Liverpool v Stoke

ntlbell · 20-09-2008 7:44pm

Stekelly wrote: »

How do you figure that? Defensive mistakes caused all 3 goals. The first Liverpool one was just the worst. For the Utd goal there was no one within 10 yards of Tevez. Thats a gift in my book.

some form of defensive mistakes tends to cause most goals..

but the type of mistakes e.g. own goals etc are out of character for united

e.g. you wont see united scoring many own goals

you will see liverpool losing a fair few goals by a non existent marker

Guy:Incognito · 20-09-2008 7:45pm

ntlbell wrote: »

some form of defensive mistakes tends to cause most goals..

but the type of mistakes e.g. own goals etc are out of character for united

e.g. you wont see united scoring many own goals

you will see liverpool losing a fair few goals by a non existent marker

There was one own goal last week, You said Utd scored 2 for us.

LuckyLloyd · 20-09-2008 7:47pm

sitout wrote: »

tut tut tut . Once again Liverpool go one step forward and two steps back. This is an absolute disaster of a result for the Liverpool no one wins the league by dropping points at home to stoke.

Ah the old saying. A strange one - particularly given that Stoke have never been in the Premiership before.

ntlbell · 20-09-2008 7:49pm

Stekelly wrote: »

There was one own goal last week, You said Utd scored 2 for us.

hmm

I'll try one more time...

the defensive mistakes _both_ of them were totally out of character for united

you prob won't see them again all season..

you will see a player coming into the pool box unmarked and scoring throughout the rest of this campaign..

Guy:Incognito · 20-09-2008 7:50pm

ntlbell wrote: »

hmm

I'll try one more time...

the defensive mistakes _both_ of them were totally out of character for united

you prob won't see them again all season..

you will see a player coming into the pool box unmarked and scoring throughout the rest of this campaign..

Try what one more time? YOu specifically said they scored both goals for us. Pretty much every goal includes some sort of defensive mistake, for every team. That doesnt equal that team scoring for you.

jesus_thats_gre · 20-09-2008 7:51pm

Dave! wrote: »

Controversial!

Tis a fact in fairness.. It should have been disallowed.

Guy:Incognito · 20-09-2008 7:52pm

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Ah the old saying. A strange one - particularly given that Stoke have never been in the Premiership before.

Its a crap really. these "most" dont seem to know what they are talking about half the time. "most" would also have said that you cant win the league by losing twice to City.

ntlbell · 20-09-2008 7:55pm

Stekelly wrote: »

Try what one more time? YOu specifically said they scored both goals for us. Pretty much every goal includes some sort of defensive mistake, for every team. That doesnt equal that team scoring for you.

the point i'm making is

to get excited and think anythings changed at liverpool basing the fact they beat an OFF FORM united regardless of how the goals were scored is nothing but delusion

hows that?

Nalz · 20-09-2008 8:29pm

LuckyLloyd wrote: »

Ah the old saying. A strange one - particularly given that Stoke have never been in the Premiership before.

This is the common type of remark made in boards these days, people dont wanna read tripe like that. I'm sure as well as everybody else that the poster meant teams like Stoke.

Boards...now ye're nitpickin

Boggles · 20-09-2008 8:35pm

I don't know what all the fuss is about, didn't Livepool draw at home against Birmingham last year and they went on to win....oh right yeah.

Mr.Nice Guy · 20-09-2008 8:39pm

Poor result from Liverpool but you can't say the title race is over at this stage. Remember United only drew 0-0 with Reading early last season and went on to become champions while Reading went on to be relegated.

Let's keep things in perspective. It won't be until November that Liverpool are out of the title race.

Nalz · 20-09-2008 8:44pm

Without question Liverpool will be closer this season.

eagle eye · 20-09-2008 8:46pm

Trilla wrote: »

Without question Liverpool will be closer this season.

NO

GuanYin · 20-09-2008 8:48pm

Keep it on topic and stop the personal comments

ntlbell · 20-09-2008 8:57pm

Trilla wrote: »

This is the common type of remark made in boards these days, people dont wanna read tripe like that. I'm sure as well as everybody else that the poster meant teams like Stoke.

Boards...now ye're nitpickin

What do you mean teams like Stoke?

Stoke have played pretty well since arriving in the premiership.

but most teams outside of the top 4 put 11 men behind the ball home and away against the top 4 but some teams like arsenal/chelsea/united in general have the players to play through it

Liverpool over the years have struggled to do it..

it doesn't take a genuis

ntlbell · 20-09-2008 8:58pm

Trilla wrote: »

Without question Liverpool will be closer this season.

based on what?

adding robbie keane? really?

kyp_durron · 20-09-2008 9:01pm

eagle eye wrote: »

NO

Can't bring myself to sleep
So I get the keys to my jeep
Well there's nothin' that I ain't gonna do tonight
Dial on room number 211
Cos I hear there a jam that's goin' on
The feelin' is so good in my neighbourhood
Ooh there's somethin' special 'bout tonight
And I know it's on
Cos everybody's got their groove on
I, I wanna let it go
Are ya here with me I said I wanna hear the party sing
If ya down throw ya hands up in the air
The mac's back wid da flava of the year
Here we go there's a party over here
Oh yes there is
If ya down throw ya hands up in the air
The mac's back wid da flava of the year
Thats why I'm kickin' in the flava

gixerfixer · 20-09-2008 9:08pm

FFS. Before the Man U game i would have taken 4 points from our next two games. I really thought it would be a draw with utd and be would have stuffed this lot but hey it didnt work out like that. People really need to calm down a bit and remember if it's a draw tomorrow (which is highly likely) we will be level with Chelsea and Man U will be looking up at us in the table. I can tell you for a fact i would have taken that at the start of the season after 5 games.:)

kyp_durron · 20-09-2008 9:12pm

ntlbell wrote: »

based on what?

adding robbie keane? really?

Robbie Keane is very good at soccer.

opr · 20-09-2008 9:33pm

ntlbell wrote: »

based on what?

adding robbie keane? really?

Alonso was well off form for alot of last term. Signs so far have been encouraging as hes putting in much better performances this season.

Mascherano was really in his first proper season at a top premiership club last year. The role he plays i think takes a huge amount of experience and hes learning all the time. I think he will be a much improved player this term.

Reira looks like he can provide real width on the wings and a genuine outlet to get the ball wide something we have been crying out for. I know its really early days but he looks decent.

Babel is like a new player for us if he starts playing more games this season. I mean again hes a really young guy who is still adjusting to premiership. He the one guy when i talk to fans of other clubs that they all say they think hes got potential to be a real good player. I think this is the season when hes gonna start showing that big time.

Keane hasn't had a good start to his liverpool career and i was so frustrated watching him today. But in the long run i am not in the least bit worried that Robbie will be a success. Yes we overpaid but i think very few people doubt hes a quailty player who always give 100% so i don't see how that can't improve us. I actually think the fact he hasn't really worked in the liverpool team as of yet is great as i really look forward to when he does click as even without this happening we still have had a decent start to both domestic and european campaign results wise.

I could go on and on and i am very confident we will be much closer this year.

Opr

Galvasean · 20-09-2008 9:34pm

Galvasean wrote: »

Gonna bet Robbie gets a hat trick. Just got a feeling.

Few! Glad I was to sick to go to the bookies today

Boggles · 20-09-2008 9:37pm

opr wrote: »

Babel is like a new player for us if he starts playing more games this season. I mean again hes a really young guy who is still adjusting to premiership.

He will be 22 in a couple of months, he is not that féckíng young.

kyp_durron · 20-09-2008 9:42pm

21, he's OLD!

ntlbell · 20-09-2008 9:59pm

opr wrote: »

Alonso was well off form for alot of last term. Signs so far have been encouraging as hes putting in much better performances this season.

Mascherano was really in his first proper season at a top premiership club last year. The role he plays i think takes a huge amount of experience and hes learning all the time. I think he will be a much improved player this term.

Reira looks like he can provide real width on the wings and a genuine outlet to get the ball wide something we have been crying out for. I know its really early days but he looks decent.

Babel is like a new player for us if he starts playing more games this season. I mean again hes a really young guy who is still adjusting to premiership. He the one guy when i talk to fans of other clubs that they all say they think hes got potential to be a real good player. I think this is the season when hes gonna start showing that big time.

Keane hasn't had a good start to his liverpool career and i was so frustrated watching him today. But in the long run i am not in the least bit worried that Robbie will be a success. Yes we overpaid but i think very few people doubt hes a quailty player who always give 100% so i don't see how that can't improve us. I actually think the fact he hasn't really worked in the liverpool team as of yet is great as i really look forward to when he does click as even without this happening we still have had a decent start to both domestic and european campaign results wise.

I could go on and on and i am very confident we will be much closer this year.

Opr

but you could take any of the top 3

change a few players name's

and they'll all have the same advances

they all have players that didn't have great seasons last year and MIGHT be better this year

they all have players who were new to the premiership and MIGHT do better this season

so if all the players in all 4 teams do aswell as expected wont the gap be just the same?

if's and buts and hope's

isn't the same every year for pool fans?

jesus_thats_gre · 20-09-2008 10:03pm

Boggles wrote: »

He will be 22 in a couple of months, he is not that féckíng young.

Jesus ****ing christ, do you take ****ing issue with everything..

His point that he is a developing young talent that shows alot of propect and will likely be a position to offer more this season than he did last season is still a valid point.

So, considering what is being said, can you not be such a pedantic ass master and stop doing your best to argue with every statement that any Liverpool man makes..

You will no doubt think that Liverpool fans are over sensitive and you are doing no harm. How come it only you that 30 or 40 people are constantly having issue with then? I have no one on my ignore list and do my best to ignore people but jesus ****ing christ, you would test anyone!!

jesus_thats_gre · 20-09-2008 10:11pm

ntlbell wrote: »

but you could take any of the top 3

change a few players name's

and they'll all have the same advances

they all have players that didn't have great seasons last year and MIGHT be better this year

they all have players who were new to the premiership and MIGHT do better this season

so if all the players in all 4 teams do aswell as expected wont the gap be just the same?

if's and buts and hope's

isn't the same every year for pool fans?

Are you actually serious? It is the same with every group of fans!!! Some people on this forum are completely retarded.

It is amazing how bias can influence some people.

You have a Liverpool fan attempting to justify why they feel that the club will do better this season. The points he made are pretty reasonable and don't really stretch the truth at all. This gets the bull**** response that is above.

At the same time, you have 50 people coming onto this thread on a daily basis constantly harping on about how Liverpool will struggle to make 4th this season or whatever. Virtually none of the points made are based on anything truthful but nothing is done about it at all.

Something really needs to be done about this sort of **** as it would seem that quite alot of users of the Liverpool persuassion are leaving these forums.

Sherifu · 20-09-2008 10:16pm

Boards is going downhill alright. Shame.

LuckyLloyd · 20-09-2008 10:16pm

Trilla wrote: »

This is the common type of remark made in boards these days, people dont wanna read tripe like that. I'm sure as well as everybody else that the poster meant teams like Stoke.

Boards...now ye're nitpickin

You may not want to read that, but I don't want to read hilarious result based overreactions after each Liverpool game. So what are we to do? I for one intend to continue posting as I keep fit.

opr · 20-09-2008 10:20pm

ntlbell wrote: »

but you could take any of the top 3

change a few players name's

and they'll all have the same advances

they all have players that didn't have great seasons last year and MIGHT be better this year

they all have players who were new to the premiership and MIGHT do better this season

so if all the players in all 4 teams do aswell as expected wont the gap be just the same?

if's and buts and hope's

isn't the same every year for pool fans?

Not at all true. The point in case of being champions is based on the fact that your players were the best. This means in most cases they have performed in every area of the pitch to a really high standard. In some cases they have even maybe over performed. I think Ronaldo will stuggle to ever score that amount of goals in a season again.

What we need to close the gap is to have our players perfom to that same high stand that the united players did last season. Of course you also need quailty and skill in those players and thats something that takes times to see or maybe develops more slowly than with other players.

Every team is a collection of "if's and buts and hope's" until they prove on the pitch that the deserve to be known as more than that. The point is alot of our players are still "if's and buts and hope's" unlike most of united players who have proved to be more than that. The point i was making is i still believe alot of our players can show more than they have wether they will remains to be seen.

“Hope is important because it can make the present moment less difficult to bear. If we believe that tomorrow will be better, we can bear a hardship today.”

Opr

ntlbell · 20-09-2008 10:25pm

jesus_thats_gre wrote: »

Are you actually serious? It is the same with every group of fans!!! Some people on this forum are completely retarded.

It is amazing how bias can influence some people.

You have a Liverpool fan attempting to justify why they feel that the club will do better this season. The points he made are pretty reasonable and don't really stretch the truth at all. This gets the bull**** response that is above.

At the same time, you have 50 people coming onto this thread on a daily basis constantly harping on about how Liverpool will struggle to make 4th this season or whatever. Virtually none of the points made are based on anything truthful but nothing is done about it at all.

Something really needs to be done about this sort of **** as it would seem that quite alot of users of the Liverpool persuassion are leaving these forums.

Eh?

It's fairly straight forward..

I asked why the guy thought he felt the pool will be closer

pool fan points out some players who were not up to par last year and thinks they MIGHT be better this year

each of the top 3 have the exact same issues players who were not up to par up and coming talent so THESE are bull**** reasons..

GOOD REASONS

would be well we have brought in much better players than the top 3 have we now have more world class players so in theory we should finish closer

liverpool haven't done that IMO they haven't brought in players that are better than the players the top 3 teams have

is this so hard to understand?

so if the top 4 all have the same results with their respected players why would liverpool be any closer than previous years?

give it a few minutes, it will sink in...

ntlbell · 20-09-2008 10:27pm

opr wrote: »

Not at all true. The point in case of being champions is based on the fact that your players were the best. This means in most cases they have performed in every area of the pitch to a really high standard. In some cases they have even maybe over performed. I think Ronaldo will stuggle to ever score that amount of goals in a season again.

What we need to close the gap is to have our players perfom to that same high stand that the united players did last season. Of course you also need quailty and skill in those players and thats something that takes times to see or maybe develops more slowly than with other players.

Every team is a collection of "if's and buts and hope's" until they prove on the pitch that the deserve to be known as more than that. The point is alot of our players are still "if's and buts and hope's" unlike most of united players who have proved to be more than that. The point i was making is i still believe alot of our players can show more than they have wether they will remains to be seen.

“Hope is important because it can make the present moment less difficult to bear. If we believe that tomorrow will be better, we can bear a hardship today.”

Opr

but even with a lot of the players playing to a high standard at united there were players who didn't they're players who are new to the team and were fitting in so if they improve as much as the liverpool players do then surley the gap will be the same?

I'll add were ronaldo over performed from a goal scoring point of view I think rooney and tevez are under performing so by your thinking if tevez and rooney and can up the game a bit the fact that ronaldo won't repeat what he did last year if tevez and rooney not to mention berbo add more it will even itself out

still leaving the same gap..

opr · 20-09-2008 10:44pm

ntlbell wrote: »

but even with a lot of the players playing to a high standard at united there were players who didn't they're players who are new to the team and were fitting in so if they improve as much as the liverpool players do then surley the gap will be the same?

No because i believe those below par player you refer to for united last season were at times carried by Ronaldo and i don't see him being able to match the kind of phenomenal season of last term. Early united performances have also kinda supported this.

I think you have few players who are putting in the last of their performances at the highest level.

You talk about bringing in players who are better than whats around in the other big teams. Berbatov may be undoubted quailty but i think hes a lazy ass %^*$ who will never put in the work that needed as a united player to keep bringing the success they are so used too.

Its gives me great heart to see the like of Park, and Fletcher line out for Man U the other night as while these players are ok they are not top quailty and certainly imo shouldn't be playing for Man United.

I am not trying to turn this into a muck throwing based argument because i know equally you could point out huge problems in the liverpool team.

The point is i don't think United are getting better but i believe liverpool are so this is why i think the gap will close.

Opr

ntlbell · 20-09-2008 10:49pm

opr wrote: »

No because i believe those below par player you refer to for united last season were at times carried by Ronaldo and i don't see him being able to match the kind of phenomenal season of last term. Early united performances have also kinda supported this.

I think you have few players who are putting in the last of their performances at the highest level.

You talk about bringing in players who are better than whats around in the other big teams. Berbatov may be undoubted quailty but i think hes a lazy ass %^*$ who will never put in the work that needed as a united player to keep bringing the success they are so used too.

Its gives me great heart to see the like of Park, and Fletcher line out for Man U the other night as while these players are ok they are not top quailty and certainly imo shouldn't be playing for Man United.

I am not trying to turn this into a muck throwing based argument because i know equally you could point out huge problems in the liverpool team.

The point is i don't think United are getting better but i believe liverpool are so this is why i think the gap will close.

Opr

ronaldo might be carrying the strikers but

there are others to improve

nani/anderson et all ronaldo's not carrying the whole team..

ntlbell · 20-09-2008 10:50pm

opr wrote: »

I am not trying to turn this into a muck throwing based argument because i know equally you could point out huge problems in the liverpool team.

The point is i don't think United are getting better but i believe liverpool are so this is why i think the gap will close.

Opr

no there'll be no muck throwing..

again what are you basing the fact united are not getting better on?

3 games?

eagle eye · 20-09-2008 10:56pm

opr wrote: »

No because i believe those below par player you refer to for united last season were at times carried by Ronaldo and i don't see him being able to match the kind of phenomenal season of last term. Early united performances have also kinda supported this.

I think you have few players who are putting in the last of their performances at the highest level.

You talk about bringing in players who are better than whats around in the other big teams. Berbatov may be undoubted quailty but i think hes a lazy ass %^*$ who will never put in the work that needed as a united player to keep bringing the success they are so used too.

Its gives me great heart to see the like of Park, and Fletcher line out for Man U the other night as while these players are ok they are not top quailty and certainly imo shouldn't be playing for Man United.

I am not trying to turn this into a muck throwing based argument because i know equally you could point out huge problems in the liverpool team.

The point is i don't think United are getting better but i believe liverpool are so this is why i think the gap will close.

Opr

The gap might well close between United and Liverpool but Chelsea and Arsenal have both improved and I don't see Liverpool closing the gap on them teams.
The problem I expect for Liverpool is that with their results against the bottom sides last season and what happened today, and against Standard Liege in both legs, its become clear that Liverpool find it difficult to break down defensive sides. I can see a lot of Managers adopting this approach now.
I don't see the other big three having these problems, they always get plenty of chances and invariably win more than Liverpool in these situations.

watman · 20-09-2008 11:18pm

Stoke fan here lucky enough to have gone to today's game . Of course i am extremely happy with the very unexpected point but still have no idea how , what or why andre marriner decided to disallow gerrards goal. We took a gamble that we could deal with everything ye threw at us , rode our luck and just about got a way with it . I do think liverpool will be closer this season , all that was wrong today was woeful finishing.

ntlbell · 20-09-2008 11:35pm

watman wrote: »

Stoke fan here lucky enough to have gone to today's game . Of course i am extremely happy with the very unexpected point but still have no idea how , what or why andre marriner decided to disallow gerrards goal. We took a gamble that we could deal with everything ye threw at us , rode our luck and just about got a way with it . I do think liverpool will be closer this season , all that was wrong today was woeful finishing.

have you seen it since?

wasn't torres offside?

citytillidie · 20-09-2008 11:48pm

No Torres was not offside

Nalz · 20-09-2008 11:58pm

ntlbell wrote: »

What do you mean teams like Stoke?

What do I mean teams like Stoke? Ah here you for real? Teams that are amongst the favourites to go down, that have very little money to spend and not the quality in their squad that most prem teams do. did you really need me to reply and confirm that. You know quite well thats what the poster meant when he just said Stoke. The reply i'm refering to "old saying" or whatever it was, was just stupid and its a sign of how things seem to be on here lately...

Luckyloyd wrote:

You may not want to read that, but I don't want to read hilarious result based overreactions after each Liverpool game

Whats with the constant bickering though? And I do recall an awful lot of "overreactions" as you put it last weekend. Are these kinda comments going to continue? The Man City comment also, I dont know who that was and I'm not going to bother to check. We can do without comments like that.

Again another Liverpool or Man United thread ends up in a na-nana-na-na we're better than you thread.

Other points - how the hell is 21/22 old or not young?

Liverpool have added other players to their squad than Robbie Keane, Riera looks decent and Agger is getting back to fitness. Reina is a different man from 2 years ago...they seem to already have a more solid look about them. I have a feeling/opinion call it what you will that they'll be stronger, no need to jump down the throat on that comment. I dont think Arsenal will keep up their current form, I think they'll be found out. I also believe Chelsea will be stronger and United slightly weaker (especially if they lose tomorrow) because of Quieroz leaving. Btw I'm a United fan but I don't come on here for a virtual "your shi'te we're deadly" session.

All of the top 4 will be closely packed together, alot more than last season. Teams are going to drop points here and there true, but come May dont be surprised that if Liverpool are 4th or 2nd they'll be less then the 11 points off the top from last season.

Ray Houghton seemed to think both Liverpool players were offside on The Premiership or whatever its called now.

watman · 21-09-2008 12:45am

ntlbell wrote: »

have you seen it since?

wasn't torres offside?

I have now seen the incident again ,even through my red and white stripped tinted glasses, torres was not offside, Teams drop points , like last year the league will probably be won with the results between the top 4 sides. So far liverpool are +3. As for us 17th will do me

eagle eye · 21-09-2008 12:53am

watman wrote: »

I have now seen the incident again ,even through my red and white stripped tinted glasses, torres was not offside, Teams drop points , like last year the league will probably be won with the results between the top 4 sides. So far liverpool are +3. As for us 17th will do me

You should take a look at the stats I posted back a bit.

If the top four never played each other last season, Liverpool would still have finished 4th.
I cannot see Liverpool taking 10 points from those games even with 3 points already. I can see 8 points as a possibility. That won't change the placings from last year. Its how you get on against the bad teams that makes the difference as was the case last year. Thats why the one point today is unacceptable.

raven136 · 21-09-2008 1:40am

didnt see anyone write united off when they drew 0-0 at home with newcastle.Have they also scored less than Liverpool.
Just wondering about these things cause i heard its a three horse race now:rolleyes:

Jazzy · 21-09-2008 4:58am

this much liverpool bashing and boggles is not involved?
for shame.

we were terrible today. i have no reason to believe keane was a good signing so far. he was invisible today. and arent these the games we bought him for?
Reira is good at best. he wont change liverpool or their results. from wat i saw today i really think beating man utd was more down to luck and them playing poorly rather then us beating them.

Third_Echelon · 21-09-2008 4:59am

citytillidie wrote: »

No Torres was not offside

From looking at the replays it looked offside to me. Torres was ahead of the last defender when the ball was delivered. He made an attempt to go for the ball, therefore he was 'active'. Therefore offside. Tight decision, but I reckon the linesman got it right.

ntlbell · 21-09-2008 10:13am

Jazzy wrote: »

this much liverpool bashing and boggles is not involved?
for shame.

we were terrible today. i have no reason to believe keane was a good signing so far. he was invisible today. and arent these the games we bought him for?
Reira is good at best. he wont change liverpool or their results. from wat i saw today i really think beating man utd was more down to luck and them playing poorly rather then us beating them.

no ones really bashing liverpool fans but a lot of fans think being realistic is bashing them

they haven't brought anyone in that will bring them closer

so it will be as you were at the top..

no bashing..

Chardee MacDennis · 21-09-2008 10:28am

yawn....

gixerfixer · 21-09-2008 10:31am

ntlbell wrote: »

no ones really bashing liverpool fans but a lot of fans think being realistic is bashing them

they haven't brought anyone in that will bring them closer

so it will be as you were at the top..

no bashing..

Em Riera and Keane

Boggles · 21-09-2008 10:31am

Third_Echelon wrote: »

From looking at the replays it looked offside to me. Torres was ahead of the last defender when the ball was delivered. He made an attempt to go for the ball, therefore he was 'active'. Therefore offside. Tight decision, but I reckon the linesman got it right.

I've looked at it a few times, I can't tell, maybe there are better angles than this one.

http://soccereview.blogspot.com/2008/09/highlights-video-liverpool-vs-stoke.html

gixerfixer · 21-09-2008 10:34am

FFS. Who cares if it was a goal or not. Sh*t happens. Most important thing was we are playing much much better in the last couple of games and we are still in the shake up at the top. If we are still there come April then happy days.

Boggles · 21-09-2008 10:38am

gixerfixer wrote: »

FFS. Who cares if it was a goal or not.

Rafa

http://news.bbc.co.uk/sport2/hi/football/eng_prem/7627492.stm

Liverpool v Stoke

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