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Circus Protesters

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    #62
    cowzerp
    Registered Users Posts: 10,549 ✭✭✭✭cowzerp


    whitser wrote: »
    how do fossetts train their elephants? i dont know.

    exactly, you dont know.

    and the common known ways are by abuse, what is seen in the circus is years after when the job is already done, the animal is broke in so to speak..

    Rush Boxing club and Rush Martial Arts head coach.



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    #63
    whitser
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,038 ✭✭✭whitser


    Honey-ec wrote: »
    Whitser, I'm beginning to think you're being deliberately obtuse here. The reason that the pounds destroy so many dogs is not as a result of people keeping them as pets, it's because of irresponsible breeding and the innate reluctance of Irish people to spay and neuter.

    If people would just adopt a bit of cop on about breeding in general than the issue of dog over-population - both in Greyhound racing and in "civilian" life - could finally be addressed.
    not entirely sure what obtuse means but i'll try and answer.
    im not advocating letting the greyhound ind just do what it wants,but at the same time i dont feeling banning it because they put down dogs is ok either. but no matter how regulated the ind there'll always be some surplus of dogs that wont make it, and if they go to the pound its curtains. so why is it so cruel if the breeder does it himself. the problem is theres too many breeders breeding below standard dogs just like the pet and show breeders.


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    #64
    whitser
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,038 ✭✭✭whitser


    beth-lou wrote: »
    But an elephant can never be "well" looked after when it is essentially living in a 20 foot container with little or no exercise. The same is true of the big cats and most other animals kept to "perform" for your pleasure. It is cruel. No two ways about it. Regardless of Greyhound racing or any other comparisons you wish to make. The keeping of large animals in 20 foot containers, constantly on the move and in the glare of spotlights, and subjected to intensive training usually using force to control them buy dominance, is cruel.
    If you are ok with that, then by all means attend the circus.
    Personally I couldn't be party to that cruelty and I have explained as such to my daughter who is more than happy not to go to the circus for the very same reason.

    It's your choice. Go by all means if your wish. But please, don't try to justify their existence in their 20 foot containers as anything other than cruel.
    lizards shouldnt be kept in glass cases either, how many people here have exotic pets? and i keep saying there is a middle ground that can be found between making sure animals are well looked after and just "ban it".


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    #65
    beth-lou
    Registered Users Posts: 729 ✭✭✭beth-lou


    One of the saddest sights I ever seen was a hippo sitting on the grass in Ardee town centre. There was puss weeping out of it's eye, it was the most depressing creature I have seen. It has no will to move, and all that seperated it and freedom was a flimsy piece of string. The animal was miserable and to be honest looked drugged up to the eye balls. A very sad sight indeed that such a magnificent animal was destined to live such a miserable life.


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    #66
    beth-lou
    Registered Users Posts: 729 ✭✭✭beth-lou


    whitser wrote: »
    lizards shouldnt be kept in glass cases either, how many people here have exotic pets? and i keep saying there is a middle ground that can be found between making sure animals are well looked after and just "ban it".

    Lizards, snakes, spiders, hamsters.... anything that is caged really. Yes. There are different levels of intelligence and of size though to consider too. An elephant is infinitely more intelligent than a lizard, a dog or even a horse, and yet you are arguing that they may be well treated in a circus.
    If you can prove it to me, I may change my mind. I think it is impossible though when you factor in the enviornment in which they are kept and their overall quality of life.


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    #67
    whitser
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,038 ✭✭✭whitser


    right so,we ban the circus. what happens to the animals?


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    #68
    beth-lou
    Registered Users Posts: 729 ✭✭✭beth-lou


    Why ban the circus? There can be a circus without the large animals. Look at Cirque Du Soleil, that is one of the best circuses in the world and there are no animals.

    Simple, return the animals to the various sanctuaries that exist to rehabilitate them. There are many throughout Europe.


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    #69
    Honey-ec
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,844 ✭✭✭Honey-ec


    whitser wrote: »
    right so,we ban the circus. what happens to the animals?

    I think the intelligent approach would be to phase animals out of circuses rather than banning them outright.

    Unfortunately the intelligent approach & animal issues have never even been close to kissing cousins in Ireland...


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    #70
    Whispered
    Registered Users Posts: 14,772 ✭✭✭✭Whispered


    Well the ones who are fit to be rehabilitated could be sent to nature reserves. I can't remember the name of it, but there is at least one specifically for elephants who were captive, where they are slowly introduced into living as a herd. Set up by an english woman in africa. They started paying the poachers (who must make a living in fairness) to become wardens, paying them through donations and tourism. Fantastic idea. I'm sure there is similar for the cats etc.

    Also, I would prefer to see this generation of circus animals put into zoos (which is a better life IMO) if it will stamp out further generations of circus animals.


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    #71
    Glowing
    Registered Users Posts: 2,851 ✭✭✭Glowing


    whitser wrote: »
    right so,we ban the circus. what happens to the animals?

    Zoo's, refuges, sanctuary's ....


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    #72
    cowzerp
    Registered Users Posts: 10,549 ✭✭✭✭cowzerp


    whitser wrote: »
    right so,we ban the circus. what happens to the animals?

    they could go to sanctuary's..
    and more importantly more animals wont be taking from the wild...

    Rush Boxing club and Rush Martial Arts head coach.



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    #73
    whitser
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,038 ✭✭✭whitser


    Honey-ec wrote: »
    I think the intelligent approach would be to phase animals out of circuses rather than banning them outright.

    Unfortunately the intelligent approach & animal issues have never even been close to kissing cousins in Ireland...
    at least that makes sense. i actually had a think last night. and in the last 9 or so years i've been to the circus about 4 or 5 times, in all that time the only exotic animal i saw was 1 elephant and a snake. it was mostly horse and dogs that did the acts. are people ok with that? we use dogs and horses every day to do trick os some sort. my quess is there'll still be protesters giving out even if there's no exotic animals. because its the same people giving out at greyhound racing,horse racing,countrysports....


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    #74
    monty_python
    Registered Users Posts: 1,682 ✭✭✭monty_python


    it is a fact of life. the culling of male calfs on dairy farms is nessecery.
    death is required for life. wake up smell the coffee and stop living in a sugar coated world. god made us and many other animals carnivors.


    i feel it is ok in this day and age to keep any animal in captivity as long as they are well looked after. there is no room left in the wild for alot of species. polar bears are an example.

    p.s i keep a python in a glass "case" am i cruel?


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    #75
    stevoman
    Registered Users Posts: 3,041 ✭✭✭stevoman


    monty_python wrote: »

    p.s i keep a python in a glass "case" am i cruel?

    i wouldnt consider that cruel at all.

    ps - hope they dont ban the flying circus! :D


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    #76
    stevoman
    Registered Users Posts: 3,041 ✭✭✭stevoman


    cowzerp wrote: »
    they could go to sanctuary's..
    and more importantly more animals wont be taking from the wild...

    most circus animals are born in captivity.


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