I'm going to give a photo to a local newspaper... for FREE! Is this a good idea??

0utpost31

Let me explain.

My mate just raised a few grand for a local hospital and will be presenting one of those MASSIVE cheques to them in the next week or so. He wants me to take a photo of the handover of the cheque which I would be happy to do since there will be a famous sportsman present too.

I'd also be happy to have it printed in the local newspaper free of charge, since it's a charity thing.

This will be my first ever "official" photo.

Anything I need to know before I do this?

City-Exile

In this case, I'd give the image to every paper for free, since the charity is the main focus. In the Copyright, imply that the image is free for distribution. Ensure you have the names of the people involved & the charity in the caption. Credit yourself in the caption too.

I wouldn't send in an image larger than 500kb though.

Ricky91t

I'm assuming you or yourfriend is writing up a story or a journalist will be there?As im sure a bit of a story would be better than just a photo,i think if it will get your friend possible publicity for future charity events then its ok to give it to them for free,but thats just my opinion,im sure others will think differently

Dodgykeeper

It is good for the soul to do a certain amount of work for free for charity, in all professions!

smelltheglove

I did this recently. I took pictures at my dads 50th birthday and he is chairman of the local GAA club so the party wasnt in a private function room, it was just all in the club invited in the main pub. I didnt know many of the guests and some thought I was taking a picture for the local freebie so I thought what the heck send in a shot. The editor was delighted, a local club chairman is enough interest etc but I was asked to write a story to go with it.

I'd definitely recommend getting the names of the people in the photo but also to fill space in your little story make sure you get some names of people in attendance, especially if there are any local people of interest, politicians businessmen etc. Get some details from your friend re the charity and the fundraising and forward the picture and the story on straight away. Dont be insulted though if they change your words. Mine weren't changed which was a welcome surprise but it could happen.

cooligPhoto

I say definitely go for it.

I'm an Officer in the local Red Cross unit and we've been fundraising this year for an ambulance (we take delivery shortly). A few times now I've taken "official" photos of presentations and celebrations. No doubt I will be taking photos of the unit with the new ambulance.

We have a PR Officer who sends in the photos with some text but I've had lots of publicity shots in the Kildare papers this year so far.

It all helps.

Phototoxin

Its for charity... why is this question even being asked.
Anything else YES because the papers make LOTs of moneys, but charity no

0utpost31

I don't have a clue about the handover of photos to newspapers, of course this is going to be a freebie but I just wanted to know if there was anything I was overlooking... If it's as simple as "hey here's the photo" with no legal forms to sign or anything then that's great.

smelltheglove

Well in my case I simply mailed the editor the picture with a little note about the reason I was sending them in, why they may be of interest and a few details. I mailed them with my copyright and said that if they were interested in any of the shots to mail me back for the unmarked version and what dpi or specs they required. I know when sending a shot to a pr agency the girl said the herald use 300dpi but others may be different. This way the apper only got the one shot free, I did state that there was no charge and I knew that they were going to use it. When they mailed me back about which photo they would like they asked me to write a few words down about the night.

Fionn

just send it in and remind them that it's copyright you and bask in the feeling of being published!!

0utpost31

Hey Fionn it's for the hospital in Carrick so you might see it in the South tipp or the Nationalist.

Fionn

cool i'll keep a lookout for it!
i often give both those papers the odd photo if it's like someone's wedding or general interest event or whatever. South Tipp will credit you sometimes but generally the Nationalist don't so i don't give them much unless someone asks me to.

0utpost31

Lads one more thing, I'm thinking a 50mm 1.8 will suffice yeah? And how are these massive cheque photos usually done? The photos are usually from the waist up aren't they?

Ricky91t

0utpost31 wrote: »

Lads one more thing, I'm thinking a 50mm 1.8 will suffice yeah? And how are these massive cheque photos usually done? The photos are usually from the waist up aren't they?

:eek:
Make sure you up the aperture abit
F/1.8 will make either the check or people quiet OOF
I'm sure you can do a few test pics!
Yeah waist up will be fine important people holding the cheque and the extras to the left and right.
Might be a good idea to have all the charity raisers (or a few)on the left and the hospital people on the right or other way round
So you can caption it "Joe bloggs and bob surname Who were raising money for the hospital hand over the cheque to the hospital staff name name and name"
Common sense i know but though id tell you

RCNPhotos

Yeah do it for free but make sure you ask they credit you for it. Even if it wasn't for charity I'd do it free, since it's your first one. I did some free stuff before but now I'm getting paid work for a mag regulary enough and that stuff is being usedi n the papers which is great. (even got front page of the herald! Was well chuffed)

As for the pic test shots are a must, try and bounce your flash off the ceiling if you can to eliminate any nasty dark shadows behind the people, if it's indoors.

Victor

Make sure they give you credit.

Anouilh

I intend to be an amateur photographer for some time to come.

I would be happy to offer photos for publication in magazines that fit within the "charity" bracket, as otherwise they just sit, unused, on my hard drive.

Not quite sure how to go about this...

smelltheglove

Anouilh wrote: »

I intend to be an amateur photographer for some time to come.

I would be happy to offer photos for publication in magazines that fit within the "charity" bracket, as otherwise they just sit, unused, on my hard drive.

Not quite sure how to go about this...

Anoouilh I pressed thanks by accident there sorry, first this is an old topic but if it has relevance no reason not to revive it, I dont know if you read all of it but my response between then and now would be different.

I dont call myself ametuer as I earn from photography yet I am not long in the game. However from my first experience in giving a photo to a paper I was also asked to write some words to go with it. In the end they had a free article. The paper was a free paper yet they would earn from advertisement. I would not do it again purely because of the fact that when I did try to communicate with the editor as to whether it was being used or if I could get a copy I was not even given the decency of a reply.

Also more recently I received a phone call from an editor requesting some of my shots. During the conversation he did not offer payment so at the end when I brought the payment subject up it was a bit of a rigmaroll... He would have happily taken them for free, but why should you give it for free, they earn through sales and advertising, as a business they want to get the job done for as little as possible so when offered 10 free shots and 10 shots with a price tag they will go for the free. Now you can look upon this as well I'd like to get my shot printed but thats fair enough, what about when you become pro? How will you feel when youre earning opportunity is decreased as the papers are reverting to ametuers freebies rather than pro shots? Also if the trend continues it may actually drive the value of shots down also, a photographer who is losing out to the ametuer may decide to offer his shot for less, in return the paper decides well I'm only going to pay this much for it from now on.....

I had a discussion with someone about this before my most recent published shots which is quite recent and he went on to send me this link, at this stage my view on it had already changed but this is basically a summary for it.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj5IV23g-fE

Paulw

smelltheglove wrote: »

I had a discussion with someone about this before my most recent published shots which is quite recent and he went on to send me this link, at this stage my view on it had already changed but this is basically a summary for it.....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mj5IV23g-fE

I always enjoy watching that youtube clip. Very accurate information and view.

whyulittle

Wonder did they pay him for that?

rymus

Victor wrote: »

Make sure they give you credit.

What he said.. But they probably won't. Even if you asked for payment you're not likely to get it. Might as well give it to them for nothing.

Anouilh

Thanks for the strange video.

More information:

http://harlanellison.com/home.htm

Anouilh

"Also if the trend continues it may actually drive the value of shots down also, a photographer who is losing out to the ametuer may decide to offer his shot for less, in return the paper decides well I'm only going to pay this much for it from now on....."

I fully agree and until now this has stopped me from offering six years of stock-piled imagery to anybody, either for love or money.

Perhaps leaving them as an heirloom could be an option?

Paulw

Just curious, but why do you think your images are worth nothing? Why are they not worth paying for?

Anouilh

Paulw wrote: »

Just curious, but why do you think your images are worth nothing? Why are they not worth paying for?

I did not say that.

They are priceless.

Paulw

Anouilh wrote: »

I did not say that.

They are priceless.

I wasn't specifically asking you, it was a general question.

My view - if a photo is good enough to be printed, then it's more than good enough to be paid for.

smelltheglove

Definitely as Paul said. My print as mentioned above ended up being 14 pictures on onw full page of a large size newspaper. Ok a local paper with low rates but total amount is ok. I could have taken the ah I'm just happy to have them printed but I didnt. I shot the pictures for free, the money they earned paid for the lens used!

when put like that you'd rather earn wouldnt you!

Covey

I think that what Anouilh might have meant was that there is not much of a market to sell photos.

Especially if you're not doing sport, I can imagine it's difficult to sell to papers.

T.

Paulw

Covey wrote: »

I think that what Anouilh might have meant was that there is not much of a market to sell photos.

I think there's less of a market because so many people give away images for free.

Most papers want photos to go with their articles. It's a matter of cost - why pay some photographer when so many people are willing to send in images for free?

Anouilh

There's no need to go round in circles on this.

Looking at all the photos accumulated over the past ten years by everybody, thanks to digital media developments, we now have a large national resource that, for money or other currency, could be used to better advantage.

In Russia, or so I have learned from writers like Dale Pesmen, hard liquour can be common currency and used for trading commodities.

That is not the problem posed by "free" dispersal of photos, music and other digital media.

There was a great interview with the editor of "Wired" by Peter Day on the World Service a few nights ago.

http://www.bbc.co.uk/worldservice/programmes/global_business.shtml

Anybody under the age of twenty-five, according to the speaker, has no problem with the idea of free media.

Nor do I.

My photos document many aspects of my life and travels.

I could try to sell them and come up against all the barriers (which I met daily as a freelance writer for years).

OR, I could unleash their potential in the new market economy in a more efficient way.

The photos may be viewed in small size on my blogs.
They could be offered to the new Boards.ie Magazine, which is being planned here and which has not been formally decided on.

With recessionary times here again, we could look at what we have and try to make the best of it.

Paulw

Anouilh wrote: »

With recessionary times here again, we could look at what we have and try to make the best of it.

Well, if cameras were free, if lenses were free, if food/drink was free, then I'd have no problems giving away my images for free.

In recessionary times, it's better to make as much as you can from whatever resources you have, to fund your life. Free won't buy you much in the shops these days, even with a recession. :cool:

Anouilh

Paulw wrote: »

Well, if cameras were free, if lenses were free, if food/drink was free, then I'd have no problems giving away my images for free.

In recessionary times, it's better to make as much as you can from whatever resources you have, to fund your life. Free won't buy you much in the shops these days, even with a recession. :cool:

But did you listen to the interview?

If one already owns the means of production and has the possibility of reaping rewards years down the line, free today might mean a tidy little income tomorrow...

Paulw

If one gives away images for free then one earns nothing to buy gear with.

Everything costs. Papers earn revenue from advertising and sales, so why should they not pay for your photos?

Yes, it's fine living with the idea that in future you may earn but, you can't live on free and maybe's.

Ricky91t

Don't give papers images for free,they are serious f**ckers about paying after that,Never again will they get anything off me for free

And agree with what paulw said

PCPhoto

I kinda agree with paulw ..... papers should pay for using images...its all down to profit margins.

Even Regional Papers earn money - if they didnt they couldnt continue printing, its just that they think the money they make is better spent on the staff (even though most of them pay very little to them too).

Anyway - my point is that the papers should pay..... but at the risk of contradicting myself - sometimes the occasional freebie in exchange for printing of your name/number/website etc ...can work.

I used to give images in exchange for passes to events (ie. access to Eircom League games)...many many years ago.

AnCatDubh

Wait up for a minute now - they're not all evil money grabbing capitalist vampires. Ok, some maybe but they, the media - particularly local, do their fare share of giving too.

I've been published a few times (national and local) and haven't ever charged or sought to earn money from the publication. In each case, I've always gotten something out of it.

Ok I admit it - at times I used the media. In fairness to them they could have turned around and said to me, well what you are looking for is unsolicited by us thus we will consider it advertising in our paper and the going rate will be €150 to be publish what I wanted. At the time, it got me what I needed which was media publicity for the clubs / organisations / events that I was in the process of promoting.

On other times I have been just chuffed at publication of my images. I mean I described it recently to a colleague of how nice a feeling it was to get an opportunity of having your image in a national publication - I never would have expected to. In these cases I gained much from it at a basic photographic developmental level.

So I don't think it's a black and white issue.

That video rant is funny but the guy has a point. Certainly if any evil empire driven purely by a motive of shareholder profit were to seek to solicit your photographic services for free - then certainly tell them which part of the liffey you'd see them jump into. But i think you've got to ask if there is something in it for you.

The world simply doesn't revolve around business arrangements - perhaps (a longer debate and a different forum) the reason that we (the world at large) is in the present recessionary situation is as a result of opinion that makes what it can out of the deal - whatever that may be.

Such thinking may not put food on the table and won't buy you a new lens or upgrade of a body and I respect anyone that needs their photography to put a crust on the table. I think they face challenging times for the next year/two/three ahead.

I'd stop short of agreeing that amateur displaces professional services though. In reality I don't expect that it is as simple as that. If you ask any professional worth their salt they will be able to tell you exactly the differentiation between the service that they will offer and the amateur. I'd humbly suggest that if there is no differentiation then such professional is not more than the amateur they claim are stealing their 'crust'. In business the professional will have to find their unique selling point and their niche.

If the media are requesting then you are charging. If you are giving then they're not writing a cheque.

Hope that doesn't offend. Just an opinion.

Anouilh

The rant on the video reminds me of why I have never visited the U.S. Perhaps there is more to life than money?

Also, despite the roaring about not offering Warner Brothers copy for free, the speaker's website has quite a few pieces which anybody can read online for free.

I think that the question raised in this thread is fundamental to how people perceive their work. If they can control where it is presented, who will have access, how much they are paid, they will be more liable to offer certain pieces of it for "free". There is a major debate going on at the moment about "atoms and bits" and MIT have got in on analysing the influence technology has on everyday commerce.

Let's see how it goes...

Anouilh

Ricky91t wrote: »

Don't give papers images for free,they are serious f**ckers about paying after that,Never again will they get anything off me for free

And agree with what paulw said

This is worrying.

Is this general in Ireland alone?

I found that some newspapers were slow to pay, but payment did happen.