FREE the WEED

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

Kold wrote: »

Yes, actually a friend of mine died whilst taking it. I won't let that blur my judgement though. You seen a few of your mates on that "pure MDMA" crap and didn't stay that long? Well Jesus H Christ, here's your degree on toxicology.

Haha, yea I don't know much about it mate, but I didn't like what I seen... They were pretty messed up.

Nichololas

Armani Tiny Vine wrote: »

Haha, yea I don't know much about it mate, but I didn't like what I seen... They were pretty messed up.

I dunno, I think a lot of that is in the different perspectives of someone actually experiencing a drugs effects to someone completely sober (maybe not even sober, just not experiencing the same thing). Have you ever gone into a pub or club near closing time completely sober? Awful.

m5ex9oqjawdg2i

Enlil_Nick wrote: »

I dunno, I think a lot of that is in the different perspectives of someone actually experiencing a drugs effects to someone completely sober (maybe not even sober, just not experiencing the same thing). Have you ever gone into a pub or club near closing time completely sober? Awful.

I concur

But that type of behaviour (being on MDMA) is tolerated less by society than the drunk yob...

I think it would be easier to sway society when it comes to mary jane... Other drugs, (even if they are less harmfull) will be less accepted. You know?

mountainyman

It should be legalised. But lanky rottentoothed ****ers and fat criminals who run head shops shouldn't be allowed sell it.

bean

ccosgrave wrote: »

"I think we should legalise marijuana in this country, just so potheads have nothing to talk about ever again."

good one

Gurgle

mountainyman wrote: »

It should be legalised. But lanky rottentoothed ****ers and fat criminals who run head shops shouldn't be allowed sell it.

The sexy hippie chicks running the ones around here can though, right?

mountainyman

deffo yes to sexy hippies and no to greedy lanky rottenteethers

JC 2K3

Armani Tiny Vine wrote: »

Well you state that it has a mortality rate. How can you expect to fight that one?

Well, caffeine has a mortality rate. Something simply having the potential to kill if misused isn't that great an argument against it.

And weed is associated with mental illness, how do you expect to fight that one?

Of course, you could tell me that the mental illness thing is a load of bullshít, but would you accept that pure MDMA does not kill, nearly all cases are due to overdosing, drinking too much water or other compounds present in pills, all of which could be basically eliminated through legalisation and regulation?

Armani Tiny Vine wrote: »

But that type of behaviour (being on MDMA) is tolerated less by society than the drunk yob...

Being happy, dancing and hugging people is tolerated less than being wasted, vomitting on the street, starting fights etc.?

Armani Tiny Vine wrote: »

I think it would be easier to sway society when it comes to mary jane... Other drugs, (even if they are less harmfull) will be less accepted. You know?

I made this point and you pretty much shot it down....

meboloxitis

Personally I'm all for free choices & I think it's remarkable how in Holland they were able to address issues like cannabis & prostitution like adults.
They regulated this and make hundreds of millions per year in tax revenue.

I don't think Ireland will ever be as liberal as Holland, not while Biffo & co are in doing their best to screw us all!

Getting back to the point, I have never heard of anybody smashing up their home, fighting & pissing all over the streets, or crying thier eyes out after a few joints! I wish I could say the same about alcohol!!

I'm a frequent flyer to Holland and we always have a great time when we visit. I'm not a stoner or red light crawler, personall yI prefer Eindhoven because it's beautiful, quiet & cheap

The simple fact of the matter is that humans are addicted to pleasure!
That's why we see men & women smoke & drink themselves to death every year. Moderation is the key....imo

Bottle_of_Smoke

Armani Tiny Vine wrote: »

that is an opinion and it isn't worth **** because, even though it is your opinion, it is wrong. Pills kill...

The crap they put in it. It has more adverse affects than mary jane.

Why does something not killing you mean it's ok?

Marajuana doesn't kill you but seeing as most people smoke it with tobacco you have all the effects of that too. It's also a gateway drug to smoking cigarettes on their own. Everyone I know who goes to amsterdam smokes it with tobacco there too so legalising won't change that. Eating it is a completely different high.

Pills on the other hand, literally thousands taken every weekend, don't hear of many deaths. If you were to legalise them I doubt there'd be any. I'm not saying we should, as they're probably not good for the heart. I jsut think they're far less harmful than smoking dope.

When I smoked my concentration went, was very un-ambitious, was unhealthy from the physical effects.

Regular smokers have 40% more chance of getting schizophrenia than a non-smoker. (I acknowledge this is only a difference of 1% and 1.4%, not a scaremongerer) to me schizophrenia is far more frightening than than mdma risks.

Oh, and the scientists agree with me.

http://newsimg.bbc.co.uk/media/images/42718000/gif/_42718419_drugs_graph2_416.gif

ScumLord

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

Why does something not killing you mean it's ok?

Marajuana doesn't kill you but seeing as most people smoke it with tobacco you have all the effects of that too. It's also a gateway drug to smoking cigarettes on their own. Everyone I know who goes to amsterdam smokes it with tobacco there too so legalising won't change that. Eating it is a completely different high.

Most people that go to Amsterdam do not smoke it with tobacco. Most Irish (or european) smokers who also smoke cigarettes mix with tobacco.

Pills on the other hand, literally thousands taken every weekend, don't hear of many deaths. If you were to legalise them I doubt there'd be any. I'm not saying we should, as they're probably not good for the heart. I jsut think they're far less harmful than smoking dope.

I don't know how people consider pills safe. I've done my fair share throwing 4 into me at a time and it does **** you up. I know someone who's a gibbering wreak because of them. Any drug with a comedown like MDMA has to be doing damage. Your also striping your brain of chemicals that could take 10 years to come back to normal. Pills are not "safe". Irish MDMA is especially bad as it's mixed down even before it makes it into a pill form where it's mixed down again. Irish pills are very far from safe.

When I smoked my concentration went, was very un-ambitious, was unhealthy from the physical effects.

Irish soap is full of nasty drugs, that make you drowzy. I've got some fine Moraccan hash here (what our soap is before it's mixed down) and that doesn't make you like that atall. your still alert and well able to go about your daily business. Irish soap is not hash! It's just a cocktail of drugs trying to be hash.
[/QUOTE]

Bottle_of_Smoke

ScumLord wrote: »

Most people that go to Amsterdam do not smoke it with tobacco. Most Irish (or european) smokers who also smoke cigarettes mix with tobacco.

They did when I was there(3 times between Jan 06 and feb 07) Saw the odd person smoking pure, seemed to be locals or Americans (who don't use tobacco)from what I could tell.

I don't know how people consider pills safe. I've done my fair share throwing 4 into me at a time and it does **** you up. I know someone who's a gibbering wreak because of them. Any drug with a comedown like MDMA has to be doing damage. Your also striping your brain of chemicals that could take 10 years to come back to normal. Pills are not "safe". Irish MDMA is especially bad as it's mixed down even before it makes it into a pill form where it's mixed down again. Irish pills are very far from safe.

Less harmful than cannibis doesn't equal safe. I've seen people in a mess from doing too many pills all right. Though, when you've had a "sensible" amount you can have a great time without people even noticing anything odd.

Irish soap is full of nasty drugs, that make you drowzy. I've got some fine Moraccan hash here (what our soap is before it's mixed down) and that doesn't make you like that atall. your still alert and well able to go about your daily business. Irish soap is not hash! It's just a cocktail of drugs trying to be hash.

Was actually much worse when I had weed than soap. Don't think I've ever had proper hash. I could go about daily business like work the next day but really only because I had bills to pay!

What do you make of the link I posted about the scientists ranking of drugs?

ScumLord

Bottle_of_Smoke wrote: »

What do you make of the link I posted about the scientists ranking of drugs?

Seen it many times. But it's only really true if the illegal drugs are pure, which they rarely ever are.

thebman

ScumLord wrote: »

Seen it many times. But it's only really true if the illegal drugs are pure, which they rarely ever are.

Wouldn't that be a point in favour of legalisation with regulation?

ScumLord

brim4brim wrote: »

Wouldn't that be a point in favour of legalisation with regulation?

Have you read this thread?

I'm all for legalization, even over decriminalization but I still think drugs have dangers asociated with them. It's only right to highlight the actual dangers of those drugs.

Executive Steve

keep it 100% illegal but make possession of less than 5 ounces punishable by a fine of 200 euro per ounce.

anything above that, keep it as it is.

if you're stupid enough to be caught you should pay a "silly bugger" tax in the same way you get a ticket if you park on double yellow lines.

Ireland has signed a variety of international treaties that we can't pull out of pretty much preventing us from ever really seriously changing our drug laws, but if we just did as i suggest we would free up thousands of garda man hours to pursue actual credible threats to the fabric of irish society (like drug gangs) while also ensuring a healthy additional source of revenue.

Gurgle

ScumLord wrote: »

I'm all for legalization, even over decriminalization but I still think drugs have dangers asociated with them. It's only right to highlight the actual dangers of those drugs.

Yes, of course - on the packaging, right underneath the ingredients.
(Of course having to print the ingredients would dramatically reduce the dangers.)

Terry

Amsterdam to shut many weed cafes

1 day ago

Amsterdam will close almost a fifth of its marijuana cafes to comply with a national ban on having them near schools, the city's mayor said.

Another city, Eindhoven, said it would start issuing permits to cannabis growers in order to better regulate the trade - if the national government approves.

The plans were announced as 33 major Dutch cities held a "weed summit" to discuss the nation's long-standing policy of tolerating marijuana use while routinely arresting growers.

Cannabis is technically illegal in the Netherlands, but can be sold in small amounts in designated cafes - euphemistically known as "coffee shops" -- without fear of prosecution. More than a quarter of the country's cafes are in Amsterdam, where they are a major tourist attraction.

But Mayor Job Cohen said the city would close about 20% of its cafes.

Those included some landmarks, such as The Bulldog - a high-traffic shop operating since 1985 in a former police station on one of the city's main squares.

Letters have been sent to 43 shops located within 250 yards of a high school, informing them they will have to close by the end of 2011 if they cannot successfully appeal the decision, Amsterdam spokeswoman Iris Reshef said. But she added that the city did not have any major problems with the cafes.

Other cities closer to the Netherlands' borders have expressed frustration at being bombarded by "drug tourists" from Germany, France or Belgium seeking to stock up on marijuana - an often finding ways to bypass a 5 gram (one fifth of an ounce) purchase limit.

"If the border areas shut down tomorrow, then (inland cities) Den Helder and Almere will soon be suffering," said Mayor Geert Leers of the southern border city Maastricht.

Representatives at the summit in Almere, 12 miles east of Amsterdam, also discussed the policy of arresting growers, which left cafes with no way to legally source their most lucrative product.

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5j77j_BoZY2VFvi7OY-xXLBDQEVJQ

Note the part about drug tourists.
Do you really want that here?

dr.bollocko

Terry wrote: »

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5j77j_BoZY2VFvi7OY-xXLBDQEVJQ

Note the part about drug tourists.
Do you really want that here?

It would be a much needed shot in the arm for the fast food and crap Movie industry.
And its drug locals we have a problem with now not the tourists. In fairness. Some poor ****er has paid to come to Ireland in November. The least we could do is offer him a fatty at the airport.

rubadub

Terry wrote: »

Note the part about drug tourists.
Do you really want that here?

I would see no hope in hell of it being made legal here on its own. When many people talk of it being made legal they really mean worldwide, like most other drugs tend to be. Most countries have similar drugs laws, they all end up copying each other (just like cannabis IS illegal in holland and the rest of the EU). Re-legalisation is taboo for many politicians in individual parties, on a bigger scale it is taboo for a country in the likes of the EU.

I expect some general EU law would be introduced and the leaders of each country could then put the "blame" on somebody else, and not appear to be in favour of it, (though I expect many would be). Many countries in the EU are already copying each other and tolerating possession of small amounts either officially or unofficially. The EU has already asked for drugs to be made illegal

On March 3, 2008, the Council of the European Union issued a decision directing member states to move to control BZP because of its recreational use.

Even if it was legal here (unlike Holland) then we would not have the same influx of drug tourists. They would have to go through airport security, while the "drug tourists" from Germany, France or Belgium just drive over and back. There was talk of Holland restricting sales to Dutch passport holders. And if it was legal the sales could be a little more restricted than in Holland.

We might get drug tourists coming in from the North, but is that really so bad? It seems Newry are having to "suffer" a terrible influx of drug tourists at the moment. Just look in bargain alerts at all the people going up north to buy cheap legal recreational drugs, stocking up for the traditional Christmas drug binge. The OP wanted it legalized and taxed (unlike Holland on both counts). There is a fortune to be made on tax, we already do make a killing on exporting legal Irish recreational drugs here and many tourists here will buy drugs locally even though our taxes are high on them.


This is from Penn & Tellers show Bullsh*t! about the "war on drugs".
BTW Penn Jillette has never drank in his life nor taken recreational drugs, not that it should really matter, but I do know some do not value the opinions of "drug users" much, and refuse to listen to their arguments at all.
http://video.google.com/videoplay?docid=3025396475247394113&ei=TGMpSfbaHaTgiALcueHjBg&q

Gurgle

Terry wrote: »

Note the part about drug tourists.
Do you really want that here?

Other cities closer to the Netherlands' borders have expressed frustration at being bombarded by "drug tourists" from Germany, France or Belgium seeking to stock up on marijuana - an often finding ways to bypass a 5 gram (one fifth of an ounce) purchase limit.

Noted - and whats the issue?

Is this somehow different to Northerners crossing the border for a tank of petrol?

Prof.Badass

Terry wrote: »

http://www.google.com/hostednews/ukpress/article/ALeqM5j77j_BoZY2VFvi7OY-xXLBDQEVJQ

Note the part about drug tourists.
Do you really want that here?

yes. if ireland wants to avoid becoming a $hithole again. As a country we'd be rich, and i don't just mean rich as in switzerland and banks. I mean really really fúckin loaded, a whole new league of prosperity.

and for what? to have a few extra people giggling and buying shiny things (not to mention the impact it would have on our food industry ).

btw I'm not just talking about weed.

EDIT- synthetic cannabinoid pills ftw!

PeakOutput

Terry wrote: »

Note the part about drug tourists.
Do you really want that here?

leave apart the bonus to the economy and the fact that the dutch are not complaining about the 'drug tourists' at all

i dont think you should look at it as what affect it would have on ireland. at the root of it all the idea is that marijuana should be legal everywhere not jsut ireland so that negates any negative arguments about drug tourism

we led the world or at least europe on the smoking ban iirc why not lead again with this

massechusets(sp) has just decrminalised it to a a 100dollar fine and no criminal record as long as you have less than a certain amount. its practically legal in california and canada accept you need a medical card and what negative affects has it had on those places?

the documentary 'americas drug war; the last white hope' is a great eye opener