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Do all Catholics in the six counties want a united Ireland?

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    #782
    K-9
    Registered Users Posts: 43,311 ✭✭✭✭K-9


    TOMASJ wrote: »
    I think you need to go figure Jimmy, Tory Island is part of Donegal and is not in Big Ians constituency, it is the most Northerly part of the island of Ireland,

    I think he means Rathlin.

    Mad Men's Don Draper : What you call love was invented by guys like me, to sell nylons.



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    #783
    djpbarry
    Registered Users Posts: 13,104 ✭✭✭✭djpbarry


    TOMASJ wrote: »
    Tory Island is part of Donegal and is not in Big Ians constituency, it is the most Northerly part of the island of Ireland,
    How can one island be the most northerly part of another island?


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    #784
    TOMASJ
    Registered Users Posts: 656 ✭✭✭TOMASJ


    djpbarry wrote: »
    How can one island be the most northerly part of another island?
    Is this ok for you Djgbarry

    Tory Island is part of Donegal and is not in Big Ians constituency, it is the most Northerly inhabited island of the coast of the republic of Ireland, (open to correction on that by a geography expert)
    and it is definitely not a DUP stronghold


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    #785
    T runner
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,307 ✭✭✭T runner


    djpbarry wrote: »
    Sorry, but the evidence suggests otherwise:

    http://www.prospect-magazine.co.uk/article_details.php?id=7817

    Hardly evidence is it. A different language, diffreent appearance, differences noticed from the first time they arrived till today. It may not suit your agenda to say the English are different to Irish bit that doesnt make the English any less Germanic.
    Whether you care to admit it or not, we’re all quite closely related, genetically at least.

    Why would I admit something so blatantlu untrue?

    I’d feel quite sorry for someone who feels they are defined by a piece of paper issued by a department of foreign affairs.

    I think thats a eak argument. It is more than a piece of paper. It represents how your ruling government view your nationality. And if your nationality is not covered by your rulers definition, there is a problem especially when accompanied by supression as witnessed in Northeren Ireland after partition and all ireland before.
    So let’s see some figures then. Demonstrate the economic benefit of unification.

    How can you have figures for something that hasnt happenned yet?
    The figures show Northern Ireland, previously a strong part of Ireland as totally dependent on Britain. Similar figures may have shown dependence from the free state counties. I think the figures have more to with a dependency, colonial mentality in the colony.

    Refute what? Your fanciful claim? I don’t have to accept it because it’s utter nonsense. Feel free to prove otherwise.

    That is blatantly untrue. Your own quoted poll shows that no catholics are unionist and no protestant are nationalist!!!!!!! Are your arguments so weak that you are now trying to refute your own poll because it doesnt suit yopur agenda?
    Are you denying the the results of this poll now?
    Ah, well that’s me convinced

    I dont think anything will convince you, your posts demonstrate an entrenched illogical view immune to take on reason when it is at odds with your view.


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    #786
    T runner
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,307 ✭✭✭T runner


    Camelot wrote: »
    The Original question in Post #1 was "Do all Catholics in the six counties want a united Ireland"?
    and this question has been definitively answered in Post 732 ~ 734 and surrounding Posts .......

    That is your opinion. The poll showed 47% wanting a United Ireland outright and 34% wanting homerule. Homerule would be seen as a stepping stone to a united Ireland by many catholics. Therefore many who suggested homerule in this poll would see it as a necessary first step to full independence.
    It also shows the catholic population showing a less insular approach and a stronger willingness to compromise from the entrenched positions of the 80's.

    The question is how many of the catholics polling for home rule would want a united Ireland eventually? The vast majority Id suggest.


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    #787
    T runner
    Closed Accounts Posts: 4,307 ✭✭✭T runner


    gurramok wrote: »
    Maybe it is well known, or maybe it is not, we'll wait and see.

    My point was that locality factor does not traverse the tribal factor. A Unionist will vote for Unionist party, Alliance, Independent and would never vote for a Nationalist candidate unless forced to do so.
    The latter occurred in West Belfast in the 90's. Unionists voted for Joe Hendron(SDLP) in order to stop Gerry Adams getting elected. But in the next election, Nationalists voted overwhelmingly for SF in that constituency by sheer force of numbers that in the next election, the small Unionist population went back to their traditional voting ways for UUP/DUP/PUP as it was pointless tactically voting. It was a forced blip just like what i described in the election for the GFA.

    I would agree with that. There is the odd anomaly. In one of the assembly ekections the DUP managed to get 1 of the 6 seats in west Belfast. Catholics voted for the DUP in very strong protest over a local issue. This was a bit of the slap in the face for Sinn Fein who normally control their electorate.
    The next election it returned to 6 nationalist. It nearly always goes on tribal (religious) lines the election results dont lie.


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    #788
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    I don't know what it is but some posters have a rosy view of the political attitudes of Northerners.

    Maybe its because they have no contact with people living up there or do not keep up to date with current affairs or they are too young to remember the various local issues for example T runner and me highlighted.

    I notice those same posters have not posted local knowledge of current affairs hardly in this thread to backup their claims, its nearly always left to those who argue the other side to post valid viewpoints.

    I think we should organise a boardsie trip up north or at least have a sticky on what times NI current affairs programmes are on the tv or the web :D


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    #789
    jimmmy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,539 ✭✭✭jimmmy


    K-9 wrote: »
    I think he means Rathlin.


    Yes, I meant Rathlin....I was doing something else at the same time as typing !


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    #790
    Irlbo
    Closed Accounts Posts: 347 ✭✭Irlbo


    jimmmy wrote: »
    Yes, I meant Rathlin....I was doing something else at the same time as typing !

    Sure you were!


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    #791
    Fighting Irish
    Registered Users Posts: 7,065 ✭✭✭Fighting Irish


    lol @ religion


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    #792
    Dannyboy83
    Registered Users Posts: 4,236 ✭✭✭Dannyboy83


    Kev_ps3 wrote: »
    Patriots do, traitors dont.

    Disobedience, in the eyes of anyone who has read history, is man's original virtue. It is through disobedience that progress has been made, through disobedience and through rebellion.

    OW


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    #793
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    Our failure in achieving a united ireland so far can be found in our failure as a society to take interest.

    We are comfortable in our surroundings so we dont give a dam.

    I think our attitude is a result of our changing nature and a handicap

    No matter what your religion a united ireland should be your goal. Not because you care for it but because its the last grip the brits have on your heritage.

    But considering most people dont give a dam about there next door neighbour the task of achieving a united ireland will fall on those in the northern counties or those who have seen what they have to live with


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    #794
    shqipshume
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,193 ✭✭✭shqipshume


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    Our failure in achieving a united ireland so far can be found in our failure as a society to take interest.

    We are comfortable in our surroundings so we dont give a dam.

    I think our attitude is a result of our changing nature and a handicap

    No matter what your religion a united ireland should be your goal. Not because you care for it but because its the last grip the brits have on your heritage.

    But considering most people dont give a dam about there next door neighbour the task of achieving a united ireland will fall on those in the northern counties or those who have seen what they have to live with

    Yep back benchers like with the goverment voting.
    Signs pointed dont vote fianna fail and what did they do.
    Its called lazy not giving a dam till **** hits the fan lol:D


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    #795
    jimmmy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,539 ✭✭✭jimmmy


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    the task of achieving a united ireland will fall on those in the northern counties or those who have seen what they have to live with

    Equally one could say the task of resisting a 32 county socialist ireland will fall on those in the northern counties or those who have seen what they have to live with.


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    #796
    djpbarry
    Registered Users Posts: 13,104 ✭✭✭✭djpbarry


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    No matter what your religion a united ireland should be your goal.
    Why?


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    #797
    Joey the lips
    Registered Users Posts: 10,262 ✭✭✭✭Joey the lips


    djpbarry wrote: »
    Why?

    Well why not? more importantly. If your asking your life is sweet and you have no problems. But i could write a 30000 word eassy convincing you why and you will either not read it or not give a dam!


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    #798
    Soldie
    Hosted Moderators Posts: 1,713 ✭✭✭Soldie


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    Well why not? more importantly. If your asking your life is sweet and you have no problems. But i could write a 30000 word eassy convincing you why and you will either not read it or not give a dam!

    Because it's pointless and we can't afford it.


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    #799
    djpbarry
    Registered Users Posts: 13,104 ✭✭✭✭djpbarry


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    Well why not?
    Because I don't see how a United Ireland will improve the lives of the population of this island. Now, your turn; why should a United Ireland be our goal?


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    #800
    luckyfrank
    Closed Accounts Posts: 1,054 ✭✭✭luckyfrank


    djpbarry wrote: »
    Because I don't see how a United Ireland will improve the lives of the population of this island. Now, your turn; why should a United Ireland be our goal?


    I think a united ireland would improve the lives of everyone on this island

    An all ireland economy would be much stronger

    Once we've figured out how we can change the north's dependancy on public sector jobs a united ireland would benfit everybody unionists would actully be in meaningful goverment and create real policys


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    #801
    djpbarry
    Registered Users Posts: 13,104 ✭✭✭✭djpbarry


    luckyfrank wrote: »
    An all ireland economy would be much stronger

    Once we've figured out how we can change the north's dependancy on public sector jobs...
    In other words, we magically remove the North's dependency on the public sector et voila! Everything's hunky dory.

    :rolleyes:

    You'll have to do better than that.


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    #802
    Permabear
    Closed Accounts Posts: 39,022 ✭✭✭✭Permabear


    This post has been deleted.


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    #803
    sceptre
    Registered Users Posts: 19,608 ✭✭✭✭sceptre


    Joey the lips wrote: »
    Well why not? more importantly. If your asking your life is sweet and you have no problems. But i could write a 30000 word eassy convincing you why and you will either not read it or not give a dam!
    If you're not willing to write a 200-word post that I might read, I don't see why I should consider reading your 30000 word essay that you're not going to write.

    "Well why not?" is probably the last thing that little Johnny thinks before he just jumps out the window after little Jackie. I need rather better than that to convince my cactus to support something, let alone me to agree with it.


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    #804
    jimmmy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,539 ✭✭✭jimmmy


    luckyfrank wrote: »
    I think a united ireland would improve the lives of everyone on this island
    Unless it was part of the British Isles ( the way other island groups eg Japan, New Zealand ) where we would then have better economy of scale, no need to pay so many super expensive Presidents / politicians, Taoiseach / embassies in every far flung little corner of the world ....

    Would'nt it be great to have access to Sainsbury / Asda prices in every town in Ireland without having to travel to Newry or Enniskillen. And great to be able to buy a nice car for many thousands less, like in the rest of the UK.


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    #805
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    donegalfella wrote: »
    This post has been deleted.

    The UK is in the same boat so that argument is void.


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    #806
    jimmmy
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,539 ✭✭✭jimmmy


    gurramok wrote: »
    The UK is in the same boat.

    At least they do not have to go across the border to feed themselves at reasonable prices. We are still getting handouts from Europe , as we have done since the seventies. The UK has been the second biggest contributer to Europe....what would their economy be like now if they had not subsidised the likes of us ?


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    #807
    gurramok
    Closed Accounts Posts: 13,992 ✭✭✭✭gurramok


    jimmmy wrote: »
    At least they do not have to go across the border to feed themselves at reasonable prices. We are still getting handouts from Europe , as we have done since the seventies. The UK has been the second biggest contributer to Europe....what would their economy be like now if they had not subsidised the likes of us ?

    Actually, why couldn't you say the truth?

    We are been subsidised by a range of countries including the UK , Germany, France etc.. You'd swear it was the UK only by your lingo! ;)

    Many small countries have high costs of living in Europe, look at Finland, Norway etc, the hint been the cost of living it goes in cycles. We had northerners coming down here for shopping in the 90's!!

    And to top it off, many countries in Africa are broke and we don't see them crying to rejoin the British or French empires! :D


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    #808
    ilkhanid
    Registered Users Posts: 929 ✭✭✭ilkhanid


    "And to top it off, many countries in Africa are broke and we don't see them crying to rejoin the British or French empires!"
    I believe people in Sierra Leone evinced this sentiment when British troops arrived not too long ago.:D


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    #809
    LordSutch
    Closed Accounts Posts: 12,078 ✭✭✭✭LordSutch


    So in this fanciful idea of a 'United Ireland' would Northern Ireland be governed from Dublin instead of London? or would the NI devolved government still be devolved (but from Dublin instead of London)?


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    #810
    Pandcoa
    Closed Accounts Posts: 31 ✭Pandcoa


    Camelot wrote: »
    So in this fanciful idea of a 'United Ireland' would Northern Ireland be governed from Dublin instead of London? or would the NI devolved government still be devolved (but from Dublin instead of London)?

    I think republicans would be thankful to settle for a devolved government up north from Dublin similarly to what it is now, they realise loyalists would never just accept rule from Dublin. This is similar to Sinn Feins old "Eire Nua" federal Ireland strategy, and still part of Republican SF policies I think.


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    #811
    fryup
    Registered Users Posts: 18,067 ✭✭✭✭fryup


    luckyfrank wrote: »
    Not all catholics want a united ireland but the majority do same as not all prodestants want to remain in the union but the majority do

    its spelt ..protestant you ignorant twat

    reading some of these comments makes me baffled at some peoples attitudes to the population up north esp the unionists.....do you honestly believe they would be happy to join up with a country that has been (lets face it) a safe haven for the killers (i.e. ira & inla) of they're people??


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