England v Ireland: why not?

shane86

Reminded by the legends v legends thread, been 13 years now since any grudge match. Having a think about it and Holland v Germany is about the only big national rivalry that hasnt had a recent outing in some type (and there may have been a friendly or two I dont know of). England v Germany several times, ditto France-Italy, Germany-Poland, Denmark-Sweden, etc etc, both competitive or friendly. What are the reasons behind stopping such a friendly? The hooligan problem and the political situation that made it so violent in Dublin are largely gone, so why no match?

Mind you, if we were to both reach the play offs and were pitted against them, seeing Ireland go through and whack the smile off that chancer Capello would nearly be better than actualy winning the cup :pac:

estebancambias

Northern Ireland vs Ireland hasn't been done in about 8 years either. the last time we played i was just a kid and i went with my dad and it was very scary. some of the chants from the north were disgusting.

spockety

They'll test the waters with a Queen's visit to Dublin first, and see if she gets her head bashed in.

Actually, they already tried testing the waters by running a few Orangemen down o'Connell St for a parade, look how that turned out.



Soccer hooliganism may be dormant, but general scummery is not, and you can be sure they would be out in force for a fixture like this.

kmart6

Never happen here...the GAA don't wanna lose their seats!:pac:

citytillidie

After Derry Linfield tonight wave bye bye to the all ireland league.

Linfield fans threw a flare into the Derry crowd along with some bottles coins and sticks, and some was returned

Charlie

Problem with this is, if we played them on a semi regular basis, I reckon there would be little to no trouble. But by having such a large gap, all the nawty firms see it as their Christmas day, and will make sure they get there to cause trouble. Such incidents I don't think would be actually reflective between 90%+ of both countries fans.

Mr.Nice Guy

It's crazy that it's been 13 years since the last nasty incident. I tend to agree with charlie on this. The scumbags will see a fixture between both sides as an opportunity to make mischief and it would probably take a lot of effort from both associations to make sure everything runs smoothly. No doubt what happened in 1995 would be brought up quite a lot if a new fixture was planned.

I'd like to see it happen but unless we are pitted against one another in a competitive fixture I can't see it taking place.

JimiTime

charlie mchugh wrote: »

Problem with this is, if we played them on a semi regular basis, I reckon there would be little to no trouble. But by having such a large gap, all the nawty firms see it as their Christmas day, and will make sure they get there to cause trouble. Such incidents I don't think would be actually reflective between 90%+ of both countries fans.

I actually think the opposite.I think if it was a scheduled type fixture you'd have the scum building up for it each time. Like the home international series. I think there is a great risk of tit for tat nonsense between the scum element. I suppose we wont know 'till it happens.

Benedict XVI

estebancambias wrote: »

Northern Ireland vs Ireland hasn't been done in about 8 years either. the last time we played i was just a kid and i went with my dad and it was very scary. some of the chants from the north were disgusting.

It's actually about 13 years, qualifing for Euro 96.

As for Ireland V England, we should leave that to the luck or misfortune of a qualifing draw.

LuckyLloyd

There are many more cons than pros. And in anycase, playing a friendly where all the marbles are at stake is counterproductive.

zAbbo

Grudge match, lol, only for us - with our massive inferiority complex.

estebancambias

yes zabbo, ireland is the only country who would call playing against a country that raped and pillaged through their land a grudge match.:rolleyes:

what silly little people we are.

Mr.Nice Guy

Benedict XVI wrote: »

It's actually about 13 years, qualifing for Euro 96.

It's not been that long. I'm pretty sure NI beat us in the last encounter which if I recall correctly was a friendly at Lansdowne. I'd say it was the late nineties or so.

zAbbo

estebancambias wrote: »

yes zabbo, ireland is the only country who would call playing against a country that raped and pillaged through their land a grudge match.:rolleyes:

what silly little people we are.

Sport > Politics

Who would of thought you were so small minded, eh?, must be from all the raping and pillaging you took.

estebancambias

what does that even mean? sport is greater than politics?

its foolish if you think there is no correlation.

Benedict XVI

Mr.Nice Guy wrote: »

It's not been that long. I'm pretty sure NI beat us in the last encounter which if I recall correctly was a friendly at Lansdowne. I'd say it was the late nineties or so.

I stand corrected, you are quiet right

Saturday May 29, 1999 Ireland Republic 0 - 1 Northern Ireland

http://www.soccerway.com/international/world/friendly/1999

Davidth88

I would love to see this game. HOWEVER

Interestingly I was at the Wembley game back in 91, the atmosphere was hostile to say the least . It was horrible ( I am English ).

I was in a pub before the game when some people I know who happen to be Celtic fans turned up, they were on their way to Kilburn for an ' off ' with the England fans . To be frank I was shocked , there were these guys who had travelled from Scotland just for a fight ,had no tickets, were not interested in the game , and indeed when I met them a few weeks later admitted they didn't even see the game.

In the stadium it was ok, but out in the streets it was horrible , I would not have wanted to be an Irish person that night.

I was shocked but I am afraid not surprised at the outcome of that night in Dublin, true there was some pretty inept policing that night , and the organisation was pretty nieve

I think things have moved on a lot since then, has anyone been to an ' Old Firm ' game recently or a Belfast Derby ? This would be an interesting litmus test for how any such game might pan out.

Xavi6

estebancambias wrote: »

yes zabbo, ireland is the only country who would call playing against a country that raped and pillaged through their land a grudge match.:rolleyes:

what silly little people we are.

:rolleyes: Seriously, let it go.

No need for any of this friendly 'grudge' match bollox. If we draw them in competition then fair enough but otherwise why bother?

stovelid

Trapp should jump at the chance of a friendly versus England, in Croker.

If we scraped a one-all draw, Trapp could survive on the feelgood factor until the 2030 qualifiers. RTE could do a great, rousing, anniversary programme called Battle of Croker: The Day Their Smiles Faded, in 2028.

mike65

I'd be in favour and I'd play it in France! Take all the potential sting out of it by forcing all and sundry to go through passport control and enjoy a friendly in a fine neutral venue where there would also be a decent number of curious locals.

Mike

Burial

stovelid wrote: »

Trapp should jump at the chance of a friendly versus England, in Croker.

If we scraped a one-all draw, Trapp could survive on the feelgood factor until the 2030 qualifiers. RTE could do a great, rousing, anniversary programme called Battle of Croker: The Day Their Smiles Faded, in 2028.

I laughed!

Anyway, I think people shouldn't outlay their angers on a soccer match... However, I'd love if we were to play England in Croker. That would be amazing. I'd instantly buy tickets!!!

Playing in France would just send all of our problems to France...

Fratton Fred

spockety wrote: »

They'll test the waters with a Queen's visit to Dublin first, and see if she gets her head bashed in.

Actually, they already tried testing the waters by running a few Orangemen down o'Connell St for a parade, look how that turned out.



Soccer hooliganism may be dormant, but general scummery is not, and you can be sure they would be out in force for a fixture like this.

what have orangemen got to do with the England football team, or England in general for that matter

zAbbo wrote: »

Grudge match, lol, only for us - with our massive inferiority complex.

fraid so.

estebancambias wrote: »

yes zabbo, ireland is the only country who would call playing against a country that raped and pillaged through their land a grudge match.:rolleyes:

actually yeah, it probably is given the time gap since Irish independance.

stovelid wrote: »

Trapp should jump at the chance of a friendly versus England, in Croker.

If we scraped a one-all draw, Trapp could survive on the feelgood factor until the 2030 qualifiers. RTE could do a great, rousing, anniversary programme called Battle of Croker: The Day Their Smiles Faded, in 2028.

I can't see it ever happening in Croker. The GAA will only let certain friendlies in there and I can't see any chance of them letting England play there. Wembley maybe, where i also think there is a lot less chance of trouble, but to be honest, what will either manager get from this game? It will be like a local Derby with too many fired up players and too much chance of injury.

spockety

Fratton Fred wrote: »

what have orangemen got to do with the England football team, or England in general for that matter

Absolutely nothing. Which shows that you have completely missed my point, well done.

Villain

TBH I think the last thing Trap needs is loaded match like one against England and lets be honest they have far more quality than us, why invite England to Croker build a huge ammount of nonsense hype and then get a beating, what good would that do for Trap and his attempts to rebuild the Irish team.

Plus the rugby fans showed how we have moved on as a nation during the England match in Croker why go back 10 years by giving soccer fans a chance to undo all that?

Fratton Fred

spockety wrote: »

Absolutely nothing. Which shows that you have completely missed my point, well done.

thank you, you are most generous.

what was your point? are you implying that the great unwashed on the republican community, the ones that cameout for the Orange march will come out for the game with England?

Maybe, but they didn't for the rugby match, so who knows?

spockety

Fratton Fred wrote: »

thank you, you are most generous.

what was your point? are you implying that the great unwashed on the republican community, the ones that cameout for the Orange march will come out for the game with England?

Maybe, but they didn't for the rugby match, so who knows?

These guys are not 'the republican community'. They are just scumbags, looking for an excuse to kick things off. Rugby isn't their game, probably wouldn't be seen within 10 miles of a rugby match, but the thoughts of a soccer match would bring with it images of lines of Gardai, british soccer riots of old, and the 1995 lansdowne match. "Ah boyz, this is gunna be f***in class.. get a few f****n cans and head down o'connell st to bash some headz and turn over and burn out cars, maybe crack a few Garda skullz.. f****n aye!".

Not true republicans, not true football fans (in the match going sense), just people who think it would be a good excuse to wrap themselves in a flag and cause a ruckus.

The Orange Order march was an example of it. The mentality, that is.

Bubs101

Most English fans like to see Ireland do well TBH, remember 1994. Still think it's really sad that a bunch of thugs still can't get past 800 years

evad_lhorg

Xavi6 wrote: »

:rolleyes: Seriously, let it go.

No need for any of this friendly 'grudge' match bollox. If we draw them in competition then fair enough but otherwise why bother?

yes fair enough, I agree entirely and think it is a load of crap when you see kids talking about the country's history and what England did many moons ago but it is always the scumbags who go on like this and they still run rampant when they want and as many people that think "who cares, its a game and should be nothing else" it doesnt matter, there will be trouble if it happens again.

Y2J_MUFC

estebancambias wrote: »

yes zabbo, ireland is the only country who would call playing against a country that raped and pillaged through their land a grudge match.:rolleyes:

what silly little people we are.

Bollocks of the highest order. How many Irish people will happily support English clubs, follow the EPL, visit England and then turn around and say spout that they hate the English? Total BS. Can't have it both ways.

You weren't raped, you weren't pillaged, so get over it. No point in blaming people for actions of their ancestors.

Personally, I think it wouldn't be such a bad thing for a game to happen. I mean, God Save The Queen was respected when England played Rugby in Croker (and rightly so), so whats the problem? You've always have scum on both sides, but it seems to work fine with the rugby....

Het-Field

It would be great.

That incident in 1995 was a once off in my opinion. I dont think I will ever forget it. My dad worked close to Lansdowne Road, and the cleaning ladies were telling both him and I not to attend the match. Apparently the English fans had been flinging paper cups at Irish fans as they made they way into the ground.

Probably my abiding memory is when the trouble first began, and just before I broke into a flood of tears, I saw a full can of 7up, and a bag from Brown Thomas being hurled for that end of the West Stand. Not only were they useful at pulling up seats, they also liked to look stylish !!