M20 - Cork to Limerick [preferred route chosen; in design - phase 3]

MrDerp

steeler j wrote: »

yes and it is a direct link to Dublin after Portlaoise ,some people only think the m20 is needed but it is only one part of a road network,it is the next most important part with the n4 and m28 ,what about all the people and towns off the m8 they would still be traveling to Portlaois and Cork on a terrible road

It is/was hardly a terrible road. The bottlenecks were the only problem. I moved up to Dublin in 2007, while still a learner and the road was fine for 100 everywhere. No bad bends anywhere, the only issue was delays through certain towns and a hilly 2+1 before Fermoy which could be challenging on a windy night.

Nothing near as bad as N20 is now

Isambard

I quite agree. My point was had the m7/8/9 been planned differently, then we could already have the M20 (and maybe even an M25)

steeler j

I'm not saying the n8 was worse than the n20 but I'll leave it to people who know better than me

marno21

Full tender award to Barry Transportation

https://irl.eu-supply.com/ctm/Supplier/PublicTenders/ViewNotice/215197

€12.34m

Mc Love

http://www.barrytransportation.ie/national-primary.html

marno21

Mc Love wrote: »

http://www.barrytransportation.ie/national-primary.html

Indeed. They are currently working on the N13/N14/N15 schemes in Donegal with RPS (it has taken 2 years and 3 months to get an emerging preferred route).

Mc Love

marno21 wrote: »

Indeed. They are currently working on the N13/N14/N15 schemes in Donegal with RPS (it has taken 2 years and 3 months to get an emerging preferred route).

Is that bad? I assume it is and if thats the case how long will they take for the N20

Bazzer007

https://www.limerickpost.ie/2019/05/08/priorities-set-after-m20-contract-award/

Carawaystick

MrDerp wrote: »

It is/was hardly a terrible road. The bottlenecks were the only problem. I moved up to Dublin in 2007, while still a learner and the road was fine for 100 everywhere. No bad bends anywhere, the only issue was delays through certain towns and a hilly 2+1 before Fermoy which could be challenging on a windy night.

Nothing near as bad as N20 is now

While not as bad as Buttevant, there were bad bends between the pink link and Watergrasshill, near Germinal in Tipp, and north of Abbeyleix

mydiscworld

How long should we expect them to take to get to Phase 1 (Concept and Feasibility) and Phase 2 (Options Selection)?

Red Silurian

Bazzer007 wrote: »

https://www.limerickpost.ie/2019/05/08/priorities-set-after-m20-contract-award/

Saw that the other day... You'd swear there was an election coming up

marno21

Traffic counters on the N20 today just below the M20 junction and also on the R515 at Charleville. Not definite but presumably traffic counts for the M20 project.

annfield1978

mydiscworld wrote: »

How long should we expect them to take to get to Phase 1 (Concept and Feasibility) and Phase 2 (Options Selection)?

Phase 1 was to be 12 months, with phase 2 circa 18 months

marno21

annfield1978 wrote: »

Phase 1 was to be 12 months, with phase 2 circa 18 months

So much for the Government saying Phases 1-4 would be complete by 2021. Wow.

Limerick74

https://www.live95fm.ie/news/green-party-want-m20-plans-scrapped/

prunudo

Lets hope nobody involved in decision making in the various infrastructural departments of this country listen to Eamon Ryan or else we won't see anything anywhere built in the next 20 years.

Cookiemunster

Limerick74 wrote: »

https://www.live95fm.ie/news/green-party-want-m20-plans-scrapped/

No real surprise there. They don't live in the real world where people and goods need to travel between both cities. They'll probably call for a high speed train line that would be vastly more expensive than a motorway and wouldn't solve the issue of goods transportation.

marno21

Limerick74 wrote: »

https://www.live95fm.ie/news/green-party-want-m20-plans-scrapped/

Hopefully they manage to put their foot in it enough times before the GE that they don’t return many TDs

AugustusMinimus

Cookiemunster wrote: »

No real surprise there. They don't live in the real world where people and goods need to travel between both cities. They'll probably call for a high speed train line that would be vastly more expensive than a motorway and wouldn't solve the issue of goods transportation.

They’re quickly becoming the anti everything party.

They’ll push rail which of course will only serve a small percentage of movements on this corridor involving full journeys between both cities.

Reality sadly is largely ignored by the greens. Reminds me of Dan Boyle’s suggestion of building a rail line to Ringaskiddy instead of a motorway. Just utter madness.

Pete_Cavan

I have said it several times before but they should CPO a wider strip between Charleville and Patrickswell to allow for a direct Cork - Limerick train in the future. It would cost very little now but would makethe project more palatable generally and cut the legs out from under all those will will jump on environmental issues to obstruct the project despite having little actual concern for the environment.

Work some positive PR by saying that the project is also designed to facilitate future sustainable transport but this does not negate the need for the road as much of the traffic using it cannot switch to rail anyway. The Climate Action Plan and other such policies will be used as a stick to beat the road project so they need ways around that.

riddlinrussell

Limerick74 wrote: »

https://www.live95fm.ie/news/green-party-want-m20-plans-scrapped/

As a green party member, this is utterly moronic, it will win the Greens no followers in the Southwest (not our stronghold anyway I know). Essential bit of road for safety, I fundamentally disagree with a policy that completely denies the necessity of building roads (sometimes).

I see Eamonn is vocally opposing the M20 while keeping fairly quiet about a widening project on the M11... its widenings and such that the greens should oppose in favour of public transport solutions, or where theres widening going on that they cannot stop, push for any extra lanes to be dedicated to PT spines.

CrabRevolution

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

I have said it several times before but they should CPO a wider strip between Charleville and Patrickswell to allow for a direct Cork - Limerick train in the future. It would cost very little now but would makethe project more palatable generally and cut the legs out from under all those will will jump on environmental issues to obstruct the project despite having little actual concern for the environment.

Work some positive PR by saying that the project is also designed to facilitate future sustainable transport but this does not negate the need for the road as much of the traffic using it cannot switch to rail anyway. The Climate Action Plan and other such policies will be used as a stick to beat the road project so they need ways around that.

I could be wrong but I'm not sure if they're allowed CPO based on such vague promises. That farmer in Leixlip won his case against a CPO as the courts ruled that the state can't CPO simply based on the notion that they planned on using it for something at some stage in the future. I'd say this would be similar.

Also 100% agree on the bolded part. A lot of the "build unneccesary uneconomical rail lines everywhere" advocates now think they have a trump card by crowbarring "won't somebody please think of the environment" into their arguments. These people never did care about the environment and still don't, but now that it's a major topic in society they feel they can twist it to suit their views.

I'd wager that these same politicians and advocates have a 90% overlap with supporters of turf cutting, one off homes etc. and the environment doesn't even get a mention from them then.

KELTICKNIGHTT

This is why everyone i know don't like green party and never will.
Does eamon Ryan live in real world. limerick/cork don't have what Dublin has.
Hope GREEN PARTY NEVER ARE IN GOVERNMENT AGAIN AS THEY RUIN IRELAND WITH THERE FAIRY POLICIES.
They talk rubbish most of the time and comments like this about a motorway that's very badly needed between limerick and cork is need for multiples of reasons, but some clown in the green party who lives in Dublin shows how much they don't have a clue.
Do they know how bloody expensive the train is. specially limerick to cork. get real !!!
Plus train will not suit everyone also. between eamon Ryan and Shane Ross, the ODD COUPLE !!!! What a pair.
When i hear clowns like eamon Ryan talk this rubbish says how much out of touch they really are with people in Munster. They haven't learn't from last time !!!
If green party ever come near my door a size 11 boot up the arse is what they get !!!!!

hans aus dtschl

riddlinrussell wrote: »

As a green party member, this is utterly moronic, it will win the Greens no followers in the Southwest (not our stronghold anyway I know). Essential bit of road for safety, I fundamentally disagree with a policy that completely denies the necessity of building roads (sometimes).

I see Eamonn is vocally opposing the M20 while keeping fairly quiet about a widening project on the M11... its widenings and such that the greens should oppose in favour of public transport solutions, or where theres widening going on that they cannot stop, push for any extra lanes to be dedicated to PT spines.

Absolutely, and this attitude is also common with some other greens in Cork.
Qu'ils mangent de la brioche, basically.

AugustusMinimus

riddlinrussell wrote: »

As a green party member, this is utterly moronic, it will win the Greens no followers in the Southwest (not our stronghold anyway I know). Essential bit of road for safety, I fundamentally disagree with a policy that completely denies the necessity of building roads (sometimes).

I see Eamonn is vocally opposing the M20 while keeping fairly quiet about a widening project on the M11... its widenings and such that the greens should oppose in favour of public transport solutions, or where theres widening going on that they cannot stop, push for any extra lanes to be dedicated to PT spines.

A much more sensible stand point. Widening roads endlessly is a fruitless exercise.

Pete_Cavan

CrabRevolution wrote: »

I could be wrong but I'm not sure if they're allowed CPO based on such vague promises. That farmer in Leixlip won his case against a CPO as the courts ruled that the state can't CPO simply based on the notion that they planned on using it for something at some stage in the future. I'd say this would be similar.

I doubt many farmers would oppose that CPO, they would already be losing a strip for the road, I don't think the few extra metres would matter when they see the payout they'd be getting. I know that is beside the point that you are making. I don't think it could be seen as similar to the Intel case as it is for a very specific purpose (linking up existing rail assets) and would be in line with every policy going (national, EU and wider international commitments).

riddlinrussell

hans aus dtschl wrote: »

Absolutely, and this attitude is also common with some other greens in Cork.
Qu'ils mangent de la brioche, basically.

I have some exposure to the Northern Green Party which is seen as considerably less 'Middle Class'. Some of the finest, sensible people I've met (Still have a policy of ceasing all road construction barring maintenance, but I digress)

The only way the greens can change is environmentally minded people who acknowledge that some roads will need to be built, and turning the party away from being seen as 'the electric car in my detached house driveway' party.

cgcsb

The green party have venemously opposed BusConnects and MetroLink and also high density residential development. Their policies are the most anti environmentalist of any party.

AugustusMinimus

cgcsb wrote: »

The green party have venemously opposed BusConnects and MetroLink and also high density residential development. Their policies are the most anti environmentalist of any party.

Let’s not forget their promotion of diesel cars.

Isambard

Pete_Cavan wrote: »

I have said it several times before but they should CPO a wider strip between Charleville and Patrickswell to allow for a direct Cork - Limerick train in the future. It would cost very little now but would makethe project more palatable generally and cut the legs out from under all those will will jump on environmental issues to obstruct the project despite having little actual concern for the environment.

Work some positive PR by saying that the project is also designed to facilitate future sustainable transport but this does not negate the need for the road as much of the traffic using it cannot switch to rail anyway. The Climate Action Plan and other such policies will be used as a stick to beat the road project so they need ways around that.

How would building a rail line( which would save mere minutes over using the current route with through trains) help the people of the N20 hinterland who want to make journeys other than end to end Cork to Limerick? It is and always has been a non starter. You cannot just look at an old rail map and say "wouldn't it be nice".