Survivor Series 2008 (may contain spoilers)

ShawnRaven

rossie1977 wrote: »

cena, orton, [/b]punk[/b], edge, jeff (if he stay clean), [/b]matt[/b] (he was hugely over last week in manchester) are the future of wwe and should be pushed through the roof.

Three reasons that state i'm banging my head off a brick wall here

First one highlighted in the sense that he was pushed so far down fans throats that they got sick of it and spent half his big push booing him.

Second one highlighed because he was given a shot at the top spot and be fumbled it

Third because the term has been and never was spring to mind.

Bubs101

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Four matches a year. *claps limply*
Way to go Mark Calloway!

Yeah, because all those matches with Edge sucked tremendous balls:rolleyes:. Your gimmick is getting older than Taker. He's had a good year

Mr.Nice Guy

ShawnRaven wrote: »

First one highlighted in the sense that he was pushed so far down fans throats that they got sick of it and spent half his big push booing him.

Before he got injured this year though he was putting pretty much everyone over. It was getting quite ridiculous since he's their biggest star.

I agree with rossie that people are getting bored with Taker and SuperHunter. For Taker I think he's become stale and needs a character change. For SuperHunter, I think he needs to be out of the main event and putting guys over the way Michaels has done in recent years.

ShawnRaven

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

Before he got injured this year though he was putting pretty much everyone over. It was getting quite ridiculous since he's their biggest star.

Not ridiculous. It was needed. People were booing the guy because he was almost invincible! Hell he still pulled that crap earlier this year with the "A car smashed into me and i showed up a couple of days later with a scratch" story.

I agree with rossie that people are getting bored with Taker and SuperHunter. For Taker I think he's become stale and needs a character change. For SuperHunter, I think he needs to be out of the main event and putting guys over the way Michaels has done in recent years.

I won't disagree with any of this, however I'll easily lump MEGACena into this category too. He needs either a change of character or a heel turn. SOMETHING different to the usual garbage we've been witnessing since the end of 2004!

ShawnRaven

Bubs101 wrote: »

Yeah, because all those matches with Edge sucked tremendous balls:rolleyes:. Your gimmick is getting older than Taker. He's had a good year

Matter of opinion, since when did having an opinion constitute as a gimmick, Bubs? Or is it still real to you, damnit? :P

dsmythy

Kozlov went unpinned so i guess they're sticking with him for a bit longer. I smell a Smackdown number one contenders match coming up.

Cena had audible booing in Boston. God help him on Raw away from the city. Maybe being more of a tweener will be best for him. The kids will still shrill away for him regardlesss and other fans will have something to boo over.

Michaels got the better of Morrison (couldn't care less about JBL). Hopefully not the end of their newly found rivalry!

Big Show in hell now or something similar for a few weeks i guess. Edge over Undertaker on Smackdown to make his title reign concrete from the beginning? With help from Vickie of course.

What's going to happen with Cena, Batista and Orton in the long run up to Wrestlemania? I still think Raw will be a worthwhile watch over the coming weeks.

Oh my favourite moment from the PPV? Layla nailing CM Punk in the head with her shoe.

rossie1977

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Not ridiculous. It was needed. People were booing the guy because he was almost invincible!

if it were about being invincible people would be rioting at the sight of HHH at this stage

people starting booing cena IIRC around the time of the HHH feud (start of 2006) when HHH came out every week and said cena couldn't wrestle and basically ran his character into the ground for 3 solid months

ShawnRaven

rossie1977 wrote: »

if it were about being invincible people would be rioting at the sight of HHH at this stage

You mean they aren't already?

people starting booing cena IIRC around the time of the HHH feud (start of 2006) when HHH came out every week and said cena couldn't wrestle and basically ran his character into the ground for 3 solid months

And well justified! Sorry, but when your finisher involves pumping up your reeboks, it's kinda hard to take one seriously in fairness.
To Cena's eternal credit, he's improved a lot in those two years, i'm just tired of the guy, but then, i'm tired of WWE, period!

rovert

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Being a big participant in that live thread, i have to say i went in with zero expectations and thats exactly what i got. My sleep pattern has been way out of whack over the course of the last six weeks so i'm not getting to bed til about 7am. As a result, i ended up watching Survivor Series out of having sweet f*ck all else to do and i knew someone else who was staying up for it too.

Jayus ShawnRaven you always go to great lengths to explain you’re watching WWE. :P I guess WWE just happened to be on again?

ShawnRaven wrote: »

It was very hard to find anything good to say about it as far as I was concerned.

Serves you right for reading the spoilers before the event then. WWE built the show around a surprise(s).

ShawnRaven wrote: »

The traditional matches were marred with meaningless squashes killing any excitement for the endings

You call them meaningless yet until we find out where they are going with Regal for example. All elimination matches at least had some thing to recommend about them. The ending of Team Orton vs Team Batista was fantastic and furthered a story.

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Cena/Jericho was bloody terrible save for the last five minutes of it.

I thought it told a realistic story and was at least decent. It was Cena & Jericho's first match in three years and Cena's first after a major injury. What where you expecting actually?

ShawnRaven wrote: »

That said, we now have a reason to tune into SD on Friday nights again.

Yeah

Taylor Hawkins won the World title

:pac:

ShawnRaven

rovert wrote: »

Jayus ShawnRaven you always go to great lengths to explain you’re watching WWE. :P I guess WWE just happened to be on again?

Not really, i don't watch the TV stuff. I explained this as i went back on my word when i had said that i probably wasn't going to bother watching it live but record it and catch it the following day. That was the plan.

Serves you right for reading the spoilers before the event then. WWE built the show around a surprise(s).

That wouldn't have made a blind bit of difference.

You call them meaningless yet until we find out where they are going with Regal for example. All elimination matches at least had some thing to recommend about them. The ending of Team Orton vs Team Batista was fantastic and furthered a story.

Doesn't make up for the 15 minutes worth of garbage building up to it. That's the problem with WWE. We're expected to jump for joy at the ending of matches despite the fact that the guts of them were terrible.

I thought it told a realistic story and was at least decent. It was Cena & Jericho's first match in three years and Cena's first after a major injury. What where you expecting actually?

See my previous answer.

ShaneU

Did anyone else think that was Mike Knox coming out when Edge appeared?

rovert

ShawnRaven wrote: »

That wouldn't have made a blind bit of difference.

I think it would just look at Edge cashing in the MITB at New Years Revolution 2006.

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Doesn't make up for the 15 minutes worth of garbage building up to it. That's the problem with WWE. We're expected to jump for joy at the ending of matches despite the fact that the guts of them were terrible.

See my previous answer.

You are of course entitled to your own opinion but your over use of words like terrible and garbage lessens their impact and your own credibility as poster. There is a difference between hyperbole and self parody. You seem to be gravitating towards the latter. I would actually like to see your reaction to something actually terrible, ShawnRaven. Even the

HHH/Koslov

match wasn’t terrible in my opinion as it was at least technically sound as boring and as outdated as it was.

Matches are meant to build as well btw, as a long time fan I know you know this.

brick tamland

Rather than give out about Taker i'd blame the booking. Taker Vs Show in a casket match is the same old boring ****e over again. cant imagine one single subscription to the ppv was bought on the strenght of it. how many show/taker fueds have there been over the years? and not 1 stand out batch from the lot.

Vince135792003

Bubs101 wrote: »

He had two good matches with Show during their feud before this and had two good T.V. matches with HHH and Hardy recently. Also everybody carwes about the streak, you're fooling yourself

Your spot on. Undertaker has had way more hits than misses this year in terms of match quality but last night was a miss undoubtedly.

CMpunked

Shawn, whats this mean?:

ShawnRaven wrote: »

And i've been to enough halloween bonfires to know that fires that big don't get put out that f*cking quickly.

I didnt see the PPV but im glad of how they had edge return to retain his "Ultimate opportunist" gimmick-thing still alive.

ShawnRaven

Comic-Book-Guy wrote: »

Shawn, whats this mean?:



I didnt see the PPV but im glad of how they had edge return to retain his "Ultimate opportunist" gimmick-thing still alive.

Just before the end of the match, there was a massive 12-15 foot flame at the entrance way created by Undertakers deadmanilicious powers. The thing lasted about 20 seconds before it was put out within 10 seconds!

It didn't look impressive, it just looked plain dumb.

ShawnRaven

ShaneU wrote: »

Did anyone else think that was Mike Knox coming out when Edge appeared?

I was wondering if Snitsky had grown hair again

ShawnRaven

rovert wrote: »

I think it would just look at Edge cashing in the MITB at New Years Revolution 2006.

It would have done, the significant difference there is that last night's appearance failed to be a surprise because WWE lost that element a long time ago. Edge was on that card in 06 anyway, so nobody was expecting him. Last night was not the case, and people were expecting him back around this time anyway.

You are of course entitled to your own opinion but your over use of words like terrible and garbage lessens their impact and your own credibility as poster. There is a difference between hyperbole and self parody. You seem to be gravitating towards the latter. I would actually like to see your reaction to something actually terrible, ShawnRaven. Even the

HHH/Koslov

match wasn’t terrible in my opinion as it was at least technically sound as boring and as outdated as it was.

Bullsh*t and you know it rovert. Call it what you want, but technically sound sure as hell the last thing i would have described the match you mentioned. A string of boring restholds. It was terrible, that's not hyperbole, it's not self parody. It's my opinion, shared by several thousands of people who attended the event. Would you like to email those guys and tell them they're wrong too?

I didn't think so.

Matches are meant to build as well btw, as a long time fan I know you know this.

The problem is, Unlike Hogan/Savage, or Bret Hart/Roddy Piper, the matches build but could maintain the crowd interest. Something WWE has failed to do for quite some time. If you removed the blinkers, rovert. You would see this.

I'm gonna end this one here rovert, this thread wasn't designed for hard hitting discussion. I'm sure you're due back in PW in the next day or so, we can discuss it then.

Bubs101

I just watched the finish to the Smackdown match and my god did Jeff nail Kozlov with that chair.

Also it's nice to think that at one point in the WWE's history all 3 titles were held by guys who weren't juiced to the gills, even if it was for 20 minutes

callaway92

Why was Edge allowed in this Smackdown Title match when it was advertised for Hardy, HHH & Koslov...???

citytillidie

I guess Edge is back with Vickie and he was the one who attacked Hardy in the hotel

rovert

callaway92 wrote: »

Why was Edge allowed in this Smackdown Title match when it was advertised for Hardy, HHH & Koslov...???

As Vicki was the GM [insert roll eyes smiley here]

A better question was Matt in on Jeff Hardy's run in as he he said he was expecting the worst an hour prior.

EdK

Anybody catch Jerry Lawler saying it was the first time ever two world titles had changed hands at the same Survivor Series

These 2 disagree

EdK

rovert wrote: »

As Vicki was the GM [insert roll eyes smiley here]

A better question was Matt in on Jeff Hardy's run in as he he said he was expecting the worst an hour prior.

I'm no doctor but Jeff looked in grand condition to compete in my professional opinion

rovert

EdK wrote: »

Anybody catch Jerry Lawler saying it was the first time ever two world titles had changed hands at the same Survivor Series

These 2 disagree

I did hear it and good spot

rovert

rovert wrote: »

You call them meaningless yet until we find out where they are going with Regal for example.

Told ya ShawnRaven:

http://www.f4wonline.com/content/view/7544/

William Regal only worked 11 seconds last night because he was sick coming off the European tour

Regal jobbed out to the skutters.

ShawnRaven

rovert wrote: »

Told ya ShawnRaven:

http://www.f4wonline.com/content/view/7544/



Regal jobbed out to the skutters.

Still doesn't mean it looked good on TV, it didn't. Neither did the parade of squashes on the opening match.

rovert

Boy was this statement by WWE on UFC 91 even more stupid in the light of this show.:

LAS VEGAS - In a stunning upset, Brock Lesnar became the first man to capture both the WWE Championship and the UFC Heavyweight Championship when he defeated UFC fan favorite Randy "The Natural" Couture on Saturday night in Sin City.

Lesnar, dubbed "The Next Big Thing" upon his arrival in WWE, earned the moniker and his first WWE Championship in 2002 after besting The Rock at SummerSlam. Thanks in large part to the backing of the WWE Universe, the former college wrestling phenomenon went on to regain the title twice, both times against Kurt Angle, once at WrestleMania in 2003 and then six months later on SmackDown.

For Lesnar, the road to UFC gold proved surprisingly short. Within roughly six months, the former WWE Superstar climbed to the top of the ultimate fighting heap, capping his ascent with the upset victory over Couture.

Critics have noted that many of the fights on the UFC pay-per-view ended in the first round, leaving UFC producers scrambling to fill the three-hour event with content. The dearth of hearty competition left many viewers to watch less prestigious under-card fights and only served to bolster claims that UFC pay-per-view events can often be a "crap shoot" in regards to filling the full three hours.

For his part, Lesnar took the encouragment of the WWE Universe and the hard lessons forged during his fiery time at WWE and showed UFC and the world why he is not only a man of mettle but also a former three-time WWE Champion.

callaway92

2008
UFC>>>WWE?

rovert

callaway92 wrote: »

2008
UFC>>>WWE?

Wait until the buyrates comes in ha ha

ShawnRaven

callaway92 wrote: »

2008
UFC>>>WWE?

I've been saying this for at least a year now!
(bleedin Johnny come lately's on the block )

callaway92

ShawnRaven wrote: »

I've been saying this for at least a year now!
(bleedin Johnny come lately's on the block )

Not really..Ive been watching it the last year and a half now...

ShawnRaven

callaway92 wrote: »

Not really..Ive been watching it the last year and a half now...

Two for me in January, UFC 66 was my first one, Liddell/Ortiz 2. Never looked back.

orestes

The topic of the thread is back that way guys

<

---

If you wanna debate between UFC and WWE start a thread on it, don't take this one off track please

rovert

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Two for me in January, UFC 66 was my first one, Liddell/Ortiz 2. Never looked back.

Well I traded US Rampage 1992 for UFC 1 & 2 when I was eleven. :P Ahead of the curve I was.

orestes wrote: »

The topic of the thread is back that way guys

<

---

If you wanna debate between UFC and WWE start a thread on it, don't take this one off track please

Sorry it seems the MMA forum is having similar problems. In fairness that statement I posted was pre Survivor Series grand standing by WWE.

Podge2k7

JP Liz wrote: »

So who attacked Jeff ??????

Edge

Rjd2

Average PPV in my opinion. The elimination matches were forgettable, yes the Orton one had a good finish but that was not enough to save it from mediocrity for me. The Divas match was poor, there were so many botches it was unreal and some of the pin falls were ridiculous especially on the heel divas. The Taker v Show match was a snore fest, which made little sense. Show challenges Taker to a casket match a few weeks ago, but then we find out he is scared of them? Plus the fact w2e are meant to believe that a veteran did not understand the rules of this match was ridiculous. The Cena match was decent although I do think having another Jericho title reign end so abruptly hurts Y2J big time. The Smackdown main event was poor, Kozlov was to green for such a match and Hunter simply is not good enough to carry him to a passable match. Taker and Jeff have got good matches out of Vlad, but the fact that Hunter failed so miserably really highlights his decline as a professional wrestler. The ending was cool though, although it makes little sense that Vicki who three months ago in a fit of rage puts Edge into a hell in a cell match with Edge, but now welcomes him back as if nothing ever happened?

ShawnRaven

Oh come on! You expect Hunter to make chicken salad from chicken sh*t?! Even Steamboat couldn't do that in 1987 against Kamala!
Man, could you be any more biased? For everything else in that post, i agree with. Disappointing that you left out the fact that Big Slow stumbled into the casket to finish that wretched match.

Rjd2

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Oh come on! You expect Hunter to make chicken salad from chicken sh*t?! Even Steamboat couldn't do that in 1987 against Kamala!
Man, could you be any more biased? For everything else in that post, i agree with. Disappointing that you left out the fact that Big Slow stumbled into the casket to finish that wretched match.

I don’t think Vlad is all that bad, I mean he had a good match with Festus for goodness sake! :eek::eek:I suppose to give Hunter some credit I could argue that their styles don’t mesh well together.
The damage on the casket match was done long before the finish.

ShawnRaven

Rjd2 wrote: »

I don’t think Vlad is all that bad, I mean he had a good match with Festus for goodness sake! :eek::eek:I suppose to give Hunter some credit I could argue that their styles don’t mesh well together.
The damage on the casket match was done long before the finish.

Definitely not, WWE were nuts to even contemplate putting the two of them together in that kinda match. 8 years ago it would have worked with HHH, when he wasn't quite so bulky and could move a lot more. I admit that HHH has deteriorated somewhat over the years, but jesus, for that match, Koslov was equally to blame for probably the worst match of 2008 in DOUBLE DOUBLE E!

Rjd2

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Definitely not, WWE were nuts to even contemplate putting the two of them together in that kinda match. 8 years ago it would have worked with HHH, when he wasn't quite so bulky and could move a lot more. I admit that HHH has deteriorated somewhat over the years, but jesus, for that match, Koslov was equally to blame for probably the worst match of 2008 in DOUBLE DOUBLE E!

Aye it takes two to tango although Kozlov you suspect will pay for it for big time with a little holiday in the midcard, sure he can say hello to Punk and Jericho while their!:pac: Umaga is back anyways soon so he will probably take Kozlovs current spot as main event monster which will relieve a lot of people.:D

ShawnRaven

Rjd2 wrote: »

Aye it takes two to tango although Kozlov you suspect will pay for it for big time with a little holiday in the midcard, sure he can say hello to Punk and Jericho while their!:pac: Umaga is back anyways soon so he will probably take Kozlovs current spot as main event monster which will relieve a lot of people.:D

Not me! Umaga is not a main eventer to me. Although Vince likes 400lb dudes so he fits the criteria somewhat.

Rjd2

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Not me! Umaga is not a main eventer to me. Although Vince likes 400lb dudes so he fits the criteria somewhat.

Its either Umaga, Khali or Big Zeke if you dont want Vlad in the main event, :pbecause Vince always will have a so called monster heel on Smackdown.

ShawnRaven

Rjd2 wrote: »

Its either Umaga, Khali or Big Zeke if you dont want Vlad in the main event, :pbecause Vince always will have a so called monster heel on Smackdown.

Precisely the reason i stopped watching weekly tv!
(wasn't Umaga a face before he got injured?)

Rjd2

ShawnRaven wrote: »

Precisely the reason i stopped watching weekly tv!
(wasn't Umaga a face before he got injured?)

Nope heel, I remember him attacking Batista a few times and he had a really brief feud with Kennedy where Umaga actually picked up a clean win! :eek::eek:
A feud with Taker has being rumoured for ages now, think of the promos!

ShawnRaven

Rjd2 wrote: »

A feud with Taker has being rumoured for ages now, think of the promos!

I'm having a nightmare thinking about the entrances. Both of them will slug their way down to the ring

Rjd2

ShawnRaven wrote: »

I'm having a nightmare thinking about the entrances. Both of them will slug their way down to the ring

Throw in Kozlov and Khali and we could have an epic battle royale!
Back to Survivor series and I know this is not exactly a ground breaking observation but Christ in a diva match with ten women; Maryse from a looks point of view outshone everyone! She also botched a few moves as well but heh that’s not relevant in divas matches

ShawnRaven

Rjd2 wrote: »

Throw in Kozlov and Khali and we could have an epic battle royale!
Back to Survivor series and I know this is not exactly a ground breaking observation but Christ in a diva match with ten women; Maryse from a looks point of view outshone everyone! She also botched a few moves as well but heh that’s not relevant in divas matches

Only because Katie Lea wasn't involved.

I SO WOULD!

Maria's getting worse!

rovert

Better late than never

Insect Overlord

What's that she threw at him, Rovert?