M20 - Cork to Limerick [preferred route chosen; in design - phase 3]

marno21

Cork Truck Driver wrote: »

Oliver Moran is off his head!

https://twitter.com/oliver_moran/status/963037615862767616

Has anyone told him about the M28 yet? Surely something else for him to get stuck in. He isn't really good at politics if he's objecting to everything that is going to develop the city and allow it to grow.

bear1 wrote: »

You have to hand it to Leo though (apart from him blocking it during the crisis) he is sticking so far to his promises when it comes to infrastructure.
This and the metro plus better links to the North West and we will finally start meeting EU standards.

I don't want to give him too much credit yet but it could be a case of that he wanted the M20 to go ahead and he realised the benefits back in 2011 but the party line was no motorway.

As soon as he became Taoiseach the M20 was back on the table straight away.

Reputable Rog wrote: »

I can't understand how countries in a much poorer financial situation than Ireland continuously invested in infrastructure during the downturn but we didn't.
Portugal, Spain etc continued to invest, Romania are building new metro lines in Bucharest, just getting on with it.
I was in the Algarve this summer after an absence of 13 years, I couldn't believe how much better their infrastructure is compared to ours,when I was there I thought we were slightly ahead.

In Ireland, the two main economic drivers of the state are the Greater Dublin Area and the South West. We continue to deprive these areas and invest in projects in other regions in an attempt to make them "prosperous".

There badly needs to be a serious investment in Dublin and Munster. The public transport in these areas is well below par and the roads in Cork, Kerry and Limerick are incredibly poor.

marno21

https://www.live95fm.ie/on-air/shows/limerick-today/limerick-today-podcasts/february-2018/limerick-today-cork-limerick-motorway-being-desc/

Discussion on the M20 from Live95FM this morning.

Kieran O'Donnell claims that they are optimistic on the M20 being open in full by 2026.

boardsuser1

marno21 wrote: »

https://www.live95fm.ie/on-air/shows/limerick-today/limerick-today-podcasts/february-2018/limerick-today-cork-limerick-motorway-being-desc/

Discussion on the M20 from Live95FM this morning.

Kieran O'Donnell claims that they are optimistic on the M20 being open in full by 2026.

How long would construction take?

3-5 years?

marno21

Cork Truck Driver wrote: »

How long would construction take?

3-5 years?

3-4 years depending on route and whether the NRR is included, and whether the contract is split/phased.

Limerick74

marno21 wrote: »

https://www.live95fm.ie/on-air/shows/limerick-today/limerick-today-podcasts/february-2018/limerick-today-cork-limerick-motorway-being-desc/

Discussion on the M20 from Live95FM this morning.

Kieran O'Donnell claims that they are optimistic on the M20 being open in full by 2026.

10 years (2028 opening) is a more realistic timeframe for the M20

marno21

The anti M20 pillock will be on the Last Word this evening on Today FM (also discussion on the Events Centre and the traffic issues in Dublin City)

markodaly

pigtown wrote: »

If you want to provide greater connectivity between the cities after they have adequately densified then why not invest in rail? It would allow people who live in the city and travel to work on the new public transport networks to travel city centre to city centre without adding to congestion or pollution.

Do you have any idea how much new rail costs? No.

Oh OK so.

The people who are against new roads and cite carbon emissions are clueless numpties. That issue is going to be solved not by trains but by the increasing proliferation of Electronic vehicles. By the time this road opens up to 35% of new cars will be electronic.

Sintend

What did ye think about his comments on the M20? I agree that sprawl along this route should be avoided by having proper planning procedures in place and I hope that this road is built by 2026 at the latest.

Copper_pipe

https://twitter.com/cooper_m/status/963097837411164160

marno21

Copper_pipe wrote: »

https://twitter.com/cooper_m/status/963097837411164160

The fella in the paper against the M20 was on Matt Cooper giving out about how there needs to be investment in the cities rather than between due to sprawl facilitation etc.

Matt then asked the DCU Professor where he lived and he said in the border region

Debate over

markodaly

marno21 wrote: »

The fella in the paper against the M20 was on Matt Cooper giving out about how there needs to be investment in the cities rather than between due to sprawl facilitation etc.

Matt then asked the DCU Professor where he lived and he said in the border region

Debate over

Did Matt tell him that there are plans to upgrade the M2 and A5? Was he against that? Was he against the M17/18 or is he just against this specific project.

Sintend

markodaly wrote: »

Did Matt tell him that there are plans to upgrade the M2 and A5? Was he against that? Was he against the M17/18 or is he just against this specific project.

He mentioned that he lived near a road which is due for an upgrade but he never mentioned which road and if he was for or against it.

prunudo

Copper_pipe wrote: »

https://twitter.com/cooper_m/status/963097837411164160

In fairness, the majority of the replys are in favour of the motorway.

trellheim

Any idea if this is going to be tolled or not . Likely two or three tolls say Patrickswell, Mallow, Blarney if they decided to

boardsuser1

trellheim wrote: »

Any idea if this is going to be tolled or not . Likely two or three tolls say Patrickswell, Mallow, Blarney if they decided to

I’d say 1 toll around Mallow, just a guess though.

marno21

Cork Truck Driver wrote: »

I’d say 1 toll around Mallow, just a guess though.

By right there should be no tolls. An untolled M17/M18, an untolled M9 and an untolled M11.

The Limerick tunnel is enough of a toll and it's not even self sustaining.

Reputable Rog

Deedsie wrote: »

Those countries citizens are not all obsessed with having a private car. They don't have the disposable income to waste on a private car.

Irish adults are considered odd if they dont have a car or choose to use public transport. Especially outside the cities

Actually both Spain and Portugal have higher rates of car ownership than Ireland. We're quiet a bit of a way down the table.

Cookiemunster

Reputable Rog wrote: »

Actually both Spain and Portugal have higher rates of car ownership than Ireland. We're quiet a bit of a way down the table.

It's the usual Irish thing saying that we're worst than everyone else. It's like people throwing the line about us being the heaviest drinkers in Europe, when that actual figures show we're nowhere near.

Cookiemunster

Deedsie wrote: »

Im talking more Romania as you mentioned and Eastern European countries really.

Poland, Slovenia, Slovakia, Estonia. Eastern European countries with a higher car ownership than Ireland.

mikeym

Cork Truck Driver wrote: »

Oliver Moran is off his head!

https://twitter.com/oliver_moran/status/963037615862767616

This is why people shouldn't vote for the Green Party.

boardsuser1

marno21 wrote: »

By right there should be no tolls. An untolled M17/M18, an untolled M9 and an untolled M11.

The Limerick tunnel is enough of a toll and it's not even self sustaining.

Realistically it shouldn't be tolled, but you know what they'll say, it's costing so much and we need a toll to recoup some of the money.

boardsuser1

mikeym wrote: »

This is why people shouldn't vote for the Green Party.

Oh, you're right there ted!

pigtown

markodaly wrote: »

Do you have any idea how much new rail costs? No.

Oh OK so.

The people who are against new roads and cite carbon emissions are clueless numpties. That issue is going to be solved not by trains but by the increasing proliferation of Electronic vehicles. By the time this road opens up to 35% of new cars will be electronic.

Ok Mark, no need to get personal.

Seeing as you're so knowledgeable about rail costs could you give me your estimate on how much a Cork - Limerick rail line will cost? And of course you'll also need to include maintenance costs and the economic boost that will come from such a service. This would need to include the time saved by avoiding the traffic congestion on the ring roads, and the extra work that can be done while traveling.
I presume this won't be difficult given your expertise.

Deedsie

Deedsie wrote: »

Those countries citizens are not all obsessed with having a private car. They don't have the disposable income to waste on a private car.

Irish adults are considered odd if they dont have a car or choose to use public transport. Especially outside the cities

They didn't continue to pay the same social payments or high level of wages in the public sector either. Thats where our taxes go.

We could have the best infrastructure in the world if our levels of pay and welfare matched Romania & Portugal.

bear1

[Deleted User] wrote: »

They didn't continue to pay the same social payments or high level of wages in the public sector either. Thats where our taxes go.

We could have the best infrastructure in the world if our levels of pay and welfare matched Romania & Portugal.

You can't be serious?

markodaly

pigtown wrote: »

Ok Mark, no need to get personal.

Seeing as you're so knowledgeable about rail costs could you give me your estimate on how much a Cork - Limerick rail line will cost? And of course you'll also need to include maintenance costs and the economic boost that will come from such a service. This would need to include the time saved by avoiding the traffic congestion on the ring roads, and the extra work that can be done while traveling.
I presume this won't be difficult given your expertise.

How much would it cost? Have no idea but I do know it will be more expensive than the M20. HS2 in the UK is projected to cost 56 Billion pounds sterling.

Building rail is hugely expensive and only viable in dense countries.

If you are advocating rail of the M20 then you need to come out with some costs here. Your the one advocating it, not me.

jacksie66

This post has been deleted.

Reputable Rog

[Deleted User] wrote: »

They didn't continue to pay the same social payments or high level of wages in the public sector either. Thats where our taxes go.

We could have the best infrastructure in the world if our levels of pay and welfare matched Romania & Portugal.

Wow, lets slash everything so in return for better infrastructure.

pigtown

markodaly wrote: »

How much would it cost? Have no idea but I do know it will be more expensive than the M20. HS2 in the UK is projected to cost 56 Billion pounds sterling.

Building rail is hugely expensive and only viable in dense countries.

If you are advocating rail of the M20 then you need to come out with some costs here. Your the one advocating it, not me.

I've no idea how much it would cost, but the only reason we know of an approximate construction cost of the M20 is because of studies that were done. Why hasn't there been one done on rail?

HS2 equivalent isn't the only option. Why not upgrade the existing rail lines, which is a long term aim of Irish Rail, and allow a direct service via Limerick Junction?

I feel I'm talking a lot about rail when it's really not the point. If we want our cities to grow and thrive then it cannot be easier and more attractive to live outside of it and work in the city. We must ensure that the cities themselves are places where people want to live and work in. This will require investment on internal infrastructure alongside making the most dangerous parts of the N20 to make it safer.

jacksie66

This post has been deleted.