Should Mary Harney resign?

is_that_so

ninty9er wrote: »

I can't recall FF ever blaming Harney for anything that went wrong in Health.

She's the most important minister to have controlled health in a long time, not just for what's been done already, but for what's planned and the full intent to do it regardless of how it hits her popularity.

I'm of the belief that tough decisions pay off politically in the long run. For example; placing the burden of 3rd level fees back on the middle classes won't be popular, but I don't think you'll find any other party taking them back under state responsibility if they get into power. This means for all the moaning a different future government may do when in opposition, faced with the same circumstances, it would have done the same when it was in opposition. Once the people see this, it presents a more democratic electoral choice.

I don't recall suggesting FF had blamed her.

I started off agreeing here until I realised it was another party political broadcast and as blinkered at they come. Of course we need hard decisions thanks to where this present Govt has steered us. The tough decisions are of their own making. This is not about third level fees, it's about running a country during tougher times. The irony of it is that the people with most experience of hard decisions are sitting on the opposition benches.

ninty9er

is_that_so wrote: »

The irony of it is that the people with most experience of hard decisions are sitting on the opposition benches.

And do you not see the irony in that.....they didn't exactly get it right, did they now?

There are very few people in Leinster House, in either chamber, with experience of running a country in recession. But recession has nothing to do with this conversation, which is about health service reform.

is_that_so

ninty9er wrote: »

And do you not see the irony in that.....they didn't exactly get it right, did they now?

There are very few people in Leinster House, in either chamber, with experience of running a country in recession. But recession has nothing to do with this conversation, which is about health service reform.

Nope not lost on me at all, any more than the dread of where we are going to end up, with health reform or anything else. Health reform is also about reforming attitudes. It's like watching headless chickens at the moment.

Harney doesn't help any more than Drumm by not managing expectations. Her main fault is that she seemed to assume that Health could be turned around in the way she cracked heads in Trade and Industry. Every bold and determined statement that throws up a scandal undermines her credibility and ultimately her legacy.

JP Liz

Source Irish Times

The then tánaiste and minister for enterprise Mary Harney travelled to Orlando, Florida, at the expense of Fás in July 2004 in a party that included the former director general of Fás, Rody Molloy, and his wife, and the then secretary general of Ms Harney's department, Paul Haran, and his wife.
Mr Molloy announced his resignation on Tuesday following intense controversy over expenditure on trips to Florida, including expensive flights for his wife paid for by Fás. As head of Fás he reported to Ms Harney's then department.
The flights in July 2004 cost €4,824.07 each. Also on the trip were Ms Harney's husband, the then chairman of Fás, Brian Geoghegan, Ms Harney's press secretary and her private secretary.
A spokesman for Ms Harney, who is now the Minister for Health and Children, rejected any suggestion that she had run up a bill of $410 with a hair and nail salon called Solutions, at Cocoa Beach, near Cape Canaveral, while on the trip.
He said Ms Harney had three days of official engagements in Florida and as was her normal practice in her capacity as Minister "she availed of standard wash and blow dries in preparation for her official engagements".
"The Minister is certain that this does not account for a total of $410. It is simply not the case that the Minister incurred a $410 bill for herself and any such insinuation is totally wrong.
"She certainly did not have any nail treatments or facials. She has never done so and would never do so on official business."
Mr Molloy was asked on Monday by Pat Kenny on RTÉ radio about the $410 bill, which was paid for by Fás. He replied. "With all due respects. Getting into detail of the preparation of somebody for a particular event, again the amount of money in terms of the total package is very, very small."
It is understood persons staying at the Radisson Resort hotel at Cape Canaveral could avail of hair treatment services at the hotel and the bill was accrued in this way. Sources close to Ms Harney last night accepted that services she had received might have contributed to the $410 bill.
Fine Gael spokesman on enterprise Leo Varadkar said last night Ms Harney's position as Minister for Health had become untenable.
"These issues first surfaced on Sunday and were raised in the Dáil on Tuesday and today. At leaders' questions yesterday she sat beside the Taoiseach while Enda Kenny challenged him on the use of taxpayers' money for beauty treatments on trips to Florida. "He specifically asked if he knew the identity of the individual in question. Mary Harney said nothing until the information was dragged from her by journalists this evening."
In July 2004 Ms Harney was attending the signing of a memorandum of understanding between Fás and the Kennedy Space Centre as part of the successful Science Challenge programme initiated by Fás.

another cock up by Mary - when will she go??

Bottle_of_Smoke

I often wonder about Mary Harney. She seems honest and hard working. However, the health service is still an utter mess.

No one can deny she deeply cares about health in this country, or that she's hard working, but is it possible she just doens't have the skills to run the health service?

lostexpectation

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

I often wonder about Mary Harney. She seems honest and hard working. However, the health service is still an utter mess.

No one can deny she deeply cares about health in this country, or that she's hard working, but is it possible she just doens't have the skills to run the health service?

why cos she keeps telling us so (like all politicians)

CCCP^

Harney would never resign. I hate her guts but she plays the game well, she is a good politician, but don't take that as a favourable comment on her career in government, I disagree with alot of things that have happened under her lookout in the HSE.

I think Harney will be the one who see's through the Government's intention to privatise the health service.

gman2k

Late into this thread, but here's my 2cents
Mary Harney is the Minister for Health - therefore, she is appointed to be responsible for adequate provision of health services in the country.
There is available now a vaccine to prevent cancers in women, and she has rolled back on a decision to provide this service due to lack of money.
Plain and simple, a number of women in the future will die young because of this decision.
Plain and simple, Harney has shown that she is not providing for the health of these women. She is not charged with being minister for finance, and has not up to now tried to obtain value for money within the health service. (I can't help but mention 'nailgate')
Plain and simple, she should resign, as she is not doing her job, as she is asked and paid to do.
Of course she won't go. This is the same woman who stated a few years ago that the electorate have a short memory, and she was right - she got re-elected along with Bertie.
This is the same woman who stated that corrupt politicians should be jailed, and a case against CJH could not proceed because of this statement (and others).

What needs to happen is this - Cowen should sack her. But he won't. After the budget fiasco, he can't let his image appear even more incompetent.
If this was the UK, she would have fallen on her own sword a long time ago, but unfortunately, we don't have the same honour in politicians in this little backwater.
We get what we vote for........

SalthillGuy

I have heard her address a group of visiting (overseas) business people. She was most imressive. She had no notes, put her elbow on the podium and spkoe for 15 minutes. She came across as really knowledgable and likeable.
She should not resign. She has too much to offer.
She is in a difficult role at the moment.
Who could do a better job.?
Whow would accept the challenge.?

Stroke Politics

Hreard a rumour today that she will be gone by the weekend and replaced by multi-millionaire-property-developer-cum-teacher-cum-TD Frank Fahey. Surely her position is surely untenable, she appointed her husband, Brian Geoghegan, as chair of FÁS!!!

I'd expect an Ivor Callely-type scene is happing right now, prior to more FÁS revelations being dug up by the Sunday papers.....

Fighting Irish

goverments don't work, its simple

its not just mary h

old boy

in health, outside of putting advisors and more management in place what has she done, refuse to vaccinate against cancer when the treatment is 2 jabs a week for the last 3 months of life, at a cost of 800 a jab, telling people that they have the all clear from cancer then 6 months later they are dead, could she not have made heads roll, if drumm is in charge of health why not make him the minister, oh yeah 2 heads are better than 1, and the buck can be passed,

nesf

gman2k wrote: »

There is available now a vaccine to prevent cancers in women, and she has rolled back on a decision to provide this service due to lack of money.

No, there is not.


There are serious questions as to the effectiveness of this vaccine and the media are acting extremely irresponsibly by misinforming the people on this issue. A good thread outlining the issue here in Biology/Medicine: http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2055416161. There are no studies of this vaccine long enough to establish that it actually works as highlighted in the New England Journal of Medicine editorial.

SalthillGuy

Mary Harney's husband has been a senior figure for many years. His appointment was not nepotism or anything like that. He position is well earned.

Permabear

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turgon

donegalfella wrote: »

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The PD founder and former PD leader received a standing ovation at a PD meeting? Hardly something to talk about.

Agent J

donegalfella wrote: »

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Maybe because we dont like the idea of having to pay 20% extra in health insurance premuims or charge 100euro if you need to go A&E?

Can think of anyone who wouldnt like that.

reganovich

No she shouldn't.

The health service is a monster...she's the only one with the guts to tackle it and not cave in to short term tactical solutions.

She's the best we have to tackle it.

Could you imagine roisin shorthall closing hospitals for the new cancer strategy..people like that cave everytime...Harney has a strategy hope she see's it through.

otherwise we'll end up with another health minister that is merely a figurehead because they are afraid to make any tough (always unpopular but neccesary) decisions

SalthillGuy

Health is probably the most challenging / difficult portfolio.
She has done at least as good and anyone before her.
For me she is ok and should be left in the position.
Frank Fahey is too busy with his proberty portfolio at the moment....

Red Alert

Has anyone seen the latest revelations on Today's Mail on Sunday? Apparently Mary Harney stayed in the presidential suite, costing over 2,500 Euro and engaged the services of a piano player at her own request. Hardly suitable as someone who's supposed to be spending money in an intelligent, efficient and compassionate way.

Permabear

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lostexpectation

donegalfella wrote: »

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omigod
it was speech to close down the party a unique occasion, it wasn't a party policy speech, totally different

Permabear

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Spyral

Should she resign ?
Please.

We've been enduring ineffectual health services for too long. Despite the boom feck all has improved and we have one of the worst medical services. We used to have one of the safest maternity systems. Now I would question if it is as safe as it was.

She earns 200000 but still charges for her hair to the state...

SalthillGuy

Red Alert wrote: »

Has anyone seen the latest revelations on Today's Mail on Sunday? Apparently Mary Harney stayed in the presidential suite, costing over 2,500 Euro and engaged the services of a piano player at her own request. Hardly suitable as someone who's supposed to be spending money in an intelligent, efficient and compassionate way.

You would wonder why people in her position would do something like this. Those things always come out, especially when the mud slinging starts.

nesf

SalthillGuy wrote: »

You would wonder why people in her position would do something like this. Those things always come out, especially when the mud slinging starts.

+1

If it's true then it was a very stupid thing to do.

Frankie Lee

I think if people want to get enough dirt on her to force a resignation they should investigate her dealings with Ulick McEvaddy.

turgon

donegalfella wrote: »

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Few Irish politicians. Donegalfella, I think youv just come so accustomed to the crap political system we have that you have come to complement the semi-half-good events. The best of a bad world is still inherently bad.

Permabear

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brianthebard

donegalfella wrote: »

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Persuasive? It's not as if the party was going to continue on and she changed everyone's mind. Besides just cause she wasn't reading the speech doesn't mean it wasn't prepared, that should be obvious, and praising someone for learning off something is just stupid. I'm going to be doing a 3 hour exam next week from memory, should I be minister for health?