HCAP Range Test

shaft666

rrpc wrote: »

Interesting to note that DMQ only maintain quality standards and issue certification to those running the courses. This backs up what Sparks said earlier about setting and maintaining standards in these courses.

The only problem I see here with this approach is the numbers involved: The DMQ has qualified over 25,000 people whereas here there is a max of maybe 3,000 (and that's being generous) who would need to take a course making it pretty much non-viable as a commercial proposition and therefore adding a competitive element to the course fees.

In other words we'll all get fleeced!
It astounds me Brussels hasn't got hold of this yet and issued an EEC wide standard test but I suppose it will come one day.

Paul

rrpc

shaft666 wrote: »

In other words we'll all get fleeced!
It astounds me Brussels hasn't got hold of this yet and issued an EEC wide standard test but I suppose it will come one day.

Paul

In fairness the HCAP isn't very expensive as courses go. €150 for the course, test and range test isn't bad. Going back to the ECDL, when that came out first it was €295 for 70 hours of tuition and an extra €70 for the test with additional fees if you failed any module and had to sit it again.

I've no idea what the cost is now, but it was relatively expensive (IMO) and was an EU standardised test.

shaft666

rrpc wrote: »

In fairness the HCAP isn't very expensive as courses go. €150 for the course, test and range test isn't bad. Going back to the ECDL, when that came out first it was €295 for 70 hours of tuition and an extra €70 for the test with additional fees if you failed any module and had to sit it again.

I've no idea what the cost is now, but it was relatively expensive (IMO) and was an EU standardised test.

I think the cost of the HCAP is very reasonable. You sure it's e150? I'm looking at an advert for it in Septembers Irish Shooters Digest which quotes e100 for first time candidate/e50 for repeat test and e35 for the training manual.

Paul

rrpc

shaft666 wrote: »

I think the cost of the HCAP is very reasonable. You sure it's e150? I'm looking at an advert for it in Septembers Irish Shooters Digest which quotes e100 for first time candidate/e50 for repeat test and e35 for the training manual.

Paul

You're right Paul, I was looking at the cost of a repeat range test and thought that was the fee for the range test separate to the written test.

So the test in full costs €100 plus the manual.

Grizzly 45

[

quote=rrpc;57380533]Only if you want to shoot on Coillte lands. On the other hand there are many European countries that adopt the same approach for all shooters. In Italy and Spain you have to do a test to get a gun licence, the Italians in fact have the whole thing under the Department of the Army!

Indeed,that is all over Europe and pretty much a given.However case in point Italy,it is so corrupt the system over there you virtually Buy the liscenses over there for watever you want.
Nor are the Italians paragons of safe hunters either!!They manage to shoot about a half dozen of themselves every year,in la passione grande[sorry my Italino isnt that up to scratch to write it properly:o]

The argument is that it puts a little bit of training between peoples ears so that they don't shoot someone by accident or leave a wounded deer wandering around the forests. If people don't feel that they should have their competency tested then they are free to not get involved. If they learn something along the way like not leaving a frearm loaded, well that's an improvement right there.

Does it???Do you drive exactly every day like you did on your driving test???We all mostly promptly reverted back to driving the way we did when we were on L plates.We are supposed to know how to be safe drivers,yet we all have bad driving habits and full liscenses.You cant account forhuman nature,sure we can all bone up for a test,and once we have the paper,go back to normal..What has been achived??We lost some more freedom,had move govt intrusion in our lives,were gypped of more money,and promptly forgot all that was taught.Think it is called delusion.

Or something like having your leaving or junior cert papers rechecked (€30 per paper), or your NCT test redone etc. etc. In the case of the HCAP its a re-test btw, not a re-assessment. You get to sit the test all over again for half price.

IOW like everything in Ireland Govt approved or appointed MONEY SPINNER!!!!Amazing ....anywhere else you pay the fee and if within 31 days you redo the requirement it is for free!!After 31 days it costs the same again,and you restart from scratch.Why do we always have to have here in Ireland a con angle to get more money out of people????:mad: Nor do you have to wait an age for results like here.21 days max is the std in Europe for a Govt reply.31 in the US,and they generally manage it in 14 days.[Apart from the Feds when it comes to class 3 firearms..Slow lot them]

As for the Data Protection Act, the HCAP would have to comply with it. As for people with a dispute, well has anyone got any input on how these are dealt with?[/quote]
[/QUOTE]
Well in that case they should have this point made VERY CLEARLY on their website,and have a policy document with the data protection comissioner for public viewing online.

hazza

Did the HCAP range test on Saturday and passed:D.
Now the real learning starts, out in the field.
Cheers everyone for your tips and words of wisdom, very encouraging and it helped.

jwshooter

hazza wrote: »

Did the HCAP range test on Saturday and passed:D.
Now the real learning starts, out in the field.
Cheers everyone for your tips and words of wisdom, very encouraging and it helped.

good man well done . it was a fine day sat ,would not like to take a standing shot today , now you have done it and passed .what have you learned about deer and the proper way of culling them and the management of our wild deer .have you learned about how to kill them or about them ,witch is more important. hazza this question is not just for yourself but for all that have done the hcap ,also what do you think the course should have told you .the only thing i learned from the hcap is sika stags dont make a alarm call,

hazza

jwshooter wrote: »

good man well done . it was a fine day sat ,would not like to take a standing shot today , now you have done it and passed .what have you learned about deer and the proper way of culling them and the management of our wild deer .have you learned about how to kill them or about them ,witch is more important. hazza this question is not just for yourself but for all that have done the hcap ,also what do you think the course should have told you .the only thing i learned from the hcap is sika stags dont make a alarm call,

I think like I said the real learning starts now.
The HCAP in fairness I would reckon is a good broad introduction to anyone wanting to start into deer stalking. In the absence of any other training course (that I am aware of) in ireland it is just that but a good starting point. The weakness is that there is so much more in practical fieldcraft to learn that it should be a subsequent (ie section 2) part of the certification. This should entail a witnessed stalk, carcass handling etc....I suppose something along the lines of our UK and European counterparts. And from rumours about I think that a HCAP part 2 could well materialise

The other aspect of course is should the certification of deer stalking just apply to Coillte leases. For example to drive a car you need to be licenced but you dont exempt someone from this requirement just because they drive the backroads. Anyway just my 2 cents (euro currency);)

ianoo

well done hazza
iwas there myself on saturday and passed
think i must of been talking to you ??

ian

hazza

Yeah thanks ianoo, well done to you as well.:)
We were lucky with the weather which helped a lot.
Must have been twenty odd lads there, I didnt hang around too long but I hope the rest got on OK.

jwshooter

hazza wrote: »

Yeah thanks ianoo, well done to you as well.:)
We were lucky with the weather which helped a lot.
Must have been twenty odd lads there, I didnt hang around too long but I hope the rest got on OK.

i cant see level two in the hcap, as the guys running it would not have the practical experience .easy read or wright a book and quote from it ,also they have no ground to run one on .

Gerri

jwshooter wrote: »

i cant see level two in the hcap, as the guys running it would not have the practical experience .easy read or wright a book and quote from it ,also they have no ground to run one on .

Are you sure they don't have the practical experience? Also, why would they need ground to run one on?

ianoo

hazza wrote: »

Yeah thanks ianoo, well done to you as well.:)
We were lucky with the weather which helped a lot.
Must have been twenty odd lads there, I didnt hang around too long but I hope the rest got on OK.

well hazza
it was about twelve when i got away ..most of the lads had passed at that stage but there was still some on the range....

ian

hazza

ianoo wrote: »

well hazza
it was about twelve when i got away ..most of the lads had passed at that stage but there was still some on the range....

ian

You must have got away the same time as myself so. Wondering if we were talking ......... I'm taking it you were on the first detail, what number were you?
hazza

tiny-nioclas

Are you sure they don't have the practical experience? Also, why would they need ground to run one on?

For the DSC level 2 you need to go on a stalk with an accredited witness(profession deer manager/stalker) and carry out everything perfectly, the stalk, the shot, the gralloch etc so i presume jw's talking about that??........a money racket is all it is :rolleyes:................ just kidding..

jwshooter

tiny-nioclas wrote: »

For the DSC level 2 you need to go on a stalk with an accredited witness(profession deer manager/stalker) and carry out everything perfectly, the stalk, the shot, the gralloch etc so i presume jw's talking about that??........a money racket is all it is :rolleyes:................ just kidding..

yes tiny and more ,its a money racket in the uk .i think the hcap is gone far enough with out becoming a total joke .

ianoo

hazza wrote: »

You must have got away the same time as myself so. Wondering if we were talking ......... I'm taking it you were on the first detail, what number were you?
hazza

well hazza
no i was on the second detail no.8 ,could be wrong about the time i left 12ish to 1ish.....
ian

Tackleberrywho

For the DSC level 2 you need to go on a stalk with an accredited witness(profession deer manager/stalker) and carry out everything perfectly, the stalk, the shot, the gralloch etc so i presume jw's talking about that??........a money racket is all it is :

I wish I could get somebody help me deer stalking, dragging a deer out over fences across drains clean out the carcass, skin it, butcher etc.. Could this accredited witness(profession deer manager/stalker)[/B]
Help me with this??
I never did the HCAP, but I did read ever article on my deer species "fallow", i watch out for ticks on deer. I also found my harris bi-pod and a good scope and rifle make a reasonable shooter look good, also crawling on my belly like a leopard through the undergrowth also helped me out. And I prefer head shots as it keeps my carcass clean. and saves more meat for the pot.

I neither pay to rent PERMISSION to shoot, I find a tin of USA at Christmas does the trick, if you get my drift:D

And Gentlemen.please this is not meant as an insult to anybody. Just hope it gives a sm ile to some who know what6 I am referring to.

.243 express

IV done and passed the Hcap(wow).A money spinner that has to be done.Better to do it now than when it becomes COMPULSORY ...On the day i did it the guy that runs the course met some people that he knew and that had passed the course(Range test),.He wanted a picture with them and walked out on to a LIVE FIRING RANGE to take a picture with them....What a Plonker...He got some abuse off of the guys who were firing.This IS the person who was passing and failing people.What A JOKE......And for the record there were about 20 Witnesses.

Magnusd

Do you need a deer calibre to do the range test or will a .22 do ?

I'd like to do the HCAp first to help with my application for a .243 or .308.

Is insurance mandatory ?