Foreign Nationals flying in for the day to sign on the dole

mudakala

I heard many storys what kind of thing did irish people in england, back in 80s, so in my view, it all right if several thousand polish are doing the same in here, if they are able to. They also payd taxes here, like irish people did. They cannot just leave, building up the country, and then ****ed off from the work place, when they are no longer needed. Im not polish myself, but if you compare them with nigerians, then polish are 100% better option .

Most polish people are working, but the africans, they dont.

Mena

mudakala wrote: »

I heard many storys what kind of thing did irish people in england, back in 80s, so in my view, it all right if several thousand polish are doing the same in here, if they are able to. They also payd taxes here, like irish people did. They cannot just leave, building up the country, and then ****ed off from the work place, when they are no longer needed. Im not polish myself, but if you compare them with nigerians, then polish are 100% better option .

Most polish people are working, but the africans, they dont.

You're talking s h i t.

And yes, I am African.

silverharp

people on welfare should have to hand over their passports , foreign travel is a luxury activity and permission to travel should be agreed with the dole office, as the person cant be abroad and looking for work

-ducks for cover

Nodin

CiaranC wrote: »

Is this thread still going? Are there still people out there who honestly believe people are flying into Dublin Airport to collect the Dole?

Not only the dole, but free cars, houses, and vast amounts of free money.

Mena wrote:

You're talking s h i t.

He is indeed. Considering how widespread these myths are, you'd wonder why no-one in officialdom takes time to launch a campaign against them. Presumably they prefer dirty looks thrown at accents and skin colour, rather than bricks at the real thieves in D4 etc.

DubArk

mudakala wrote: »

I heard many storys what kind of thing did irish people in england, back in 80s, so in my view, it all right if several thousand polish are doing the same in here, if they are able to. They also payd taxes here, like irish people did. They cannot just leave, building up the country, and then ****ed off from the work place, when they are no longer needed. Im not polish myself, but if you compare them with nigerians, then polish are 100% better option .

Most polish people are working, but the africans, they dont.

I have never read such rasist clap trap and I'm surprised the mods haven't stepped in and banned you for such remarks? :rolleyes:

silverharp

silverharp wrote: »

people on welfare should have to hand over their passports , foreign travel is a luxury activity and permission to travel should be agreed with the dole office, as the person cant be abroad and looking for work

-ducks for cover

Confiscating passports from suspected cheats is sufficient, not for everyone.
Someone might have a family crisis at "home" and need to travel there quickly, if their passport's gone, they're stuffed.

Mena

Would denying someone their passport not infringe some human right?

Besides, I don't see the need. As far as I know, you're only allowed two weeks holiday while claiming JB/JA. If you miss getting your payment at the PO other than that you lose it.

Removing someone's passport seems superfluous to me.

pdb123

its a fairly simple fix, anyone who is not Irish should have to present themselves to the local garda station twice a week unless..
present proof when you go to sign on

pdb123

pdb123 wrote: »

its a fairly simple fix, anyone who is not Irish should have to present themselves to the local garda station twice a week unless..
present proof when you go to sign on

No point in tarring all with thsame brush, only those suspected of cheating should be treated this way.

Nodin

Considering theres no proof that its happening (to my knowledge) I fail to see the need to consider any measures.....

themadchef

Some people percieve the dole as free money.

I feel the day is only around the corner when people will actually have to do some kind of work while on the dole. Ten hours a week, community work like FAS..whatever.

Not everyone wants to be on the dole i know that. But, for some it's almost a career. A day or two community service would soon get rid of all the day trippers and if nothing else sicken the hole off those who stay at home because they can, not because there is no work. There were still plenty of these on the live register in the good times. It should have been brought in then imo.

Look at all the community projects that would benefit too. Im sure most people would actually like to feel like their earning their money!

mudakala

DubArk wrote: »

I have never read such rasist clap trap and I'm surprised the mods haven't stepped in and banned you for such remarks? :rolleyes:

You seem to be a real blind idiot. Sure thing you dont know anything what is going on, in your own country. And Im not going to tell you that either. You can live and die, without getting to know how someone is taking money just from your own wallet. How these people are driving cars that you only see in TV, having holidays when ever and when they want and it all comes without working a day in this country.

javaboy

mudakala wrote: »

You seem to be a real blind idiot. Sure thing you dont know anything what is going on, in your own country. And Im not going to tell you that either. You can live and die, without getting to know how someone is taking money just from your own wallet. How these people are driving cars that you only see in TV, having holidays when ever and when they want and it all comes without working a day in this country.

Banned.

pcardin

mudakala wrote: »

You seem to be a real blind idiot. Sure thing you dont know anything what is going on, in your own country. And Im not going to tell you that either. You can live and die, without getting to know how someone is taking money just from your own wallet. How these people are driving cars that you only see in TV, having holidays when ever and when they want and it all comes without working a day in this country.

Agree. Sad but fact.

pcardin

DubArk wrote: »

Those remarks make you no better then the people your talking about!! You CANT talk about people in Ireland as if their one unit! :rolleyes:

I agree with you but just remember your own words next time you are talking or will talk about foreingers. They also are not all the same. :cool:

Nodin

pcardin wrote: »

Agree. Sad but fact.

A fact?

Who are "these people"?
What specific cars are they driving that we 'only see on TV'?
Why havent you reported them to the Department?
Why hasn't he?

thelordofcheese

Nodin wrote: »

A fact?

Who are "these people"?
What specific cars are they driving that we 'only see on TV'?
Why havent you reported them to the Department?
Why hasn't he?

I'm assuming it's because the Department have a rule against investigating events that have been imagined.

DubArk

mudakala wrote: »

You seem to be a real blind idiot. Sure thing you dont know anything what is going on, in your own country. And Im not going to tell you that either. You can live and die, without getting to know how someone is taking money just from your own wallet. How these people are driving cars that you only see in TV, having holidays when ever and when they want and it all comes without working a day in this country.

:rolleyes:

9 posts and you’re the fountain of all knowledge!! Now you’re calling me an idiot. Your obviously unable to communicate your thoughts and arguments without reducing yourself to name calling and been a racist.

mudakala wrote: »

They cannot just leave, building up the country, and then ****ed off from the work place, when they are no longer needed. Im not polish myself, but if you compare them with nigerians, then polish are 100% better option .

Most polish people are working, but the africans, they dont.

Maybe some day you might broaden your tiny little mind and travel and see this wonderful planet that we all share and learn that Ireland is not the centre of the planet. You surround yourself in half truths like a protective membrane hiding your ignorance. Making your broad statements is just you trying to hide your lack of education on the subject(If you chuck enough ****e some of it might stick).

You’re not that clever its really easy to be a racist...... no effort required!
It's a lazy argument! :rolleyes::rolleyes:

MisterMonkey

I know a guy who lives in holland and used to come back once a month for his dole now he just has a friend go into the social welfare office with his social security card with no photo and collect it for him once a week. his argument is that if he didnt do it hed be back in ireland on the dole anyway so whats the difference

DubArk

pcardin wrote: »

I agree with you but just remember your own words next time you are talking or will talk about foreingers. They also are not all the same. :cool:

Sorry is it me but that makes no sense at all!!!

redout

We are getting screwed all over. I read in the Independent just the other day that we are now giving over €4.5 Million a year to persons overseas claiming for Children who are Irish citizens at to jumping from just €1 Million a couple of years back. How the hell is that so you ask ? Its the forigners who had the kids here before we closed the loophole at to now leaving the country and are claiming for the kids. Obviously no way Irish people jumped from €1 Million to €4.5 Million in just a couple of years as that would have required thousands to have all of a sudden just upped and left the country which is not logical for that many to have done so.

redout

Mena wrote: »

Would denying someone their passport not infringe some human right?

Besides, I don't see the need. As far as I know, you're only allowed two weeks holiday while claiming JB/JA. If you miss getting your payment at the PO other than that you lose it.

Removing someone's passport seems superfluous to me.

Its not a violation of a persons rights to remove their passport as it happens every day of the week when the courts order people to surrender their passports to the Gardai before they are even convicted of a crime. Its certainly an idea worthy of further thought. If a person is claiming the dole then why would it be that they are travelling back to their home country so frequently. Anyone who is known to do so then should have to surrender there passport to the Gardai until such matter is sorted out and they can supply a valid reason for leaving the country regularly. Another way to get around this is that those on the dole should have to sign a register at the dole office for example on a Monday just to prove that they are actually in the country (shouldnt be hard considering they are not working right ?) then come to collect there dole on say a friday. That way it would cut down on the amount of persons abusing the system as it would require them to travel here twice a week which would probably make them give it up or else stay here permanently.

rayme1

id do the very same if i could get away with it only problem is im irish,so im kept down all the time!! its the stupid ****ing governments fault!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

thelordofcheese

redout wrote: »

Its not a violation of a persons rights to remove their passport as it happens every day of the week when the courts order people to surrender their passports to the Gardai before they are even convicted of a crime.

however, at that point they have been charged with a crime, hence the curtailing of their basic rights.
People that are on the dole (or god forbid, not irish and on the dole) have committed no crime and certainly have not been charged with anything.

redout wrote: »

Its certainly an idea worthy of further thought.

No, it's not.

redout wrote: »

Another way to get around this is that those on the dole should have to sign a register at the dole office for example on a Monday just to prove that they are actually in the country (shouldnt be hard considering they are not working right ?) then come to collect there dole on say a friday. That way it would cut down on the amount of persons abusing the system as it would require them to travel here twice a week which would probably make them give it up or else stay here permanently.

Wait, so at a time when the country is looking to save money and the most obvious area of costcutting would be to streamline and reduce the bureaucracy of government offices, your solution is to create a system that would, at the very least, create double the paperwork.

*slow clap*
Well done.

redout

thelordofcheese wrote: »

however, at that point they have been charged with a crime, hence the curtailing of their basic rights. People that are on the dole (or god forbid, not irish and on the dole) have committed no crime and certainly have not been charged with anything.

Charged with a crime is not convicted. People leaving on a regular basis without just cause to their home country is enough to warrant suspicion by the Gardai and therefore should be enough reason for the Gardai to seize the passport until a valid explanation is given for a person returning to their home country every week and only returning to Ireland for a day or two. Certain people on the dole do commit crime by ripping the state off ! but as the above if there is suspicion of fraudulent activity against the state then the Gardai must act.


No, it's not.

I dont agree.


Wait, so at a time when the country is looking to save money and the most obvious area of costcutting would be to streamline and reduce the bureaucracy of government offices, your solution is to create a system that would, at the very least, create double the paperwork.

More money would be saved recouping the millions being fraudently siphoned from the state on a weekly basis than the cost of your paperwork so at the end of the day it makes sense. Your reasoning on that does not add up. Why bother with CAB then by your reckoning ? An agency with a budget of millions of €uro a year to recoup millions from criminals

.

thelordofcheese

redout wrote: »

Charged with a crime is not convicted. People leaving on a regular basis without just cause to their home country is enough to warrant suspicion by the Gardai and therefore should be enough reason for the Gardai to seize the passport until a valid explanation is given for a person returning to their home country every week and only returning to Ireland for a day or two.

No. this is stupid and an over reaction.
Ignoring how exactly this information is supposed to become known, if it's known that people are leaving the country frequently, then have them come to the Dole office and explain it. If the explaination is not sufficent or they don't turn up, stop the payment.
Seizing their passport is a kneejerk reaction with absolutely no merit what so ever, and it would be better to increase internal methods of detecting fraud by the dole office than this bizzare 'solution'.

redout wrote: »

I dont agree.

I'm not surprised, it's still an atrocious idea.

redout wrote: »

More money would be saved recouping the millions being fraudently siphoned from the state on a weekly basis than the cost of your paperwork so at the end of the day it makes sense.

Millions on a weekly basis? Back that claim up or shush.

redout wrote: »

Your reasoning on that does not add up. Why bother with CAB then by your reckoning ? An agency with a budget of millions of €uro a year to recoup millions from criminals

At this point i don't think even you know what your trying to say. You are certainly not comparing like with like.

So the idea is that seizing peoples passports by the gardai, with no explaination as to HOW you'd figure out if people were travelling abroad coupled with a needlessly complicated double signing system is the solution to welfare fraud.
Am i missing anything?

I just want to make sure this idea is exactly as retarded as i think it is.

thelordofcheese

thelordofcheese wrote: »

Wait, so at a time when the country is looking to save money and the most obvious area of costcutting would be to streamline and reduce the bureaucracy of government offices, your solution is to create a system that would, at the very least, create double the paperwork.

*slow clap*
Well done.

It's called "job creation". better than paying the dole to unemployed bankers, at least they'll earn it.

Boeyenk

Bob the Builder wrote: »

If that was me, and I had a knife....

Fúcking tax payers money being given to scabby little fúckers like that.

At least that man worked or did some labour before.

I can point out many (irish)dole receivers on o connol street, lower abbey street and near the templebar area who never worked a day in their life...

DONT YOU BLAME THE FOREIGNERS!! first look in your own surroundings!

do you hava yawro? any spare chaaaange???

acontadino

why do people make it out that these 'foreigners' are bad shady people. they came here when things are good, just content and now they just receieve dole. i swear some people make me mad. all this baggage. GET ON WITH LIFE.

redout

thelordofcheese wrote: »

No. this is stupid and an over reaction.
Ignoring how exactly this information is supposed to become known, if it's known that people are leaving the country frequently, then have them come to the Dole office and explain it. If the explaination is not sufficent or they don't turn up, stop the payment.
Seizing their passport is a kneejerk reaction with absolutely no merit what so ever, and it would be better to increase internal methods of detecting fraud by the dole office than this bizzare 'solution'.

"If its known" really that is beyond belief that you could say such a thing. That implies the Gardai dont know who enters or leaves the country. Do you really think that so ? FFS get a grip man ! of course they bloody well know who enters and who leaves. Fuk me, like was that for real ? The rest of what you wrote more or less is what I said except that you want these people to explain themselves to the dole office whereas I said the Gardai. How many scroungers Irish/Foreign lie through their teeth to the welfare on a regular basis ! Thats why I reckon the Gardai should deal with it if there is enough there to warrant suspicion. I am sure that you will find that less will try lieing if they had to explain themselves to the Gardai and for those that still did lie the Gardai would be more wide to it one would imagine.




I'm not surprised, it's still an atrocious idea.

So says you the one who thinks we dont know who enters and leaves our own country ! I suppose Bin Laden is hiding in the Wicklow mountains, is he ?



Millions on a weekly basis? Back that claim up or shush.

Well I dont work in the Dept of Finance or the Civil service so I cant but considering how the government recoups millions every year from persons defrauding the system (that info is reported in the press) then I would say that its a safe bet.

.