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40K people, including nationalized immigrants and non-resident aliens on the dole
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JWAD wrote:No it wasn't that article. It was in another edition. If I remember rightly whatever the latest edition on the 10th September was.
It wasn't this one was it? That's a comparison of projected levels of immigration in 2060. It's not a comparison of current immigration levels. All the evidence I've seen indicates that Ireland and Spain have the highest immigration in Europe. I'm going to treat any claim otherwise with skepticism until the evidence is produced to back it up.JWAD wrote:And since you bring up 2005, this is the year that the anti-foreigner platform uses stats from in order to scare everyone into thinking that there is a catastrophe on board.
2005 is the year that mass immigration really began into Ireland with the lifting of the restrictions on the easter Europeans. The numbers entering the country have still not fallen back to pre-2005 levels.JWAD wrote:So what if people stay here permanently?
If large numbers of them decide to stay here permanently then we might find we have problems integrating them into our population. Other countries in Europe have faced problems integrating their immigrants into their populations over the last few decades so why shouldn't we expect the same problem in Ireland?JWAD wrote:If you want foreigners out then reciprocate in a non-hypocritical fashion. Why should other countries have to take your nationals then?
They shouldn't have to take my nationals. Every country should be allowed to set their own immigration policy and admit only as many people as they want.JWAD wrote:Send 'em all home and bring all your own back. After that happens, give us some employment figures.
You're assuming I want to send all the foreigners home when I've already said that that's not what I want. I just want to see a reduction in the number of people entering the country.0 -
No it wasnt that either.It wasn't this one was it? That's a comparison of projected levels of immigration in 2060. It's not a comparison of current immigration levels. All the evidence I've seen indicates that Ireland and Spain have the highest immigration in Europe. I'm going to treat any claim otherwise with skepticism until the evidence is produced to back it up
Yet the immigration numbers have decreased and the immigration rate has also decreased (see link provided earlier by myself and another poster).2005 is the year that mass immigration really began into Ireland with the lifting of the restrictions on the easter Europeans. The numbers entering the country have still not fallen back to pre-2005 levels
There's that word 'integrating'. In what way, are immigrants supposed to 'intergrate' exactly? Language is an obvious must, I'll agree. What else though? What will make somebody like you accept a non-national into 'your' society?If large numbers of them decide to stay here permanently then we might find we have problems integrating them into our population
Other countries in Europe have faced problems integrating their immigrants into their populations over the last few decades so why shouldn't we expect the same problem in Ireland?
Freedom of mobility of labour is one of the original traits of the 'Common Market' that Ireland joined. Thats the way it is. What you suggest is take as much economically as you can and give back sweet f**k all.They shouldn't have to take my nationals. Every country should be allowed to set their own immigration policy and admit only as many people as they want
And that number is reducing. As with any other country, immigration follows economic and standard of living trends.You're assuming I want to send all the foreigners home when I've already said that that's not what I want. I just want to see a reduction in the number of people entering the country.
You'd be more interested in reducing immigrants? I'd be more interested myself in taking persistant claimants of social benefit who refuse to work and fraudulent claimants off the register. Whether or not they are non-nationals means eff all.
We live in an open economy. Know why? Because this country CANNOT sustain itself on its own.0 -
JWAD wrote:No it wasnt that either.
This is the archive of their articles on the subject of immgration.
http://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/immigration/
Do you see it among those?JWAD wrote:Yet the immigration numbers have decreased and the immigration rate has also decreased (see link provided earlier by myself and another poster).
It hasn't decreased by enough to bring it back to pre-2005 levels. We're still taking in far more people than our economy needs and far more people, per head of population, than most other EU countries are taking in each year.JWAD wrote:There's that word 'integrating'. In what way, are immigrants supposed to 'intergrate' exactly?
They should consider themselves Irish and should feel a greater sense of loyalty to this country than they do the country of their ancestors.JWAD wrote:Freedom of mobility of labour is one of the original traits of the 'Common Market' that Ireland joined. Thats the way it is.
EU member states should be allowed the option of temporarily restricting access from other EU countries when there is a recession and when it doesn't make sense to be admitting tens of thousands of extra workers when there are already thousands of people on the dole.JWAD wrote:What you suggest is take as much economically as you can and give back sweet f**k all.
No, what I suggest is that we try to reduce immigration into our country at a time when we have huge numbers of people out of work.
Ireland will be a net contributor the EU in a few years and so that's when we will begin paying them back for all the money we took from them.JWAD wrote:And that number is reducing.
It's not reducing by enough. We're still taking in more people per capita than most other EU countries are taking in each year. We're still taking in more people than there are jobs to be filled.JWAD wrote:You'd be more interested in reducing immigrants? I'd be more interested myself in taking persistant claimants of social benefit who refuse to work and fraudulent claimants off the register. Whether or not they are non-nationals means eff all.
It's not an either/or. We should be doing both. I think restricting immigration will have a greater impact on the dole queues because it will make it easier for people on the dole to get back into employment. There's no point getting people off the dole if they can't find jobs when they go looking for them.0 -
in my eyes the irish are the hardest working race in europe over in the uk there are very few buildings. roads .bridges or canals that hasent been built by the irish-if you phone for builder there is a good chance that he originally came from ireland--i know every country has its lay-abouts -but ireland has less than most -most immigrants take on the low paid jobs that others dont want- only down fall is because of that wages are kept low0
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I know you don't believe me so all I can say is find out which edition was out on the date I gave and order a back issue.This is the archive of their articles on the subject of immgration.
http://www.economist.com/blogs/freeexchange/immigration/
Do you see it among those?
You say this as if each migrant entering the country here displaces somebody already here. You still don't seem able (or willing) to grasp the concept of how an economy affects population growth.It hasn't decreased by enough to bring it back to pre-2005 levels. We're still taking in far more people than our economy needs and far more people, per head of population, than most other EU countries are taking in each year
EU member states should be allowed the option of temporarily restricting access from other EU countries when there is a recession and when it doesn't make sense to be admitting tens of thousands of extra workers when there are already thousands of people on the dole.
In this Quality Assurance process of yours, how do you gauge one's "loyalty" to this country or compare between those you deem 'okay' and those not? What defines "loyalty"? Especially in a country with such a p*ss poor voting record, I'd say "loyalty" is the least on people's minds here.They should consider themselves Irish and should feel a greater sense of loyalty to this country than they do the country of their ancestors
rofl!Ireland will be a net contributor the EU in a few years and so that's when we will begin paying them back for all the money we took from them
Not exactly got a great track record in backing up this statement, has it?
So you suggest leaving things as they are for 'nationals' then.It's not an either/or. We should be doing both. I think restricting immigration will have a greater impact on the dole queues because it will make it easier for people on the dole to get back into employment. There's no point getting people off the dole if they can't find jobs when they go looking for them.
*shakes head*............and back to square one again.............0 -
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I cant believe that dud 2008 troll started this ...
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:rolleyes:They should consider themselves Irish and should feel a greater sense of loyalty to this country than they do the country of their ancestors.
Do they have to kneel before you and swear an oath of allegiance to Padraig Pearse while singing the Soldier’s Song backwards simultaneously in both Irish and English?
You really haven't thought this through. Suppose we restrict access to one particular nationality; let's pick our largest immigrant group, the British. Now, presumably, Britain would respond by restricting access to Britain for Irish nationals. So anybody who would otherwise emigrate to Britain to find work is stuck on the dole here.EU member states should be allowed the option of temporarily restricting access from other EU countries when there is a recession and when it doesn't make sense to be admitting tens of thousands of extra workers when there are already thousands of people on the dole.
I wouldn't hold your breath if I were you.Ireland will be a net contributor the EU in a few years...
Define "enough".It's not reducing by enough.
In which case the people who do not get jobs will move on; no problem.We're still taking in more people than there are jobs to be filled.
"John used to work as a roofer, but was recently laid off. He was unable to find another job as a roofer due to the downturn in the construction sector. Many of his former work colleagues have emigrated. He is currently on the dole. There is a job available in his local Spar shop, but the pay is not nearly enough to support him and his family, so John stays on the dole.I think restricting immigration will have a greater impact on the dole queues because it will make it easier for people on the dole to get back into employment.
Pavel arrives in John's neighbourhood from The Czech Rep. He finds a room to rent. He takes the job in John's local Spar shop, but it's not quite enough to make ends meet, so he takes a job as a lounge boy in a local pub too. John stays on the dole."
See the problem with your argument?
Exactly. So whadya think we should be concentrating on doing right now?There's no point getting people off the dole if they can't find jobs when they go looking for them.0
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