Stephen Ireland Open Door or Slam it Shut! [mod warning post #645 / #713]

population

I think Dunne and Given have alot to answer for here. Dunne more so. Basically Ireland has hinted the reason he wont return is that he was bullied which nobody in any walk of life would be expected to put up with.

Now Dunne as club captain and senior Irish player, and Given as senior club and Irish player cant afford the lad support and or protection??? I find this crazy tbh. It is up to them to stamp out any messing within the players ranks that contributes to his continued absence.

I am gutted Ireland wont return, but if the rumours are to be believed and nothing concrete has been done to address this, and by concrete I dont mean (come back and play for us and lets forget all about it), I mean serious consequences for bullying behaviour, then unfortuneatly despite all his silliness with grannygate etc, Ireland will have the moral high ground in my opinion.

dogpile

population wrote: »

I think Dunne and Given have alot to answer for here. Dunne more so. Basically Ireland has hinted the reason he wont return is that he was bullied which nobody in any walk of life would be expected to put up with.

Now Dunne as club captain and senior Irish player, and Given as senior club and Irish player cant afford the lad support and or protection??? I find this crazy tbh. It is up to them to stamp out any messing within the players ranks that contributes to his continued absence.

I am gutted Ireland wont return, but if the rumours are to be believed and nothing concrete has been done to address this, and by concrete I dont mean (come back and play for us and lets forget all about it), I mean serious consequences for bullying behaviour, then unfortuneatly despite all his silliness with grannygate etc, Ireland will have the moral high ground in my opinion.

Did you watch the interview??

"Nothing to do with the players, manager or staff...things just didn't feel right and had been brewing for a while" in his own words (or words to that effect)

the guy is a tit and how anyone can try "understand" his point of view is beyond me....I could never watch him play and not think to myself what a c.....

Dublin_Gunner

Stephen Ireland.

Good player - check
Would benefit the irish squad - check
twat - check
GF is a twat - check
lack of balls - check


Seriously though bullied??? Give me a break. So he got a bit of a slaggin off the lads, what type of a pansy is he?

There is some other reason, that we just dont know as to why he doesn;t want to play for Ireland, and to be honest, if he doesn't want to, I dont want him to either.

A player should be bloody proud to pull on that green jersey, how many others would give there right arm for the chance to play for Ireland at Croker or Landsdowne?

I dont think he even deserves another chance, regardless of how good a player he is - he's not gonna make a new team out of us by himself.

After the weekend, I'd love to see Liam Lawrence get a good run, he played great, and scored a cracker, but thats for another discussion.

therecklessone

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Thank you.

dogpile

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

There is some other reason, that we just dont know as to why he doesn;t want to play for Ireland, .

Something or someone has turned his head, maybe it's his Cork background?? I can't for the life of me imagine someone from Dublin turning their back on the Irish team...remember reading some time back he was eligable to play for England or Italy at one point, perhaps his sense of "Irishness" is not all there or he feels he's above it and the players tho where he'd have got this idea playing for a nothing like Manchester City is anybodies guess :rolleyes:

Dublin_Gunner

dogpile wrote: »

Something or someone has turned his head, maybe it's his Cork background?? I can't for the life of me imagine someone from Dublin turning their back on the Irish team...remember reading some time back he was eligable to play for England or Italy at one point, perhaps his sense of "Irishness" is not all there or he feels he's above it and the players tho where he'd have got this idea playing for a nothing like Manchester City is anybodies guess :rolleyes:

In fairness, I dont think being from Cork he should be any less patriotic than someone from Dublin, or anywhere else for that matter.

Irwin, Keane etc

Maybe he jsut thinks he's should be playing for a better International side, and doesn't really care all that much about Ireland, which is what I think you were getting at.

Either way, IMO I wouldn't have him back, not with the attitude he has shown towards the Irish team.

dogpile

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Either way, IMO I wouldn't have him back, not with the attitude he has shown towards the Irish team.

I'll agree and say no more...

~Rebel~

dogpile wrote: »

Something or someone has turned his head, maybe it's his Cork background?? I can't for the life of me imagine someone from Dublin turning their back on the Irish team...remember reading some time back he was eligable to play for England or Italy at one point, perhaps his sense of "Irishness" is not all there or he feels he's above it and the players tho where he'd have got this idea playing for a nothing like Manchester City is anybodies guess :rolleyes:

are you serious? this is your reasoning? "its coz he's from cork"...

I have a feeling thats fairly low on the list of potential reasons.

population

dogpile wrote: »

Did you watch the interview??

"Nothing to do with the players, manager or staff...things just didn't feel right and had been brewing for a while" in his own words (or words to that effect)

the guy is a tit and how anyone can try "understand" his point of view is beyond me....I could never watch him play and not think to myself what a c.....

What footballers say in interviews and what they mean are often very different things.

population

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

Stephen Ireland.
Seriously though bullied??? Give me a break. So he got a bit of a slaggin off the lads, what type of a pansy is he?

Its really not for anyone else to judge how slagging affects certain people. Worked on sites for years and I personally was able to give and take the stick, however I would say that some people would find some of the "banter" a little choice shall we say.

For the record I dont agree with what Stephen Ireland is doing, but if as has been suggested his hairplugs were pulled etc then I can understand he might feel somewhat vulnerable coming back

Highsider

Look the guy does'nt want to play for his country. End of story. Why can't people just let it go. It bloody embarrassing at this stage.

Dublin_Gunner

population wrote: »

Its really not for anyone else to judge how slagging affects certain people. Worked on sites for years and I personally was able to give and take the stick, however I would say that some people would find some of the "banter" a little choice shall we say.

For the record I dont agree with what Stephen Ireland is doing, but if as has been suggested his hairplugs were pulled etc then I can understand he might feel somewhat vulnerable coming back

In fairness, if he's after coming up through playing underage football, then through the ranks at pro level, he should be well used to it by now and have tougher skin. Its obviously an excuse.

As the Highsider above said, he doesn't want to play and thats it.

And as I've said, if he doesn't want to play, then I certainly would not want him to play. There are MANY others that would give anything to play for their country, we don't need the likes of him on our national team.

Xavi6

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

we don't need the likes of him on our national team.

Spot on. Who needs genuine quality when you can have the Glenn Whelan's of the world instead?

Dublin_Gunner

Xavi6 wrote: »

Spot on. Who needs genuine quality when you can have the Glenn Whelan's of the world instead?

A quality player if forced to play might give a 50% performance?? I'd even take Glen Whelan at 100% over SI at 50%.

Sorry, but IMO the places on our national team really should be for players who actually WANT to play for Ireland.

Xavi6

Dublin_Gunner wrote: »

A quality player if forced to play might give a 50% performance?? I'd even take Glen Whelan at 100% over SI at 50%.

Sorry, but IMO the places on our national team really should be for players who actually WANT to play for Ireland.

You said we don't NEED him. We NEED every good player possible.

Not WANTING him is completely different.

ntlbell

Xavi6 wrote: »

You said we don't NEED him. We NEED every good player possible.

Not WANTING him is completely different.

We don't NEED someone with his attitude.

We NEED someone with his ability.

Dublin_Gunner

ntlbell wrote: »

We don't NEED someone with his attitude.

We NEED someone with his ability.

Thank you, I think you just stated what I for some reason couldn't find the vocabulary to say in about 5 posts lol

Xavi, I didn't mention us wanting or needing him in my last post, if you read it again, it states players that want to play for us.

So hard to get the meaning across in text!

So what I was saying was we dont NEED him [S Ireland], we do NEED players that WANT TO PLAY FOR IRELAND.

Ugh, the semantics of it all.........

But yes, a player of his calibre certainly wouldn't be turned away if they wanted to play on our national side.

Xavi6

ntlbell wrote: »

We don't NEED someone with his attitude.

We NEED someone with his ability.

Same thing as I said really.

event

some of the posts in this thread of the last few days have been nothing sort of embarrassing

bigstar

event wrote: »

some of the posts in this thread of the last few days have been nothing sort of embarrassing

+1. Especially the likes of this.

Brian Capture wrote: »

Stephen Ireland is a traitor.

Players that refuse to represent their country should be forced out of the game.

seriously hes a football player, get a grip.

Xavi6

From MCFC.co.uk -

Irish come calling again for Stevie

08/06/2009 09:35

Giovanni Trapattoni is trying to tempt City midfielder Stephen Ireland out of international exile in his bid to steer the Republic of Ireland to the World Cup finals in South Africa next summer.

The Republic manager revealed after his team's 1-1 draw with Bulgaria in Sofia that he has been in contact again with Ireland, named the Blues' Player of the Year by supporters after his outstanding season.

Trapattoni said: "We have to know if he wishes to come back or not. I saw two or three City games and I like him, and I will try all possible ways to get him to come back. I want to know what he is thinking and Mark Hughes is not sure. He said it is up to him, but we do not know."

Ireland, 22, has made six appearances for the senior side and scored four goals after being called up by Steve Staunton, but has not played for the Republic since September 2007.

His City skipper Richard Dunne was inspirational in earning the point against qualification rivals Bulgaria that set up a crunch match in October with world champions Italy, who head Group Eight by just a point.

Ireland, who has just signed a new five-year deal at the City of Manchester Stadium, is spending his summer repeating the rigorous personal training programme that underpinned his improved performances last winter.

Can't see him changing his mind tbh.

Leiva

If it means me drinking beer in the lovely South Africian Sun looking at Ireland play then i will hold open every door for him from here to Durban

jaykay74

Xavi6 wrote: »

From MCFC.co.uk -



Can't see him changing his mind tbh.

Neither can I. The lad isn't interested. Shame.

allthedoyles

From what I can see, the door is open, but Stephen needs to decide , whether to walk through it or not .

dogpile

Surely Given and Dunne can twist his arm......tho if rumour is true that's how it all started!!!



someone twisted his arm and pulled his hair :D

Guy:Incognito

Obviously all this traitor talk etc is rubbish but tbh the grovelling from the press is getting embarassing, worse still if Trappatoni is doing it. After he said he wasnt playing the first time, it should be dropped till he comes to the manager himself and says he wants ot play, maybe bar one conversation if theres a change of manager.

bullpost

I don't know but I think this could be a good time to try to get him to change his mind.
Its every footballers dream to experience playing in the world cup finals.

For players of small nations like ours that opportunity may only come along once in a career .

That opportunity after the weekends result is now so close you can smell it.

Its got to be tempting for him .

Trap should emphasise the professionalism thats now at the root of this team and the opportunity to take it to the next level with his inclusion.

Guy:Incognito

bullpost wrote: »

Its every footballers dream to experience playing in the world cup finals.
.

Obviously not.

Plus, someone else will have to miss out on that dream if he's allowed back in for the WC.

bullpost wrote: »

That opportunity after the weekends result is now so close you can smell it.
.

For the players involved that got the country in the position, yes. Theres no problem with a player normally in the squad but out injured coming in, but for Ireland to swan back in with Ireland on the verge of a playoff position at least , or worse still, after qualification, is not acceptable. If he comes back, it should be afetr the WC.

jaykay74

Stekelly wrote: »

Obviously not.

I'd agree with this 100%. He is interested in having a great club career and the irish thing is a distraction to that.

I'd never say close the door. I think its the right time to have a talk with him now as its probably now or never for this campaign in terms of him changing his mind but I just don't think he cares about international football.

patmac

Anyone else hear the story of a dressing room incident involving Ireland, something to do with his haircut, which is the main reason he won't play for the naitonal side?

Boggles

stovelid wrote: »

Absolutely.

By the sounds of it, a few of the players feel the same way. Disgusting to think that players of far more limited ability have suffered so much criticism and got Ireland to the verge of a play-off (or even more) and some poser might swan back in after all the hard work.

F*ck that. And f*ck being held to ransom by people saying "all that matters is....we need...etc". At least have some principles, even if that quality is sorely lacking in Irish football most of the time.

Stekelly wrote: »

For the players involved that got the country in the position, yes. Theres no problem with a player normally in the squad but out injured coming in, but for Ireland to swan back in with Ireland on the verge of a playoff position at least , or worse still, after qualification, is not acceptable. If he comes back, it should be afetr the WC.

This is one of the reasons why I think he shouldn't come back, the perception from some fans that when he does he will be "swanning".

Any interview I have seen him in the past 12 months has impressed me, he has come across as humble, intelligent and realistic, there wasn't a hint of fowl about him.

stovelid

Stekelly wrote: »

Theres no problem with a player normally in the squad but out injured coming in, but for Ireland to swan back in with Ireland on the verge of a playoff position at least , or worse still, after qualification, is not acceptable. If he comes back, it should be afetr the WC.

Absolutely.

By the sounds of it, a few of the players feel the same way. Disgusting to think that players of far more limited ability have suffered so much criticism and got Ireland to the verge of a play-off (or even more) and some poser might swan back in after all the hard work.

F*ck that. And f*ck being held to ransom by people saying "all that matters is....we need...etc". At least have some principles, even if that quality is sorely lacking in Irish football most of the time.

stovelid

Boggles wrote: »

This is one of the reasons why I think he shouldn't come back, the perception from some fans that when he does he will be "swanning".

Any interview I have seen him in the past 12 months has impressed me, he has come across as humble, intelligent and realistic, there wasn't a hint of fowl about him.

I've always maintained that it's his - or any players - business if they want to play for their country, but the timing is woeful here if he did come back. It just wouldn't be fair, and it would look motivated by vanity and self-interest. The team bond would surely suffer, as some of the recent player leaks would seem to prove.

Guy:Incognito

Boggles wrote: »

Any interview I have seen him in the past 12 months has impressed me, he has come across as humble, intelligent and realistic, there wasn't a hint of fowl about him.

12 months ago would have been the time to come back. It's too far into the campaign to hand him a spot back now. As I said, if he wants to come back, after the WC is the time thats fair to everyone.

Boggles

Stekelly wrote: »

12 months ago would have been the time to come back. It's too far into the campaign to hand him a spot back now. As I said, if he wants to come back, after the WC is the time thats fair to everyone.

What if he is the difference between qualification or not?

Guy:Incognito

Boggles wrote: »

What if he is the difference between qualification or not?

No thanks.

As I said, If he'd been long term injured (Steven Reid) no problem. But to let players swan in and out as it suits isnt on. If you opt out of a campaign, fine. But dont come back in when the going is good. Next consideration should be for 2012 euro qualifiers .

Boggles

Stekelly wrote: »

No thanks.

As I said, If he'd been long term injured (Steven Reid) no problem. But to let players swan in and out as it suits isnt on. If you opt out of a campaign, fine. But dont come back in when the going is good. Next consideration should be for 2012 euro qualifiers .

Hypethically speaking if we got to a play off and you knew Ireland would be the difference between qualification or not, you would still say "no thanks"?

CHD

Stekelly wrote: »

12 months ago would have been the time to come back. It's too far into the campaign to hand him a spot back now. As I said, if he wants to come back, after the WC is the time thats fair to everyone.

Screw that, Him and Stephen Reid on top of there games at the WC and we can get to the quarter finals. Glady take him back, i think thats fair.

herbieflowers

So what do you say to the lad whose been in all the squads and has to miss out? "Sorry sonny, this lad Ireland here showed an interest once it became more certain that we'd qualify for the play-offs. I know he didn't show much of an interest when we were struggling away to Montenegro but he's back in anyway."

Boggles

herbieflowers wrote: »

So what do you say to the lad whose been in all the squads and has to miss out? "Sorry sonny, this lad Ireland here showed an interest once it became more certain that we'd qualify for the play-offs. I know he didn't show much of an interest when we were struggling away to Montenegro but he's back in anyway."

I'd say sorry Liam Miller but you were only here to make up the numbers anyways and I never had any intention of playing you.

bullpost

CHD wrote: »

Screw that, Him and Stephen Reid on top of there games at the WC and we can get to the quarter finals. Glady take him back, i think thats fair.

Agree - The reality is with the current squad we'll just about scrape in and our current midfield would be cannon fodder come the finals.
With both Ireland and Reid in there we'd be a transformed team and who knows how far we could go.

herbieflowers

Boggles wrote: »

I'd say sorry Liam Miller but you were only here to make up the numbers anyways and I never had any intention of playing you.

Lol. But you get what I mean. I have nothing against Ireland, or him coming back. But now isn't the time, imo. He hasn't been involved, that's where it ends for me.

Guy:Incognito

CHD wrote: »

, i think thats fair.

On who? Certainly not the player that has to drop out for Ireland to come in.

Guy:Incognito

Boggles wrote: »

Hypethically speaking if we got to a play off and you knew Ireland would be the difference between qualification or not, you would still say "no thanks"?

Thats what I meant the first time and I stand by it.

Would you be fine losing your place and possibly your only shot at a finals if you were in the squad all the way thorugh only to be told to stay at home for the end in favour of someone in Irelands position?

Boggles

herbieflowers wrote: »

Lol. But you get what I mean. I have nothing against Ireland, or him coming back. But now isn't the time, imo. He hasn't been involved, that's where it ends for me.

I do understand what you mean.

I don't have a solid opinion on the matter, the longer it goes on the harder it is to come back.

What i can safely say though, is Ireland instead of Whelan the other night and we would be top of the group, IMO.

Guy:Incognito

Boggles wrote: »

I do understand what you mean.

I don't have a solid opinion on the matter, the longer it goes on the harder it is to come back.

What i can safely say though, is Ireland instead of Whelan the other night and we would be top of the group, IMO.

I just dont think it should matter how good he is.He doesnt deserve his place.

Positive discrimination is still discrimination.

CHD

Stekelly wrote: »

On who? Certainly not the player that has to drop out for Ireland to come in.

Boo hoo tbh. Your there to win, you field your strongest team. If he is back for the next game then he deserves to be there.

Should S.Reid be dropped because he hasn't played in the last while, would be unfair after all wouldn't it....

missingtime

I think he's waiting for a player on the squad to retire, he might come back then.

It would be very sly of him to join the squad if we qualify for the world cup.

killwill

I think it is pretty simple, if he comes back and plays now all is forgiven. If he doesn't feature in the qualifiers he can not play in the World Cup, if e get there.

NabyLadistheman

The notion of "it's too late in the campaign for him to swan back in" is absolute guff. 3 games left, I really do believe it would bolster the squad and give us that extra bit of quality. The reality is we have drew alot of games we should be winning (to qualify) We can still top the table - but not without Ireland. We don't have enough quality to beat the Italian's in Croke Park. Throw Stephen Ireland into the mix & I believe we would be able to beat them as we could have someone in midfield who is capable of getting a goal or almost certainly create one.

If Stephen Ireland is the differance between us qualifying or finishing 2nd & losing a play-off then I know, Trap know's and all the players know what needs to be done.

Open arms - Hugs - South Africa