M20 - Cork to Limerick [preferred route chosen; in design - phase 3]

Isambard

doubtful, it doesn't go through anywhere! Turn at the compound , under the long railway tunnel, turn right, cross over the road to Blarney (that goes over a bridge over the N20) , continue past the pitch and putt, turn right at the T junc, turn right in Kileen back on to the N20

edit checked map, yes that's the road I'd say

Copper_pipe

https://www.rte.ie/news/munster/2018/0809/984120-cork-n20/

Kevwoody

Kevwoody wrote: »

Would it be an option to close the junction and force traffic to use the grade seperated junction at Blarney?
From what i remember, theres only a few houses when you turn off the N20, then a T junction with the old Mallow road.

I posted the above over 4 months ago, glad to see its being considered now.

AugustusMinimus

IMO, it’s not a dangerous junction. People must be blind to turn across oncoming traffic.

Kevwoody

AugustusMinimus wrote:

IMO, it’s not a dangerous junction. People must be blind to turn across oncoming traffic.

It always seems to be tourists heading to Blarney. It's actually the most dangerous junction on the N20 going by the amount of collisions there.
Its not just traffic going into the junction, its the assholes coming out of it without stopping and using the hard shoulder as a slip road. Its my pet hate and the N20 is notorious for it.

marno21

Traffic on the N20 south of Rathduff is sufficiently high that there should be no right turn junctions on it. It's little wonder there are accidents due to the mainline speed and the lack of gaps for turning traffic meaning people take more risks

Isambard

it needs sorting even if it isn't closed, I came very close to an accident there when someone came out on the main drag right in front of me, it's very substandard. It wouldn't be too much hardship to send all traffic via the modern junction just up the road.

Cork Trucker

The 2 junctions that need closing along the road are the Waterloo one, which is currently closed anyway and it makes sense.

Also a junction near the infamous picnic park that take you to Grenagh (not the Rathduff junction, before that again coming from Cork) and Bweeng, there was a fatal accident there in recent times also as a memorial headstone is erected in the spot.

Cork Trucker

Isambard wrote: »

it needs sorting even if it isn't closed, I came very close to an accident there when someone came out on the main drag right in front of me, it's very substandard. It wouldn't be too much hardship to send all traffic via the modern junction just up the road.

The other problem that is happening is people coming up the hill from off the junction, don't look, don't stop and just pull straight out, madness.

Even blocking off the righthand turn wouldn't be enough as you'd still have accidents.

AugustusMinimus

Would it really be that difficult to install a merging lane for people to get up to speed coming out if Waterloo?

corinthion

Cork Trucker wrote: »

The 2 junctions that need closing along the road are the Waterloo one, which is currently closed anyway and it makes sense.

Also a junction near the infamous picnic park that take you to Grenagh (not the Rathduff junction, before that again coming from Cork) and Bweeng, there was a fatal accident there in recent times also as a memorial headstone is erected in the spot.

you are right but what you will find now is that if the Waterloo junction is closed traffic will now turn off at this junction and come along the locally known glen road in to Waterloo. and that is a terrible road. the ditches were only cut recently and it opened it up a bit but its still narrow and dangerous .
the council should do whats done in Raduff , put up proper lighting , signs proper speed controls . one of the things that annoyed me a lot is the speeding van which was about 1 mile up the road on the overtaking lane i thought these were supposed to be a accident black spots , this will help with slowing traffic down if its positioned around the waterloo junction

Cork Trucker

corinthion wrote: »

you are right but what you will find now is that if the Waterloo junction is closed traffic will now turn off at this junction and come along the locally known glen road in to Waterloo. and that is a terrible road. the ditches were only cut recently and it opened it up a bit but its still narrow and dangerous .
the council should do whats done in Raduff , put up proper lighting , signs proper speed controls . one of the things that annoyed me a lot is the speeding van which was about 1 mile up the road on the overtaking lane i thought these were supposed to be a accident black spots , this will help with slowing traffic down if its positioned around the waterloo junction

I've driven the road many times over the years so know it well, I just never knew the name of it until you mentioned it, it is a terribly bad road, the investment needed would be far exceed the Rathduff works from 2012.

It should be classed as a black spot, I haven't seen a blackspot sign in well over 10 years now, were they phased out?

Taking a right turn along that road is madness.

Should it be a case of say, after Rathduff, the next right turn shouldn't be until you meet the junction of the Commons bar to turn up right for Parklands/Onslow Gardens?

Isambard

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Would it really be that difficult to install a merging lane for people to get up to speed coming out if Waterloo?

they have not very long ago removed all the acceleration lanes, certainly in Cork. It isn't people turning left on to the N20 that are the problem. It seems to be people turning right who aren't used to traffic approaching fast on the left side of the road. I think the slight bend makes it worse, they are looking across the road (where they expect cars to be) instead of hard to the right where the cars are approaching. It seems clear so they pull out.

AugustusMinimus

The echo saying thT closing the junction will create a 60km round trip for residents.

What a credible paper the echo is. Do they multiply all figure by 10? Steering Group, I’m looking at you.

Isambard

amazing. That's 40 miles in old money.

Kevwoody

AugustusMinimus wrote:

The echo saying thT closing the junction will create a 60km round trip for residents.

Looks like its going to be opposed locally then so. Madness when you consider there's only a handful of houses on the road before it joins the old Mallow road.

marno21

The only issue to me seems to be the lack of N20 crossing points in that area. There is no easy solution to this until the M20 is built.

rounders

I'm a local in that area. I do agree that the echo inflated the 60km figure massively but also there will be still a detour.

The primary school in Whitechurch serves the Waterloo area and the school bus, coming from the school in the evening enters the N20 at the Whitechurch turn off (next junction on the mallow side) and turns down Waterloo. Without the junction it has to either go to blarney or go back to the picnic site junction.

I tried to google map the detour route to see how much extra it would cause but interestly enough Google maps has already marked the road closed till October. I'd estimate the detour would be about 10km detour round trip instead of 60km

I also should say I agree something needs to be done with the junction. I just wanted to spell out both sides of the debate

AugustusMinimus

Am I correct in saying that the Waterloo Road was the previous Blarney to Mallow Road.

The road also seems to continue past Rathduff and hugs the modern N20. Presume it was also the previous Cork / Blarney to Mallow Road after Rathduff.

Of course the old Cork to Rathduff Road emerges into the N20 just before Rathduff village.

rounders

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Am I correct in saying that the Waterloo Road was the previous Blarney to Mallow Road.

The road also seems to continue past Rathduff and hugs the modern N20.  Presume it was also the previous Cork / Blarney to Mallow Road after Rathduff.

Of course the old Cork to Rathduff Road emerges into the N20 just before Rathduff village.

I'd be from a different generation but I believe the main road from blarney to mallow would have been to go from blarney, up the station road and then link up with the "Old Mallow Road" which runs parallel to the N20 for the section between cork and Rathduff.
Ironically enough, when the N20 originally opened there was another road to Waterloo. The junction was directly opposite the Whitechurch junction that is currently there. Shortly after the road opened the they made a decision that they needed to close one of the roads. You can can guess which they closed

Isambard

there is no room at that junction to make it suitable for a Motorway junction anyway, come the M20 , so something has to be done. I can't see that many people would be affected if they used the Station Rd to and from Whitechurch. The detour via this road to and from Waterloo can't possibly be 10km surely.

Which way did they go before that junction was put in?(this section of the N20 was brand new a few years back and it's not obvious what the road layout used to be)

Some traffic calming and banning right turns out of the Waterloo Junction may be the solution.

Cork Trucker

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Steering Group, I’m looking at you.

Harrington will be the Chairperson of the M20 Steering Group next :rolleyes:

Cork Trucker

AugustusMinimus wrote: »

Am I correct in saying that the Waterloo Road was the previous Blarney to Mallow Road.

The road also seems to continue past Rathduff and hugs the modern N20. Presume it was also the previous Cork / Blarney to Mallow Road after Rathduff.

Of course the old Cork to Rathduff Road emerges into the N20 just before Rathduff village.

I'm from an 80's generation who grew up in the Fairhill/Parklands area.

From what I can remember, albeit a bit vague, the old road was the current Old Mallow Road which ends up just outside Rathduff on the Cork side.

It was around 1990 the New Mallow Road was opened.

Isambard

I see today that the Waterloo junction is still closed, and yet the sideroad almost opposite is open again. I wouldn't bet on it re-opening at all.

Kevwoody

Isambard wrote:

I see today that the Waterloo junction is still closed, and yet the sideroad almost opposite is open again. I wouldn't bet on it re-opening at all.

I heard a snippet of an interview this evening on the radio from a local councillor saying the new road markings make it obvious the junction wont reopen.
Is there no right turn filter lane or what?

grogi

Could someone post Google Maps link to this junction?

Reputable Rog

grogi wrote: »

Could someone post Google Maps link to this junction?

Here's a street view image. Edit-sorry won't load.

Isambard

I didn't think to look at the road markings, I'll be that way again in a day or so

Isambard

grogi wrote: »

Could someone post Google Maps link to this junction?

https://www.google.com/maps/@51.956157,-8.5741534,190a,35y,1.43h,45t/data=!3m1!1e3

you can't tell in the photo, but the S shaped access road is in fact a pretty steep hill

corinthion

marno21 wrote: »

The only issue to me seems to be the lack of N20 crossing points in that area. There is no easy solution to this until the M20 is built.

Hi Marno you seem the mostly likely to answer this question. i have been reading a few facebook comments on the closure of the junction.
one said that there was a plan for that junction when the M20 was supposed to be built a few years ago , Do you know if there was one and what it was ?