FREE the WEED

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Dragan wrote: »

Where you are ****ing up is by telling people what to do.

Don't sweat it D ... Hint people, look through my pix in the photographic forum

humanji

Toiletroll wrote: »

Its a free country and now I dont feel too bad telling you to fúck off

And what are you doing differently? You sound more full of shiit than anyone else. Good day

And now you make TBH's post seem all the more likely.

Toiletroll

humanji wrote: »

And now you make TBH's post seem all the more likely.

Oh yes, loose then cling. You are all the same. Afraid, and always beaten.

Thankfully - I (and some other posters/mods) are different.

humanji

Mairt wrote: »

Don't sweat it D ... Hint people, look through my pix in the photographic forum

They better be pornographic!

humanji

Toiletroll wrote: »

Oh yes, loose then cling. You are all the same. Afraid, and always beaten.

Thankfully - I (and some other posters/mods) are different.

I are different? You English do good!

See this superiority complex you have doesn't really suit you. Grow up, seriously.

Toiletroll

humanji wrote: »

I are different? You English do good!

See this superiority complex you have doesn't really suit you. Grow up, seriously.

I changed the sentence with an edit

You are confusing this with your inferiority complex

Doc

I still don't understand why you think it should be legal.

So far the main arguments have been that it could be taxed (anything could be taxed just because you can make money by doing something doesn't mien you should),

that it doesn't have as bad an affect on people as alcohol (I have covered this already and abuse of legal substances is bad but as i said no reason to legalese another)

Its not that bad for you. (on this point I totally disagree but I have expressed my views on this comprehensibly in other threads and don't fell the need to do so here again.)

It opens your mind. (I know many people who smoke and have to say without exception that they are far more creative when their not stoned, I would say that if its the case for you you are the exception not the rule.)

humanji

Toiletroll wrote: »

I changed the sentence with an edit

You are confusing this with your inferiority complex

My tiny penis has nothing to do with this. Eh...I mean...eh...shut up!

Toiletroll

humanji wrote: »

My tiny penis has nothing to do with this. Eh...I mean...eh...shut up!

Go smoke one and come up with something creative and/or inspiring :pac:

Enough with your recession marketing ethics!

Dudess

"It's a free country" this, "it's a free country" that. Sure, it may be so but what's that got to do with Boards.ie, a privately owned website? You can't post whatever you feel like posting on Boards.ie simply because Ireland is a "free country". If the admins of this website decided for no reason there was to be a ban on any mentions of Madonna, and a site banning for those who breached this rule... nothing could stop them.

ejmaztec

It's all a bit primitive really, burning some old plant to flick a few switches in your brain, when, with a certain amount of mental effort, you can flick the switches for free.

There really are some deluded suckers on this planet. Creativity? You've either got it or you haven't - weed makes no difference.

humanji

Toiletroll wrote: »

Go smoke one and come up with something creative and/or inspiring :pac:

Enough with your recession marketing ethics!

Ah, but I don't need any substance to come up with my ideas

"It's a free country" this, "it's a free country" that. Sure, it may be so but what's that got to do with Boards.ie, a privately owned website? You can't post whatever you feel like posting on Boards.ie simply because Ireland is a "free country". If the admins of this website decided for no reason there was to be a ban on any mentions of Madonna, and a site banning for those who breached this rule... nothing could stop them.

Give it up, you're not an AH mod anymore. More on!

Dudess

But... but... but I can't!

humanji

Aw bless. I feel bad now. *hug*

Dragan

Doc wrote: »

I still don't understand why you think it should be legal.

So far the main arguments have been that it could be taxed (anything could be taxed just because you can make money by doing something doesn't mien you should),

that it doesn't have as bad an affect on people as alcohol (I have covered this already and abuse of legal substances is bad but as i said no reason to legalese another)

Its not that bad for you. (on this point I totally disagree but I have expressed my views on this comprehensibly in other threads and don't fell the need to do so here again.)

It opens your mind. (I know many people who smoke and have to say without exception that they are far more creative when their not stoned, I would say that if its the case for you you are the exception not the rule.)

With regard to the taxation, that is really the last point in favour of the legalisation of anything, that it would provide more income to the general fund. It's a valid point on it's own, but only if everything else that needs to checked is coming back positive.

In my opinion, the first thing that needs to be done with weed are some proper clinical trials. There is no point in saying it is good or bad for you, as this is purely relevant to your point of view right now. The important issue is precendant, and in this case it would be comparing the effects of something that is currently illegal with things that are currently legal. In this case you would have to look at the three major drugs that are already available for easy public consumption, alchohol, nicotine and caffeine. You would also need to compare the various delivery systems for each one and compare the relevant delivery systems for THC.

To say that the legality of alchohol and ciggarettes is a moot issue is a lie. At the end of the day these things are legal, available in the market, and if something less dangerous ( as i said, studies need to be done ) is kept illegal then you need to ask the question, why?

There is the simple argument that while something is illegal it can be wholely controlled. In the same way there is a black market for alchohol and smokes, there would also be a black market for cannabis should that become legal. The important things to check here would be the effect of the current black market versus the changes it would undergo if cannabis became legal.

Would it lessen, and if so where would the criminals go to make their money? Would the legalisation of cannabis mean a push in the criminal community of other, still illegal drugs, and as such what would the effects be on communities and targets groups for these dealers?

As for it "opening your mind", i agree with the line that creative people are creative anyway. Arguing that it "opens your mind" is pointless, if anything i would argue that the effects in this way are considerably less that the average person realises, that you can happily smoke a joint or two and interact with people who are straight that would never know you had that joint, in the same way as it would be very, very difficult to tell if the average person had had, say, one pint.

Finally, for the people who are vehemently against the legalisation of cannabis i would point out that there are countries in the world where the sale, consumption or possession of alchohol are wrong and illegal. If you were born in those countries you would have the same view of alchohol that you currently have of cannabis.

I think we are all adult enough to admit that alchohol is no great evil when not abused, so perhaps it might be an idea to entertain some level of open mindedness to the argument that the legal sale of cannabis in Ireland would not mean the downfall of our society.

As i have said many times, i would be all for the legalisation of cannabis in Ireland but i readily of admit that a lot of time and effort needs to be put into the thought, and planning of going about such things.

I will also happily say that the majority of the arguments expressed by the PRO side are futile, not backed up and just being recited verbatim, whilst the CON side are sitting in a foolish intractable trench and refusing to accept any possibility that cannabis may not actually be a bad thing.

Personally i find it more amusing than anything.

Toiletroll

Doc wrote: »

I still don't understand why you think it should be legal.

So far the main arguments have been that it could be taxed (anything could be taxed just because you can make money by doing something doesn't mien you should),

that it doesn't have as bad an affect on people as alcohol (I have covered this already and abuse of legal substances is bad but as i said no reason to legalese another)

Its not that bad for you. (on this point I totally disagree but I have expressed my views on this comprehensibly in other threads and don't fell the need to do so here again.)

It opens your mind. (I know many people who smoke and have to say without exception that they are far more creative when their not stoned, I would say that if its the case for you you are the exception not the rule.)

One of the main issues for me is the fact that I am a criminal because of it. I work a full time job and have my own company on top of it. I spend all my time being productive, yet I am a criminal

faceman

studiorat wrote: »

People should know the difference between use and abuse.

But again I've met people who think it's fine to drink until you can't get served anymore drink in a place and think you are a heroin dealer if you like to smoke a joint.

People who abuse substances and addicts are unable to distingush between use and abuse.

Dragan

Toiletroll wrote: »

One of the main issues for me is the fact that I am a criminal because of it. I work a full time job and have my own company on top of it. I spend all my time being productive, yet I am a criminal

Another moot argument, you can't pick and choose what makes you a criminal based on your on moral standpoints.

You are living and working in Ireland, as such you are required to live by the laws of the land. Should you choose not to this makes you a criminal.

It's about that simple.

faceman

Toiletroll wrote: »

One of the main issues for me is the fact that I am a criminal because of it. I work a full time job and have my own company on top of it. I spend all my time being productive, yet I am a criminal

Of course you are a criminal. what part of "breaking the law" do you not understand?

Dragan

faceman wrote: »

People who abuse substances and addicts are unable to distingush between use and abuse.

Thats a bit of a sweeping statement, a bit like lumping psychopaths in with sociopaths when the two are vastly different things.

At the end of the day you cannot say that an addict is not aware they are abusing a substance, it's a cop out and just building more excuses for addicts who will happily feed everyone that line because it shirks there own personal responsibility.

"I'm an addict, i can't help it, i didn't realise".

A load of rubbish, plain and simple. The majority of people who abuse substances are well aware that they are taking said substance at a very high level, at a level that would be outside of the socially accepted or healthy norm, be that chocolate, coffee, booze, cannabis or MDMA etc etc.

faceman

Dragan wrote: »

Thats a bit of a sweeping statement, a bit like lumping psychopaths in with sociopaths when the two are vastly different things.

At the end of the day you cannot say that an addict is not aware they are abusing a substance, it's a cop out and just building more excuses for addicts who will happily feed everyone that line because it shirks there own personal responsibility.

"I'm an addict, i can't help it, i didn't realise".

A load of rubbish, plain and simple. The majority of people who abuse substances are well aware that they are taking said substance at a very high level, at a level that would be outside of the socially accepted or healthy norm, be that chocolate, coffee, booze, cannabis or MDMA etc etc.

I think you may have misinterpreted my point but I agree with most of what you are saying.

Toiletroll

Dragan wrote: »

With regard to the taxation, that is really the last point in favour of the legalisation of anything, that it would provide more income to the general fund. It's a valid point on it's own, but only if everything else that needs to checked is coming back positive.

In my opinion, the first thing that needs to be done with weed are some proper clinical trials. There is no point in saying it is good or bad for you, as this is purely relevant to your point of view right now. The important issue is precendant, and in this case it would be comparing the effects of something that is currently illegal with things that are currently legal. In this case you would have to look at the three major drugs that are already available for easy public consumption, alchohol, nicotine and caffeine. You would also need to compare the various delivery systems for each one and compare the relevant delivery systems for THC.

To say that the legality of alchohol and ciggarettes is a moot issue is a lie. At the end of the day these things are legal, available in the market, and if something less dangerous ( as i said, studies need to be done ) is kept illegal then you need to ask the question, why?

There is the simple argument that while something is illegal it can be wholely controlled. In the same way there is a black market for alchohol and smokes, there would also be a black market for cannabis should that become legal. The important things to check here would be the effect of the current black market versus the changes it would undergo if cannabis became legal.

Would it lessen, and if so where would the criminals go to make their money? Would the legalisation of cannabis mean a push in the criminal community of other, still illegal drugs, and as such what would the effects be on communities and targets groups for these dealers?

As for it "opening your mind", i agree with the line that creative people are creative anyway. Arguing that it "opens your mind" is pointless, if anything i would argue that the effects in this way are considerably less that the average person realises, that you can happily smoke a joint or two and interact with people who are straight that would never know you had that joint, in the same way as it would be very, very difficult to tell if the average person had had, say, one pint.

Finally, for the people who are vehemently against the legalisation of cannabis i would point out that there are countries in the world where the sale, consumption or possession of alchohol are wrong and illegal. If you were born in those countries you would have the same view of alchohol that you currently have of cannabis.

I think we are all adult enough to admit that alchohol is no great evil when not abused, so perhaps it might be an idea to entertain some level of open mindedness to the argument that the legal sale of cannabis in Ireland would not mean the downfall of our society.

As i have said many times, i would be all for the legalisation of cannabis in Ireland but i readily of admit that a lot of time and effort needs to be put into the thought, and planning of going about such things.

I will also happily say that the majority of the arguments expressed by the PRO side are futile, not backed up and just being recited verbatim, whilst the CON side are sitting in a foolish intractable trench and refusing to accept any possibility that cannabis may not actually be a bad thing.

Personally i find it more amusing than anything.

Good post! Informative & constructive. As I've said its the criminal aspect of it that hits the hardest and the crroked drug squads all over the country. What with rape and the fact they will rob you of your possesions! (non drug related) and its happened to me! Made a complaint to ombudsman and its ignored... (the rape part didnt happen to me)

This is quite good also:
http://boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=57641400&postcount=113

Toiletroll

Dragan wrote: »

Another moot argument, you can't pick and choose what makes you a criminal based on your on moral standpoints.

You are living and working in Ireland, as such you are required to live by the laws of the land. Should you choose not to this makes you a criminal.

It's about that simple.

If you sit back and accept laws you will find yourself in an invisible prison. If you stand up for what you believe in you can make changes

The EU is passing 10's of laws every week... Do you get to vote on them? I was born into this country and its so behind the times in so many ways it would be good to see soemthing as a first here.

Watch the documentary I've posted above. Its amusing and eye opening!

ejmaztec

Toiletroll wrote: »

If you sit back and accept laws you will find yourself in an invisible prison. If you stand up for what you believe in you can make changes

The EU is passing 10's of laws every week... Do you get to vote on them? I was born into this country and its so behind the times in so many ways it would be good to see soemthing as a first here.

Watch the documentary I've posted above. Its amusing and eye opening!

Are we going to have drugs martyrs now? Should be interesting.

Dragan

ejmaztec wrote: »

Are we going to have drugs martyrs now? Should be interesting.

You see now why i hang my head everytime i see a legalise cannabis thread in AH?:)

Toiletroll

Dragan wrote: »

You see now why i hang my head everytime i see a legalise cannabis thread in AH?:)

Look, there are so many people using cannibis. Official figures state that at least 1 in 3 people in Ireland have tried it.

So 1 in 3 people are criminals? Logical if you want to put fear into everyone and run a police state

ejmaztec

Dragan wrote: »

You see now why i hang my head everytime i see a legalise cannabis thread in AH?:)

As long as they don't think of setting fire to themselves in the street as a protest. Some of the locals might get high from the fumes, then take it upon themselves to set fire to a few more to repeat the buzz.

Dragan

Toiletroll wrote: »

So 1 in 3 people are criminals?

There is a high possibility that everyone shall die a criminal, that they shall commit some small illegality over the course of their life that they right off based on their own individual moral code.

The simple fact of the matter is that yes, they have broken the law.

Irishcrx

Dragan wrote: »

There is a high possibility that everyone shall die a criminal, that they shall commit some small illegality over the course of their life that they right off based on their own individual moral code.

The simple fact of the matter is that yes, they have broken the law.

Yes they have broken it as such, but just because it's currently law doesn't mean that their right and we are wrong, it took them over 500 years to make cannibis illegal and it used to be a big part of culture in many parts of the world, so it's only been illegal a small blip on the radar of time.

The law also used to burn people and hang people for stealing apples, did that make it right? Or is it right to convict a young fella of 18 for smoking 15 quids worth of pot on a Saturday in private with a few friends while people go ouit and assault people and get a slap on the wrist. Look at the bigger picture.

Toiletroll

Dragan wrote: »

There is a high possibility that everyone shall die a criminal, that they shall commit some small illegality over the course of their life that they right off based on their own individual moral code.

The simple fact of the matter is that yes, they have broken the law.

A law that could be relaxed... I never cried for 100% legality!... medical use etc. Prescriptions etc... Morphine is a pretty strong and addictive drug. its not illegal and has a better buz than weed. (I was hospitalised for a while and had to take it). Yet Morphine is not as common as the illegal drugs. it is also highly addictive whereass weed is not

People want what they Cannot have. People are adventuous and love a mystery.

Legalising cannibis could very well reduce its popularity... Of course it could also increase it... If tourists visitied etc and spend their monies...