Appealing Irish Rail fine

spiderman1885

So can I get off a train

"Eh... yeah I came from Broombridge, so I'll pay you now?"

Right well there's the excuse to use everyone!

L1011

spiderman1885 wrote: »

So can I get off a train

"Eh... yeah I came from Broombridge, so I'll pay you now?"

Right well there's the excuse to use everyone!

You'd probably get caught unless you'd just got off a train that stopped there, mind.

MOH

KC61 wrote: »

There is no obligation to use a TVM if the booking office is closed.

The only obligation to buy a ticket is when the booking office is open. Some tickets are only available from the booking office, and as such cannot be bought if the office is shut! In that case, you pay at the destination.

According to IRISHRAIL (the boards user, not the company) you must buy a ticket from a TVM, even if the cheaper one you qualify for isn't available from it:

IRISH RAIL wrote: »

Ham`n`egger is spot on in all his replies moh is not TVM`s have been provided by the board to purchase a ticket before depature so if you fail to use one thats evasion

Ham'nd'egger

MOH wrote: »

According to IRISHRAIL (the boards user, not the company) you must buy a ticket from a TVM, even if the cheaper one you qualify for isn't available from it:

To be fair (pun intended), I would contend that to be the case as opposed to it being as distinct to it being actual hard fact. In all honesty, if a TVM is at hand and you can purchase the ticket to cover you using one, it makes sense to do do and not to incur a standard ticket penalty at your destination station.

KC61

MOH wrote: »

According to IRISHRAIL (the boards user, not the company) you must buy a ticket from a TVM, even if the cheaper one you qualify for isn't available from it:

I am afraid that the individual in question is incorrect.

There is no obligation to use the TVM if the booking office is closed.

MOH

KC61 wrote: »

I am afraid that the individual in question is incorrect.

There is no obligation to use the TVM if the booking office is closed.

Good, glad that's cleared up

paulm17781

Who do you find more handsome, Brad Pitt or Johnny Depp?

I am a student who travels from killester to dun laoirghe mon - fri.


It costs 2.10 each way which i pay there and back.


Last week after college i went to to DL train station as usual and realized i must of dropped a euro coin from my pocket that i always keep exactly 2.10 so i now had 1.10 and a 20 cent from lunch.

Since i live so far away i had no choice but to get the train anyway, so i even bought a ticket, the furtest i could get was a e1.25 ticket Which only brings you 1 stop to salthill ( despite it only costing an extra 85c to go about 13 stations more.

When i got clontarf i was approached by a ticket collector, who then got very intimidating, he went on about how i bought a short hop ticket only 1 stop, but i pointed out how that wasn't really fare as it costs 1.10 to go 1 stop and only 2.10 to go 12!

We the got of the train at killester were he was taking my details i tried to keep walking then, when i see another 4 ticket inspectors getting off the dart and walking towards me now 5 of them were cornering me in and being very intimidating, they would not believe my details. And said how they would detain me until the police came.

I Think this was very unfair as i had tried to pay as much as i could in buying a ticket for 1.10( the most i could do).

Now i have 21 days to pay 50e which i cannot afford.

SeanW

In all fairness, you tried to get away with paying less than the journey cost. If the fare was 2.10, the fare was 2.10 not whatever you have in your pocket. What did you expect?

Since i live so far away i had no choice but to get the train anyway

I wasnt trying to "Get away" with it, its all i had left, so was therefor stranded.

Rockshamrover

Why don't IE introduce some method of paying for your ticket using your mobile phone? For example the case of the chap from Portmarnock. He gets on the train knowing he needs a ticket. He dials up the service on his phone and pays his fare. Like most things in this country, we assume that every body is just looking for a free ride:D. When all people want is an efficient way to go about their business without tonnes of rules and regulations.

The function of IE I would have thought was to get customers to and from their destinations. They are not some kind of border police or security service. Instead of putting all the effort into stopping the "hardened criminal commuters", they should be looking at ways to make their payment system more efficient and customer focused.

Lead me to your taker.
Rock.

Stark

Rockshamrover wrote: »

Why don't IE introduce some method of paying for your ticket using your mobile phone?.

Why don't people just pay for their tickets? If you go into a shop, find the queue's too long and you're in a rush, you don't just grab what you want and walk out of the shop with it thinking "ah I'll pay them next time".

Rockshamrover

My suggestion is more ways to pay not don't pay. Thanks for your response.

thomasj

Yep but you don't have a level crossing in the way of the shop blocking people from getting across to the ticket office! as in coolmines case!

But fair deuce to them for putting the auto ticket machines on the City bound platform at Coolmine. I have an annual bus & rail but because they locked the gate entrance to the city bound platform years ago when theticket office was closed even those with a ticket had to get across to the ticket office on the other side to show the ticket and get across before the level crossing went down.

One evening 2 or 3 years ago around 4 I arrived and the level crossing was down! There were 2 trains coming both ways so it was down for 5-8 mins! I tried to open the gate for the citybound platform but it was locked and the train i was going for came and left an I missed it! And the next train wasn't for a whole 2 hours!!!!!

In fairness to the ticket office guy he understood my cause, fairly decent chap and gave me the number of the guy to complain to about this!

Now the Citybound gates at Coolmine stay open with the ticket vending machines now operation. But this stations location is a nightmare, I wouldn't recommend it to any eldery or disabled passenger.

madds

Turnip2000 wrote: »

Just wondering has anybody ever appealed and been let off or anything along the lines of this?

Similar incident happened me in 2005 in Connolly station. Name and address taken (inspector even asked to speak to someone so they could verify the address I was giving so he rang my wife at home. I felt like a little school kid). Anyhow I asked for the name of someone in IR that I could speak to. Rang this person that morning and explained my side of things. Yer man said it was either pay the fine (€40 I think it was at the time) or face the possibility of an increased €220 fine etc. I told him I wouldn't be paying the fine and would be sending a written letter of complaint, which I did. I never did receive that fine.

I found it funny at the time, coz if IR placed more emphasis in ensuring that the monies collected by their employees at the gates (before the ticket machines were installed) went straight into the IR coffers instead of into their pockets (1 for you, 2 for me), I reckon they would have been more flexible with Joe Public.

Sure they used to take money off the homeless to allow them stay indoors on the platform at night.

Mr. Presentable

Rockshamrover wrote: »

Why don't IE introduce some method of paying for your ticket using your mobile phone? For example the case of the chap from Portmarnock..

Then they'll use the old I had no credit on my phone spin. If you are old enough to be allowed out on your own, you're old enough to be responsible for paying the correct fare.

For crying out loud, one euro short? You could pick that up in dropped change in a few minutes outside any shop or station.

Varkov

Anyone know why I might have been fined €100 instead of €50 this morning?

I was coming form Leixlip and was going to be late for work. Last time I did this was months ago, and there was never any problem paying at the other end in Connolly. So I walked straight up to the booth, not like I was trying to sneak out and told him simply what the story was. €100 please mate.

Is it up to the **** stain at the booth to decide? Not my fault he works in a ****ing train station.

penexpers

Varkov wrote: »

Is it up to the **** stain at the booth to decide? Not my fault he works in a ****ing train station.

Not his fault you didn't have a ticket.

paulm17781

Varkov wrote: »

Anyone know why I might have been fined €100 instead of €50 this morning?

I was coming form Leixlip and was going to be late for work. Last time I did this was months ago, and there was never any problem paying at the other end in Connolly. So I walked straight up to the booth, not like I was trying to sneak out and told him simply what the story was. €100 please mate.

Is it up to the **** stain at the booth to decide? Not my fault he works in a ****ing train station.

It isn't your fault he works in a train station. It is however your fault you didn't have a ticket. Don't take it out on him, he's only doing his job.

Varkov

Yeah, just a bit pissed off first thing on a Monday.

Has anyone here ever been charged more than €50 though?

paulm17781

Varkov wrote: »

Yeah, just a bit pissed off first thing on a Monday.

Has anyone here ever been charged more than €50 though?

I've heard of one other person here. He pretty much said he had a go at the guy and then the fine was upped to €100 (abuse of power but I kind of see his point). I'm not sure if they've gotten stricter or if you were very unlucky.

Varkov

Probably because I did the same thing then. Bit of attitude

paulm17781

Varkov wrote: »

Probably because I did the same thing then. Bit of attitude

It is a pain how they do that but unfortunately I'm not sure there's anything you can do, other than have a ticket.

Varkov

Just rang to confirm, apparently its a seperate 50 euro charge for providing false information.

I gave him a fake address and name, and he demanded a phone number for someone to confirm this. ****ing smarmy **** got my sick mam out of bed for this. Im really in the mood tomorrow to put my hood up and box the ****er. Not his fault, but would make me feel alot better.

goingnowhere

Varkov wrote: »

Just rang to confirm, apparently its a seperate 50 euro charge for providing false information.

I gave him a fake address and name, and he demanded a phone number for someone to confirm this. ****ing smarmy **** got my sick mam out of bed for this. Im really in the mood tomorrow to put my hood up and box the ****er. Not his fault, but would make me feel alot better.

You evaded the fare, lied to the guy to get off, but got caught out by a diligent member of staff who copped you where playing him

The fixed penalty is €100 its at the member of staff discretion to charge the lower €50 charge. Act the muppet in any way €100 it will be.

If you really don't like it go to court and you might get some time to think about it maybe, 3 to 6 months. Its smart arses like you thinking its acceptable to avoid fares and fines who are one of the reasons the damn fares are as bad as there are.

dazberry

Varkov wrote: »

Just rang to confirm, apparently its a seperate 50 euro charge for providing false information.

Fixed Penalties.pdf

If you board a service without a valid ticket, at a station
where a ticket selling facility was provided, you will be
charged the fixed penalty payment. The payment ranges
from €25 to a maximum of €100.

TBH I think all this is crazy, there should be just one fixed penalty [fullstop].

D.

Varkov

goingnowhere wrote: »

Its smart arses like you thinking its acceptable to avoid fares and fines who are one of the reasons the damn fares are as bad as there are.

The thing I'm majorly pissed off about it that i tried to pay on the other end, and opposed to the **** heads shooting up and causing disturbences on the trians everyday, I get ****ing fined.

Plus, yer man was being a right ****ing prick about it, lucky he dosen't get bottled.

paulm17781

Varkov wrote: »

Plus, yer man was being a right ****ing prick about it, lucky he dosen't get bottled.

Dude, I'd hate to have a 100 euro fine, I really would. Look at what you're writing though, you're still making out that it is his fault. All he did was his job. Stop blaming him and just make sure you have a ticket.

For many years (possible since their inception) it has been illegal to travel on an Irish Rail train without a valid ticket. Yes, they used to let people away with this and they shouldn't have. Now they're clamping down and people are getting caught. Somewhat unfairly but it is the law, they should have communicated it better (IMO).

None the less, you are talking about bottling and punching the guy, for doing his job. You were the one who did wrong today (I'm not trying to annoy you, it is fact). Just pay the fine and don't let it happen again, it avoids this kind of stress.

Tell me, if you do something in work that someone else doesn't like, should they "put my hood up and box the ****er" tomorrow or perhaps bottle you? I doubt you'd like it much.

Ckal

I can definitely see why they are clamping down. I know most people will try and get away without paying. But there are those who can't buy a ticket because the ticket booths are closed and/or the ticket machines don't work.

Surely when customers pay for overpriced tickets they should get a high-quality service which doesn't involve abandoned ticket booths, broken ticket machines, and late trains?

I know life isn't that easy. But they seem to manage in England, Wales, Norway, Germany and many other places I've been to where the tickets are cheap and the trains are on time.

I guess that's Ireland for ya.

paulm17781

Ckal wrote: »

I can definitely see why they are clamping down. I know most people will try and get away without paying. But there are those who can't buy a ticket because the ticket booths are closed and/or the ticket machines don't work.

You are under no obligation to buy a ticket if the booths are closed and there are no ticket machines. That is the only valid reason to travel without one. "The queue was too long", "I was running late.", "I don't like paying" are not valid reasons.

penexpers

Ckal wrote: »

I know life isn't that easy. But they seem to manage in England, Wales, Norway, Germany and many other places I've been to where the tickets are cheap and the trains are on time.

Trains in Germany and England/Wales are not always cheap. Cheap if you book months in advance, but not so cheap if you buy on the day.

I never did get that fine, i wrote about earlier.

Chap made a big deal of paying 80c less, cause its all i had to get home.


Wasnt even smart enough to get the fine to me.


The last few months they have been checking tickets on trains around lunch time between killester and raheny.

They only feel the need to do it at them stations for some reason.

ronano

has anyone refused to ring someone to confirm their address,what happens?

Varkov

I told him at first I wasn't going to ring, and he said he'd have to call the guards then.

Was thinking of legging it, but i've to use the station every day.

Varkov

Varkov wrote: »

I told him at first I wasn't going to ring, and he said he'd have to call the guards then.

Was thinking of legging it, but i've to use the station every day.

lol i got surrounded by 4 of em, had a route of escape planned

Victor

Varkov wrote: »

The thing I'm majorly pissed off about it that i tried to pay on the other end, and opposed to the **** heads shooting up and causing disturbences on the trians everyday, I get ****ing fined.

Plus, yer man was being a right ****ing prick about it, lucky he dosen't get bottled.

Whats the difference between shooting up and bottling someone?

At least the junkie isn't hurting someone directly from the shooting up (there is of course systematic crime in funding the drugs).

Varkov

cisk wrote: »

lol i got surrounded by 4 of em, had a route of escape planned

Yeah, I was eyeing up the barrier. "Could I vault that?"

cheesy-does-it

hey all,

just wondering if anyone has any advice...Yesterday I was getting the train from leixlip to drumcondra and was caught out without a ticket...no excuses, just caught out. Anywho the inspector asked for my i.d and i gave him my college i.d and he took down my name, then he asked for my address... I panicked and gave a fake address. He believed me and took it down and gave me the reciept thing. I was pretty chuffed then as i presumed i got away but I'm just wondering if there's any chance i could get caught? Mainly because the fake address i gave isn't a million miles away and if the people get the local guards to check my name my details could be in there somewhere...Would people think it's better to leave it and hope for the best or ring up Irish Rail and explain? I really don't want a thousand euro fine to be honest!!

Any advice greatly appreciated!

superman25

Hi,

Need your advice.
I have had the unfortunate experience of getting one of these €50 fines by asking to pay at my destination (Connolly) from Killester.
I am not a regular user of The DART and I had to use it one day. I have however payed at my destination in previous experiences and there was never a problem.
I got off at Connolly, went straight to "The Box" where this employee is and asked to pay for a ticket. He said "Yes" like a smart arse..none the less, ended up getting a fine of €50. i still went and purchased a ticket for my journey and I still have it.
I have appealed to IR with a negative reply and I wonder should I let it run on to the court.

Cheers

SerialComplaint

superman25 wrote: »

Hi,

Need your advice.
I have had the unfortunate experience of getting one of these €50 fines by asking to pay at my destination (Connolly) from Killester.
I am not a regular user of The DART and I had to use it one day. I have however payed at my destination in previous experiences and there was never a problem.
I got off at Connolly, went straight to "The Box" where this employee is and asked to pay for a ticket. He said "Yes" like a smart arse..none the less, ended up getting a fine of €50. i still went and purchased a ticket for my journey and I still have it.
I have appealed to IR with a negative reply and I wonder should I let it run on to the court.

Cheers

Was there any particular reason why you didn't buy a ticket at Killester?

spiderman1885

Think alot of people on here got offended by others not paying the fines...

IE employees?:D

brettmirl

I doubt it.

People who don't pay their way, push up the ticket costs for all the honest people who take the train.

dowlingm

spiderman1885 wrote: »

Think alot of people on here got offended by others not paying the fines...

IE employees?:D

Not me. Check the conflict of interest thread. Presume you're in there yourself?

stward23

Just wondering did u get that fine after? The sme thing happened to me the other day,I have a wrong address but real name and number! Cheers!

petepeanut

Superman
I found myself in the exact same position as you from killester into connolly. It was also the day of th ebus strikes so all off clontarf/ killester were getting the dart. what annoyed me most is that the guy at the other end was so steadfast in his refusal to budge. If I had tried to dodge or flash an old ticket I wouln't mind so much but th efact that I was very open about it annoyed me more.

well i guess I will either no always but a ticket or bunk on all of the time and if i do get caught I wont be so naive to provide them with my real name and address.

Maybe the guy in connolly is on a bonus for getting more fines in?
any thoughts?

petepeanut

can anyone answer me this. any there any rules covering the payment of fines. if i decide to be peevish and pay in pennies will it be accepted?
thanks

MOH

petepeanut wrote: »

Superman
I found myself in the exact same position as you from killester into connolly. It was also the day of th ebus strikes so all off clontarf/ killester were getting the dart. what annoyed me most is that the guy at the other end was so steadfast in his refusal to budge. If I had tried to dodge or flash an old ticket I wouln't mind so much but th efact that I was very open about it annoyed me more.

well i guess I will either no always but a ticket or bunk on all of the time and if i do get caught I wont be so naive to provide them with my real name and address.

Maybe the guy in connolly is on a bonus for getting more fines in?
any thoughts?

Probably no good to you, but Irish Rail did have displays saying they were accepting dublin bus tickets, so if you had one you should have grounds for an appeal.

petepeanut

thats great thanks.

I did have a dublin buss travel pass which I couldnt use on the day
thanks

MOH

petepeanut wrote: »

thats great thanks.

I did have a dublin buss travel pass which I couldnt use on the day
thanks

Oh, great! They didn't advertise it very well, but the message was displayed on the scolling platform displays - I definitely saw it at Killester both Monday and Tuesday, also in Blackrock, and it was on the TV screens at Pearse too.
Hope it works out OK!

Victor

petepeanut wrote: »

Superman
I found myself in the exact same position as you from killester into connolly. It was also the day of th ebus strikes so all off clontarf/ killester were getting the dart. what annoyed me most is that the guy at the other end was so steadfast in his refusal to budge. If I had tried to dodge or flash an old ticket I wouln't mind so much but th efact that I was very open about it annoyed me more.

Would you have told a bus driver that you'd pay at the other end?

If you hold a Dublin Bus annual / monthly pass, these were being accepted by Irish Rail during the unoffical strike. If this is the case, talk to Irish Rail and explain the situation.

well i guess I will either no always but a ticket or bunk on all of the time and if i do get caught I wont be so naive to provide them with my real name and address.

And they might just call the Garda (or have them there already) and you could be arrested.

Maybe the guy in connolly is on a bonus for getting more fines in?
any thoughts?

Maybe he's just doing his job?

petepeanut wrote: »

if i decide to be peevish and pay in pennies will it be accepted?

Legally, people don't have to accept more than 50 coins. They could rightly refuse you and the ticket would stand and a summons and day in court would follow.