying to rub it in ppls faces tho does it? and thats exactly wat im ripping the piss outta, the attitude. it is very very lame

Eh its not really rubbing anything in anyone's face? It isn't as though that person is sitting at home heartbroken at not going to live football and petrified at the idea of going to a stadium with real life football fans. Irish people are just lazy. The standard thing is nothing but an excuse. Ireland seems to be one of the only countries that make that excuse. People in Africa have a massive interest in the Premiership as do people worldwide, but clubs there still have thousands in their ground.

Bubs101

DSB wrote: »

. The standard thing is nothing but an excuse. Ireland seems to be one of the only countries that make that excuse. People in Africa have a massive interest in the Premiership as do people worldwide, but clubs there still have thousands in their ground.

Ireland is right beside Britain and a good quarter of it is part of Britain. Africa is miles away. For me this is the real reason. Top quality football is so close compared to the bog standard football that the LOI produce. It also doesn't help that I can see top quality, exciting rugby for the same price at a closer venue

DSB

Bubs101 wrote: »

Ireland is right beside Britain and a good quarter of it is part of Britain. Africa is miles away. For me this is the real reason. Top quality football is so close compared to the bog standard football that the LOI produce. It also doesn't help that I can see top quality, exciting rugby for the same price at a closer venue

If you prefer rugby to football thats fair enough. But eh I don't think that the geographical distance makes any difference when both groups watch through a television and both country's have their national sports media saturated with Premier League sports. It just comes down to the fact that Irish people are lazy.

bohsman

Believe it or not the standard here has shot up in the last 5-10 years, Ive been dragging friends along to a few bigger games recently, most have enjoyed it and will probably come back for big games, I just find it strange that most Irish are so quick to knock their own league when theyre so fiercly patriotic about most things along with the fact that most people around the world support their teams along with a team in the PL//La Liga etc.

Savman

Perhaps the OP might be kind enough to explain to us mere mortals and judases what exactly a "Non-LOI" fan is.

Non League Of Ireland? Wow, that must be really crap.

It would be really stoopid to label people who dont take an interest in a particular league as "non fans" whatever that is.

But if you insist I guess you could call me a Non-Bundesliga, Non-MLS and Non-Arabian Amateur League fan. :rolleyes:

bohsman

Savman wrote: »

Perhaps the OP might be kind enough to explain to us mere mortals and judases what exactly a "Non-LOI" fan is.

Non League Of Ireland? Wow, that must be really crap.

It would be really stoopid to label people who dont take an interest in a particular league as "non fans" whatever that is.

But if you insist I guess you could call me a Non-Bundesliga, Non-MLS and Non-Arabian Amateur League fan. :rolleyes:

If the thread was asking you why you dont support one of those leagues it would make sense to call the thread that.

OhNoYouDidn't

bohsman wrote: »

If the thread was asking you why you dont support one of those leagues it would make sense to call the thread that.

Any sort of semantic nonsense other than answering the question....