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No insurance cert fine

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  • 16-09-2008 5:52pm
    #1
    Redpunto
    Registered Users Posts: 2,024 ✭✭✭


    Got our dinky car on the Tuesday and got stopped by guard on way home from work on Thursday, had no insurance cert yet as it was in the post, it came the next day. I had nothing to say we had just bought the car but he rang whoever he rings with the reg and says that its still in someones elses name, Anyhows he tells me to go to police station with the cert and my licence (as id forgotten that too!) and he was going to fine me. Now, I went into the station the next day and the guard there said shes never heard of someone being fined for displaying no cert like that, they just want to make sure that youre insured. What do I get in the post today, a fine for €60. Now it says on it something like "failure for not displaying a valid insurance cert 10 days after certification" or something like that. ANy views lads and ladies.


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    #2
    challengemaster
    Registered Users Posts: 16,930 ✭✭✭✭challengemaster


    I'd challenge it personally. Sounds like a load of bull.


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    #3
    ScouseMouse
    Closed Accounts Posts: 5,070 ✭✭✭ScouseMouse


    Thats the biggest load of bollix I ever heard. Do what I did. Go to the station the guard is based in and ask for the seargent (spelling?). No cop in his right mind would do this.


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    #4
    galwaytt
    Registered Users Posts: 12,776 ✭✭✭✭galwaytt


    Challenge - you can't get a cert quicker than the ins co and An Post sending it out. If that's 2 or 12 days, they'll just have to suck it up.

    Go to station with your papers, and show them, otherwise, challenge it. Nobody gets a cert in advance.

    Ode To The Motorist

    “And my existence, while grotesque and incomprehensible to you, generates funds to the exchequer. You don't want to acknowledge that as truth because, deep down in places you don't talk about at the Green Party, you want me on that road, you need me on that road. We use words like freedom, enjoyment, sport and community. We use these words as the backbone of a life spent instilling those values in our families and loved ones. You use them as a punch line. I have neither the time nor the inclination to explain myself to a man who rises and sleeps under the tax revenue and the very freedom to spend it that I provide, and then questions the manner in which I provide it. I would rather you just said "thank you" and went on your way. Otherwise I suggest you pick up a bus pass and get the ********* ********* off the road” 



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    #5
    Guy:Incognito
    Registered Users Posts: 38,247 ✭✭✭✭Guy:Incognito


    galwaytt wrote: »
    Challenge - you can't get a cert quicker than the ins co and An Post sending it out. If that's 2 or 12 days, they'll just have to suck it up.
    .

    Theres offence for not displaying discs and not producing certs , be they in your pocket, at home or in the post.

    Your not supposed to drive the car till you have your documents. The fact that we all do and most of the time a blind eye is turned doesnt change the law. You always run the risk of encountering a Gard that wants to employ the law (oh the humanity).


    I cant see why it wouldnt be upheld if the law was broken.


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    #6
    craichoe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,706 ✭✭✭craichoe


    Stekelly wrote: »
    Theres offence for not displaying discs and not producing certs , be they in your pocket, at home or in the post.

    Your not supposed to drive the car till you have your documents. The fact that we all do and most of the time a blind eye is turned doesnt change the law. You always run the risk of encountering a Gard that wants to employ the law (oh the humanity).


    I cant see why it wouldnt be upheld if the law was broken.

    Rubbish

    A. Any insurance company will tell your insured from when you've paid for the insurance
    B. I've been in court for that very reason and it was struck out


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    #7
    L1011
    Registered Users Posts: 68,927 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    It may be the law but any judge in the country will strike it out and probably berate the Guard for taking it there in the first place...


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    #8
    Anan1
    Registered Users Posts: 22,815 ✭✭✭✭Anan1


    craichoe wrote: »
    Rubbish

    A. Any insurance company will tell your insured from when you've paid for the insurance
    B. I've been in court for that very reason and it was struck out

    A. You're missing the point. Even if you are insured, not displaying the disc is an offence.

    B. Good for you. Let's hope the OP is as lucky. But Stekelly is right.


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    #9
    Muzzy
    Registered Users Posts: 193 ✭✭Muzzy


    Call into the station and challenge that.

    The Garda has times and date recorded on his own paperwork and the station would have recorded times and dates when you sent in your paperwork also. And your Insurance paperwork will clearly state start times and dates of your policy and the transfer.

    Also, if you have a full licence, you will have the Driving of other cars on your policy, since the car was legally registered in someone elses name, you are covered TPF&T to drive the car anyway, no insurance paperwork is required, it's automatic cover.

    Once your policy is paid for you are covered to drive the car. I work in Underwriting and deal with Garda queries almost everyday at work. You have nothing to worry about.

    The shades will always give you 10 days to produce evidence of insurance (Cert, Disc, Cover letter, confirmation over the phone/fax, anything really whiles your C&D and being produced) to your local station.

    After 10 days they can take the matter further alright, but still, nothing will happen if you've an active policy. You just got a muppet of a Garda to be honest.


    ***Edit. You forgot your drivers licence, can't really comment on that, but you are supposed to have that with you, and they can fine you or give points for that.


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    #10
    Redpunto
    Registered Users Posts: 2,024 ✭✭✭Redpunto


    Thanks guys,

    in all fairness the garda in question was a b*llix. He kept saying he could take the car away from me and id be walking home???

    Anyroad I was thinking if I pushed it could he still go after me not having the drivers licence with me (and yep im full licence) but it says nothing about that on the letter I got. Might have a word with my local station, were nice the last time I called in! Havent a clue what his name was or his station, prob should have got it but was so peeved didnt even think of it.

    Its €60 which is not too bad with no penalty points but 'pose €60 is a few cases of beer or one pair of kids shoes.....:D


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    #11
    pyramuid man
    Registered Users Posts: 1,196 ✭✭✭pyramuid man


    as far as i am aware, the law is that you are supposed to carry your license but you also have 10 days to produce. think soon loophole there


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    #12
    Esel
    Registered Users Posts: 22,322 ✭✭✭✭Esel


    Redpunto wrote: »
    ...Now it says on it something like "failure for not displaying a valid insurance cert 10 days after certification" or something like that....
    You were less than '10 days after certification', so that fine won't hold, imo. Your local station should be able to identify/get in touch with the issuing Garda from the details on the fine itself?
    Redpunto wrote: »
    Anyroad I was thinking if I pushed it could he still go after me not having the drivers licence with me (and yep im full licence) ...
    He could have done, but he gave you the option to produce, so if you do/have done, you're covered.

    Not your ornery onager



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    #13
    smash
    Closed Accounts Posts: 34,809 ✭✭✭✭smash


    go to the cop station with your disc, if it ends up in court bring your disc and your log book to show you'd just bought the car and you were insured and waiting for the disc... it'll be struck off very quickly!


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    #14
    TheNog
    Registered Users Posts: 4,160 ✭✭✭TheNog


    Redpunto wrote: »
    Got our dinky car on the Tuesday and got stopped by guard on way home from work on Thursday, had no insurance cert yet as it was in the post, it came the next day. I had nothing to say we had just bought the car but he rang whoever he rings with the reg and says that its still in someones elses name, Anyhows he tells me to go to police station with the cert and my licence (as id forgotten that too!) and he was going to fine me. Now, I went into the station the next day and the guard there said shes never heard of someone being fined for displaying no cert like that, they just want to make sure that youre insured. What do I get in the post today, a fine for €60. Now it says on it something like "failure for not displaying a valid insurance cert 10 days after certification" or something like that. ANy views lads and ladies.

    I'm a member myself and think this lad is a total bloody eejit who should be shot with balls of his own ****e. To fine a person for not displaying a disc is the lowest of the low tbh. He was right to demand you to produce your cert
    wihin the 10 days was the correct and only route to take. If you produced the insurance cert then leave it at that.

    My advice to you is to write to the local Superintendent asking him/her to review it. State the summons number on your letter (it can be found on the top right of the summons). Outline the circumstances and state you produced the insurance cert. I would hope the Super would strike out the summons in court and you would not have to attend. Make sure you write the letter soon, don;t leave it on the long finger.

    Not making any excuses here but I am hoping against hope the guard you met was fresh out college. We all made the silliest mistakes when we began till we realise that crappy things like this do no good for anyone be it the guards or the public.
    Stekelly wrote: »
    Theres offence for not displaying discs and not producing certs , be they in your pocket, at home or in the post.

    Your not supposed to drive the car till you have your documents. The fact that we all do and most of the time a blind eye is turned doesnt change the law. You always run the risk of encountering a Gard that wants to employ the law (oh the humanity).

    There is a specific offence for not displaying discs but it is so minor it is usually not even considered and certainly in this case it should never have been considered. I agree with you when you say that no one should drive without the necessary discs in place but common sense should have prevailed here. Get the person to produce documents and if they produce, leave it at that. That is the proper use of the discretionary power of a Garda.
    Muzzy wrote: »
    Call into the station and challenge that.

    The Garda has times and date recorded on his own paperwork and the station would have recorded times and dates when you sent in your paperwork also. And your Insurance paperwork will clearly state start times and dates of your policy and the transfer.

    Also, if you have a full licence, you will have the Driving of other cars on your policy, since the car was legally registered in someone elses name, you are covered TPF&T to drive the car anyway, no insurance paperwork is required, it's automatic cover.

    Once your policy is paid for you are covered to drive the car. I work in Underwriting and deal with Garda queries almost everyday at work. You have nothing to worry about.

    The shades will always give you 10 days to produce evidence of insurance (Cert, Disc, Cover letter, confirmation over the phone/fax, anything really whiles your C&D and being produced) to your local station.

    After 10 days they can take the matter further alright, but still, nothing will happen if you've an active policy. You just got a muppet of a Garda to be honest.


    ***Edit. You forgot your drivers licence, can't really comment on that, but you are supposed to have that with you, and they can fine you or give points for that.

    +1. By law you do not have to carry your insurance cert with you but you may be demanded to produce within 10 days. Driving licence is different though but you are given the chance in law to produce within 10 days. By the way for those who do not know the maximum fine for not carrying your licence with you is €800!!!!!! There is no points for this offence.
    Redpunto wrote: »
    Thanks guys,

    in all fairness the garda in question was a b*llix. He kept saying he could take the car away from me and id be walking home???

    Anyroad I was thinking if I pushed it could he still go after me not having the drivers licence with me (and yep im full licence) but it says nothing about that on the letter I got. Might have a word with my local station, were nice the last time I called in! Havent a clue what his name was or his station, prob should have got it but was so peeved didnt even think of it.

    Its €60 which is not too bad with no penalty points but 'pose €60 is a few cases of beer or one pair of kids shoes.....:D

    The guard was correct in saying he could have seized your car. If this had happened all you would have to do is produce your insurance cert and the car would be given back to you and you would not have to pay the seizure fee.

    60 quid is still 60 quid.
    pyramuid man wrote: »
    as far as i am aware, the law is that you are supposed to carry your license but you also have 10 days to produce. think soon loophole there

    There is no loophole as they are 2 separate offences but can be made into three. If you had no licence and then failed to produce the summons you could get is No Driving Licence, Failing to Produce Driving Licence There and Then to a Garda and Failing to Produce a Driving Licence within 10 days.


    Hope this helps OP


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    #15
    Zube
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,502 ✭✭✭Zube


    TheNog wrote: »
    I'm a member myself and think

    Thanks, Nogs, you covered everything I would have said, with more authority.


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    #16
    Redpunto
    Registered Users Posts: 2,024 ✭✭✭Redpunto


    hello,,,, went into the local station and had a nice chat with the lady there who said this fella obviously doesnt own a car as otherwise he would have had the cop on not to fine,,,,anyhows, she told me to ring the number at the top of the fine letter. It used to be that youd appeal to the local superindentent but now its all sorted by this office in Tipp. They said just to send copies of everything so ill wait and see what happens. the bangarda was saying that i need to get it sorted before the 28 days the fine will go up even if its being appealed.


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