Using Roundup

Cuauhtemoc

Using Roundup??

I have been clearing a large area that we're going to use for growing vegetables.
The area is/was infested up to head height with a huge variety of weeds(ragwort hogweed and others i haven't identified yet)
The plan was to have it as organic as possible.

Just wondering the best way to clear the site initially. I've hacked it down to ground level and the farmer who is to plough it for us reckons roundup is the only way to go.
Though after reading around a bit I'm not so sure. This
and this for example.

There are also a few homemade vinegar based recipes out there though not sure how effective they'd be.

May well have to go with roundup or something similar but if anyone has thoughts/suggestions I'd be grateful.

Cheers.

C.

ravima

You could pull every weed out by the roots, ensuring that all parts were removed and you should have it weed free, but at what physical cost to your arms, back and mental health.

Roundup is used by all farmers when killing weeds and foliage. If you take all reasonable precautions, you should be OK. If using a knapsack sprayer, ensure that you have plastic leggings on your legs, wear wellies, wear a waterproof coat, wear gloves and a face mask. Also ensure that you spray on a calm day and do not let any drift hit your unprotected face.

Cuauhtemoc

Thanks Ravima,

Practicality does sometimes have to win over. I'll give it a good dose then and see how "organic" i can go from there.

C.

brianthebard

You can't be organic if you are using roundup, that should be obvious? Personally I'd boycott roundup and any other monsanto products if there's a choice which there is. Weeds happen, you can't avoid that, its better to weed often and for a few years than to spray chemicals into an "organic" patch.

Rovi

Glyphosate, the active ingredient of Roundup, is long since gone off patent, so there are plenty of alternatives available for those who have moral issues with using Monsanto products.

Cuauhtemoc

You can't be organic if you are using roundup, that should be obvious? Personally I'd boycott roundup and any other monsanto products if there's a choice which there is. Weeds happen, you can't avoid that, its better to weed often and for a few years than to spray chemicals into an "organic" patch.

I know, but i just don't see how i'd clear this area without spraying..it makes the jungle look tame(well maybe slightly exaggerated).
The home remedy wouldn't kill the roots and i'm hoping to plant for next spring.

What i meant on the organic side was too treat it once with roundup(or something non monsanto equilavent) and then go organic from there. Three years i believe the land has to be untreated for official purposes..i think.
I could still grow in those three years with non organix labelling.


C.

bbam

It seems there is a flaw in the logic here...
While you want to go organic you are well willing to have a good dose of roundup to start with..
It seems (not meaning to have a go) that you want the organic label but not the hard graft that sometimes goes along with it....

How large is the area you are clearing?

I've seen an acre plot cleared by hymac, ploughed/tilled and brought into cultivation.. the key was th scrape off the top 3/4 inches of soil with the digger and then turn the bare soil with the plough..

The result was a plot which hadn't been "poluted" with chemical but which didnt need a leigon of men to get under control either..

Not that it was asked for I think a sensible & moderate usage of chemical is fine, my problem is when chemicals are over-used to substitute best practice or just hard work..

brianthebard

I agree with bbam, if you are going organic then surely it is for some reason, you have chosen this method of horticulture. Does it not seem hypocritical to you to spray with pesticides beforehand and then start to act organic? Imo it should be approaching this from an organic standpoint from the start.

Cuauhtemoc

Bbam/Brian, I do agree with your points. Was looking for alternatives to spraying. I'll accept i probably took that option a little too easily .
I'm fairly new to this and mainly the advice given has been spray then plough and work from there.
Not afraid of a bit of hard work(most of the time ) once i have a plan
It's about half an acre the initial area we're going to use. Not very big.

The hi-mac idea sounds good. Was going to do something similar with a small area using a shovel to plant some garlic now. Didn't occur to me to do the whole lot that way. Might just try and use the shovel on the whole area between now and spring if i have the time.
Good exercise for me!

Thanks for the advice.

C.

Daithi BC

If most of the vegetation is cut down, a couple of outdoor pigs should have it cleared pretty quickly. I put two Tamworths into an old overgrown vegetable garden (about a half-acre in size) and they had it down to bare earth in about a month.

nilhg

bbam wrote: »

It seems there is a flaw in the logic here...
While you want to go organic you are well willing to have a good dose of roundup to start with..
It seems (not meaning to have a go) that you want the organic label but not the hard graft that sometimes goes along with it....

How large is the area you are clearing?

I've seen an acre plot cleared by hymac, ploughed/tilled and brought into cultivation.. the key was th scrape off the top 3/4 inches of soil with the digger and then turn the bare soil with the plough..

The result was a plot which hadn't been "poluted" with chemical but which didnt need a leigon of men to get under control either..

Not that it was asked for I think a sensible & moderate usage of chemical is fine, my problem is when chemicals are over-used to substitute best practice or just hard work..

I have to say the logic of this amuses me, 5lt of Roundup is bad, but burning God knows how many liters of diesel in a hymac and tractor to strip hundreds of tonnes of the most fertile topsoil off your land is good?

Different strokes for different folks...........

bbam

Hundereds of tonnes??
Get yourself a good driver and he'll strip a few tonne at most, mostly vegitation and roots from weeds... I saw this done and there as one tractor trailor load removed... max 5 tonne of weeds roots and some soil.

For the produce from the land to be organic it dont matter how much diesel you burn to get the land right... As long as the land isnt polluted with chemicals..

Its the greens who would rather see you dig for 10 years rather than burn some diesel...:P

Anyhow... I think the whole organic thing is nonsence (no offence OP).

I also like the idea of the pigs... Land cleared and a big fry up to finnish.. win-win

Cuauhtemoc

Well the wife is interested in getting a couple of pigs and have been offered some by local farmer. Although i would lose all my exercise from the digging . She also won't allow them to be christmas dinner (Can't beat a nice bit of ham!!) or a fry up either so she'll be responsible for them .
As for the organic nonsense no offence taken. I agree it can go too far at times (organic clothes amongst other things) but i see no harm in minimizing exposure to pesticides.

As for monsanto the more i read the more i think it takes "Evil Corporation" to a whole new level.

Pigs are the main contender so far then though i'll still dig up for the garlic. Thanks for the replies/advice.

C.

brianthebard

Great idea for the pigs, they'll do the best job of everything and you'll still get your exercise looking after them and digging the ground afterwards. Why won't she let them be cooked though, what else can they be used for?? Pigs' milk-ewwww!

JohnBoy

if god didnt want us to eat pigs he wouldnt have made them so dammed tasty

Cuauhtemoc

Why won't she let them be cooked though, what else can they be used for?? Pigs' milk-ewwww!

I think once we've had them for a while it'd be akin to eating our dog or something. So they'll be employed as mobile rotovaters only. Until i eh.."sell" them.

C.