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accompanined on first provisonal law

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    #32
    SV
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭SV


    paddy reilly wrote: »
    well i passed my test last week exactly 6 months and 2 weeks after first getting my learner permit. I was one of the people to be affected by the 6 month rule. so if i could have done my test any sooner i would have. I passed the test first time without any lessons i just learned the rules of the road book. Over the six months before my test i drove 9000 miles and never was accompanied i drove every day on the motor way and never got stoped by the gaurds always waved through check points. i never put L plates up on my car and i always though peope who did were just advertising stupidity.


    Well done on passing your test.


    Horrible attitude to have on the road though.


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    #33
    andrewh5
    Registered Users Posts: 588 ✭✭✭andrewh5


    Wishbone Ash wrote: »
    Driving unaccompanied does not invalidate 3rd party insurance. See post # 18.

    Then it damn well should! No other EU country is dense enough to allow unqualified drivers to drive on their roads unaccompanied!! It was a stupid thing for this country to ever agree to.


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    #34
    hobochris
    Registered Users Posts: 2,164 ✭✭✭hobochris


    pink fluffy bunny wrote: »
    ERR....I have my full licence but i wouldnt have a clue what to do if my slipped on icy roads, i didnt have to do that part in my driving test!

    i have been looking into an advanced driving course because i wouldnt have have a clue what to do in an emerency situation.

    As I said this is an extreme example but here is a couple of pointers that could get you out of a "slippery" situation:

    - when coming to a stop at a junction always aim to stop about 10 meters before your actual stop point, this way you can avoid sliding onto a main road.you should crawl slowly for the remaining ten meters up to your stop mark.

    -If you spin out:
    --*Don't Panic!*
    --*DO NOT BRAKE*
    --put the car into 2nd gear and turn the wheel into the direction you are spinning out in(this will feel wrong as you instinctively fell the n
    eed to turn out the spin) but it will allow you to recover control faster. --*do not accelerate*
    --just keep the wheels moving enough so they don't lock.
    --if you have time put your hazards on.
    -- look around quickly to see whats around you, more importantly which direction your drifting in so that if you are going to hit something you can brace yourself(sound horn to warn others).

    I did a course a few years ago in a previous job on freight transport in winter conditions.. was for the company insurance i think.

    there's a few others but that's the general gist..


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    #35
    SV
    Closed Accounts Posts: 9,534 ✭✭✭SV


    andrewh5 wrote: »
    Then it damn well should! No other EU country is dense enough to allow unqualified drivers to drive on their roads unaccompanied!! It was a stupid thing for this country to ever agree to.

    It doesn't allow drivers to drive unaccompanied?
    It just means that if they crash into some poor unfortunate and don't have the money that the other person won't have to pay out of their own pocket., their own car is not covered however.


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    #36
    Berty
    Registered Users Posts: 26,149 ✭✭✭✭Berty


    MYOB wrote: »
    Your opinion and the actual hard facts are entirely different here. Irish insurers still cover unaccompanied learner permit drivers as has been stated over, and over again on this thread. Your post is written as if this is what you would currently do, when clearly it isn't - as they're still insured.

    Jeez MYOB,

    I said Insurers "Should" not Insure these drivers at all, full stop, ever. Thats what I would prefer to see happen.

    I know its not happening. I know they are insured. I have read all the factual statements stating they are insured.

    I just dont think they should be EVER.


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    #37
    The Muppet
    Registered Users Posts: 14,003 ✭✭✭✭The Muppet


    quirke_folder wrote: »
    I will just say one more thing.

    I am of the opinion that Insurance companies should NEVER cover anybody unless they are accompanied. If you are hit by a learner permit driver who is on their own then you should know straight off they have no Insurance.

    Who would pay for the damage to the innocent party?
    quirke_folder wrote: »
    Call the Gardai.

    Have them detained for driving without an appropriate license.


    You're obligied to call the garda for every road accident, I don't think the responding guard would take to kindly to be told how to do their job. It may not be necessar to detain the culprit.


    quirke_folder wrote: »
    Take them to court unless they have the money to pay for your damages and other incidentals.

    This is my opinion of the way the Insurance policies should be written not what I believe to be the current state of play.

    If they don't have the money to pay for the damage what good is taking them to court, They still won't have the mopney to pay damages. What does the innocent victim do for a car in the years it will take a case to get to court?

    It's not a vey well though out opioion, is it?


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    #38
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 50,630 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    The Muppet wrote: »
    You're obligied to call the garda for every road accident, I don't think the responding guard would take to kindly to be told how to do their job. It may not be necessar to detain the culprit.


    Untrue, you are only obliged to call gardai if someone is injured


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    #39
    Berty
    Registered Users Posts: 26,149 ✭✭✭✭Berty


    My opinion is MY opinion.

    If you have not the correct license to drive by yourself then your not insured and should have no failsafes.

    Who pays? The bloody person who hit you of course.

    If they have no money. You sue them like you would an uninsured driver. They could have a house, their car of course and other assets which could be liquified if they needed to cough up money due to a court decision.

    The long term idea is to discourage unlicensed permit drivers from being on the streets.

    Why should you have the right to drive alone if you have not passed your test?


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    #40
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 50,630 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    quirke_folder wrote: »
    Who pays? The bloody person who hit you of course.

    If they have no money. You sue them like you would an uninsured driver. They could have a house, their car of course and other assets which could be liquified if they needed to cough up money due to a court decision

    I totally get where you are coming from on this, but its there, not to protect the "uninsured" driver, but to protect the victim. If this is a learner driver, it's possible that he's an 18 year old, in college, no job, driving a €200 car, if it's a case that their is a fatality (for example), the only asset this 18 year old has is his car which is probably written off now anyway, so who pays funeral expenses etc? I think it is a good thing for he victim, but I also think that, as Alanstrainor mentioned earlier, the insurance company should then sue the insured to reclaim damages.


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    #41
    L1011
    Registered Users Posts: 68,968 ✭✭✭✭L1011


    quirke_folder wrote: »
    My opinion is MY opinion.

    If you have not the correct license to drive by yourself then your not insured and should have no failsafes.

    Who pays? The bloody person who hit you of course.

    If they have no money. You sue them like you would an uninsured driver. They could have a house, their car of course and other assets which could be liquified if they needed to cough up money due to a court decision.

    The long term idea is to discourage unlicensed permit drivers from being on the streets.

    Why should you have the right to drive alone if you have not passed your test?

    Their car has just hit you - it will be mostly worthless if your vehicle has damage higher than the average person can pay for.

    Their house would not be touchable in proceedings for this amount of money.

    As a result the innocent party would get nothing. This is why insurers cover third party on drivers no matter what licencing is required.


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    #42
    Bogger77
    Registered Users Posts: 1,857 ✭✭✭Bogger77


    one small point:
    Even if the person driving has never had an insurance policy, there still is 3rd part cover from the MIBI. Those of us paying insurance pay a % each year towards that fund.


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    #43
    Wishbone Ash
    Registered Users Posts: 24,995 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    andrewh5 wrote: »
    Then it damn well should! No other EU country is dense enough to allow unqualified drivers to drive on their roads unaccompanied!! It was a stupid thing for this country to ever agree to.
    You are mixing up your arguments. Learner Drivers are not permitted to drive unaccompanied here either (except in A, A1, M and W). Why do your think that an innocent party should suffer because a Learner Driver has broken the law?
    quirke_folder wrote:
    My opinion is MY opinion.

    If you have not the correct license to drive by yourself then your not insured and should have no failsafes.
    Which would you prefer if you were run over by a Learner Driver - for them to have 3rd party cover or for them to have no insurance cover? It's a no brainer!
    quirke_folder wrote:
    Why should you have the right to drive alone if you have not passed your test?
    Thousands of people are legally entitled to drive alone without having passed a test (and I'm not referring to those in categories A, A1, M and W).
    Deleted User wrote:
    Untrue, you are only obliged to call gardai if someone is injured
    One is only obliged to call the Gardai is someone is injured or if the vehicles are causing a blockage or posing a danger to others.

    Gardai in Dublin rarely attend material damage only accidents unless they witness the accident themselves. They usually advise those involved to report it to the nearest Garda Station.


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    #44
    Lumen
    Registered Users Posts: 31,084 ✭✭✭✭Lumen


    Deleted User wrote: »
    the only asset this 18 year old has is his car

    He has some redundant internal organs which might fetch a decent price.


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    #45
    craichoe
    Closed Accounts Posts: 2,706 ✭✭✭craichoe


    quirke_folder wrote: »
    My opinion is MY opinion.

    If you have not the correct license to drive by yourself then your not insured and should have no failsafes.

    Who pays? The bloody person who hit you of course.

    If they have no money. You sue them like you would an uninsured driver. They could have a house, their car of course and other assets which could be liquified if they needed to cough up money due to a court decision.

    The long term idea is to discourage unlicensed permit drivers from being on the streets.

    Why should you have the right to drive alone if you have not passed your test?

    What planet are you one, typical courtcase is,

    Person has to pay other person X amount of money by order of the court

    Person says they don't have it

    Judge asks how much they can afford, they say 20 euro a week, Judge says ok and they pay 20 euro a week until the debt is paid off.

    This is how it goes for everything, not just car crashes.


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    #46
    Wishbone Ash
    Registered Users Posts: 24,995 ✭✭✭✭Wishbone Ash


    craichoe wrote: »
    Judge asks how much they can afford, they say 20 euro a week, Judge says ok and they pay 20 euro a week until the debt is paid off
    ...and at that rate , it would take them 1,000 years to pay off a €1,000,000 personal injuries claim!

    Hence the need for insurance quirke_folder.


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    #47
    Graham_B18C
    Registered Users Posts: 8,620 ✭✭✭Graham_B18C


    Deleted User wrote: »
    he wasn't insured on the motorway
    Couple of friends of mine work in insurance, you are covered on the motorway even on a provisional


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    #48
    [Deleted User]
    Posts: 50,630 ✭✭✭✭ [Deleted User]


    Grahamo999 wrote: »
    Couple of friends of mine work in insurance, you are covered on the motorway even on a provisional

    we have established that! but it's 3rd party only

    To the OP: all of this means that if you had been in an accident on the motorway and you were left paralysed, your parents would have had to cover all your medical costs for the rest of your life! Very considerate!


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