Sinn Fein/IRA to organise provocative march

jimmy-jazz · 18-10-2008 8:44pm

Zand wrote: »

peace keeping tours in Iraq and Afghanistan.

I'm sure the vast majority of people will agree the RIR and indeed the rest of British Army, have suffered enough trying to bring some peace and order over there

I find it hard to believe to stat with that anyone could even consider it a peacekeeping tour, when more damage has been done since the invasions.

As for the efforts to bring peace and order over there, last time i checked peace wasn't brought around through violent force. Something that i'm sure you would criticise sinn fein and the IRA for.

And as for the march, i can already see hundreds of teenage hooligans with celtic hoodies on the city streets for"the cause", for something they know nothing about. guaranteed to be plenty of stone throwing. I just hope the gardaí do a better job than they did around the time of the love ulster parade.

BlaasForRafa · 18-10-2008 9:12pm

dlofnep wrote: »

Not really, the IRA was defending it's land - The US & Britain were invading a foreign land.

Sinn Féin are justified in their actions. Tough.

Thats one of the most cretinous posts I've ever seen on boards.

So the Ira were justified in killing hundreds of civilians during their "war" eh?

madden1 · 18-10-2008 10:06pm

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

Thats one of the most cretinous posts I've ever seen on boards.

So the Ira were justified in killing hundreds of civilians during their "war" eh?

No they were not nor neither were the British Army the UDA SAS UDR (fill in the rest)
The thing is bad things happened on both sides,
its over, so people don't want all this trailed up again with a coat trailing march by the RIR trough Belfast.

ibuprofen · 18-10-2008 10:08pm

dlofnep wrote: »

The British army were a threat to the civilians of Ireland. Therefore, the IRA had a right to defend itself against the British by your judgement. I'm glad we can both agree that the IRA was justified in their attacks on British military.

+1

dlofnep · 18-10-2008 10:20pm

BlaasForRafa wrote: »

Thats one of the most cretinous posts I've ever seen on boards.

So the Ira were justified in killing hundreds of civilians during their "war" eh?

*Yawn*

Your inability to read really hinders your ability to make any sort of valid statement. I never stated that it justified the deaths of civilians, I stated the IRA was defending against a foreign nation in comparison to the US/Britain which was leading a war for oil. Britain had up until and after that point dictated Irish politics and had used excessive force against the people of Ireland, which lead to the death of many innocent children at the hands of British soldiers, which btw were never held accountable for their actions.

There was a history of injustices against the Irish people at the hands of the British. To say the IRA did not have merit in their war against British soldiers is downright silly.

To compare the IRA's war against the British army, to the British/US conquest for oil in Iraq is ridiculous. The IRA's war had merit, and while the death of civilians at the hands of the IRA is condemnable - It's intentions to remove British rule from Ireland are commendable.

Liam Byrne · 19-10-2008 12:02am

dlofnep wrote: »

To compare the IRA's war against the British army, to the British/US conquest for oil in Iraq is ridiculous.

To many right-thinking people, it was ridiculous to murder innocent people in an attempt to achieve the IRA's "cause". And if you ask many people it's as a result of the despicable tactics that we are NOW only at a half-decent point in sorting out the north's issues. Not "because of" the IRA, but "despite" them.

The IRA's war had merit, and while the death of civilians at the hands of the IRA is condemnable - It's intentions to remove British rule from Ireland are commendable.

Removing Saddam Hussein had merit, and few would have disagreed with it; but Bush & Blair didn't just do that - they unnecessarily murdered thousands of innocent people along the way.

They also made him out to be far more of a threat and a monster than he was; that doesn't mean that he wasn't, but the lies peddled in order to gain support were way off.......and you can draw your own conclusions on how that part correlates.

P.S. Apologies to all right-thinking people for the fact that my quoting that part results in the phrase contained in the initial 5 words has been repeated.

Take the current budget and the resulting furore as an example; there's obviously a need to save money, that everyone acknowledges, but the methods have caused people to despise those who've attempted it the wrong way.

Whatever the possible merits of any goal, the tactics used DO have a bearing.

And to the poster who said that the IRA said they'd exist until the Irish people said no; well, we'd have voted no much earlier if we'd been given the choice, but we weren't consulted initially when they decided to create themselves.

There are plenty of valid comparisons, and yes, it is completely hypocritical.

If it were the IRA that wanted to march, would people who disagreed with what they did along the way be entitled to protest ?

If the people protesting were soldiers in Iraq, then they'd be hypocrites too, but if they were normal, peaceloving people who detest violence and criminiality, they'd be perfectly entitled to protest.

TOMASJ · 19-10-2008 12:27am

[

And to the poster who said that the IRA said they'd exist until the Irish people said no; well, we'd have voted no much earlier if we'd been given the choice, but we weren't consulted initially when they decided to create themselves.

There are plenty of valid comparisons, and yes, it is completely hypocritical

Liam If the IRA had not decided to create themselves. as you put it you would not have the freedom to have had a current budget as you would either be one of those west brits or on the side of the IRA.
wonder which side you would have taken.
.

dlofnep · 19-10-2008 12:49am

Liam Byrne wrote: »

Removing Saddam Hussein had merit, and few would have disagreed with it; but Bush & Blair didn't just do that - they unnecessarily murdered thousands of innocent people along the way.

Except the IRA's goal was to remove British rule. The US/British goal was to secure oil. Big difference.

Liam Byrne wrote: »

If it were the IRA that wanted to march, would people who disagreed with what they did along the way be entitled to protest ?

If the people protesting were soldiers in Iraq, then they'd be hypocrites too, but if they were normal, peaceloving people who detest violence and criminiality, they'd be perfectly entitled to protest.

Firstly, it's Sinn Féin, not the IRA. Secondly, Sinn Féin is engaged in a peaceful route to Irish Unity. Or have you forgotten? They are well entitled to object to British military parades, especially when the same military slaughtered countless civilians here in Ireland, and likewise in Iraq & Afghanistan. The plight of the Irish people is comparable to that of the Iraqis. A oppressive foreign nation (Britain) pushes it's weight about, and tries to control a land that has nothing to do with it. It makes perfect sense to object to parades of their evil military.

Dudess · 19-10-2008 2:43am

Allah Hu Akbar wrote: »

Funny the way most Mod's have a Pro-Brit / Anti-IRA about them.

"Most"? I presume by that you mean about three.

Zand wrote: »

Sinn Fein/IRA are going to organize a provocative march on the very day that the Royal Irish Regiment are to have a homecoming parade through Belfast city centre. They have applied to the Parades Commission for a so called anti war demonstration of up to 500 people on the day 200 RIR return for a homecoming after their peace keeping tours in Iraq and Afghanistan.

These brave young men and women will be welcomed by decent who know they have a very difficult job to do and do it in the most professional manner. I'm sure the vast majority of people will agree the RIR and indeed the rest of British Army, have suffered enough trying to bring some peace and order over there, without the terrorist layabouts who support Sinn Fein/IRA insulting them on their homecoming ??

http://www3.u.tv/news/LocalNews/index.asp?id=91655

What do I hate as much as republican extremists? Oh yeah... people who try to rise others by mouthing off about the no-good terrorist IRA and the honourable British army, while neglecting to consider the background to the IRA's campaign or the atrocities committed by the honourable British army...

Spread · 19-10-2008 11:19am

I think a lot of these rantings are by Colonel Meyers under different guises:D

LordSutch · 19-10-2008 12:02pm

Typical Republican response to what should be a tumultuous Homecoming for the Royal Irish Regiment, anyway it wont stop the majority of decent people from lining the streets with flags & cheering the lads back home. By all accounts the R.I.R did a brave & courageous tour of duty in Iraq and Afghanistan - well done to them I say.

Seeing as Sinn Fein-IRA are so 'Anti' the Local Regiment returning home maybe they (Sinn Fein-IRA) should go & offer their services to the Taliban now that their experteise is no longer required in South America

Erin Go Brath · 19-10-2008 12:05pm

Camelot wrote: »

Typical Republican response to what should be a tumultuous Homecoming for the Royal Irish Regiment, anyway it wont stop the majority of decent people from lining the streets with flags & cheering the lads back home. By all accounts the R.I.R did a brave & courageous tour of duty in Iraq and Afghanistan - well done to them I say.

Seeing as Sinn Fein-IRA are so 'Anti' the Local Regiment returning home maybe they (Sinn Fein-IRA) should go & offer their services to the Taliban now that their experteise is no longer required in South America

You meant to say supporters of war mongers surely

Dudess · 19-10-2008 12:10pm

I kinda think people who say stuff like

it wont stop the majority of decent people from lining the streets with flags & cheering the lads back home. By all accounts the R.I.R did a brave & courageous tour of duty in Iraq and Afghanistan - well done to them I say.

don't really believe what they're saying and are just embracing that whole Republican backlash thing which has become kinda de rigeur I suppose since the Celtic Tiger gained impetus and Irish people forgot about the injustices in the North.
It's all very Independent Newspapers...

dlofnep · 19-10-2008 12:14pm

Camelot wrote: »

Typical Republican response to what should be a tumultuous Homecoming for the Royal Irish Regiment, anyway it wont stop the majority of decent people from lining the streets with flags & cheering the lads back home. By all accounts the R.I.R did a brave & courageous tour of duty in Iraq and Afghanistan - well done to them I say.

The Knights of the round table would shake their heads in disbelief at this.

But well done you say, very well. Perhaps you could care to comment on the following articles.

TOMASJ · 19-10-2008 1:35pm

Camelot wrote: »

Typical Republican response to what should be a tumultuous Homecoming for the Royal Irish Regiment, anyway it wont stop the majority of decent people from lining the streets with flags & cheering the lads back home. By all accounts the R.I.R did a brave & courageous tour of duty in Iraq and Afghanistan - well done to them I say.

Seeing as Sinn Fein-IRA are so 'Anti' the Local Regiment returning home maybe they (Sinn Fein-IRA) should go & offer their services to the Taliban now that their experteise is no longer required in South America

Did the brits not give their services to the Tilaban a few years back, when that other big bad wolf Russia was not the favourite chum,

funny how things change, might not be to long unto the Local Regiment is of no use and is dumped like the Loyalist paramilatries were.

EuskalHerria · 19-10-2008 1:57pm

podge79 wrote: »

as is yours my son

If he was your son i would suggest to him that he be sterilised as to stop your seed being spread even further!!!

People cannot seem to comprehend this but sinn fein ahve nothing to do with this march anymore!!!!! Firstly i am perosnally thankful as i said, they cannot organise a march against the puppets of this war and then meet george bush in belfast?

I think that this is not a Povacative march, there have been a lot of anti-war marches before that were not labelled "provocative" so why does sinn feins name to the march add provacation? Best example to shut these un-educated generalisations is the peaceful protests over the last 3 to 4 years on the 12th that have passed off peacefully against the orange order marches through nationalist areas? But know once people ahve a generalised view of anything or any organisation then it's very hard to turn a bunch of idiots away from their ignorance and refusal to re-evaluate a situation or organisation.

As i said sinn fein are no longer taking part in this demonstration so i think this thread has run it's course, however ridiculous it was in the first place. I wish the best of luck to those who are going to be going to demonstrating against the parading of war criminals through irish streets. Hopefully it will go well and i'm certain it will pass peacefully.

gurramok · 19-10-2008 2:09pm

Something is missing here.

The SDLP on Belfast City Council voted against the parade. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/uk_news/northern_ireland/7593266.stm

As far as i can see, both SF and SDLP represent nationalist views and voted against this march.

Does that make the SDLP provos too for opposing it?

mrtaylor1981 · 19-10-2008 2:23pm

gurramok wrote: »

Something is missing here.

The SDLP on Belfast City Council voted against the parade. http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/low/uk_news/northern_ireland/7593266.stm

As far as i can see, both SF and SDLP represent nationalist views and voted against this march.

Does that make the SDLP provos too for opposing it?

Well you can thank Mr Hume for that, he was the one who threw they to the Provos and then jumped ship at the end of his career.

And yes, this is a provocative march by Sinn fein\IRA. So much for looking for peace, they just want to stir up tensions between the unionists and moderate nationalists and the SDLP are falling for it.

The RIR are ordinary blokes, well trained soldiers, just trying to combat international terrorism. Most of those statistics quoted here are just from looney left organisations trying to discredit Britain and the US efforts over there.

For all you lefties, would you rather bin laden and his crowd over bombing here ??

dlofnep · 19-10-2008 2:38pm

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

For all you lefties, would you rather bin laden and his crowd over bombing here ??

I didn't know Bin Laden lived in Iraq. I have no fear of them ever attacking Ireland. We try our best to keep our noses out of other people's business. We've got our own problems to deal with. The only foreign nation to ever attack the Irish people in recent history was infact, Britain. Or has your memory become muddled?

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

The RIR are ordinary blokes, well trained soldiers, just trying to combat international terrorism.

Combating international terrorism by securing oil in Iraq and killing civilians in Iraq, which furthers the resentment there towards Western countries. Tell us all again why they are in Iraq? Weapons of Mass destruction, was it? Oh yeah - they found absolutely none of them. If you want to combat nations that are a real threat to Britain, then I could name off about 50 that are well above the list than Iraq that Britain could have launched an assault against. Why was there no attack on North Korea when they publicly stated that they had nuclear weapons?

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

Most of those statistics quoted here are just from looney left organisations trying to discredit Britain and the US efforts over there.

So Amnesty international is a loony organisation? I see. And I guess all the eye-witness reports from Iraqi civilians are really just from a bunch of Iraqis who escaped from a mental asylum, right?

EuskalHerria · 19-10-2008 2:42pm

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

The RIR are ordinary blokes, well trained soldiers, just trying to combat international terrorism. Most of those statistics quoted here are just from looney left organisations trying to discredit Britain and the US efforts over there.

For all you lefties, would you rather bin laden and his crowd over bombing here ??

Jesus christ!!!:eek: Your must have been on a serious session last night to loose that many brain cells!!

Bin laden bombing here? since when has that ever been his plan or even when was he ever capable of mounting a serious attack like that here, with his bombers and all?:rolleyes:

The RIR are just an ordinary bunch of soldiers trying to fight international terrorism? Groups sympathetic to al qaeda only attacked britain after iraq and afghanistan were invaded so why were britis troops involved? There history and there present actions prove they are not ordinary soldiers. Just because you may have right wing view doesn't mean you have to be totally ignorant!!!

mrtaylor1981 · 19-10-2008 2:53pm

dlofnep wrote: »

I didn't know Bin Laden lived in Iraq. I have no fear of them ever attacking Ireland. We try our best to keep our noses out of other people's business. We've got our own problems to deal with. The only foreign nation to ever attack the Irish people in recent history was infact, Britain. Or has your memory become muddled?

Combating international terrorism by securing oil in Iraq and killing civilians in Iraq, which furthers the resentment there towards Western countries. Tell us all again why they are in Iraq? Weapons of Mass destruction, was it? Oh yeah - they found absolutely none of them. If you want to combat nations that are a real threat to Britain, then I could name off about 50 that are well above the list than Iraq that Britain could have launched an assault against. Why was there no attack on North Korea when they publicly stated that they had nuclear weapons?

So Amnesty international is a loony organisation? I see. And I guess all the eye-witness reports from Iraqi civilians are really just from a bunch of Iraqis who escaped from a mental asylum, right?

So your a Sinn Fein\IRA member obviously. Making excuses for Arab terrorism would come easy for you of course. It's the Arab terrorists who are responsible for most of the deaths. The RIR and the rest of the British forces will stay there - until the job is done.

EuskalHerria · 19-10-2008 2:56pm

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

The RIR and the rest of the British forces will stay there - until the job is done.

What job? beating and killing innocent civilians? osama bin laden is dead so there not hunting him anymore? So what are they doing out there?!!

dlofnep · 19-10-2008 3:00pm

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

So your a Sinn Fein\IRA member obviously.

I'm a proud supporter of Sinn Féin, can't say I'm an IRA member however. Is everyone who opposes your filthy war against the Iraqi people a member of the IRA?

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

Making excuses for Arab terrorism would come easy for you of course.

Where did I make excuses for Arab terrorism?

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

It's the Arab terrorists who are responsible for most of the deaths.

You keep telling yourself that. 1 million people dead since the US/British invasion of Iraq. Countless breaches of human rights, and killing of civilians by British troops (all of which I've sourced and referenced in a previous post for your viewing pleasure).

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

The RIR and the rest of the British forces will stay there - until the job is done.

What job might that be? Until you've sucked Iraq dry of Oil? Might be another 50 years yet. Do tell those RIR lads to call home and tell their parents that might not be home for supper.

I see you conveniently skipped past my point on North Korea. Could it because your argument carries no weight whatsoever and other than tell us how great the British troops are, you've really no substance in your debate?

Mr.Micro · 19-10-2008 3:04pm

EuskalHerria wrote: »

What job? beating and killing innocent civilians? osama bin laden is dead so there not hunting him anymore? So what are they doing out there?!!

That's just it, the US want the people to believe he is out there, and we will get him/them before they get us. He is like the big bad bogeyman. The US always has to have a bad guy or country to justify its existence and its continuing arms race.

mrtaylor1981 · 19-10-2008 3:06pm

EuskalHerria wrote: »

Jesus christ!!!:eek: Your must have been on a serious session last night to loose that many brain cells!!

Bin laden bombing here? since when has that ever been his plan or even when was he ever capable of mounting a serious attack like that here, with his bombers and all?:rolleyes:

The RIR are just an ordinary bunch of soldiers trying to fight international terrorism? Groups sympathetic to al qaeda only attacked britain after iraq and afghanistan were invaded so why were britis troops involved? There history and there present actions prove they are not ordinary soldiers. Just because you may have right wing view doesn't mean you have to be totally ignorant!!!

I am from Fermanagh, I know quite a few RIR soldiers, and they are far from the picture some of you in the south have of them as told by Sinn fein/IRA. Anyway, the British army is well known for it's tight internal discipline but no nonsense approach to it's overseas operations. Indeed, there are young men from the south coming north to join them, the numbers are small but undoubtedly will grow, so much for Sinn fein/IRA's propaganda winning.

dlofnep · 19-10-2008 3:12pm

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

Anyway, the British army is well known for it's tight internal discipline but no nonsense approach to it's overseas operations.

Oh really, care to explain why nothing has ever been done about the murder of Irish civilians on Bloody Sunday, or why Aidan McAnaspie's murder was covered up and is only now being brought to light by the PSNI who reject the British army's statement? Some tight internal discipline there.

You're talking out of your arse to be honest.

Poccington · 19-10-2008 3:40pm

dlofnep wrote: »

I didn't know Bin Laden lived in Iraq. I have no fear of them ever attacking Ireland. We try our best to keep our noses out of other people's business. We've got our own problems to deal with. The only foreign nation to ever attack the Irish people in recent history was infact, Britain. Or has your memory become muddled?

Was any of those 200 lads from the RIR involved in the invasion of Ireland? No didn't think so.

Combating international terrorism by securing oil in Iraq and killing civilians in Iraq, which furthers the resentment there towards Western countries. Tell us all again why they are in Iraq? Weapons of Mass destruction, was it? Oh yeah - they found absolutely none of them. If you want to combat nations that are a real threat to Britain, then I could name off about 50 that are well above the list than Iraq that Britain could have launched an assault against. Why was there no attack on North Korea when they publicly stated that they had nuclear weapons?

Name the 50 please. I'd be very interested to hear them, as I'm sure you're quite the expert on the military capabilities of foreign nations.

So Amnesty international is a loony organisation? I see. And I guess all the eye-witness reports from Iraqi civilians are really just from a bunch of Iraqis who escaped from a mental asylum, right?

Eye witness reports from Iraqi civilians? I'm sure none of those folk could ever tell a lie.

As for civilian deaths, I'll let you in on a little secret.... Civilians die in war. It's not a nice thing but it happens. It happened in WW1, it happened in WW2, it happened in Vietnam, it happened in North Korea, it happened with the Ruskies in Afghanistan, it happened in the 1st Gulf War and it will continue to happen in every war from now until the end of time. It's not nice but it's inevitable.

Poccington · 19-10-2008 3:43pm

EuskalHerria wrote: »

What job? beating and killing innocent civilians? osama bin laden is dead so there not hunting him anymore? So what are they doing out there?!!

Osama is dead?

Any credible proof?

Allah Hu Akbar · 19-10-2008 3:53pm

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

So your a Sinn Fein\IRA member obviously. Making excuses for Arab terrorism would come easy for you of course. It's the Arab terrorists who are responsible for most of the deaths. The RIR and the rest of the British forces will stay there - until the job is done.

When will that be? When all the oil is gone?

Allah Hu Akbar · 19-10-2008 3:55pm

mrtaylor1981 wrote: »

I am from Fermanagh, I know quite a few RIR soldiers, and they are far from the picture some of you in the south have of them as told by Sinn fein/IRA. Anyway, the British army is well known for it's tight internal discipline but no nonsense approach to it's overseas operations. Indeed, there are young men from the south coming north to join them, the numbers are small but undoubtedly will grow, so much for Sinn fein/IRA's propaganda winning.

I coulda swore you were from East Belfast.

Sinn Fein/IRA to organise provocative march

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