How many viewings are sellers getting?

Duckjob

axel rose wrote: »

Look at other houses in the area to see if the price is fair. If 10 houses in an estate is selling at 300 dont bother offering 150.

10 houses advertising asking 300k != 10 houses sold at 300k

Good luck with the sale, hope it goes well.

Climate Expert

astrofool wrote: »

There will be people putting in low ball offers on the chances that someone will bite.

While the total fall over the next few years might be 40%, 50%, 90%, you can't expect someone to sell at those figures today (unless there are other circumstances). The buyer will just have to wait those few years (and keep offering low balls in the mean time).

Some people might just have to sell at nearly any cost. If a person hits up ten properties with a lowball offer then they have a pretty good chance somebody will go for it.

axel rose

Climatexpert admit it- you offered me 180 for my house.:D
I think I will bill you for the time effort and energy that I wasted when I cleaned my house for you. Seriously I hope you dont find yourself in such a situation.......ie being forced to sell a house at negative equity.

Climate Expert

axel rose wrote: »

Climatexpert admit it- you offered me 180 for my house.:D
I think I will bill you for the time effort and energy that I wasted when I cleaned my house for you. Seriously I hope you dont find yourself in such a situation.......ie being forced to sell a house at negative equity.

I hear what you are saying about time wasting. Unfortunately that is the nature of selling a house. Half the viewings are just neighbours who want to have a gawk around your place. This is from experience.

ionapaul

One thing to be ready for (fingers crossed it doesn't happen to you) is gazundering; one of my friends recently bought a house, he offered X, waited a few weeks until a few days before contracts were due to be signed and told the vendor that his bank were unwilling to lend him as much as they had earlier agreed to, so he now only could pay X-€25k! Obviously this placed the vendors in a very tight spot, but they very reluctantly agreed to accept the smaller amount, rather than go through all the hassle of finding another buyer again.

I am unsure of the rights and wrongs of gazundering (is it fair to do given all the gazumping during the last 10 years?), but something to watch out for.

The_Conductor

ionapaul wrote: »

One thing to be ready for (fingers crossed it doesn't happen to you) is gazundering; one of my friends recently bought a house, he offered X, waited a few weeks until a few days before contracts were due to be signed and told the vendor that his bank were unwilling to lend him as much as they had earlier agreed to, so he now only could pay X-€25k! Obviously this placed the vendors in a very tight spot, but they very reluctantly agreed to accept the smaller amount, rather than go through all the hassle of finding another buyer again.

I am unsure of the rights and wrongs of gazundering (is it fair to do given all the gazumping during the last 10 years?), but something to watch out for.

Its unethical- as effectively you are going back on your word before you can be legally held accountable for it. Certainly gazumping, equally unethical, happened in the very recent past, two wrongs don't a right make though.

People will always try to maximise their advantage- and if it becomes common knowledge that other people are getting away with gazundering- it will become common practice all round.

Not very fair- but while the boot was on the other foot people didn't complain.......

Climate Expert

smccarrick wrote: »

Its unethical- as effectively you are going back on your word before you can be legally held accountable for it. Certainly gazumping, equally unethical, happened in the very recent past, two wrongs don't a right make though.

People will always try to maximise their advantage- and if it becomes common knowledge that other people are getting away with gazundering- it will become common practice all round.

Not very fair- but while the boot was on the other foot people didn't complain.......

Ethics are subjective. The only ethical guide we have is the law and it says its fine.

axel rose

ionapaul wrote: »

One thing to be ready for (fingers crossed it doesn't happen to you) is gazundering; one of my friends recently bought a house, he offered X, waited a few weeks until a few days before contracts were due to be signed and told the vendor that his bank were unwilling to lend him as much as they had earlier agreed to, so he now only could pay X-€25k! Obviously this placed the vendors in a very tight spot, but they very reluctantly agreed to accept the smaller amount, rather than go through all the hassle of finding another buyer again.

I am unsure of the rights and wrongs of gazundering (is it fair to do given all the gazumping during the last 10 years?), but something to watch out for.

yea its a fear alright I can only hope that whatever saint my mother in law has been praying to will look after us.....otherwise Ill bloody get them in their beds :cool:

axel rose

Climate Expert wrote: »

Ethics are subjective. The only ethical guide we have is the law and it says its fine.

would you be prepared to gazunder? If the shoe were on the other foot would you be prepared to gazump someone?

Gareth37

Treehouse72 wrote: »

No.

The property crash is about 2 years old now and still has another 5 or 6 to go. So the market should pick up sometime around Christmas 2014.

So at present, we are in whatever the opposite of a small pick up is.

And there's also an off-chance that the catastrophic and unprecedented meltdown of the international financial system today might make things a tad worse. As will the swinging cutbacks to be announced in the budget. Not to mention the rocketing numbers on the dole and impending flight of several multinationals. As will rising emigration (fewer people to rent those BLT's to. Yummy). As would a possible bank failure (if Fortis and Lehman can go...). As will rising general inflation and stagnant real wages.

Yeah, all in all I'd say there is more chance of a small pick up in Eamon de Valera's pecker than there is in the Irish property morkesh.

I pretty much agree with this.

punchestown

axel rose wrote: »

would you be prepared to gazunder? If the shoe were on the other foot would you be prepared to gazump someone?

What would you do Axel if a cash buyer showed up tommorrow and offered asking price plus 10k? Or if another person showed up in the afternoon and was desperate for your place and was willing to 20k over? Would you stay with the person you have gone sale agreed or would you suddenly be interested in seeing where these new offers could lead?

Climate Expert

axel rose wrote: »

would you be prepared to gazunder? If the shoe were on the other foot would you be prepared to gazump someone?

I would do pretty much anything to get ahead in this world (as long as its legal of course).

axel rose

punchestown wrote: »

What would you do Axel if a cash buyer showed up tommorrow and offered asking price plus 10k? Or if another person showed up in the afternoon and was desperate for your place and was willing to 20k over? Would you stay with the person you have gone sale agreed or would you suddenly be interested in seeing where these new offers could lead?

what do think I would do? The deposit is paid, the estate agent assures me that their mortage approval is sound and the house is off the agents webpage. I acepted their offer. there are no more viewings, there are no more offers. It appears that me and my morals are a dying breed. :rolleyes:

Climate Expert

It appears that me and my morals are a dying breed.

You would seriously turn down 20K for your moral convictions. The person you are trying to appease here would probably rip you off in a second if they could.
I subsrcibe to the Nash equillibrium, it will never let you down.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nash_equilibrium

esmeralda

axel rose wrote: »

would you be prepared to gazunder? If the shoe were on the other foot would you be prepared to gazump someone?

I sincerely hope that I would never do it. It may be technically legal but then so are quite a few other despicable forms of behaviour.

I might be tempted if I had irrefutable proof that the people I was buying off had done it to a previous buyer/seller. Even then it would make me feel like c**p.

Actually it's a conversation I've had many a time over the years and I'm glad to say that everyone I hold dear would seem to be of a similar opinion. But I should add that quite a few people I don't hold so dear said they would have no qualms whatsoever in doing it (note of interest, these were people I didn't hold dear even before that particular conversation).

axel rose

Is your only guideline to ethical behaviour legitimacy? wow! dont you just love modern Ireland.

axel rose

we are very different people thank god. I just hope that there are more of my type around. I hope I never do business with ya. Do unto others and all that

Climate Expert

Do unto others and all that

That is an unnatural and unstable attitude which could only work if everybody though like that.
When you know what people are like and accept living your life through self interest then you will never be dissapointed.

axel rose

Climate Expert wrote: »

That is an unnatural and unstable attitude which could only work if everybody though like that.
When you know what people are like and accept living your life through self interest then you will never be dissapointed.

whatever floats your boat big C! :rolleyes:

Theboinkmaster

Axel be very careful - I find it very hard the believe mortgages are being handed out right now, especially with what's going on at the moment.

Mortgage approval doesn't mean much these days....

Is the buyer an FTB? Unbelievable an FTB would go sale agreed this week of all weeks....

Best of luck with it though

EKRIUQ

gurramok wrote: »

A myth. The market decides the price, the seller can decide if they want to sell or not at that price.

I've been saying that for years but all I get back back is Developers and builders are greedy bastards.

The Estate Agent and developer doesn't decide the price the market does

bobbysands81

bangersandmash wrote: »

To summarise: Property is on sale since February. Poster suggests yesterday that there might be a pick up in the market. Then, during the most tumultuous week in Ireland's recent history, the property goes sale agreed the next day. Excuse me if this seems hard to believe.

See shill.

I went sale agreed last week in very similar circumstances.

raido9

axel rose wrote:

groom, well I bought my house about 4 years ago for just under the stamp duty limit 190,000. although it was structurally sound it had to be gutted.
It was with the first agent we knew the price was too high after about 6 weeks but he kept advising us to not drop, we dropped the price anyway by 15k. about a month later we wanted to drop the price again but he went awol for another couple of weeks. surprise surprise he went under.

we went with another estate agent who recommended that we drop our price by a total of 50k. this put our price at just under 290. we were getting offers of 180........ seriously we priced the house to sell it there are houses in my estate that are smaller in both size and plot for 340. these houses are in no where near the condition mine is in. So can you see that some offers are just a wee bit mad? ( that guy went up to 190). He was obviously chancing his arm but at the same time it was a waste of everyones time.....

bangers why do you think I posted?

axel rose wrote: »

Climatexpert admit it- you offered me 180 for my house.:D
I think I will bill you for the time effort and energy that I wasted when I cleaned my house for you. Seriously I hope you dont find yourself in such a situation.......ie being forced to sell a house at negative equity.

Stop trying to make out your a victim here. Your not in negative equity.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_equity

The_Conductor

raido9 wrote: »

Stop trying to make out your a victim here. Your not in negative equity.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Negative_equity

Depends on how much it cost him to gut the interior and reconstitute the house...... He could very well be in negative equity, or if not, its marginal.

ZYX

I love this. The 4 stages of Accommodation & Property forum

1. Axel Rose you will never get a bidder. Drop your price.
2. You got a bidder? Well you must be lying
3. You are not lying? Well then the bidder will pull out
4. Anyway who cares about you. You are not someone we can feel smug over. You actually made money.

The_Conductor

Behave.
No personal abuse- or you will be banned.

spockety

smccarrick wrote: »

Behave.
No personal abuse- or you will be banned.

In fairness, he is not far off the mark.

There seems to be a lot of people (I'm not saying _everybody_) who hang around on this forum, on askaboutmoney.com, and on thepropertypin.com who have a locked in view of how they see the market.

They are not involved in selling property, they don't own a property, and they are not involved in buying property. Yet despite evidence to the contrary, they seem completely and totally unwilling to accept that there are ANY property dealings happening at the moment at all!

Some property IS selling, banks ARE giving out mortgages (as in, handing out money, not just approving), and some people who are intelligent and are armed with all the facts about the market and the economy are still buying because it is the right option for THEM right now, for whatever reason.

I mean one particular post above is laughable:

"Axel be very careful - I find it very hard the believe mortgages are being handed out right now, especially with what's going on at the moment.
Mortgage approval doesn't mean much these days...."

He finds it hard to believe that mortgages are being handed out right now! Where is the evidence to back it up? I suggest to you, forum readers, that if banks had literally stopped handing out mortgages, it would be front page news on every paper and the leading story on every news bulletin.

The market is falling, who knows where or when it will stop. But the fact is that there is still a market there, it is completely unrecognisable from the market of a few years ago, but it is still there. I think there are a lot of people posting without actually having any hard evidence to hand about what is happening on the ground.

Obviously the best way forward would be to bring in legislation forcing the publication of house sale prices, that is the amount that actually changes hands. Then we would get an undeniable picture of exactly what is going on.

The_Conductor

What you are saying is very true.
I am guessing that very few of the people posting here are actually involved in buying or selling a property at the moment (I'm in the very unhappy position of trying to do both).

Yes- property is selling- where sellers are being reasonable and realistic and accepting that property prices have fallen and that its now a buyers market (this should not imply that they should be presumed to be doormats of course).

Its a very good market for people who are not trying to sell a property to fund the purchase of a new property- in particular first time buyers. They are in most cases able to negotiate deals with developers that would have been a pipe dream not long ago- but also to negotiate significant discounts on the asking prices of second hand properties.

A major stumbling point at present is precisely what the government is going to introduce in the budget in 2 weeks time, and in the Finance Bill in late November. Estate Agents and indeed the media, have whetted up people's expectations of a package of measures to try to get the FTB group back into the market again. This is exacerbated by various lobby groups, notably the CIF, planting all sorts of weird and wonderful suggestions of possible courses of action in the media.

A major concern is of course- whats going to happen to Ireland Inc- in particular the employment market. Obviously people are getting laid off, government finances are in an appalling state and stealth taxes are going to rise (aside from another 15% on electricity in Jan and 22% on gas). People feel poorer, and when sentiment is like that- people are less likely to spend.

Some of you here have been posting on the two banking threads over in the After Hours forum- which is closely related to this issue.

Property is still selling- albeit at a much reduced rate, where people are being realistic about their expectations.

S.

punchestown

spockety wrote: »

Obviously the best way forward would be to bring in legislation forcing the publication of house sale prices, that is the amount that actually changes hands. Then we would get an undeniable picture of exactly what is going on.

An excellent point, but sadly not going to happen.

axel rose

radio I never siad that I was in negative equity. I was refering posts where climate expert stated that some vendors are forced to sell at any price. I would hate for anyone to be in such a situation. Ive never done the poor me-all I wanted to know if other people were getting more viewings! In a perfect world house prices would be stable.

I cant understand the nastiness and what I can only describe jealously when it comes to house prices. ( not aiming this at you directly but overall on this section) Its mad.


some of us poor eejits had to watch years of crap weekend tv to buy our houses. Imagine the highlight of your weekend being winning streak and the late late for all that time! Now for that I want sympathy